University of Sussex protest a 'waste of time' (From The Argus)

Perhaps if the protesters think they can do it so much better they can set up their own university and show the professionals how to do it without making any cuts.

itsnotme wrote:
Perhaps if the protesters think they can do it so much better they can set up their own university and show the professionals how to do it without making any cuts.

Pretty sure that's not what they're saying. If they give money to the university to study they should get a say in how it's run.

A news blackout on their crazy protest would make it even more pointless! I hope these disruptive students are not allowed to continue their studies at the uni following their criminal act.

It is typical of management at University of Sussex to carry on with this insane and ideologically driven privatisation of services, despite clear opposition from staff and students. Do they think that staff and students are stupid and that it is not worth consulting them before taking such a decision? If staff and students thought that this insane plan would improve services they would support it, but the fact is that it will do the opposite! This is the sort of obtuse top down management that is ruining education and health services in this country. Enough is enough! Good for you students! You have the overwhelming support of staff and other students, as well as of some very important "names". It is good to see young people fighting for what they believe in! Don't give up!

I'm surprised that the novelty hasn't already worn-off; most students have an attention span of 20 seconds

Privatisation may lead to short term gain but in the long term ... it is a costly means of ensuring a drop in service

theleftygiraffe wrote:

itsnotme wrote:
Perhaps if the protesters think they can do it so much better they can set up their own university and show the professionals how to do it without making any cuts.

Pretty sure that's not what they're saying. If they give money to the university to study they should get a say in how it's run.

What a stupid statement ! We're talking about support services here not teaching. I've not noticed the students complaining that university services such as banking or even student placement are supplied by private companies. Yet when other support services are put out to tender ( not teaching I'll point out ) they get all upset about it.This despite the employees involved not campaigning about it.

It's nothing but a few uneducated posh kids campaigning for the sake of it. So they've missed 3 weeks of lectures that THEY have paid for. I'm sure they will start moaning when they fail their final exams due to their own fault. Selfish, dragged up brats is all they are without any understanding of the real world.

itsnotme wrote:
Perhaps if the protesters think they can do it so much better they can set up their own university and show the professionals how to do it without making any cuts.

It has been announced more than once by the Vice Chancellor that the purpose of the proposed privatization of the University's services is NOT as a result of spending cuts.

It's nothing but a few uneducated posh kids campaigning for the sake of it.

Point of order Fightback - posh kids are usually educated because they have been to a decent private school. Poor kids are uneducated (in comparison) because they have had the benefit of Labour's fine Comprehensive (comprehensively bad that is) system.

Either way they have missed 3 weeks of education - not yet paid for by them and, if they fail their finals and don't get a job, it probably never will be !

Fight_Back wrote:

theleftygiraffe wrote:

itsnotme wrote:
Perhaps if the protesters think they can do it so much better they can set up their own university and show the professionals how to do it without making any cuts.

Pretty sure that's not what they're saying. If they give money to the university to study they should get a say in how it's run.

What a stupid statement ! We're talking about support services here not teaching. I've not noticed the students complaining that university services such as banking or even student placement are supplied by private companies. Yet when other support services are put out to tender ( not teaching I'll point out ) they get all upset about it.This despite the employees involved not campaigning about it.

It's nothing but a few uneducated posh kids campaigning for the sake of it. So they've missed 3 weeks of lectures that THEY have paid for. I'm sure they will start moaning when they fail their final exams due to their own fault. Selfish, dragged up brats is all they are without any understanding of the real world.

1) If you read the official statements from the current anti-privatization movement you will understand that actually there are real and pressing concerns about the potential effects of such a change. There are too many for me to list here but if you visit their Facebook page I am sure you will agree.

2) Some staff members are actively involved in the movement, and many others have voiced their support for it.

3) I challenge you to visit one of the occupied sites and take a while to air your views to the protesters - your opinion may well be altered once you realise how passionate, intelligent and articulate some of these so called 'brats' are. Do you think the movement would have attracted such support as Will Self, Noam Chomsky and Caroline Lucas if the situation was as much of a non-issue as you make it out to be?

I look forward to hearing your response.

Meanwhile the real world get on with life completely oblivious to this storm in a privatised tea cup.

theleftygiraffe wrote:

itsnotme wrote: Perhaps if the protesters think they can do it so much better they can set up their own university and show the professionals how to do it without making any cuts.

Pretty sure that's not what they're saying. If they give money to the university to study they should get a say in how it's run.

why should they,they obviously applied to go there because they like the way the uni is ran and the quality of teaching,not,who's cooking lunch.

A waste of time?

Well yes of course it is, we all knew it as soon as they started it so its hardly headline news!

bluemonday wrote:

theleftygiraffe wrote:

itsnotme wrote: Perhaps if the protesters think they can do it so much better they can set up their own university and show the professionals how to do it without making any cuts.

Pretty sure that's not what they're saying. If they give money to the university to study they should get a say in how it's run.

why should they,they obviously applied to go there because they like the way the uni is ran and the quality of teaching,not,who's cooking lunch.

'They obviously applied to go there because they like the way the uni is ran...' Right. And now they're taking exception to the way the uni is being run and they're trying to do something to change it. Although I'm not part of the occupation movement, I do believe that people should be able to stand up and speak up for their beliefs - though the majority of commentators on these articles seem intent on arbitrarily dismissing the movement as a bunch of lefty hippies who will soon tire of the novelty of occupation. I honestly don't believe this is doing the situation any justice and urge such people to research the proposal and the stances of the opposite sides in greater detail before coming to a conclusion.

Voting and protesting are pointless, the truth is out. Arson and mayhem may get their attention, you never know.

You just don't get why local people don't give a toss do you?
Well here goes. The unis have very little connection to the community apart from the physical presence of the buildings.
Annually the unis attract thousands of out of town kids who don't pay council tax and who behave like animals in our communities screaming, shouting, throwing rubbish onto the streets.
The unis have spent a decade ignoring locals pleas for them to reign in students to no avail.
Now you want support? Your principle may have good intention but your record in the community sadly means no one cares because you have been so utterly selfish just like your bosses running the place.
They don't give a toss about locals or workers. Do you get it now?

The students have a free choice.

They chose to attend this particular university. If they dont the way it is run they should vote with their feet and go to a different university or was it a case of Sussex being the only university to accept them ?

Hoses, anyone?

Fairfax Sakes wrote:
Hoses, anyone?

Censorship anyone?

Regardless of whether these students elected to come to Sussex or Sussex being the only Uni to accept them as has been suggested; They have the right to protest against a proposal they deem as wrong.

It is just sad that a University that once was really radical has now descended to displaying the behaviour we've learnt to expect from our less illustrious Politicians (Maggie, the thief of school childrens' milk, Blair the warmonger/Cameron the stealer of bread from the mouths of babes and Kitcat the cycle lane obsessive, the 389 greedy politicians involved in the expenses scandal to name but a few)

Power ueber alles style of government and authority should not be part of the democratic process we ave every right to expect in a country that claims it is a Democracy.

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
You just don't get why local people don't give a toss do you?
Well here goes. The unis have very little connection to the community apart from the physical presence of the buildings.
Annually the unis attract thousands of out of town kids who don't pay council tax and who behave like animals in our communities screaming, shouting, throwing rubbish onto the streets.
The unis have spent a decade ignoring locals pleas for them to reign in students to no avail.
Now you want support? Your principle may have good intention but your record in the community sadly means no one cares because you have been so utterly selfish just like your bosses running the place.
They don't give a toss about locals or workers. Do you get it now?

Certainly a valid point, and one I haven't heard before in relation to this movement. A couple of brief points though; firstly, as a student of the University I'm sad that this is the impression you have of students in general.Whilst there are a number of students who do do the things you describe, there are also many more who form a conscientious and important part of society in the town. However, you probably don't notice these students because they are more likely to be studying in the library and working hard to achieve a good degree - you may scoff at this but I assure you it is the truth. Secondly, and more importantly, one of the major focuses of the current occupation is actually on trying to prevent the outsourcing of 235 jobs on campus to private contractors. These staff members were NOT consulted about the change. Imagine if you were in their position - job security suddenly thrown into doubt, pension plans could be changed etc etc. I suppose what I am trying to say is that even if the local community finds it difficult to back students for whatever (in my opinion, fair) reason, surely these workers - some of whom have been employed by the University for 10+ years - deserve some sort of support?

unbiasedneutral wrote:

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
You just don't get why local people don't give a toss do you?
Well here goes. The unis have very little connection to the community apart from the physical presence of the buildings.
Annually the unis attract thousands of out of town kids who don't pay council tax and who behave like animals in our communities screaming, shouting, throwing rubbish onto the streets.
The unis have spent a decade ignoring locals pleas for them to reign in students to no avail.
Now you want support? Your principle may have good intention but your record in the community sadly means no one cares because you have been so utterly selfish just like your bosses running the place.
They don't give a toss about locals or workers. Do you get it now?

Certainly a valid point, and one I haven't heard before in relation to this movement. A couple of brief points though; firstly, as a student of the University I'm sad that this is the impression you have of students in general.Whilst there are a number of students who do do the things you describe, there are also many more who form a conscientious and important part of society in the town. However, you probably don't notice these students because they are more likely to be studying in the library and working hard to achieve a good degree - you may scoff at this but I assure you it is the truth. Secondly, and more importantly, one of the major focuses of the current occupation is actually on trying to prevent the outsourcing of 235 jobs on campus to private contractors. These staff members were NOT consulted about the change. Imagine if you were in their position - job security suddenly thrown into doubt, pension plans could be changed etc etc. I suppose what I am trying to say is that even if the local community finds it difficult to back students for whatever (in my opinion, fair) reason, surely these workers - some of whom have been employed by the University for 10+ years - deserve some sort of support?

Great way to start the weekend!

Just spent the last 5 minutes belly laughing at your comments and will look out for any future posts you make for same reason.

Now to reality...

The proposed changes will take place regardless of the actions of this misguided minority and they would do well to consider that at the end of their protest journey, no one will be there to support them.

One opportunity might be the OccupyBrighton movement that in the past has proved of interest to posh kids, although typically 6 weeks and a gust of wind and its all over.

Though I can understand the reason Somethingsarejustwro
ng, I am appalled at anyone who advocates considering oneself defeated before even trying.

Regardless of whether these are current students or not do we really want people to stop caring enough about change to want to address it?
Maybe the protest will change nothing ... But at least those with a social conscience can say they tried.

I marched with the anti-poll tax campaign, I was out there with the anti-war movement to mention but a couple. Neither of them were successful in different ways. Do I view those periods as a waste of time? No ... though there were other things I could have been doing, like sitting back and bemoaning the fact that it wouldn't matter me going as it won't change anything anyway.

I am 56 years old, in a wheelchair, greyhaired, decrepit and worn out. But I still take on causes I care about, even those I think don't stand a snowballs chance in Hades, and I still fight till the bitter end. Not because it always changes things for the better but because not voicing my disapprobation may well make things worse.

Think of the suffragettes, think of the thousands of people that beavered away behind the scenes in the abolition of slavery movements, again referring to but two. Some never saw the desired change come about in their lifetime. But their seemingly futile efforts then eventually led to changes they could only dream about.

Sadly students the global market now overshadows local employment rules.
The very reason you enjoy cheap computers, tvs, booze, telecoms etc is because of cheap labour in emergin economies.
In 30 years if working I've been in sourced and out sourced and restructured more times than I can remember as well as made redundant several times.
When you start work you will realise that while your protest had good intention, you are a minuscule wheel in an out of control wagon.
Employment rights are out of the window in the workplace except councils which are the last workers stronghold.

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
Sadly students the global market now overshadows local employment rules.
The very reason you enjoy cheap computers, tvs, booze, telecoms etc is because of cheap labour in emergin economies.
In 30 years if working I've been in sourced and out sourced and restructured more times than I can remember as well as made redundant several times.
When you start work you will realise that while your protest had good intention, you are a minuscule wheel in an out of control wagon.
Employment rights are out of the window in the workplace except councils which are the last workers stronghold.

Which doesn't necessarily mean we should just bow to the inevitable.

At one time it was viewed as inevitable that some people were sold. If things are wrong, they need to be addressed.

Somethingsarejustwro
ng wrote:

unbiasedneutral wrote:

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
You just don't get why local people don't give a toss do you?
Well here goes. The unis have very little connection to the community apart from the physical presence of the buildings.
Annually the unis attract thousands of out of town kids who don't pay council tax and who behave like animals in our communities screaming, shouting, throwing rubbish onto the streets.
The unis have spent a decade ignoring locals pleas for them to reign in students to no avail.
Now you want support? Your principle may have good intention but your record in the community sadly means no one cares because you have been so utterly selfish just like your bosses running the place.
They don't give a toss about locals or workers. Do you get it now?

Certainly a valid point, and one I haven't heard before in relation to this movement. A couple of brief points though; firstly, as a student of the University I'm sad that this is the impression you have of students in general.Whilst there are a number of students who do do the things you describe, there are also many more who form a conscientious and important part of society in the town. However, you probably don't notice these students because they are more likely to be studying in the library and working hard to achieve a good degree - you may scoff at this but I assure you it is the truth. Secondly, and more importantly, one of the major focuses of the current occupation is actually on trying to prevent the outsourcing of 235 jobs on campus to private contractors. These staff members were NOT consulted about the change. Imagine if you were in their position - job security suddenly thrown into doubt, pension plans could be changed etc etc. I suppose what I am trying to say is that even if the local community finds it difficult to back students for whatever (in my opinion, fair) reason, surely these workers - some of whom have been employed by the University for 10+ years - deserve some sort of support?

Great way to start the weekend!

Just spent the last 5 minutes belly laughing at your comments and will look out for any future posts you make for same reason.

Now to reality...

The proposed changes will take place regardless of the actions of this misguided minority and they would do well to consider that at the end of their protest journey, no one will be there to support them.

One opportunity might be the OccupyBrighton movement that in the past has proved of interest to posh kids, although typically 6 weeks and a gust of wind and its all over.

Although you might not support this particular campaign, it is similar movements which have quickly snowballed and grown into revolutions in the past. Laugh all you like, it's the truth.