Boris Bike scheme is a bit of an uphill struggle

The Argus: Boris Bike scheme is a bit of an uphill struggle Boris Bike scheme is a bit of an uphill struggle

A bike-hire scheme has been dismissed for Brighton and Hove because it is too hilly.

Ian Davey, the city council’s transport committee chairman, ruled out a Boris Bikes style initiative due to costs.

Among the issues highlighted were the running costs of a bike-hire scheme.

In theory, cyclists can pick up a bike at one point in the city and leave it at another point in the city at the end of their journey.

However there are fears people would be more inclined to use the bikes to travel down the city’s hills but not want to ride back up.

It means staff and a van would be needed to regularly redistribute the bikes to the more popular pick up points in the city.

Added to the initial start- up costs of the scheme, Coun Davey believed, while he would welcome an initiative in the city, it was simply not practical at the moment.

He said: “These schemes are not cheap to run. “Our emphasis has been on making Brighton and Hove a city safe for cycling and creating the right environment for more people to use a bike.

“Schemes such as these come forward but we already have shops in the city which hire bikes.”

He added plans like the 20mph scheme were creating “the right conditions for many people to cycle” and that was a better use of resources.

Some of the city’s most recent bike schemes have come under fire such as the Old Shoreham Road cycle lane and the redevelop- ment of L e w e s Road.

The city ’s Tory party initially backed a Boris Bikes scheme when they were in power but were voted out before it could be introduced.

Worthing however is considering its own Boris Bikes.

Council leader Paul Yallop said he believed a bike- hire scheme could revive the town because it was “very flat”.
 

Coun Yallop said he was keen to see what people thought of the idea which could require business sponsorship to get off the ground – such as the Barclays part- nership with the London bikes.

Coun Yallop said: “The high street and the town centres need to reinvent themselves with what they’ve been through over the past few years.

“Perhaps this is another idea where we can make Worthing a more vibrant place. “There could be a lot of people that would like to take advantage of a scheme like this.”

 

Comments (55)

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9:34am Sun 7 Apr 13

Somethingsarejustwrong says...

So the ridiculous Greens have been wasting huge amounts of money on building out infrastructure, which now by their own admission is unsuitable for use.

Couldn't make it up...where's HJarrs when we need her most?
So the ridiculous Greens have been wasting huge amounts of money on building out infrastructure, which now by their own admission is unsuitable for use. Couldn't make it up...where's HJarrs when we need her most? Somethingsarejustwrong

9:44am Sun 7 Apr 13

mimseycal says...

Somethingsarejustwro
ng
wrote:
So the ridiculous Greens have been wasting huge amounts of money on building out infrastructure, which now by their own admission is unsuitable for use.

Couldn't make it up...where's HJarrs when we need her most?
Aw! You took the words out of my mouth!

Consistency across the board certainly seems a foreign concept to Kitcat and co.
[quote][p][bold]Somethingsarejustwro ng[/bold] wrote: So the ridiculous Greens have been wasting huge amounts of money on building out infrastructure, which now by their own admission is unsuitable for use. Couldn't make it up...where's HJarrs when we need her most?[/p][/quote]Aw! You took the words out of my mouth! Consistency across the board certainly seems a foreign concept to Kitcat and co. mimseycal

9:54am Sun 7 Apr 13

rpdutt says...

'It means staff and a van would be needed to regularly redistribute the bikes to the more popular pick up points in the city.'
Eh? Of course it does, and you'd need more than one van. The London scheme does so. Did they even look at London?
Is there no one forward-thinking in the council?
'It means staff and a van would be needed to regularly redistribute the bikes to the more popular pick up points in the city.' Eh? Of course it does, and you'd need more than one van. The London scheme does so. Did they even look at London? Is there no one forward-thinking in the council? rpdutt

10:01am Sun 7 Apr 13

Tallywhacker says...

I think you will find that on average Brighton is in fact flat. Using the council formula for statistics, by subtracting the depth of the valleys from the height of the hills, averaging and then rounding up or down as you need Brighton is built on a flat and level plain. Except for the playing fields which are tilted as required because nobody plays on a level playing field.
I think you will find that on average Brighton is in fact flat. Using the council formula for statistics, by subtracting the depth of the valleys from the height of the hills, averaging and then rounding up or down as you need Brighton is built on a flat and level plain. Except for the playing fields which are tilted as required because nobody plays on a level playing field. Tallywhacker

10:02am Sun 7 Apr 13

The last temptation of crisps says...

Every town should have an old bike for visiting strangers to ride.
People sneering at the Green's dysfunctional policies need to accept they are a party ahead of the times.
The post-apocalyptic, fossil fuel depleted, mung bean morality, eco twattery will be a viable option in about 500 years...if all goes badly.
Every town should have an old bike for visiting strangers to ride. People sneering at the Green's dysfunctional policies need to accept they are a party ahead of the times. The post-apocalyptic, fossil fuel depleted, mung bean morality, eco twattery will be a viable option in about 500 years...if all goes badly. The last temptation of crisps

10:08am Sun 7 Apr 13

Tallywhacker says...

Oh, I forgot. The goalposts. The goalposts on the fields are shift-able. Unless you are playing with the councils ball, in which case if they are losing they will of course take it home to their mummy. But basically it's flat, on average, so too speak.
Oh, I forgot. The goalposts. The goalposts on the fields are shift-able. Unless you are playing with the councils ball, in which case if they are losing they will of course take it home to their mummy. But basically it's flat, on average, so too speak. Tallywhacker

10:11am Sun 7 Apr 13

Plantpot says...

So now we know what the overwhelming majority already knew - that the current level of cycling is about as good as it's going to get. The sheer waste of taxpayers money, local or not, on vanity projects such as the Lewes Road and OSR is staggering. And this in a time when the Greens bleat about costs. One thing is for sure - the LR & OSR projects will be extraordinarily expensive to put right, and will be an enduring memorial to the Green menace, and what happens when people stay at home when they could be voting.

The cycling project on The Drive, permanently devoid of cyclists as it is, is nothing other than an act of vandalism.
So now we know what the overwhelming majority already knew - that the current level of cycling is about as good as it's going to get. The sheer waste of taxpayers money, local or not, on vanity projects such as the Lewes Road and OSR is staggering. And this in a time when the Greens bleat about costs. One thing is for sure - the LR & OSR projects will be extraordinarily expensive to put right, and will be an enduring memorial to the Green menace, and what happens when people stay at home when they could be voting. The cycling project on The Drive, permanently devoid of cyclists as it is, is nothing other than an act of vandalism. Plantpot

10:14am Sun 7 Apr 13

Morpheus says...

Brighton too hilly? The council needs to move from the seafront to the top of Elm Grove and get a touch of reality about Brighton.
Brighton too hilly? The council needs to move from the seafront to the top of Elm Grove and get a touch of reality about Brighton. Morpheus

10:19am Sun 7 Apr 13

Maxwell's Ghost says...

And herein lies the truth about why people don't cycle in the city, the topography makes it impractical unless you are very fit and don't need to use the bike for transporting food/goods or kids.
If the greens had bothered doing a census of all the student areas off the Lewes Road corridor about why they don't cycle that would be the main answer. Instead they rolled out a £6 million scheme on the route which we now know will take less than one per cent of traffic off the road. What a very expensive experiment. Now we need a scheme which will remove the hills of Bear Road, Coombe Road, Ditchling Road and Southover Street and Elm Grove.
But remember, last week HJarrs said that she didn't go into Brighton at Easter because it was too cold even though she only lives in Hanover yet she thinks we should all be cycling. I cycle and I can tell you it's been one of the hardest years with the wet summer and then ice cold windy winters.
And herein lies the truth about why people don't cycle in the city, the topography makes it impractical unless you are very fit and don't need to use the bike for transporting food/goods or kids. If the greens had bothered doing a census of all the student areas off the Lewes Road corridor about why they don't cycle that would be the main answer. Instead they rolled out a £6 million scheme on the route which we now know will take less than one per cent of traffic off the road. What a very expensive experiment. Now we need a scheme which will remove the hills of Bear Road, Coombe Road, Ditchling Road and Southover Street and Elm Grove. But remember, last week HJarrs said that she didn't go into Brighton at Easter because it was too cold even though she only lives in Hanover yet she thinks we should all be cycling. I cycle and I can tell you it's been one of the hardest years with the wet summer and then ice cold windy winters. Maxwell's Ghost

10:30am Sun 7 Apr 13

Dealing with idiots says...

We will shortly be launching a range of toilet target stickers to commemorate the Green administrations great achievements in Brighton and Hove. They will feature all your favourites including councillors Kitcat, Davey and Hawtree and are designed to last until 5th May 2015. Also a range contemporary under bed china night soil ware featuring the grinning visage of the same councillors is also proposed. Order early to avoid disappointment.
We will shortly be launching a range of toilet target stickers to commemorate the Green administrations great achievements in Brighton and Hove. They will feature all your favourites including councillors Kitcat, Davey and Hawtree and are designed to last until 5th May 2015. Also a range contemporary under bed china night soil ware featuring the grinning visage of the same councillors is also proposed. Order early to avoid disappointment. Dealing with idiots

10:34am Sun 7 Apr 13

tekniko says...

A bit late for an April Fools prank from the Greens.
A bit late for an April Fools prank from the Greens. tekniko

10:41am Sun 7 Apr 13

george smith says...

The last temptation of crisps wrote:
Every town should have an old bike for visiting strangers to ride. People sneering at the Green's dysfunctional policies need to accept they are a party ahead of the times. The post-apocalyptic, fossil fuel depleted, mung bean morality, eco twattery will be a viable option in about 500 years...if all goes badly.
Really is that why the chinese are off their bikes and cannot buy cars fast enough?
[quote][p][bold]The last temptation of crisps[/bold] wrote: Every town should have an old bike for visiting strangers to ride. People sneering at the Green's dysfunctional policies need to accept they are a party ahead of the times. The post-apocalyptic, fossil fuel depleted, mung bean morality, eco twattery will be a viable option in about 500 years...if all goes badly.[/p][/quote]Really is that why the chinese are off their bikes and cannot buy cars fast enough? george smith

10:42am Sun 7 Apr 13

rpdutt says...

'People don't cycle in the city'. I see lots of people doing so daily, and would join them if a bike-hire scheme were introduced. The Greens should be castigated, not for doing too much for cycling, but for doing too little.
'People don't cycle in the city'. I see lots of people doing so daily, and would join them if a bike-hire scheme were introduced. The Greens should be castigated, not for doing too much for cycling, but for doing too little. rpdutt

10:58am Sun 7 Apr 13

bikerjimbo says...

The greens are coming to their senses then after doshing out loads of wonga, (sorry our wonga). Do they really live here if it has taken them that long to realise Brighton is hilly. What goes down must go up at some point and that will include getting rid of the lunatic schemes a legacy of the Greens
The greens are coming to their senses then after doshing out loads of wonga, (sorry our wonga). Do they really live here if it has taken them that long to realise Brighton is hilly. What goes down must go up at some point and that will include getting rid of the lunatic schemes a legacy of the Greens bikerjimbo

10:59am Sun 7 Apr 13

makoshark says...

I have an idea that may solve this problem!... How about if every bike also had a small propulsion unit that would assist climbing the hilly parts! Hey, lets take it a bit further, why not add a couple of extra wheels to make the bikes with propulsion a bit more stable and safe... and then why not simply encase these four wheeled self propelled bikes with a roof and doors to protect from the horrific weather we have been having! Just an idea! (but hang on, a forward thinking council could then have places to store these items whilst not in use, even differing floors to save space... and how about a centralised service that charges some form of tax for using the road... anyone think it could catch on?)
I have an idea that may solve this problem!... How about if every bike also had a small propulsion unit that would assist climbing the hilly parts! Hey, lets take it a bit further, why not add a couple of extra wheels to make the bikes with propulsion a bit more stable and safe... and then why not simply encase these four wheeled self propelled bikes with a roof and doors to protect from the horrific weather we have been having! Just an idea! (but hang on, a forward thinking council could then have places to store these items whilst not in use, even differing floors to save space... and how about a centralised service that charges some form of tax for using the road... anyone think it could catch on?) makoshark

11:00am Sun 7 Apr 13

Plantpot says...

rpdutt wrote:
'People don't cycle in the city'. I see lots of people doing so daily, and would join them if a bike-hire scheme were introduced. The Greens should be castigated, not for doing too much for cycling, but for doing too little.
As a proportion of road users, the number of cyclists is minute. The vastly expensive cycle schemes have demonstrated that there is no pent up demand for cycling facilities in the city. If everyone stuck to the Highway Code, or just employed common sense, there would be little to no reason for dedicated cycling schemes anyway.
[quote][p][bold]rpdutt[/bold] wrote: 'People don't cycle in the city'. I see lots of people doing so daily, and would join them if a bike-hire scheme were introduced. The Greens should be castigated, not for doing too much for cycling, but for doing too little.[/p][/quote]As a proportion of road users, the number of cyclists is minute. The vastly expensive cycle schemes have demonstrated that there is no pent up demand for cycling facilities in the city. If everyone stuck to the Highway Code, or just employed common sense, there would be little to no reason for dedicated cycling schemes anyway. Plantpot

11:02am Sun 7 Apr 13

qm says...

There seems to be an inconsistency between building cycle lanes and encouraging people to cycle about town, and a related proposal not being supported because it's too hilly.
As for the "not being convenient at the moment " from Councillor Davey, are we waiting for natural erosion (a few hundred thousand years perhaps) to make it more convenient, or is it closer to the truth that the Council has spent too much of our taxes on hair brained activities like ripping up perfectly good lawns etc. etc. I have no doubt that many of my far more knowledgeable peers here will have a plethora of examples that meet that criteria!
There seems to be an inconsistency between building cycle lanes and encouraging people to cycle about town, and a related proposal not being supported because it's too hilly. As for the "not being convenient at the moment " from Councillor Davey, are we waiting for natural erosion (a few hundred thousand years perhaps) to make it more convenient, or is it closer to the truth that the Council has spent too much of our taxes on hair brained activities like ripping up perfectly good lawns etc. etc. I have no doubt that many of my far more knowledgeable peers here will have a plethora of examples that meet that criteria! qm

11:25am Sun 7 Apr 13

NickBtn says...

It feels like we're all living in a channel 4 political comedy.... One where all this money is spent on cycle lanes and then we have the punch line that it's all too hilly and no-one wants them!

Plenty of other comic moments for anyone wanting to write a script for this comedy involving fish, excessive parking charges and a tree

Only problem is that if you made a TV series of it all no one would believe that it was real.....
It feels like we're all living in a channel 4 political comedy.... One where all this money is spent on cycle lanes and then we have the punch line that it's all too hilly and no-one wants them! Plenty of other comic moments for anyone wanting to write a script for this comedy involving fish, excessive parking charges and a tree Only problem is that if you made a TV series of it all no one would believe that it was real..... NickBtn

11:36am Sun 7 Apr 13

qm says...

NickBtn wrote:
It feels like we're all living in a channel 4 political comedy.... One where all this money is spent on cycle lanes and then we have the punch line that it's all too hilly and no-one wants them!

Plenty of other comic moments for anyone wanting to write a script for this comedy involving fish, excessive parking charges and a tree

Only problem is that if you made a TV series of it all no one would believe that it was real.....
Unless you lived in Brighton or Hove!
:))
[quote][p][bold]NickBtn[/bold] wrote: It feels like we're all living in a channel 4 political comedy.... One where all this money is spent on cycle lanes and then we have the punch line that it's all too hilly and no-one wants them! Plenty of other comic moments for anyone wanting to write a script for this comedy involving fish, excessive parking charges and a tree Only problem is that if you made a TV series of it all no one would believe that it was real.....[/p][/quote]Unless you lived in Brighton or Hove! :)) qm

11:43am Sun 7 Apr 13

Cgull says...

Surprised the greens haven't put in a proposal to flatten the city.
Surprised the greens haven't put in a proposal to flatten the city. Cgull

11:47am Sun 7 Apr 13

Fercri Sakes says...

Somethingsarejustwro
ng
wrote:
So the ridiculous Greens have been wasting huge amounts of money on building out infrastructure, which now by their own admission is unsuitable for use.

Couldn't make it up...where's HJarrs when we need her most?
Unsuitable for tubby car drivers perhaps. The rest of us are enjoying the cycle improvements in town as we don't have to compete with fast big lumps of metal that can easily kill us if the driver lacks concentration or is a bit nasty.

Brighton may be hilly but Hove is pretty flat. Even the unfit should be able to cycle up The Drive and along the Old Shoreham Road. And the Lewes Road is far from hilly.

Unfortunately it seems that some car drivers want all us to ditch our cycles for cars. This Clarksonesque twisted logic will really improve parking and traffic conditions in town.
[quote][p][bold]Somethingsarejustwro ng[/bold] wrote: So the ridiculous Greens have been wasting huge amounts of money on building out infrastructure, which now by their own admission is unsuitable for use. Couldn't make it up...where's HJarrs when we need her most?[/p][/quote]Unsuitable for tubby car drivers perhaps. The rest of us are enjoying the cycle improvements in town as we don't have to compete with fast big lumps of metal that can easily kill us if the driver lacks concentration or is a bit nasty. Brighton may be hilly but Hove is pretty flat. Even the unfit should be able to cycle up The Drive and along the Old Shoreham Road. And the Lewes Road is far from hilly. Unfortunately it seems that some car drivers want all us to ditch our cycles for cars. This Clarksonesque twisted logic will really improve parking and traffic conditions in town. Fercri Sakes

11:50am Sun 7 Apr 13

Maxwell's Ghost says...

I cycle along the Lewes Road every day and there was no need to spend all the cash in a new bike lane for the 20 of us who use the route.
The worst bit if this road is the stretch from bear road to elm grove which is. Bike lane full of parked cars. What do the Greens do about the really troublesome stretch? Nothing so it negates any work done on the rest of the route.
As for cycling its hard work and if you want to do it in all weathers as a real commute you really do have to spend cash in decent waterproof kit and shoes and then have shower and changing facilities at work.
All of these elements to being able to use two wheels as a viable alternative to the car reduce the likelihood of people doing it in large numbers.
The other risk on the Lewes Road the Greens refuse to address are the bendy buses which Boris banned from London yet the council did not object to in Brighton. I would advise HJarrs and the Green councillors to watch bikes and the buses in action around the Gyratory, particularly the bend opposite the Bear pub. It's life threatening as the bus sweeps around the outside lane while the rear end sweeps through the inside lane and the small section of cycle lane. I cannot believe the council has not objected to these vehicles. The city's roads are not suitable for these vehicles.
I cycle along the Lewes Road every day and there was no need to spend all the cash in a new bike lane for the 20 of us who use the route. The worst bit if this road is the stretch from bear road to elm grove which is. Bike lane full of parked cars. What do the Greens do about the really troublesome stretch? Nothing so it negates any work done on the rest of the route. As for cycling its hard work and if you want to do it in all weathers as a real commute you really do have to spend cash in decent waterproof kit and shoes and then have shower and changing facilities at work. All of these elements to being able to use two wheels as a viable alternative to the car reduce the likelihood of people doing it in large numbers. The other risk on the Lewes Road the Greens refuse to address are the bendy buses which Boris banned from London yet the council did not object to in Brighton. I would advise HJarrs and the Green councillors to watch bikes and the buses in action around the Gyratory, particularly the bend opposite the Bear pub. It's life threatening as the bus sweeps around the outside lane while the rear end sweeps through the inside lane and the small section of cycle lane. I cannot believe the council has not objected to these vehicles. The city's roads are not suitable for these vehicles. Maxwell's Ghost

11:52am Sun 7 Apr 13

Automaton says...

Can't believe the Greens won't support this. Why do they have to have bike stations at the top of the very hilly areas. Surely they could be mainly in the centre of town, at the stations and seafront.i suspect one of the reasons some people don't cycle is the hassle of securing ones bike at the destination. Using this bike scheme would circumvent this problem. I bet many more people would cycle is a system like this was implemented
What a waste of space the greens are!
Can't believe the Greens won't support this. Why do they have to have bike stations at the top of the very hilly areas. Surely they could be mainly in the centre of town, at the stations and seafront.i suspect one of the reasons some people don't cycle is the hassle of securing ones bike at the destination. Using this bike scheme would circumvent this problem. I bet many more people would cycle is a system like this was implemented What a waste of space the greens are! Automaton

11:56am Sun 7 Apr 13

rolivan says...

Now they have caught up having rushed around making sure they spent last years budget they have now decidede to put the Brakes on for this year until they have some Grants approved.
Now they have caught up having rushed around making sure they spent last years budget they have now decidede to put the Brakes on for this year until they have some Grants approved. rolivan

12:15pm Sun 7 Apr 13

qm says...

On reflection, perhaps it's not a good idea after all when you look at how low London has had to go to find a sponsor . . . .
On reflection, perhaps it's not a good idea after all when you look at how low London has had to go to find a sponsor . . . . qm

4:15pm Sun 7 Apr 13

BURIRAM says...

Worthing to have a Bike Scheme, just when I was thinking of setting up a Scheme to hire Zimmer Frames so people could walk from one place to another.
Worthing to have a Bike Scheme, just when I was thinking of setting up a Scheme to hire Zimmer Frames so people could walk from one place to another. BURIRAM

5:42pm Sun 7 Apr 13

Jimmy Stewart's Imaginary Rabbit says...

Blimey, Mr Davey in 'sensible decision' shock! He's right though, outside of the flat seafront and its immediate hinterland Brighton is far too hilly for cycling to be anything other than a mode of transport for a tiny, tiny minority. Hopefully future transport initiatives will reflect this.

Now electric bikes that you don't need to pedal UP the hills ...
Blimey, Mr Davey in 'sensible decision' shock! He's right though, outside of the flat seafront and its immediate hinterland Brighton is far too hilly for cycling to be anything other than a mode of transport for a tiny, tiny minority. Hopefully future transport initiatives will reflect this. Now electric bikes that you don't need to pedal UP the hills ... Jimmy Stewart's Imaginary Rabbit

6:00pm Sun 7 Apr 13

Dealing with idiots says...

george smith wrote:
The last temptation of crisps wrote: Every town should have an old bike for visiting strangers to ride. People sneering at the Green's dysfunctional policies need to accept they are a party ahead of the times. The post-apocalyptic, fossil fuel depleted, mung bean morality, eco twattery will be a viable option in about 500 years...if all goes badly.
Really is that why the chinese are off their bikes and cannot buy cars fast enough?
Ah but the Chinese are gradually weaning themselves of totalitarian rule whereas Kitbrat and his shower are introducing it here.
[quote][p][bold]george smith[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The last temptation of crisps[/bold] wrote: Every town should have an old bike for visiting strangers to ride. People sneering at the Green's dysfunctional policies need to accept they are a party ahead of the times. The post-apocalyptic, fossil fuel depleted, mung bean morality, eco twattery will be a viable option in about 500 years...if all goes badly.[/p][/quote]Really is that why the chinese are off their bikes and cannot buy cars fast enough?[/p][/quote]Ah but the Chinese are gradually weaning themselves of totalitarian rule whereas Kitbrat and his shower are introducing it here. Dealing with idiots

7:18pm Sun 7 Apr 13

HJarrs says...

Councillor Davey is bang on the money with his comment. The Boris Bike scheme, nice though it would be, is very expensive to run and relys on continuous public funding, which would have the usual suspects above up in arms, jabbering on about anti-car vanity projects. Also, the Boris bike is a 3 gear 23 kg monster and so a different and lighter solution is required for the hilly parts of the city.

Instead, we need to concentrate the limited resources on providing decent infrastructure. For example £600k of council cash has levered in £5.5 million of external funding for improving the Lewes Rd corridor, of which a good quality cycle lane is part. As has been pointed out above, this route, which has thousands of potential users, is woefully underused, though 755 daily cycle journeys as quoted in a recent transport survey is somewhat about the 20 users quoted above!

Once more safe and convenient cycle routes are built and established and ridership is up then a more sophisticated city wide bike scheme might be practical with a mix of lighter weight bikes and electric bikes; funding permitting. In the mean time the council should support and promote the existing private bike hire operators.
Councillor Davey is bang on the money with his comment. The Boris Bike scheme, nice though it would be, is very expensive to run and relys on continuous public funding, which would have the usual suspects above up in arms, jabbering on about anti-car vanity projects. Also, the Boris bike is a 3 gear 23 kg monster and so a different and lighter solution is required for the hilly parts of the city. Instead, we need to concentrate the limited resources on providing decent infrastructure. For example £600k of council cash has levered in £5.5 million of external funding for improving the Lewes Rd corridor, of which a good quality cycle lane is part. As has been pointed out above, this route, which has thousands of potential users, is woefully underused, though 755 daily cycle journeys as quoted in a recent transport survey is somewhat about the 20 users quoted above! Once more safe and convenient cycle routes are built and established and ridership is up then a more sophisticated city wide bike scheme might be practical with a mix of lighter weight bikes and electric bikes; funding permitting. In the mean time the council should support and promote the existing private bike hire operators. HJarrs

8:35pm Sun 7 Apr 13

rpdutt says...

Agreed, Boris bikes are chunky, but they need to be to stand up to hire use. I can't see the private hire people as a solution unless they're prepared to invest in the infrastructure of docking stations etc the scheme requires. If I want to hire a bike at the. Station and dock it somewhere else, say at the Pavilion or Hove Lawns, there's no one offering that service, nor will there be if we leave it to the existing providers
Agreed, Boris bikes are chunky, but they need to be to stand up to hire use. I can't see the private hire people as a solution unless they're prepared to invest in the infrastructure of docking stations etc the scheme requires. If I want to hire a bike at the. Station and dock it somewhere else, say at the Pavilion or Hove Lawns, there's no one offering that service, nor will there be if we leave it to the existing providers rpdutt

8:36pm Sun 7 Apr 13

rolivan says...

HJarrs wrote:
Councillor Davey is bang on the money with his comment. The Boris Bike scheme, nice though it would be, is very expensive to run and relys on continuous public funding, which would have the usual suspects above up in arms, jabbering on about anti-car vanity projects. Also, the Boris bike is a 3 gear 23 kg monster and so a different and lighter solution is required for the hilly parts of the city.

Instead, we need to concentrate the limited resources on providing decent infrastructure. For example £600k of council cash has levered in £5.5 million of external funding for improving the Lewes Rd corridor, of which a good quality cycle lane is part. As has been pointed out above, this route, which has thousands of potential users, is woefully underused, though 755 daily cycle journeys as quoted in a recent transport survey is somewhat about the 20 users quoted above!

Once more safe and convenient cycle routes are built and established and ridership is up then a more sophisticated city wide bike scheme might be practical with a mix of lighter weight bikes and electric bikes; funding permitting. In the mean time the council should support and promote the existing private bike hire operators.
"Also, the Boris bike is a 3 gear 23 kg monster and so a different and lighter solution is required for the hilly parts of the city"

It would be far easier to tell us the non hilly parts which is most of Hove south of Old Shoreham Rd.Lewes Rd London Rd / Preston Rd and the seafront along to the Marina and up to St James St
[quote][p][bold]HJarrs[/bold] wrote: Councillor Davey is bang on the money with his comment. The Boris Bike scheme, nice though it would be, is very expensive to run and relys on continuous public funding, which would have the usual suspects above up in arms, jabbering on about anti-car vanity projects. Also, the Boris bike is a 3 gear 23 kg monster and so a different and lighter solution is required for the hilly parts of the city. Instead, we need to concentrate the limited resources on providing decent infrastructure. For example £600k of council cash has levered in £5.5 million of external funding for improving the Lewes Rd corridor, of which a good quality cycle lane is part. As has been pointed out above, this route, which has thousands of potential users, is woefully underused, though 755 daily cycle journeys as quoted in a recent transport survey is somewhat about the 20 users quoted above! Once more safe and convenient cycle routes are built and established and ridership is up then a more sophisticated city wide bike scheme might be practical with a mix of lighter weight bikes and electric bikes; funding permitting. In the mean time the council should support and promote the existing private bike hire operators.[/p][/quote]"Also, the Boris bike is a 3 gear 23 kg monster and so a different and lighter solution is required for the hilly parts of the city" It would be far easier to tell us the non hilly parts which is most of Hove south of Old Shoreham Rd.Lewes Rd London Rd / Preston Rd and the seafront along to the Marina and up to St James St rolivan

8:48pm Sun 7 Apr 13

Maxwell's Ghost says...

......HJarrs who lives in Hanover and said she didn't venture into Brighton during Easter as it was too chilly yet believes hoardes of people want to trek up the steep Brighton hills with a 15mph north easterly biting in their face.
Now HJarrs, I challenge you to get a bike and cycle it up Bear Road.
Tell me how long it takes you, tell me what bike you used, what gears you used and the cost of the bike and I will share with you my results. I have a couple of bikes, one for Brighton centre (where the wheels get stamped on when parked) a commuting bike, which is a light road bike and a hybrid spare.
Come on HJarrs share your experience or I will get The Argus to sort out a challenge for you.
......HJarrs who lives in Hanover and said she didn't venture into Brighton during Easter as it was too chilly yet believes hoardes of people want to trek up the steep Brighton hills with a 15mph north easterly biting in their face. Now HJarrs, I challenge you to get a bike and cycle it up Bear Road. Tell me how long it takes you, tell me what bike you used, what gears you used and the cost of the bike and I will share with you my results. I have a couple of bikes, one for Brighton centre (where the wheels get stamped on when parked) a commuting bike, which is a light road bike and a hybrid spare. Come on HJarrs share your experience or I will get The Argus to sort out a challenge for you. Maxwell's Ghost

9:02pm Sun 7 Apr 13

HJarrs says...

Bear Rd is a poor example, most people do not live on such an extreme climb. A more typical example would be city centre to falmer, along Western Road or along the seafront, as these are more popular routes. I bet you don't see many Boris Bikes topping Hampstead Heath, a detour I used to take to get a hill in on my commute when living in London years ago(no I didn't live in a posh house Maxy).

However, you nicely make my point about needing a more sophisticated offering. I like the idea of prividing options of electric bikes for those not wanting to sweat their way up some of the more hilly areas of the city.
Bear Rd is a poor example, most people do not live on such an extreme climb. A more typical example would be city centre to falmer, along Western Road or along the seafront, as these are more popular routes. I bet you don't see many Boris Bikes topping Hampstead Heath, a detour I used to take to get a hill in on my commute when living in London years ago(no I didn't live in a posh house Maxy). However, you nicely make my point about needing a more sophisticated offering. I like the idea of prividing options of electric bikes for those not wanting to sweat their way up some of the more hilly areas of the city. HJarrs

9:11pm Sun 7 Apr 13

HJarrs says...

rpdutt wrote:
Agreed, Boris bikes are chunky, but they need to be to stand up to hire use. I can't see the private hire people as a solution unless they're prepared to invest in the infrastructure of docking stations etc the scheme requires. If I want to hire a bike at the. Station and dock it somewhere else, say at the Pavilion or Hove Lawns, there's no one offering that service, nor will there be if we leave it to the existing providers
You are quite right, there will be no private Boris Bike provider as it makes no money without subsidy. I merely meant that there should be better publicity and coordination of what is already there.
[quote][p][bold]rpdutt[/bold] wrote: Agreed, Boris bikes are chunky, but they need to be to stand up to hire use. I can't see the private hire people as a solution unless they're prepared to invest in the infrastructure of docking stations etc the scheme requires. If I want to hire a bike at the. Station and dock it somewhere else, say at the Pavilion or Hove Lawns, there's no one offering that service, nor will there be if we leave it to the existing providers[/p][/quote]You are quite right, there will be no private Boris Bike provider as it makes no money without subsidy. I merely meant that there should be better publicity and coordination of what is already there. HJarrs

9:55pm Sun 7 Apr 13

Maxwell's Ghost says...

OK lets choose a range of key routes in Brighton.
Ditchling Road, Coldean Lane, New England Hill, then over to Hollingbury and up Carden Hill.
Come on you choose some routes and take up the challenge.
OK lets choose a range of key routes in Brighton. Ditchling Road, Coldean Lane, New England Hill, then over to Hollingbury and up Carden Hill. Come on you choose some routes and take up the challenge. Maxwell's Ghost

10:02pm Sun 7 Apr 13

HJarrs says...

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
OK lets choose a range of key routes in Brighton.
Ditchling Road, Coldean Lane, New England Hill, then over to Hollingbury and up Carden Hill.
Come on you choose some routes and take up the challenge.
I am not sure what point you are making other than Boris Bikes are clearly not the answer for areas of the city.
[quote][p][bold]Maxwell's Ghost[/bold] wrote: OK lets choose a range of key routes in Brighton. Ditchling Road, Coldean Lane, New England Hill, then over to Hollingbury and up Carden Hill. Come on you choose some routes and take up the challenge.[/p][/quote]I am not sure what point you are making other than Boris Bikes are clearly not the answer for areas of the city. HJarrs

6:52am Mon 8 Apr 13

Maxwell's Ghost says...

Ok I will spell it out for you HJarrs.
The Greens spend an inordinate amout of time on projects which the councils officers reports show will have no impact on getting vehicles off the road and reducing pollution. Yet despite this vast amounts of time are dedicated to this obsession despite the local people who have lived here for generations telling you that the town has never had large numbers of cyclists not even when I was a kid and there were much fewer cars in town.
This is because of the topography. So many people have posted about this month free month as the greens scratch their baffled heads and wonder why.
Then the Council decides that the hills mean the Boris bike scheme won't work.
Blimey has someone just switched an Eco light bulb on.
I can tell you that even with a very light bike with decent gears getting around Brighton is a challenge.
As you seem full of inexperienced hit air I challenge you to take your bike out and report back how long it took you to get up Carden Hill, Hollingdean up to Ditchling, New England hill up to Seven Dials and Coldean Lane.
These are key routes at this end of town.
I don't believe you cycle and I believe that you want people to do as you say not as you do and your ridiculous
Comment last week that it was too cold to go into town demonstrates this.
Too cold from Hanover to
Town? Yet you expect people to cycle and walk up to 30 minutes to the nearest bus stop on some outlying estates.
You are a dreamer HJarrs. Now get a thermal vest on and a good cycle coat and take on the challenge.
I will ask you repeatedly on this site for your results and watch you evade the answers and come up with excuses like it was too cold.
Ok I will spell it out for you HJarrs. The Greens spend an inordinate amout of time on projects which the councils officers reports show will have no impact on getting vehicles off the road and reducing pollution. Yet despite this vast amounts of time are dedicated to this obsession despite the local people who have lived here for generations telling you that the town has never had large numbers of cyclists not even when I was a kid and there were much fewer cars in town. This is because of the topography. So many people have posted about this month free month as the greens scratch their baffled heads and wonder why. Then the Council decides that the hills mean the Boris bike scheme won't work. Blimey has someone just switched an Eco light bulb on. I can tell you that even with a very light bike with decent gears getting around Brighton is a challenge. As you seem full of inexperienced hit air I challenge you to take your bike out and report back how long it took you to get up Carden Hill, Hollingdean up to Ditchling, New England hill up to Seven Dials and Coldean Lane. These are key routes at this end of town. I don't believe you cycle and I believe that you want people to do as you say not as you do and your ridiculous Comment last week that it was too cold to go into town demonstrates this. Too cold from Hanover to Town? Yet you expect people to cycle and walk up to 30 minutes to the nearest bus stop on some outlying estates. You are a dreamer HJarrs. Now get a thermal vest on and a good cycle coat and take on the challenge. I will ask you repeatedly on this site for your results and watch you evade the answers and come up with excuses like it was too cold. Maxwell's Ghost

7:22am Mon 8 Apr 13

george smith says...

HJarrs wrote:
Bear Rd is a poor example, most people do not live on such an extreme climb. A more typical example would be city centre to falmer, along Western Road or along the seafront, as these are more popular routes. I bet you don't see many Boris Bikes topping Hampstead Heath, a detour I used to take to get a hill in on my commute when living in London years ago(no I didn't live in a posh house Maxy). However, you nicely make my point about needing a more sophisticated offering. I like the idea of prividing options of electric bikes for those not wanting to sweat their way up some of the more hilly areas of the city.
Do you have a bike in Hanover?
[quote][p][bold]HJarrs[/bold] wrote: Bear Rd is a poor example, most people do not live on such an extreme climb. A more typical example would be city centre to falmer, along Western Road or along the seafront, as these are more popular routes. I bet you don't see many Boris Bikes topping Hampstead Heath, a detour I used to take to get a hill in on my commute when living in London years ago(no I didn't live in a posh house Maxy). However, you nicely make my point about needing a more sophisticated offering. I like the idea of prividing options of electric bikes for those not wanting to sweat their way up some of the more hilly areas of the city.[/p][/quote]Do you have a bike in Hanover? george smith

8:29am Mon 8 Apr 13

HJarrs says...

Ask away. If you are playing the "I cycle more than you cycle" then you win, big deal, I have commuted, toured and leisure cycled enough to know what is realistic and to know how enjoyable and healthy it can be. However, like other regulars, you purposely mislead that encouraging cycling means that everyone must cycle. That is plainly a stupid position. And your comments about cycling 30 mins to a bus stop is bizarre! What is that about?

But, your cycling prowess continues to be my best argument; if you can do it then it is quite feasible for many more people to cycle in the city.

I am sure you will join me in encouraging more people to take up a pastime you enjoy. I think we could double bike use along the Lewes rd over a couple of years to 1500+ , a good thing I am sure you agree. What do you think, treble the numbers in 5 years? Could we get 10% of journeys in the city made by bike in 10 years time? Helping to cut congestion and keeping people healthy. Wouldn't that be great? Ok, I agree its a modest target, but a lot of oldies are wedded to their cars unlike you and the Boris bike scheme is not the right solution for B&H. Keep setting a good example.

Ps we were cycling down the seafront yesterday, not a car park space to be had! There was me thinking parking charges were putting people off and lack of visitors had nothing to do with the poor weather we have been having!
Ask away. If you are playing the "I cycle more than you cycle" then you win, big deal, I have commuted, toured and leisure cycled enough to know what is realistic and to know how enjoyable and healthy it can be. However, like other regulars, you purposely mislead that encouraging cycling means that everyone must cycle. That is plainly a stupid position. And your comments about cycling 30 mins to a bus stop is bizarre! What is that about? But, your cycling prowess continues to be my best argument; if you can do it then it is quite feasible for many more people to cycle in the city. I am sure you will join me in encouraging more people to take up a pastime you enjoy. I think we could double bike use along the Lewes rd over a couple of years to 1500+ , a good thing I am sure you agree. What do you think, treble the numbers in 5 years? Could we get 10% of journeys in the city made by bike in 10 years time? Helping to cut congestion and keeping people healthy. Wouldn't that be great? Ok, I agree its a modest target, but a lot of oldies are wedded to their cars unlike you and the Boris bike scheme is not the right solution for B&H. Keep setting a good example. Ps we were cycling down the seafront yesterday, not a car park space to be had! There was me thinking parking charges were putting people off and lack of visitors had nothing to do with the poor weather we have been having! HJarrs

9:08am Mon 8 Apr 13

Maxwell's Ghost says...

I am not saying I cycle more than you.
I am challenging you to take part in an experiment about cycling in town.
Stop wriggling. You keep promoting cycling and telling us all to get on our bikes and yet you wont do it yourself and you seem to be basing your ideology of a holiday on a bike you once took without any real knowledge of this town.
Will you take the chellenge? This is about a simple daily cycle on key routes in Brighton and your holiday touring and casual cycling experience is irrelevant.
It's not about how fast you do it, I want you to take a simple challenge.
It's nothing more than the Green party are asking residents to do.
Come on HJarrs take the challenge.
I am not saying I cycle more than you. I am challenging you to take part in an experiment about cycling in town. Stop wriggling. You keep promoting cycling and telling us all to get on our bikes and yet you wont do it yourself and you seem to be basing your ideology of a holiday on a bike you once took without any real knowledge of this town. Will you take the chellenge? This is about a simple daily cycle on key routes in Brighton and your holiday touring and casual cycling experience is irrelevant. It's not about how fast you do it, I want you to take a simple challenge. It's nothing more than the Green party are asking residents to do. Come on HJarrs take the challenge. Maxwell's Ghost

9:26am Mon 8 Apr 13

Maxwell's Ghost says...

...and HJarrs read my posts closely. I said that some people have a 30 minute walk to the nearest bus stop not cycle.
Just get out of your priviledged town centre world and take the challenge as you clearly have absolutely no idea about cycling in this town.
...and HJarrs read my posts closely. I said that some people have a 30 minute walk to the nearest bus stop not cycle. Just get out of your priviledged town centre world and take the challenge as you clearly have absolutely no idea about cycling in this town. Maxwell's Ghost

9:28am Mon 8 Apr 13

Automaton says...

rpdutt wrote:
Agreed, Boris bikes are chunky, but they need to be to stand up to hire use. I can't see the private hire people as a solution unless they're prepared to invest in the infrastructure of docking stations etc the scheme requires. If I want to hire a bike at the. Station and dock it somewhere else, say at the Pavilion or Hove Lawns, there's no one offering that service, nor will there be if we leave it to the existing providers
Exactly. Many more people would cycle if they could just drop the bike of at the destination safely and not have to worry about carting around cumbersome locks and chains to prevent theft of their own bikes.
[quote][p][bold]rpdutt[/bold] wrote: Agreed, Boris bikes are chunky, but they need to be to stand up to hire use. I can't see the private hire people as a solution unless they're prepared to invest in the infrastructure of docking stations etc the scheme requires. If I want to hire a bike at the. Station and dock it somewhere else, say at the Pavilion or Hove Lawns, there's no one offering that service, nor will there be if we leave it to the existing providers[/p][/quote]Exactly. Many more people would cycle if they could just drop the bike of at the destination safely and not have to worry about carting around cumbersome locks and chains to prevent theft of their own bikes. Automaton

11:49am Mon 8 Apr 13

Fercri Sakes says...

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
I am not saying I cycle more than you.
I am challenging you to take part in an experiment about cycling in town.
Stop wriggling. You keep promoting cycling and telling us all to get on our bikes and yet you wont do it yourself and you seem to be basing your ideology of a holiday on a bike you once took without any real knowledge of this town.
Will you take the chellenge? This is about a simple daily cycle on key routes in Brighton and your holiday touring and casual cycling experience is irrelevant.
It's not about how fast you do it, I want you to take a simple challenge.
It's nothing more than the Green party are asking residents to do.
Come on HJarrs take the challenge.
From Brighton I can cycle from Littlehampton, or to Saltdean, or (soon) to Lewes, or to Patcham with no hills.

If I lived up the top of Bear Road I could cycle to the bottom and push my bike up there. Cycling down is a bit easier.

Anyway, your point?
[quote][p][bold]Maxwell's Ghost[/bold] wrote: I am not saying I cycle more than you. I am challenging you to take part in an experiment about cycling in town. Stop wriggling. You keep promoting cycling and telling us all to get on our bikes and yet you wont do it yourself and you seem to be basing your ideology of a holiday on a bike you once took without any real knowledge of this town. Will you take the chellenge? This is about a simple daily cycle on key routes in Brighton and your holiday touring and casual cycling experience is irrelevant. It's not about how fast you do it, I want you to take a simple challenge. It's nothing more than the Green party are asking residents to do. Come on HJarrs take the challenge.[/p][/quote]From Brighton I can cycle from Littlehampton, or to Saltdean, or (soon) to Lewes, or to Patcham with no hills. If I lived up the top of Bear Road I could cycle to the bottom and push my bike up there. Cycling down is a bit easier. Anyway, your point? Fercri Sakes

11:51am Mon 8 Apr 13

Fercri Sakes says...

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
...and HJarrs read my posts closely. I said that some people have a 30 minute walk to the nearest bus stop not cycle.
Just get out of your priviledged town centre world and take the challenge as you clearly have absolutely no idea about cycling in this town.
Are you still suggesting to us that you cycle into Brighton from eastbourne every day?
[quote][p][bold]Maxwell's Ghost[/bold] wrote: ...and HJarrs read my posts closely. I said that some people have a 30 minute walk to the nearest bus stop not cycle. Just get out of your priviledged town centre world and take the challenge as you clearly have absolutely no idea about cycling in this town.[/p][/quote]Are you still suggesting to us that you cycle into Brighton from eastbourne every day? Fercri Sakes

1:44pm Mon 8 Apr 13

Maxwell's Ghost says...

Ahhh yes, buy a bike and push it up hills. Only the Greens would suggest that after spending £6 million on a bike lane on the flat surrounded by hills.
Now clearly you haven't tried pushing a bike up Bear Road with two panniers of shopping or even one with a change of clothes for work in it.
HJarrs refused to go into town from her home in Hanover because it was too cold, yet expects the average person to jump on a bike.
And it's really silly and makes a mockery of any argument when people like HJarrs refuses to face facts or compares flat cities of Europe with Brighton. I have cycled in Belgium, Holland and France on flat terrain, but I have also cycled across Italy. No wonder the Italians have a great success with the Tour de France as the terrain is incredibly hilly.
You can continue to ignore what is in front of your face, that people don't want to push bikes up Bear Road, or any other road, but it's like people who used to ignore the fact that television was taking off.
As for cycling to EB, actually it's a hilly route, so no certainly not every day.
As a cyclist, you will know that some days a ride can be painfully hard depending on the wind direction and destination and so sometimes you can only manage two trips a week.
Now that is the reality of commuting and cycling.
I am honest about my ability and the terrain and challenges. The Green Party refuses to ask people or accept that most of the population lives up dreadful hills.
However, it's nice to know that your new policy is to push bikes around town.
As we can do that on pavements, perhaps you could have saved a few million.
Ahhh yes, buy a bike and push it up hills. Only the Greens would suggest that after spending £6 million on a bike lane on the flat surrounded by hills. Now clearly you haven't tried pushing a bike up Bear Road with two panniers of shopping or even one with a change of clothes for work in it. HJarrs refused to go into town from her home in Hanover because it was too cold, yet expects the average person to jump on a bike. And it's really silly and makes a mockery of any argument when people like HJarrs refuses to face facts or compares flat cities of Europe with Brighton. I have cycled in Belgium, Holland and France on flat terrain, but I have also cycled across Italy. No wonder the Italians have a great success with the Tour de France as the terrain is incredibly hilly. You can continue to ignore what is in front of your face, that people don't want to push bikes up Bear Road, or any other road, but it's like people who used to ignore the fact that television was taking off. As for cycling to EB, actually it's a hilly route, so no certainly not every day. As a cyclist, you will know that some days a ride can be painfully hard depending on the wind direction and destination and so sometimes you can only manage two trips a week. Now that is the reality of commuting and cycling. I am honest about my ability and the terrain and challenges. The Green Party refuses to ask people or accept that most of the population lives up dreadful hills. However, it's nice to know that your new policy is to push bikes around town. As we can do that on pavements, perhaps you could have saved a few million. Maxwell's Ghost

2:39pm Mon 8 Apr 13

TedMaul says...

Most cyclist are arrogant fools who shouldn't be on a road to start with, or on the bike paths.
All bikes should be scrapped and made illegal
Most cyclist are arrogant fools who shouldn't be on a road to start with, or on the bike paths. All bikes should be scrapped and made illegal TedMaul

2:59pm Mon 8 Apr 13

Fercri Sakes says...

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
Ahhh yes, buy a bike and push it up hills. Only the Greens would suggest that after spending £6 million on a bike lane on the flat surrounded by hills.
Now clearly you haven't tried pushing a bike up Bear Road with two panniers of shopping or even one with a change of clothes for work in it.
HJarrs refused to go into town from her home in Hanover because it was too cold, yet expects the average person to jump on a bike.
And it's really silly and makes a mockery of any argument when people like HJarrs refuses to face facts or compares flat cities of Europe with Brighton. I have cycled in Belgium, Holland and France on flat terrain, but I have also cycled across Italy. No wonder the Italians have a great success with the Tour de France as the terrain is incredibly hilly.
You can continue to ignore what is in front of your face, that people don't want to push bikes up Bear Road, or any other road, but it's like people who used to ignore the fact that television was taking off.
As for cycling to EB, actually it's a hilly route, so no certainly not every day.
As a cyclist, you will know that some days a ride can be painfully hard depending on the wind direction and destination and so sometimes you can only manage two trips a week.
Now that is the reality of commuting and cycling.
I am honest about my ability and the terrain and challenges. The Green Party refuses to ask people or accept that most of the population lives up dreadful hills.
However, it's nice to know that your new policy is to push bikes around town.
As we can do that on pavements, perhaps you could have saved a few million.
What exactly is wrong with cycling 95% of your journey and then pushing your bike uphill for five minutes? If I got a bus home I don't get a taxi from the bus stop to my house, I walk.

Yes, a few people live in areas slightly too far away from the seafront, Lewes Road, London Road, The Drive or Old Shoreham Road but for the rest of us who live near this network it's well spent money.

We're not all lycra-clad diehards. Some of us just want to be able to get from A to B easily around town avoiding being hit by vehicles. Cycle lanes are a relatively inexpensive way of doing this.
[quote][p][bold]Maxwell's Ghost[/bold] wrote: Ahhh yes, buy a bike and push it up hills. Only the Greens would suggest that after spending £6 million on a bike lane on the flat surrounded by hills. Now clearly you haven't tried pushing a bike up Bear Road with two panniers of shopping or even one with a change of clothes for work in it. HJarrs refused to go into town from her home in Hanover because it was too cold, yet expects the average person to jump on a bike. And it's really silly and makes a mockery of any argument when people like HJarrs refuses to face facts or compares flat cities of Europe with Brighton. I have cycled in Belgium, Holland and France on flat terrain, but I have also cycled across Italy. No wonder the Italians have a great success with the Tour de France as the terrain is incredibly hilly. You can continue to ignore what is in front of your face, that people don't want to push bikes up Bear Road, or any other road, but it's like people who used to ignore the fact that television was taking off. As for cycling to EB, actually it's a hilly route, so no certainly not every day. As a cyclist, you will know that some days a ride can be painfully hard depending on the wind direction and destination and so sometimes you can only manage two trips a week. Now that is the reality of commuting and cycling. I am honest about my ability and the terrain and challenges. The Green Party refuses to ask people or accept that most of the population lives up dreadful hills. However, it's nice to know that your new policy is to push bikes around town. As we can do that on pavements, perhaps you could have saved a few million.[/p][/quote]What exactly is wrong with cycling 95% of your journey and then pushing your bike uphill for five minutes? If I got a bus home I don't get a taxi from the bus stop to my house, I walk. Yes, a few people live in areas slightly too far away from the seafront, Lewes Road, London Road, The Drive or Old Shoreham Road but for the rest of us who live near this network it's well spent money. We're not all lycra-clad diehards. Some of us just want to be able to get from A to B easily around town avoiding being hit by vehicles. Cycle lanes are a relatively inexpensive way of doing this. Fercri Sakes

5:38pm Mon 8 Apr 13

Maxwell's Ghost says...

A few people live away from the flat areas....goodness you clearly don't get around town as you will know that most of the urban areas are on hills.
As for pushing a bike for some of the journey, it depends what is at the end of the journey. Mine is Bear Road and as with many residential locations, most are up hills of varying gradients and it can be a bloody killer after even a 15 mile ride. I used to do Carden Avenue and then I lived on The Drove and they are murder at the end of a ride and if you push the bike it can add a good bit of time to a journey.
One can only assume you live on the seafront, although even St James's Street is quite steep and when you get a bus up your arse revving away it can be annoying.
It's a shame Brighton is hilly and I enjoy cycling but I really do have my eyes open and understand why people don't care much for it in this town, but when you can't get cycling supporters such as people like HJarrs to walk into town when the weather is a bit nippy, you can see you have no chance of getting those who need convincing onto two wheels.
A few people live away from the flat areas....goodness you clearly don't get around town as you will know that most of the urban areas are on hills. As for pushing a bike for some of the journey, it depends what is at the end of the journey. Mine is Bear Road and as with many residential locations, most are up hills of varying gradients and it can be a bloody killer after even a 15 mile ride. I used to do Carden Avenue and then I lived on The Drove and they are murder at the end of a ride and if you push the bike it can add a good bit of time to a journey. One can only assume you live on the seafront, although even St James's Street is quite steep and when you get a bus up your arse revving away it can be annoying. It's a shame Brighton is hilly and I enjoy cycling but I really do have my eyes open and understand why people don't care much for it in this town, but when you can't get cycling supporters such as people like HJarrs to walk into town when the weather is a bit nippy, you can see you have no chance of getting those who need convincing onto two wheels. Maxwell's Ghost

5:51pm Mon 8 Apr 13

thevoiceoftruth says...

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station?

HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station? HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle. thevoiceoftruth

6:48pm Mon 8 Apr 13

Fercri Sakes says...

thevoiceoftruth wrote:
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station?

HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle.
Those routes aren't that hilly. The three real hilly areas would be Southover/Racecourse
/ElmGrove/Bear Road, Ditchling Road/Hollingbury/Fiv
e Ways and Dyke Road/Seven Dials. The rest is easily cycleable.

Could a statto find out the percentage of residents who's front doors are below 50m above sea level?
[quote][p][bold]thevoiceoftruth[/bold] wrote: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station? HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle.[/p][/quote]Those routes aren't that hilly. The three real hilly areas would be Southover/Racecourse /ElmGrove/Bear Road, Ditchling Road/Hollingbury/Fiv e Ways and Dyke Road/Seven Dials. The rest is easily cycleable. Could a statto find out the percentage of residents who's front doors are below 50m above sea level? Fercri Sakes

7:33pm Mon 8 Apr 13

thevoiceoftruth says...

Fercri Sakes wrote:
thevoiceoftruth wrote:
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station?

HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle.
Those routes aren't that hilly. The three real hilly areas would be Southover/Racecourse

/ElmGrove/Bear Road, Ditchling Road/Hollingbury/Fiv

e Ways and Dyke Road/Seven Dials. The rest is easily cycleable.

Could a statto find out the percentage of residents who's front doors are below 50m above sea level?
My point, which I probably didn't explain very well, was that this is for tourists, isn't it? Residents would have their own bikes. So even the town centre isn't exactly flat. You may be young and fit but not everyone can cycle up to the station without getting out of puff. Especially on a Boris bike.
[quote][p][bold]Fercri Sakes[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]thevoiceoftruth[/bold] wrote: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station? HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle.[/p][/quote]Those routes aren't that hilly. The three real hilly areas would be Southover/Racecourse /ElmGrove/Bear Road, Ditchling Road/Hollingbury/Fiv e Ways and Dyke Road/Seven Dials. The rest is easily cycleable. Could a statto find out the percentage of residents who's front doors are below 50m above sea level?[/p][/quote]My point, which I probably didn't explain very well, was that this is for tourists, isn't it? Residents would have their own bikes. So even the town centre isn't exactly flat. You may be young and fit but not everyone can cycle up to the station without getting out of puff. Especially on a Boris bike. thevoiceoftruth

11:29am Tue 9 Apr 13

Fercri Sakes says...

thevoiceoftruth wrote:
Fercri Sakes wrote:
thevoiceoftruth wrote:
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station?

HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle.
Those routes aren't that hilly. The three real hilly areas would be Southover/Racecourse


/ElmGrove/Bear Road, Ditchling Road/Hollingbury/Fiv


e Ways and Dyke Road/Seven Dials. The rest is easily cycleable.

Could a statto find out the percentage of residents who's front doors are below 50m above sea level?
My point, which I probably didn't explain very well, was that this is for tourists, isn't it? Residents would have their own bikes. So even the town centre isn't exactly flat. You may be young and fit but not everyone can cycle up to the station without getting out of puff. Especially on a Boris bike.
Ah yes, you're right. I think the Boris bikes idea isn't suitable for Brighton at all. I'm glad the Greens put an end to this silly Tory proposal.
[quote][p][bold]thevoiceoftruth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Fercri Sakes[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]thevoiceoftruth[/bold] wrote: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station? HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle.[/p][/quote]Those routes aren't that hilly. The three real hilly areas would be Southover/Racecourse /ElmGrove/Bear Road, Ditchling Road/Hollingbury/Fiv e Ways and Dyke Road/Seven Dials. The rest is easily cycleable. Could a statto find out the percentage of residents who's front doors are below 50m above sea level?[/p][/quote]My point, which I probably didn't explain very well, was that this is for tourists, isn't it? Residents would have their own bikes. So even the town centre isn't exactly flat. You may be young and fit but not everyone can cycle up to the station without getting out of puff. Especially on a Boris bike.[/p][/quote]Ah yes, you're right. I think the Boris bikes idea isn't suitable for Brighton at all. I'm glad the Greens put an end to this silly Tory proposal. Fercri Sakes

11:44am Tue 9 Apr 13

Automaton says...

thevoiceoftruth wrote:
Fercri Sakes wrote:
thevoiceoftruth wrote:
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station?

HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle.
Those routes aren't that hilly. The three real hilly areas would be Southover/Racecourse


/ElmGrove/Bear Road, Ditchling Road/Hollingbury/Fiv


e Ways and Dyke Road/Seven Dials. The rest is easily cycleable.

Could a statto find out the percentage of residents who's front doors are below 50m above sea level?
My point, which I probably didn't explain very well, was that this is for tourists, isn't it? Residents would have their own bikes. So even the town centre isn't exactly flat. You may be young and fit but not everyone can cycle up to the station without getting out of puff. Especially on a Boris bike.
Many residents do not have their own bikes as they live in flats and terraced houses and do not have space to store them. Even with storage in say a padlocked shed in a back yard of a terraced house I bet many residents cant be bothered to use them for a short journey.
I think Boris bikes would be a great idea asit would open up the joys of cycling to many people residents or tourists
[quote][p][bold]thevoiceoftruth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Fercri Sakes[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]thevoiceoftruth[/bold] wrote: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station? HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle.[/p][/quote]Those routes aren't that hilly. The three real hilly areas would be Southover/Racecourse /ElmGrove/Bear Road, Ditchling Road/Hollingbury/Fiv e Ways and Dyke Road/Seven Dials. The rest is easily cycleable. Could a statto find out the percentage of residents who's front doors are below 50m above sea level?[/p][/quote]My point, which I probably didn't explain very well, was that this is for tourists, isn't it? Residents would have their own bikes. So even the town centre isn't exactly flat. You may be young and fit but not everyone can cycle up to the station without getting out of puff. Especially on a Boris bike.[/p][/quote]Many residents do not have their own bikes as they live in flats and terraced houses and do not have space to store them. Even with storage in say a padlocked shed in a back yard of a terraced house I bet many residents cant be bothered to use them for a short journey. I think Boris bikes would be a great idea asit would open up the joys of cycling to many people residents or tourists Automaton

7:00pm Tue 9 Apr 13

thevoiceoftruth says...

Automaton wrote:
thevoiceoftruth wrote:
Fercri Sakes wrote:
thevoiceoftruth wrote:
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station?

HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle.
Those routes aren't that hilly. The three real hilly areas would be Southover/Racecourse



/ElmGrove/Bear Road, Ditchling Road/Hollingbury/Fiv



e Ways and Dyke Road/Seven Dials. The rest is easily cycleable.

Could a statto find out the percentage of residents who's front doors are below 50m above sea level?
My point, which I probably didn't explain very well, was that this is for tourists, isn't it? Residents would have their own bikes. So even the town centre isn't exactly flat. You may be young and fit but not everyone can cycle up to the station without getting out of puff. Especially on a Boris bike.
Many residents do not have their own bikes as they live in flats and terraced houses and do not have space to store them. Even with storage in say a padlocked shed in a back yard of a terraced house I bet many residents cant be bothered to use them for a short journey.
I think Boris bikes would be a great idea asit would open up the joys of cycling to many people residents or tourists
That's a fair point about storage. However, due to the terrain, all the bikes will be going one way - downhill. Nobody is going to want to ride them back uphill again. Also, it works in London because getting the tube in summer is hellish and there are millions of potential customers.

Also, won't all the wheels get kicked in? Seems to be a Brighton thing!
[quote][p][bold]Automaton[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]thevoiceoftruth[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Fercri Sakes[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]thevoiceoftruth[/bold] wrote: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. So finally, the Greens accept Brighton is hilly! Hurrah! It wouldn't even work in town - I mean who wants to cycle up North Street to Churchill Square, or up Queens Road to the station? HJarrs doesn't even have a bike. She just wants the peasants to cycle.[/p][/quote]Those routes aren't that hilly. The three real hilly areas would be Southover/Racecourse /ElmGrove/Bear Road, Ditchling Road/Hollingbury/Fiv e Ways and Dyke Road/Seven Dials. The rest is easily cycleable. Could a statto find out the percentage of residents who's front doors are below 50m above sea level?[/p][/quote]My point, which I probably didn't explain very well, was that this is for tourists, isn't it? Residents would have their own bikes. So even the town centre isn't exactly flat. You may be young and fit but not everyone can cycle up to the station without getting out of puff. Especially on a Boris bike.[/p][/quote]Many residents do not have their own bikes as they live in flats and terraced houses and do not have space to store them. Even with storage in say a padlocked shed in a back yard of a terraced house I bet many residents cant be bothered to use them for a short journey. I think Boris bikes would be a great idea asit would open up the joys of cycling to many people residents or tourists[/p][/quote]That's a fair point about storage. However, due to the terrain, all the bikes will be going one way - downhill. Nobody is going to want to ride them back uphill again. Also, it works in London because getting the tube in summer is hellish and there are millions of potential customers. Also, won't all the wheels get kicked in? Seems to be a Brighton thing! thevoiceoftruth

10:48am Wed 10 Apr 13

billy goat-gruff says...

This Brighton is too hilly for cyclists argument is an old chestnut - unless you live in Hanover, Fiveways or Seven Dials, there's no problem. The Boris Bikes are for tourists who most likely want to cycle down from the station and along the seafront - they probably won't want to cycle up Albion Hill! And isn't it time we had a circular bus taking in the station and all the tourist spots?
This Brighton is too hilly for cyclists argument is an old chestnut - unless you live in Hanover, Fiveways or Seven Dials, there's no problem. The Boris Bikes are for tourists who most likely want to cycle down from the station and along the seafront - they probably won't want to cycle up Albion Hill! And isn't it time we had a circular bus taking in the station and all the tourist spots? billy goat-gruff

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