Argus asks referendum council tax question - have your say here

The Argus: Sarah Ison and Caroline Wallis Sarah Ison and Caroline Wallis

Hundreds of people have had their say on plans for a council tax rise referendum – and now we want to hear from you as we hold our own survey.

Last week, Brighton and Hove City Council’s minority Green administration shocked many with the news it planned to go to the polls with a 4.75% rise in the rates.

Some claim the increase, which works out at about £6 a month for a Band D property, is needed to protect the vulnerable in the face of government cuts.

But others argue triggering a £230,000 vote would be a waste of money.

With politicians not making a decision until next month, The Argus is encouraging all our readers to have their say here first.

As well as taking to the streets, we will publish an online poll and voting forms in the paper so residents can indicate how they would vote in any city-wide poll.

Michael Beard, editor of The Argus, said: “For more than 130 years, The Argus has represented the views of local people on issues that matter most.

“The issue of a council tax referendum will have not only a profound impact on our own city, but on the national political landscape.

“It is our aim to create a barometer to guide the city’s leaders through what will be a tempestuous few weeks.”

The announcement, which appeared in Friday’s paper, has become one of our most commented on stories ever, with more than 180 of our online readers having their say.

Dozens more have sent letters to our Hollingbury HQ.

Opinion is split on whether the Greens should increase council tax by more than the Government’s 2% cap as it looks to make £24 million of savings in 2014/15. Any rise above this would automatically trigger a city-wide vote, due to be held on May 22.

Conservative and Labour councillors could unite to throw out the plans, either at the council’s policy and resources committee on February 13 or when the budget is finalised on February 27.

Our roving reporter Charlotte Schroeter launched our survey yesterday by asking 100 people in the bustling North Laine if they would support the rise.

78 residents said they would vote against with just 22 in support.

Brighton resident Delphine Gane, 72, said: “I’m sure they could make savings elsewhere.

“I’m not against paying taxes but I do feel we’re not getting the full picture.

“I don’t want council tax to go up but I can’t make an informed decision.”

Fellow resident Caroline Wallis said: “It’s outrageous.

“The council shouldn’t guilt trip us into affording things.”

The Argus will be asking another 400 residents over the next two days in a series of street surveys.

Tomorrow, Charlotte will be in London Road and St James’s Street before heading to Hollingbury and George Street, Hove on Wednesday.

Don’t miss the results of the street poll so far in The Argus on Thursday.

You can also have your say by filling in the form below, voting by text by sending a message to 80360 with the word SUPIC and your answer. 

Alternatively, you can visit our Facebook page or tweet using the hashtag #bhref. 

Our final poll of on-street surveys, postal votes and online responses will then be printed in the paper on February 13. 

Right click and select Save As on the image below to download your voting form. Postal forms should be returned to Neil Vowles at Argus House, Crowhurst Road, Brighton, BN1 8AR no later than February 7.

The Argus:

Comments (81)

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9:59am Tue 21 Jan 14

FC says...

Troll Mode: ENGAGED
Troll Mode: ENGAGED FC

10:08am Tue 21 Jan 14

clubrob6 says...

If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.
If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around. clubrob6

10:44am Tue 21 Jan 14

Richada says...

I've just voted - it's 20 / 80 against at the moment.

Exactly what the great majority of us would have expected under the circumstances.
I've just voted - it's 20 / 80 against at the moment. Exactly what the great majority of us would have expected under the circumstances. Richada

10:54am Tue 21 Jan 14

Martha Gunn says...

Sometimes it might be justified and sensible to impose an increase like this.

But with this Green council and its record of complete incompetence and disunity?

I think not.
Sometimes it might be justified and sensible to impose an increase like this. But with this Green council and its record of complete incompetence and disunity? I think not. Martha Gunn

11:00am Tue 21 Jan 14

BrighterStar says...

This I fear boils down to a matter of trust. I would happily pay extra on my Council Tax if it meant that care for the old and disabled could be kept out of the hands of the private sector, but I would want to see a clear and transparent correolation between the extra revenue and how it was spent. Unfortunately, this Council has not taken the people with them on their journey and as such are not trusted. They are quite probably blamed for things that a totally out of their hands as a result, but have no one but themselves to blame for this. Instead of trying to change the world with all the fervour of a teenager let lose in Ibiza, they should have concentrated on making the Council more representative of the whole city's needs. It remains riddled with a culture of secrecy and apparent cronyism (as typified by the recent case of the Head of Housing) and as such is going to struggle to win this referendum, how ever worthwhile its intention.
This I fear boils down to a matter of trust. I would happily pay extra on my Council Tax if it meant that care for the old and disabled could be kept out of the hands of the private sector, but I would want to see a clear and transparent correolation between the extra revenue and how it was spent. Unfortunately, this Council has not taken the people with them on their journey and as such are not trusted. They are quite probably blamed for things that a totally out of their hands as a result, but have no one but themselves to blame for this. Instead of trying to change the world with all the fervour of a teenager let lose in Ibiza, they should have concentrated on making the Council more representative of the whole city's needs. It remains riddled with a culture of secrecy and apparent cronyism (as typified by the recent case of the Head of Housing) and as such is going to struggle to win this referendum, how ever worthwhile its intention. BrighterStar

11:06am Tue 21 Jan 14

aBloke says...

surely the Green Party can't be that stupid that they think that the majority of B&H residents are going to vote in favour of increasing their council tax? I'm all for democracy and having a say, but if they go ahead with this referendum, imo they should be told that if the Yes vote is less than say 20%, Green Party HQ is responsible for paying back the £230k to the B&H council pot
surely the Green Party can't be that stupid that they think that the majority of B&H residents are going to vote in favour of increasing their council tax? I'm all for democracy and having a say, but if they go ahead with this referendum, imo they should be told that if the Yes vote is less than say 20%, Green Party HQ is responsible for paying back the £230k to the B&H council pot aBloke

11:24am Tue 21 Jan 14

We are the 99% says...

So when the referendum vote says no (because turkeys don't vote for Christmas), the Greens will blame the people for this cut in services!
Well the Greens shouldn't have squandered millions on these idiotic cycle/bus lanes that nobody asked for before pleading poverty and asking for more!
So when the referendum vote says no (because turkeys don't vote for Christmas), the Greens will blame the people for this cut in services! Well the Greens shouldn't have squandered millions on these idiotic cycle/bus lanes that nobody asked for before pleading poverty and asking for more! We are the 99%

11:24am Tue 21 Jan 14

Eugenius says...

The figures have been revised down slightly, as precepts for the Police and Fire Authority aren't expected to go up by 4.75% so the monthly increase from last year for each band is as follows:

Band A £2.83 (disabled relief)
Band A £3.40
Band B £3.96
Band C £4.53
Band D £5.09
Band E £6.23
Band F £7.36
Band G £8.49
Band H £10.19

That's per household rather than per person.
Deduct 25% if you are sole occupant.
The figures have been revised down slightly, as precepts for the Police and Fire Authority aren't expected to go up by 4.75% so the monthly increase from last year for each band is as follows: Band A £2.83 (disabled relief) Band A £3.40 Band B £3.96 Band C £4.53 Band D £5.09 Band E £6.23 Band F £7.36 Band G £8.49 Band H £10.19 That's per household rather than per person. Deduct 25% if you are sole occupant. Eugenius

11:38am Tue 21 Jan 14

Eugenius says...

clubrob6 wrote:
If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.
Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea.

Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.
[quote][p][bold]clubrob6[/bold] wrote: If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.[/p][/quote]Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea. Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work. Eugenius

11:44am Tue 21 Jan 14

Ambo Guy says...

Vote Green get s**t on
Vote Green get s**t on Ambo Guy

11:47am Tue 21 Jan 14

Brighton1000 says...

Eugenius wrote:
clubrob6 wrote:
If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.
Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea.

Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.
So you're now sherking responsibility for the rubbish chaos away from the green council also? Go and deliver your spin somewhere else. Do you honestly think Brighton residents are that unintelligent that they will believe a word you type? Every post you type, you bat away responsibility. Avoid questions, manipulate what people ask. You are a perfect example of why the majority of us cannot wait to see the back of the greens, And it appears that day may come sooner than it first appeared, What a lovely thought :)
[quote][p][bold]Eugenius[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]clubrob6[/bold] wrote: If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.[/p][/quote]Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea. Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.[/p][/quote]So you're now sherking responsibility for the rubbish chaos away from the green council also? Go and deliver your spin somewhere else. Do you honestly think Brighton residents are that unintelligent that they will believe a word you type? Every post you type, you bat away responsibility. Avoid questions, manipulate what people ask. You are a perfect example of why the majority of us cannot wait to see the back of the greens, And it appears that day may come sooner than it first appeared, What a lovely thought :) Brighton1000

11:55am Tue 21 Jan 14

Richada says...

BrighterStar wrote:
This I fear boils down to a matter of trust. I would happily pay extra on my Council Tax if it meant that care for the old and disabled could be kept out of the hands of the private sector, but I would want to see a clear and transparent correolation between the extra revenue and how it was spent. Unfortunately, this Council has not taken the people with them on their journey and as such are not trusted. They are quite probably blamed for things that a totally out of their hands as a result, but have no one but themselves to blame for this. Instead of trying to change the world with all the fervour of a teenager let lose in Ibiza, they should have concentrated on making the Council more representative of the whole city's needs. It remains riddled with a culture of secrecy and apparent cronyism (as typified by the recent case of the Head of Housing) and as such is going to struggle to win this referendum, how ever worthwhile its intention.
Well said!

The most balanced and articulate opinion that I've read on the whole sorry saga.
[quote][p][bold]BrighterStar[/bold] wrote: This I fear boils down to a matter of trust. I would happily pay extra on my Council Tax if it meant that care for the old and disabled could be kept out of the hands of the private sector, but I would want to see a clear and transparent correolation between the extra revenue and how it was spent. Unfortunately, this Council has not taken the people with them on their journey and as such are not trusted. They are quite probably blamed for things that a totally out of their hands as a result, but have no one but themselves to blame for this. Instead of trying to change the world with all the fervour of a teenager let lose in Ibiza, they should have concentrated on making the Council more representative of the whole city's needs. It remains riddled with a culture of secrecy and apparent cronyism (as typified by the recent case of the Head of Housing) and as such is going to struggle to win this referendum, how ever worthwhile its intention.[/p][/quote]Well said! The most balanced and articulate opinion that I've read on the whole sorry saga. Richada

12:18pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Fight_Back says...

Eugenius wrote:
clubrob6 wrote:
If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.
Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea.

Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.
It would have been nice if Jason Kitcat had waited for the 20mph zone accident data you suggest before proclaiming it a triumph on his list of Green successes !
[quote][p][bold]Eugenius[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]clubrob6[/bold] wrote: If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.[/p][/quote]Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea. Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.[/p][/quote]It would have been nice if Jason Kitcat had waited for the 20mph zone accident data you suggest before proclaiming it a triumph on his list of Green successes ! Fight_Back

12:19pm Tue 21 Jan 14

browneyedgirl says...

I think this is a highly cynical move by the Greens.They are trying to make it hard to vote against it because by implication that would mean voting against protecting social care for the vulnerable.

They have concentrated on this one issue but they are simply proposing a general rise in council tax in the most emotive way they can. Why can't they say the increase is to pay for libraries/ recycling/ any of the other101 things they are responsible for? Why would they have to cut back on social care in particular? They haven't explained this
I think this is a highly cynical move by the Greens.They are trying to make it hard to vote against it because by implication that would mean voting against protecting social care for the vulnerable. They have concentrated on this one issue but they are simply proposing a general rise in council tax in the most emotive way they can. Why can't they say the increase is to pay for libraries/ recycling/ any of the other101 things they are responsible for? Why would they have to cut back on social care in particular? They haven't explained this browneyedgirl

12:31pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Eugenius says...

browneyedgirl wrote:
I think this is a highly cynical move by the Greens.They are trying to make it hard to vote against it because by implication that would mean voting against protecting social care for the vulnerable.

They have concentrated on this one issue but they are simply proposing a general rise in council tax in the most emotive way they can. Why can't they say the increase is to pay for libraries/ recycling/ any of the other101 things they are responsible for? Why would they have to cut back on social care in particular? They haven't explained this
It's chiefly because social care is by the far the largest budget area - these services cost the council £112 million last year, and we have an additional budget gap of £24 million to make up this year. The first draft of the budget published at the end of November made savings across the board but the public consultation showed that people were very unhappy with cuts in social care. So we've produced a new plan to protect social care and propose to put it to a city-wide vote.
[quote][p][bold]browneyedgirl[/bold] wrote: I think this is a highly cynical move by the Greens.They are trying to make it hard to vote against it because by implication that would mean voting against protecting social care for the vulnerable. They have concentrated on this one issue but they are simply proposing a general rise in council tax in the most emotive way they can. Why can't they say the increase is to pay for libraries/ recycling/ any of the other101 things they are responsible for? Why would they have to cut back on social care in particular? They haven't explained this[/p][/quote]It's chiefly because social care is by the far the largest budget area - these services cost the council £112 million last year, and we have an additional budget gap of £24 million to make up this year. The first draft of the budget published at the end of November made savings across the board but the public consultation showed that people were very unhappy with cuts in social care. So we've produced a new plan to protect social care and propose to put it to a city-wide vote. Eugenius

12:56pm Tue 21 Jan 14

fredaj says...

Eugenius wrote:
browneyedgirl wrote:
I think this is a highly cynical move by the Greens.They are trying to make it hard to vote against it because by implication that would mean voting against protecting social care for the vulnerable.

They have concentrated on this one issue but they are simply proposing a general rise in council tax in the most emotive way they can. Why can't they say the increase is to pay for libraries/ recycling/ any of the other101 things they are responsible for? Why would they have to cut back on social care in particular? They haven't explained this
It's chiefly because social care is by the far the largest budget area - these services cost the council £112 million last year, and we have an additional budget gap of £24 million to make up this year. The first draft of the budget published at the end of November made savings across the board but the public consultation showed that people were very unhappy with cuts in social care. So we've produced a new plan to protect social care and propose to put it to a city-wide vote.
You say "we".

Who are you exactly?
[quote][p][bold]Eugenius[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]browneyedgirl[/bold] wrote: I think this is a highly cynical move by the Greens.They are trying to make it hard to vote against it because by implication that would mean voting against protecting social care for the vulnerable. They have concentrated on this one issue but they are simply proposing a general rise in council tax in the most emotive way they can. Why can't they say the increase is to pay for libraries/ recycling/ any of the other101 things they are responsible for? Why would they have to cut back on social care in particular? They haven't explained this[/p][/quote]It's chiefly because social care is by the far the largest budget area - these services cost the council £112 million last year, and we have an additional budget gap of £24 million to make up this year. The first draft of the budget published at the end of November made savings across the board but the public consultation showed that people were very unhappy with cuts in social care. So we've produced a new plan to protect social care and propose to put it to a city-wide vote.[/p][/quote]You say "we". Who are you exactly? fredaj

1:01pm Tue 21 Jan 14

charlie smirke says...

Am I right in saying that Brighton is the only place in the country that wants to go over a 2% rise? If so, WHY ?? How come the whole of the rest of the UK can manage but not the only green council ??
Am I right in saying that Brighton is the only place in the country that wants to go over a 2% rise? If so, WHY ?? How come the whole of the rest of the UK can manage but not the only green council ?? charlie smirke

1:46pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Warren Morgan says...

I have blogged on the reasons behind the sudden change from a 2% rise to a 4.75% rise, and why the arguments don't really add up:
http://warrenmorgan.
wordpress.com/2014/0
1/20/are-brighton-an
d-hove-residents-bei
ng-asked-to-pay-6-mo
re-a-month-so-the-gr
een-leader-can-keep-
his-job/
I have blogged on the reasons behind the sudden change from a 2% rise to a 4.75% rise, and why the arguments don't really add up: http://warrenmorgan. wordpress.com/2014/0 1/20/are-brighton-an d-hove-residents-bei ng-asked-to-pay-6-mo re-a-month-so-the-gr een-leader-can-keep- his-job/ Warren Morgan

1:53pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Ricayboy says...

I wonder hoe much money the council spends each year on translation services and politically-correct projects that only benefit minorities, not the whole community? I am against any rise and would suggest the council cuts down on its own wastefulness first.
I wonder hoe much money the council spends each year on translation services and politically-correct projects that only benefit minorities, not the whole community? I am against any rise and would suggest the council cuts down on its own wastefulness first. Ricayboy

2:00pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Bugzy84 says...

So they cannot afford to pay for basic services, yet can throw more millions of pounds on top of the 15 million already agreed to loaned to the private companies to build the i360.
I'm aware some of it come from the central government but where has this extra money come from? Do we really need the i360 in the first place, how much sea do people what to see?
How long is this loan for, what is the interest rate on it and what will be done with the profits?
So they cannot afford to pay for basic services, yet can throw more millions of pounds on top of the 15 million already agreed to loaned to the private companies to build the i360. I'm aware some of it come from the central government but where has this extra money come from? Do we really need the i360 in the first place, how much sea do people what to see? How long is this loan for, what is the interest rate on it and what will be done with the profits? Bugzy84

2:04pm Tue 21 Jan 14

WooahWooah says...

So the Argus decides to circumvent democracy by holding its own vote ahead of the real one. How is the Argus going to stop people voting more than once? How is the Argus going to stop people from outside Brighton and Hove - like me and many other Albion fans who read the paper online - voting and affecting its result? What information is the Argus providing to ensure that voters are informed before they cast their vote?

This is an amateur effort and people should wait for the real thing rather than feed the local media. Or isn't the Argus bothered about credibility and reliability these days?
So the Argus decides to circumvent democracy by holding its own vote ahead of the real one. How is the Argus going to stop people voting more than once? How is the Argus going to stop people from outside Brighton and Hove - like me and many other Albion fans who read the paper online - voting and affecting its result? What information is the Argus providing to ensure that voters are informed before they cast their vote? This is an amateur effort and people should wait for the real thing rather than feed the local media. Or isn't the Argus bothered about credibility and reliability these days? WooahWooah

2:21pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Richada says...

WooahWooah wrote:
So the Argus decides to circumvent democracy by holding its own vote ahead of the real one. How is the Argus going to stop people voting more than once? How is the Argus going to stop people from outside Brighton and Hove - like me and many other Albion fans who read the paper online - voting and affecting its result? What information is the Argus providing to ensure that voters are informed before they cast their vote?

This is an amateur effort and people should wait for the real thing rather than feed the local media. Or isn't the Argus bothered about credibility and reliability these days?
I don't think you are quite up to speed on this one.

The whole point is that we B&HC tax paying residents don't want the council to waste yet another £230,000 of our money whilst blackmailing us that they cannot afford to fund services for the "vulnerable".

The current administration listens to nobody in this city and cares not a jot what the people who voted them in think of them now. All they are interested in is grandstanding by positioning themselves against the national government and hoping to bask in the limelight of the national press.......

.......whilst the council tax payers pick up the bill for it.

Amateur as it is (and I do agree with you on that) this vote should very clearly state the obvious. Those against the increase are just as passionate in their feelings as those for it - I think the double voting to which you refer will be a "self cancelling" factor anyway.
[quote][p][bold]WooahWooah[/bold] wrote: So the Argus decides to circumvent democracy by holding its own vote ahead of the real one. How is the Argus going to stop people voting more than once? How is the Argus going to stop people from outside Brighton and Hove - like me and many other Albion fans who read the paper online - voting and affecting its result? What information is the Argus providing to ensure that voters are informed before they cast their vote? This is an amateur effort and people should wait for the real thing rather than feed the local media. Or isn't the Argus bothered about credibility and reliability these days?[/p][/quote]I don't think you are quite up to speed on this one. The whole point is that we B&HC tax paying residents don't want the council to waste yet another £230,000 of our money whilst blackmailing us that they cannot afford to fund services for the "vulnerable". The current administration listens to nobody in this city and cares not a jot what the people who voted them in think of them now. All they are interested in is grandstanding by positioning themselves against the national government and hoping to bask in the limelight of the national press....... .......whilst the council tax payers pick up the bill for it. Amateur as it is (and I do agree with you on that) this vote should very clearly state the obvious. Those against the increase are just as passionate in their feelings as those for it - I think the double voting to which you refer will be a "self cancelling" factor anyway. Richada

2:25pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Wiggsy says...

Perhaps the Council could detail how the additional funds would be apportioned to the services that will specifically benefit from the additional 2.75% in order voters can make an informed decision on deciding whether spending £230k on the referendum is worthwhile.
Perhaps the Council could detail how the additional funds would be apportioned to the services that will specifically benefit from the additional 2.75% in order voters can make an informed decision on deciding whether spending £230k on the referendum is worthwhile. Wiggsy

2:28pm Tue 21 Jan 14

taman says...

g ormless
r ide rough shod
e nd in sight
e ar less
no one likes
s od off now
g ormless r ide rough shod e nd in sight e ar less no one likes s od off now taman

2:37pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Quiterie says...

Ricayboy wrote:
I wonder hoe much money the council spends each year on translation services and politically-correct projects that only benefit minorities, not the whole community? I am against any rise and would suggest the council cuts down on its own wastefulness first.
I received an email from the Council a couple of weeks ago reminding me that "Multi-cultural Women’s Swimming" is restarting. So that's nice.
[quote][p][bold]Ricayboy[/bold] wrote: I wonder hoe much money the council spends each year on translation services and politically-correct projects that only benefit minorities, not the whole community? I am against any rise and would suggest the council cuts down on its own wastefulness first.[/p][/quote]I received an email from the Council a couple of weeks ago reminding me that "Multi-cultural Women’s Swimming" is restarting. So that's nice. Quiterie

2:42pm Tue 21 Jan 14

sasquatch2202 says...

Alongside all the other taxpayers money this crackpot council has wasted on road schemes and pavement narrowing etc, they are still hell bent on pushing through plans to build a permanent travellers site on our beautiful south downs at a cost of £1.7 million this will also cost hundreds of thousands of pounds a year to run. THAT is where your council tax increase will go! Scrap this complete waste of money and I will vote yes to an increase. As long as the greens promise not to put themselves up for re election because frankly they couldn't run a bath!
Alongside all the other taxpayers money this crackpot council has wasted on road schemes and pavement narrowing etc, they are still hell bent on pushing through plans to build a permanent travellers site on our beautiful south downs at a cost of £1.7 million this will also cost hundreds of thousands of pounds a year to run. THAT is where your council tax increase will go! Scrap this complete waste of money and I will vote yes to an increase. As long as the greens promise not to put themselves up for re election because frankly they couldn't run a bath! sasquatch2202

2:44pm Tue 21 Jan 14

RaveyDavey says...

So long as the rise doesn't affect Lewes I am wholeheartedly in favour and fully support the increase! Tax & spend, tax & spend, tax & spend - looks like the Greens been taking lessons from the Labour Party!!
So long as the rise doesn't affect Lewes I am wholeheartedly in favour and fully support the increase! Tax & spend, tax & spend, tax & spend - looks like the Greens been taking lessons from the Labour Party!! RaveyDavey

3:13pm Tue 21 Jan 14

WooahWooah says...

Richada wrote:
WooahWooah wrote:
So the Argus decides to circumvent democracy by holding its own vote ahead of the real one. How is the Argus going to stop people voting more than once? How is the Argus going to stop people from outside Brighton and Hove - like me and many other Albion fans who read the paper online - voting and affecting its result? What information is the Argus providing to ensure that voters are informed before they cast their vote?

This is an amateur effort and people should wait for the real thing rather than feed the local media. Or isn't the Argus bothered about credibility and reliability these days?
I don't think you are quite up to speed on this one.

The whole point is that we B&HC tax paying residents don't want the council to waste yet another £230,000 of our money whilst blackmailing us that they cannot afford to fund services for the "vulnerable".

The current administration listens to nobody in this city and cares not a jot what the people who voted them in think of them now. All they are interested in is grandstanding by positioning themselves against the national government and hoping to bask in the limelight of the national press.......

.......whilst the council tax payers pick up the bill for it.

Amateur as it is (and I do agree with you on that) this vote should very clearly state the obvious. Those against the increase are just as passionate in their feelings as those for it - I think the double voting to which you refer will be a "self cancelling" factor anyway.
So what's to stop fans of the increase, or people like the respondent from Lewes above, voting in favour and giving people a false picture of public opinion?

And how do you know that 'double voting' will cancel itself out? I can conceivably vote online (multiple times), in the paper, on Facebook and on the street. Ludicrous, and makes the whole exercise pointless - except perhaps to a Council that wants to discredit the outcome.
[quote][p][bold]Richada[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]WooahWooah[/bold] wrote: So the Argus decides to circumvent democracy by holding its own vote ahead of the real one. How is the Argus going to stop people voting more than once? How is the Argus going to stop people from outside Brighton and Hove - like me and many other Albion fans who read the paper online - voting and affecting its result? What information is the Argus providing to ensure that voters are informed before they cast their vote? This is an amateur effort and people should wait for the real thing rather than feed the local media. Or isn't the Argus bothered about credibility and reliability these days?[/p][/quote]I don't think you are quite up to speed on this one. The whole point is that we B&HC tax paying residents don't want the council to waste yet another £230,000 of our money whilst blackmailing us that they cannot afford to fund services for the "vulnerable". The current administration listens to nobody in this city and cares not a jot what the people who voted them in think of them now. All they are interested in is grandstanding by positioning themselves against the national government and hoping to bask in the limelight of the national press....... .......whilst the council tax payers pick up the bill for it. Amateur as it is (and I do agree with you on that) this vote should very clearly state the obvious. Those against the increase are just as passionate in their feelings as those for it - I think the double voting to which you refer will be a "self cancelling" factor anyway.[/p][/quote]So what's to stop fans of the increase, or people like the respondent from Lewes above, voting in favour and giving people a false picture of public opinion? And how do you know that 'double voting' will cancel itself out? I can conceivably vote online (multiple times), in the paper, on Facebook and on the street. Ludicrous, and makes the whole exercise pointless - except perhaps to a Council that wants to discredit the outcome. WooahWooah

3:14pm Tue 21 Jan 14

anubis says...

Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge.

The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires!

OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!!

There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding.

FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.
Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge. The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires! OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!! There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding. FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION. anubis

3:36pm Tue 21 Jan 14

heartthrob says...

i voted the opposite I would in a referendum because we cant have the Argus kingmaking
i voted the opposite I would in a referendum because we cant have the Argus kingmaking heartthrob

3:49pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Richada says...

WooahWooah wrote:
Richada wrote:
WooahWooah wrote:
So the Argus decides to circumvent democracy by holding its own vote ahead of the real one. How is the Argus going to stop people voting more than once? How is the Argus going to stop people from outside Brighton and Hove - like me and many other Albion fans who read the paper online - voting and affecting its result? What information is the Argus providing to ensure that voters are informed before they cast their vote?

This is an amateur effort and people should wait for the real thing rather than feed the local media. Or isn't the Argus bothered about credibility and reliability these days?
I don't think you are quite up to speed on this one.

The whole point is that we B&HC tax paying residents don't want the council to waste yet another £230,000 of our money whilst blackmailing us that they cannot afford to fund services for the "vulnerable".

The current administration listens to nobody in this city and cares not a jot what the people who voted them in think of them now. All they are interested in is grandstanding by positioning themselves against the national government and hoping to bask in the limelight of the national press.......

.......whilst the council tax payers pick up the bill for it.

Amateur as it is (and I do agree with you on that) this vote should very clearly state the obvious. Those against the increase are just as passionate in their feelings as those for it - I think the double voting to which you refer will be a "self cancelling" factor anyway.
So what's to stop fans of the increase, or people like the respondent from Lewes above, voting in favour and giving people a false picture of public opinion?

And how do you know that 'double voting' will cancel itself out? I can conceivably vote online (multiple times), in the paper, on Facebook and on the street. Ludicrous, and makes the whole exercise pointless - except perhaps to a Council that wants to discredit the outcome.
Actually, with 35% in favour - acording to the Argus right now - I'm coming around to your opinion!
[quote][p][bold]WooahWooah[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Richada[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]WooahWooah[/bold] wrote: So the Argus decides to circumvent democracy by holding its own vote ahead of the real one. How is the Argus going to stop people voting more than once? How is the Argus going to stop people from outside Brighton and Hove - like me and many other Albion fans who read the paper online - voting and affecting its result? What information is the Argus providing to ensure that voters are informed before they cast their vote? This is an amateur effort and people should wait for the real thing rather than feed the local media. Or isn't the Argus bothered about credibility and reliability these days?[/p][/quote]I don't think you are quite up to speed on this one. The whole point is that we B&HC tax paying residents don't want the council to waste yet another £230,000 of our money whilst blackmailing us that they cannot afford to fund services for the "vulnerable". The current administration listens to nobody in this city and cares not a jot what the people who voted them in think of them now. All they are interested in is grandstanding by positioning themselves against the national government and hoping to bask in the limelight of the national press....... .......whilst the council tax payers pick up the bill for it. Amateur as it is (and I do agree with you on that) this vote should very clearly state the obvious. Those against the increase are just as passionate in their feelings as those for it - I think the double voting to which you refer will be a "self cancelling" factor anyway.[/p][/quote]So what's to stop fans of the increase, or people like the respondent from Lewes above, voting in favour and giving people a false picture of public opinion? And how do you know that 'double voting' will cancel itself out? I can conceivably vote online (multiple times), in the paper, on Facebook and on the street. Ludicrous, and makes the whole exercise pointless - except perhaps to a Council that wants to discredit the outcome.[/p][/quote]Actually, with 35% in favour - acording to the Argus right now - I'm coming around to your opinion! Richada

3:53pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Richada says...

Quiterie wrote:
Ricayboy wrote:
I wonder hoe much money the council spends each year on translation services and politically-correct projects that only benefit minorities, not the whole community? I am against any rise and would suggest the council cuts down on its own wastefulness first.
I received an email from the Council a couple of weeks ago reminding me that "Multi-cultural Women’s Swimming" is restarting. So that's nice.
That's completely sexist - are there no multi-cultural men in Brighton & Hove?

I think they need sending on an equality course straight away.

Being a non-swimmer I am a disadvantaged minority, any chance of a council tax rebate?

Thought not.
[quote][p][bold]Quiterie[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Ricayboy[/bold] wrote: I wonder hoe much money the council spends each year on translation services and politically-correct projects that only benefit minorities, not the whole community? I am against any rise and would suggest the council cuts down on its own wastefulness first.[/p][/quote]I received an email from the Council a couple of weeks ago reminding me that "Multi-cultural Women’s Swimming" is restarting. So that's nice.[/p][/quote]That's completely sexist - are there no multi-cultural men in Brighton & Hove? I think they need sending on an equality course straight away. Being a non-swimmer I am a disadvantaged minority, any chance of a council tax rebate? Thought not. Richada

3:55pm Tue 21 Jan 14

darcyp says...

Eugenius says...

The figures have been revised down slightly, as precepts for the Police and Fire Authority aren't expected to go up by 4.75% so the monthly increase from last year for each band is as follows:

Band A £2.83 (disabled relief)
Band A £3.40
Band B £3.96
Band C £4.53
Band D £5.09
Band E £6.23
Band F £7.36
Band G £8.49
Band H £10.19

That's per household rather than per person.
Deduct 25% if you are sole occupant.
Score: -10
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...


11:38am Tue 21 Jan 14

Eugenius says...


clubrob6 wrote:
If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.
Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea.

Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.

I'm Disabled I don't get any help from anywhere,my family are just about keeping our heads above water,i can't afford another well nearly £4.53 on my council tax.........i'm tired of paying for other ppl that don't pay their council tax.
As for the 20mph and waiting to see if the accident rates have gone down that's a load of tosh you ppl are not listening ( TEACH PPL THE GREEN CROSS CODE) or introduce jay walking,the times I've backed up into a space and ppl just carry on walking behind me,i've sat in traffic and seen quite a few misses where ppl have run out infront of cars and buses,set a camera up at the clock tower and watch how many pedestrians take their lives in their own hands because they can't wait a few seconds for the lights to change stop blaming the motorist all the time.
Eugenius says... The figures have been revised down slightly, as precepts for the Police and Fire Authority aren't expected to go up by 4.75% so the monthly increase from last year for each band is as follows: Band A £2.83 (disabled relief) Band A £3.40 Band B £3.96 Band C £4.53 Band D £5.09 Band E £6.23 Band F £7.36 Band G £8.49 Band H £10.19 That's per household rather than per person. Deduct 25% if you are sole occupant. Score: -10 Like Dislike .Quote » Report this post » ... 11:38am Tue 21 Jan 14 Eugenius says... clubrob6 wrote: If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around. Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea. Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work. I'm Disabled I don't get any help from anywhere,my family are just about keeping our heads above water,i can't afford another well nearly £4.53 on my council tax.........i'm tired of paying for other ppl that don't pay their council tax. As for the 20mph and waiting to see if the accident rates have gone down that's a load of tosh you ppl are not listening ( TEACH PPL THE GREEN CROSS CODE) or introduce jay walking,the times I've backed up into a space and ppl just carry on walking behind me,i've sat in traffic and seen quite a few misses where ppl have run out infront of cars and buses,set a camera up at the clock tower and watch how many pedestrians take their lives in their own hands because they can't wait a few seconds for the lights to change stop blaming the motorist all the time. darcyp

3:58pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Ricayboy says...

How much does this cost a year?
http://www.brighton-
hove.gov.uk/content/
council-and-democrac
y/equality/translati
ons-and-interpreting
-services
How much does this cost a year? http://www.brighton- hove.gov.uk/content/ council-and-democrac y/equality/translati ons-and-interpreting -services Ricayboy

4:07pm Tue 21 Jan 14

fredflintstone1 says...

Eugenius wrote:
browneyedgirl wrote:
I think this is a highly cynical move by the Greens.They are trying to make it hard to vote against it because by implication that would mean voting against protecting social care for the vulnerable.

They have concentrated on this one issue but they are simply proposing a general rise in council tax in the most emotive way they can. Why can't they say the increase is to pay for libraries/ recycling/ any of the other101 things they are responsible for? Why would they have to cut back on social care in particular? They haven't explained this
It's chiefly because social care is by the far the largest budget area - these services cost the council £112 million last year, and we have an additional budget gap of £24 million to make up this year. The first draft of the budget published at the end of November made savings across the board but the public consultation showed that people were very unhappy with cuts in social care. So we've produced a new plan to protect social care and propose to put it to a city-wide vote.
Don't think you're fooling people. The budget plans revealed where your priorities lie. You want to carry on paying for sheep rather than the care of the elderly. Your proposed Council tax increase is simply a way of maintaining cash flow to carry on with your vanity projects.

Why should the hard-working people of this city now be expected to pick up the bill for yet another 5000 students, all of whom will use Council services, but none of whom pay council tax? Perhaps you should have thought about imposing a section 106 agreement on all new student housing, eg in the London Road and elsewhere, to get some recompense? Or are you so desperate to get the student vote at any cost?

Also, how much Council money disappears into what the Greens like to term "third sector organisations" rather than ever reaching the people that it needs to reach? This will be the next big scandal. Do you not think that there should be a wide-ranging, independent investigation into nepotism and croneyism in the Council now?
[quote][p][bold]Eugenius[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]browneyedgirl[/bold] wrote: I think this is a highly cynical move by the Greens.They are trying to make it hard to vote against it because by implication that would mean voting against protecting social care for the vulnerable. They have concentrated on this one issue but they are simply proposing a general rise in council tax in the most emotive way they can. Why can't they say the increase is to pay for libraries/ recycling/ any of the other101 things they are responsible for? Why would they have to cut back on social care in particular? They haven't explained this[/p][/quote]It's chiefly because social care is by the far the largest budget area - these services cost the council £112 million last year, and we have an additional budget gap of £24 million to make up this year. The first draft of the budget published at the end of November made savings across the board but the public consultation showed that people were very unhappy with cuts in social care. So we've produced a new plan to protect social care and propose to put it to a city-wide vote.[/p][/quote]Don't think you're fooling people. The budget plans revealed where your priorities lie. You want to carry on paying for sheep rather than the care of the elderly. Your proposed Council tax increase is simply a way of maintaining cash flow to carry on with your vanity projects. Why should the hard-working people of this city now be expected to pick up the bill for yet another 5000 students, all of whom will use Council services, but none of whom pay council tax? Perhaps you should have thought about imposing a section 106 agreement on all new student housing, eg in the London Road and elsewhere, to get some recompense? Or are you so desperate to get the student vote at any cost? Also, how much Council money disappears into what the Greens like to term "third sector organisations" rather than ever reaching the people that it needs to reach? This will be the next big scandal. Do you not think that there should be a wide-ranging, independent investigation into nepotism and croneyism in the Council now? fredflintstone1

4:10pm Tue 21 Jan 14

bikerjimbo says...

Richada wrote:
I've just voted - it's 20 / 80 against at the moment.

Exactly what the great majority of us would have expected under the circumstances.
But the Greens will turn this into a positive vote somehow and inform us that we agreed it was the right thing to do and they will carry out our wishes!!
[quote][p][bold]Richada[/bold] wrote: I've just voted - it's 20 / 80 against at the moment. Exactly what the great majority of us would have expected under the circumstances.[/p][/quote]But the Greens will turn this into a positive vote somehow and inform us that we agreed it was the right thing to do and they will carry out our wishes!! bikerjimbo

4:14pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Sir Prised says...

The argument for the 20mph zone is the same one that has closed hundreds of level-crossings i.e. today's population are too thick to be responsible for their own safety, so we have to wrap them up in cotton wool. Personal responsibility has been replaced by rights and entitlement. It's always someone else's fault when things go wrong!
The argument for the 20mph zone is the same one that has closed hundreds of level-crossings i.e. today's population are too thick to be responsible for their own safety, so we have to wrap them up in cotton wool. Personal responsibility has been replaced by rights and entitlement. It's always someone else's fault when things go wrong! Sir Prised

4:20pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Fight_Back says...

anubis wrote:
Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge.

The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires!

OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!!

There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding.

FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.
How EXACTLY is taking more hard earned money from local tax payers fighting against the government ?
[quote][p][bold]anubis[/bold] wrote: Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge. The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires! OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!! There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding. FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.[/p][/quote]How EXACTLY is taking more hard earned money from local tax payers fighting against the government ? Fight_Back

4:26pm Tue 21 Jan 14

upsidedowntuctuc says...

anubis wrote:
Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge.

The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires!

OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!!

There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding.

FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.
What a total lot of tosh.
Almost Tory like in the have's forcing the havenots to pay up All that is missing is a Duckhouse
What about those that have been squeezed so far they have no more to pay out? This will finish them? As long as they waste money hand over fist it's a NO from me until they resign and let the grown ups take over
Less than 16 months to go OR even less...
[quote][p][bold]anubis[/bold] wrote: Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge. The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires! OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!! There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding. FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.[/p][/quote]What a total lot of tosh. Almost Tory like in the have's forcing the havenots to pay up All that is missing is a Duckhouse What about those that have been squeezed so far they have no more to pay out? This will finish them? As long as they waste money hand over fist it's a NO from me until they resign and let the grown ups take over Less than 16 months to go OR even less... upsidedowntuctuc

4:26pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Brighton1000 says...

This vote will be rigged by the greens up and down the UK, I would love to have access to the thousands of emails asking them to vote in favour. Poor idea Argus
This vote will be rigged by the greens up and down the UK, I would love to have access to the thousands of emails asking them to vote in favour. Poor idea Argus Brighton1000

4:39pm Tue 21 Jan 14

RottingdeanRant says...

I agree with many of the comments about the Argus vote and its limitations, but similar problems exist with the proposed referendum unless only the individuals that actually paid any B&H council tax can vote!
I agree with many of the comments about the Argus vote and its limitations, but similar problems exist with the proposed referendum unless only the individuals that actually paid any B&H council tax can vote! RottingdeanRant

5:15pm Tue 21 Jan 14

sasquatch2202 says...

May I suggest that ONLY council tax payers should be allowed to vote in the next election. This should wipe out 80% of green party support. Is this too radical an idea?
May I suggest that ONLY council tax payers should be allowed to vote in the next election. This should wipe out 80% of green party support. Is this too radical an idea? sasquatch2202

5:25pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Vigilia says...

This poll is fatally flawed.
I have come back to it four times today on the same computer and have been able to register a vote every time.
There will be a coterie of Green trolls out there registering vote after vote.
This poll is fatally flawed. I have come back to it four times today on the same computer and have been able to register a vote every time. There will be a coterie of Green trolls out there registering vote after vote. Vigilia

6:04pm Tue 21 Jan 14

WooahWooah says...

Vigilia wrote:
This poll is fatally flawed.
I have come back to it four times today on the same computer and have been able to register a vote every time.
There will be a coterie of Green trolls out there registering vote after vote.
I rest my case, m'lud.
[quote][p][bold]Vigilia[/bold] wrote: This poll is fatally flawed. I have come back to it four times today on the same computer and have been able to register a vote every time. There will be a coterie of Green trolls out there registering vote after vote.[/p][/quote]I rest my case, m'lud. WooahWooah

6:05pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Ambo Guy says...

sasquatch2202 wrote:
May I suggest that ONLY council tax payers should be allowed to vote in the next election. This should wipe out 80% of green party support. Is this too radical an idea?
Makes perfect sense to me and many many others. Of course the pro Green idiots on here will harp on about the rights of the students but what gets me is that most of the the students who vote Green won't even be living in Brighton after their university course is over. I just wonder how many students who lumbered us with the Greens in the last election are still living here to see the chaos they've caused.
[quote][p][bold]sasquatch2202[/bold] wrote: May I suggest that ONLY council tax payers should be allowed to vote in the next election. This should wipe out 80% of green party support. Is this too radical an idea?[/p][/quote]Makes perfect sense to me and many many others. Of course the pro Green idiots on here will harp on about the rights of the students but what gets me is that most of the the students who vote Green won't even be living in Brighton after their university course is over. I just wonder how many students who lumbered us with the Greens in the last election are still living here to see the chaos they've caused. Ambo Guy

6:13pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Lady Smith says...

Stop blaming local government for what the ConDems are doing:
From last June: 'Councils in England face a 10% cut in funding from central government as part of the coalition's spending plans for 2015/16, the BBC has been told.'
Stop blaming local government for what the ConDems are doing: From last June: 'Councils in England face a 10% cut in funding from central government as part of the coalition's spending plans for 2015/16, the BBC has been told.' Lady Smith

6:24pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Vigilia says...

Vigilia wrote:
This poll is fatally flawed.
I have come back to it four times today on the same computer and have been able to register a vote every time.
There will be a coterie of Green trolls out there registering vote after vote.
I've just done it for a fifth time and what is more, I also registered a vote on my Smartphone and tablet.
Please remove it Argus, it's meaningless.
[quote][p][bold]Vigilia[/bold] wrote: This poll is fatally flawed. I have come back to it four times today on the same computer and have been able to register a vote every time. There will be a coterie of Green trolls out there registering vote after vote.[/p][/quote]I've just done it for a fifth time and what is more, I also registered a vote on my Smartphone and tablet. Please remove it Argus, it's meaningless. Vigilia

6:46pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Maxwell's Ghost says...

Eugenius is clearly aGreen councillor and has failed to answer a poster's question as to his/her identity.
The fact he spends almost every hour of the day posting suggests he claims the allowances for being a councillor from the tax payers' pot to produce nothing but PR and spin.
When do you do any ward work Eugenius which is what you are employed by the electorate to do.
As for the increase, no one will vote to hand money to an irresponsible party such as the Greens.
Vote against any rise and if you can afford to pay more, give directly to local charities which support front line services then you can ensure your money reaches those in need instead of a bike lane or an unused electricity car charging point or for Mr Davey to install a light up bus time table for his posh voters in Preston Park.
And the cheeky Greens blame other parties for poverty. This sort of reckless spend is immoral and shameful. Mr Davey should resign as he is not right.
Eugenius is clearly aGreen councillor and has failed to answer a poster's question as to his/her identity. The fact he spends almost every hour of the day posting suggests he claims the allowances for being a councillor from the tax payers' pot to produce nothing but PR and spin. When do you do any ward work Eugenius which is what you are employed by the electorate to do. As for the increase, no one will vote to hand money to an irresponsible party such as the Greens. Vote against any rise and if you can afford to pay more, give directly to local charities which support front line services then you can ensure your money reaches those in need instead of a bike lane or an unused electricity car charging point or for Mr Davey to install a light up bus time table for his posh voters in Preston Park. And the cheeky Greens blame other parties for poverty. This sort of reckless spend is immoral and shameful. Mr Davey should resign as he is not right. Maxwell's Ghost

6:48pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Robertostarlight says...

Ambo Guy wrote:
sasquatch2202 wrote:
May I suggest that ONLY council tax payers should be allowed to vote in the next election. This should wipe out 80% of green party support. Is this too radical an idea?
Makes perfect sense to me and many many others. Of course the pro Green idiots on here will harp on about the rights of the students but what gets me is that most of the the students who vote Green won't even be living in Brighton after their university course is over. I just wonder how many students who lumbered us with the Greens in the last election are still living here to see the chaos they've caused.
Quite amazing that the American colonies fought a war over two centuries ago because of ' No taxation without representation...' and yet the very opposite applies in Britain' , (i.e. ..'representation without taxation..'), when it comes to students registering to vote in local city wards where no Council Tax is paid by them.

It really is time that this was sorted out as it is simply inequitable. They{students}, and for that matter their greedy landlords in many ways, are simply getting a 'free ride' but at the expense of those who do actually contribute.

A 'no' vote from me for any increase until these so-called Councillors, who seem to still have a 'student' mentality themselves' are gone.
[quote][p][bold]Ambo Guy[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sasquatch2202[/bold] wrote: May I suggest that ONLY council tax payers should be allowed to vote in the next election. This should wipe out 80% of green party support. Is this too radical an idea?[/p][/quote]Makes perfect sense to me and many many others. Of course the pro Green idiots on here will harp on about the rights of the students but what gets me is that most of the the students who vote Green won't even be living in Brighton after their university course is over. I just wonder how many students who lumbered us with the Greens in the last election are still living here to see the chaos they've caused.[/p][/quote]Quite amazing that the American colonies fought a war over two centuries ago because of ' No taxation without representation...' and yet the very opposite applies in Britain' , (i.e. ..'representation without taxation..'), when it comes to students registering to vote in local city wards where no Council Tax is paid by them. It really is time that this was sorted out as it is simply inequitable. They{students}, and for that matter their greedy landlords in many ways, are simply getting a 'free ride' but at the expense of those who do actually contribute. A 'no' vote from me for any increase until these so-called Councillors, who seem to still have a 'student' mentality themselves' are gone. Robertostarlight

7:16pm Tue 21 Jan 14

thevoiceoftruth says...

The poll above is as pointless as the referendum as you can vote countless times from different devices. Eugenius (who I suspect is Mr Kitkat) has already explained that students will be able to vote in the referendum, even though they don't pay council tax. People who are not affected by the rise can vote for it. So no, I don't support a referendum.
The poll above is as pointless as the referendum as you can vote countless times from different devices. Eugenius (who I suspect is Mr Kitkat) has already explained that students will be able to vote in the referendum, even though they don't pay council tax. People who are not affected by the rise can vote for it. So no, I don't support a referendum. thevoiceoftruth

7:33pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Martin999 says...

bikerjimbo wrote:
Richada wrote:
I've just voted - it's 20 / 80 against at the moment.

Exactly what the great majority of us would have expected under the circumstances.
But the Greens will turn this into a positive vote somehow and inform us that we agreed it was the right thing to do and they will carry out our wishes!!
I have just found out that Jason Kitkat's real father is Sir Humphrey Appleby!
[quote][p][bold]bikerjimbo[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Richada[/bold] wrote: I've just voted - it's 20 / 80 against at the moment. Exactly what the great majority of us would have expected under the circumstances.[/p][/quote]But the Greens will turn this into a positive vote somehow and inform us that we agreed it was the right thing to do and they will carry out our wishes!![/p][/quote]I have just found out that Jason Kitkat's real father is Sir Humphrey Appleby! Martin999

7:41pm Tue 21 Jan 14

brighton bluenose says...

Christ - it says a lot about Michael Beard and Neil Vowles when they report as fact that over 180 on-line readers have commented on this story! The fact is that as of right now there are 185 comments on the original web-story with many many repeat posters so the '180 on-line readers' is total bo**ocks - but hey thats the sort of press we have in Brighton and the UK these days!!
Even if true this is less than 0.10% speaking on behalf of either yes or no so hardly a ringing endorsement one way or the other!!
Christ - it says a lot about Michael Beard and Neil Vowles when they report as fact that over 180 on-line readers have commented on this story! The fact is that as of right now there are 185 comments on the original web-story with many many repeat posters so the '180 on-line readers' is total bo**ocks - but hey thats the sort of press we have in Brighton and the UK these days!! Even if true this is less than 0.10% speaking on behalf of either yes or no so hardly a ringing endorsement one way or the other!! brighton bluenose

7:49pm Tue 21 Jan 14

brighton bluenose says...

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
Eugenius is clearly aGreen councillor and has failed to answer a poster's question as to his/her identity.
The fact he spends almost every hour of the day posting suggests he claims the allowances for being a councillor from the tax payers' pot to produce nothing but PR and spin.
When do you do any ward work Eugenius which is what you are employed by the electorate to do.
As for the increase, no one will vote to hand money to an irresponsible party such as the Greens.
Vote against any rise and if you can afford to pay more, give directly to local charities which support front line services then you can ensure your money reaches those in need instead of a bike lane or an unused electricity car charging point or for Mr Davey to install a light up bus time table for his posh voters in Preston Park.
And the cheeky Greens blame other parties for poverty. This sort of reckless spend is immoral and shameful. Mr Davey should resign as he is not right.
We have had decades of Labour and Tory rule both nationally and local and we now have the child poverty that you correctly bang on about both locally and nationally so - just that we are all clear - please explain to us all how the Greens who have been in power for two years or so locally are responsible for that child poverty and how they are meant to solve this problem both nationally and locally?!
[quote][p][bold]Maxwell's Ghost[/bold] wrote: Eugenius is clearly aGreen councillor and has failed to answer a poster's question as to his/her identity. The fact he spends almost every hour of the day posting suggests he claims the allowances for being a councillor from the tax payers' pot to produce nothing but PR and spin. When do you do any ward work Eugenius which is what you are employed by the electorate to do. As for the increase, no one will vote to hand money to an irresponsible party such as the Greens. Vote against any rise and if you can afford to pay more, give directly to local charities which support front line services then you can ensure your money reaches those in need instead of a bike lane or an unused electricity car charging point or for Mr Davey to install a light up bus time table for his posh voters in Preston Park. And the cheeky Greens blame other parties for poverty. This sort of reckless spend is immoral and shameful. Mr Davey should resign as he is not right.[/p][/quote]We have had decades of Labour and Tory rule both nationally and local and we now have the child poverty that you correctly bang on about both locally and nationally so - just that we are all clear - please explain to us all how the Greens who have been in power for two years or so locally are responsible for that child poverty and how they are meant to solve this problem both nationally and locally?! brighton bluenose

7:51pm Tue 21 Jan 14

We are the 99% says...

anubis wrote:
Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge.

The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires!

OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!!

There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding.

FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.
The Greens Aren't fighting or hurting this Tory led Government!
They're hurting ordinary people, struggling to make ends meet!
And the Green fanatical policies, are causing even more, of an added unnecessary financial burden!
[quote][p][bold]anubis[/bold] wrote: Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge. The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires! OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!! There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding. FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.[/p][/quote]The Greens Aren't fighting or hurting this Tory led Government! They're hurting ordinary people, struggling to make ends meet! And the Green fanatical policies, are causing even more, of an added unnecessary financial burden! We are the 99%

8:00pm Tue 21 Jan 14

brighton bluenose says...

We are the 99% wrote:
anubis wrote:
Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge.

The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires!

OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!!

There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding.

FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.
The Greens Aren't fighting or hurting this Tory led Government!
They're hurting ordinary people, struggling to make ends meet!
And the Green fanatical policies, are causing even more, of an added unnecessary financial burden!
Shut up you clown - the unnecessary financial burden is caused by central government cuts to local government funding all caused by decades of Labour/Tory misrule! The Greens are VERY unfortunate that as a new regime they are bearing the brunt of these cuts just as many other councils are across the country
[quote][p][bold]We are the 99%[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]anubis[/bold] wrote: Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge. The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires! OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!! There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding. FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.[/p][/quote]The Greens Aren't fighting or hurting this Tory led Government! They're hurting ordinary people, struggling to make ends meet! And the Green fanatical policies, are causing even more, of an added unnecessary financial burden![/p][/quote]Shut up you clown - the unnecessary financial burden is caused by central government cuts to local government funding all caused by decades of Labour/Tory misrule! The Greens are VERY unfortunate that as a new regime they are bearing the brunt of these cuts just as many other councils are across the country brighton bluenose

8:23pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Richada says...

Vigilia wrote:
Vigilia wrote:
This poll is fatally flawed.
I have come back to it four times today on the same computer and have been able to register a vote every time.
There will be a coterie of Green trolls out there registering vote after vote.
I've just done it for a fifth time and what is more, I also registered a vote on my Smartphone and tablet.
Please remove it Argus, it's meaningless.
That would explain the eyebrow raising 40 / 60 split now.......

.........chickens voting on behalf of turkeys for Christmas.
[quote][p][bold]Vigilia[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Vigilia[/bold] wrote: This poll is fatally flawed. I have come back to it four times today on the same computer and have been able to register a vote every time. There will be a coterie of Green trolls out there registering vote after vote.[/p][/quote]I've just done it for a fifth time and what is more, I also registered a vote on my Smartphone and tablet. Please remove it Argus, it's meaningless.[/p][/quote]That would explain the eyebrow raising 40 / 60 split now....... .........chickens voting on behalf of turkeys for Christmas. Richada

8:31pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Valerie Paynter says...

I read in a tweet today that the council has over 800 services. I would like a list of them so I can tick off the ones that are obviously PC and about indulging pouting officers using council resources and diverting their attention to bullying complaints and then I'd look at what is needed and what is outrageous - like BHCC playing at being a developer, say, and offering to borrow and loan on £36m to a developer to build i360. A lot of expensive officer time goes into that kind of thing.
I read in a tweet today that the council has over 800 services. I would like a list of them so I can tick off the ones that are obviously PC and about indulging pouting officers using council resources and diverting their attention to bullying complaints and then I'd look at what is needed and what is outrageous - like BHCC playing at being a developer, say, and offering to borrow and loan on £36m to a developer to build i360. A lot of expensive officer time goes into that kind of thing. Valerie Paynter

9:47pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Maxwell's Ghost says...

Brightonbluenose Eugenius and HJarrs constantly produce PR for the Greens on this site all day. Vast amounts of time are used issuing PR, how they earn a living I cannot imagine.
With this continuous PR have you learned anything about the party's work to help local elderly, vulnerable and young people? Name some high profile people schemes..not transport schemes, real front line helping people in hardship schemes....and don't fall for Bill Randall telling us they have housed 68 people. That's 68 people from the 17,000 on the housing list while the same Green council promise to bring 5,000 young people from outside the city here with new homes, even giving them 550 parking spaces on Preston Barracks, while local people are told to get on their bikes.
You tell me bluenose what message people get from these actions?
Brightonbluenose Eugenius and HJarrs constantly produce PR for the Greens on this site all day. Vast amounts of time are used issuing PR, how they earn a living I cannot imagine. With this continuous PR have you learned anything about the party's work to help local elderly, vulnerable and young people? Name some high profile people schemes..not transport schemes, real front line helping people in hardship schemes....and don't fall for Bill Randall telling us they have housed 68 people. That's 68 people from the 17,000 on the housing list while the same Green council promise to bring 5,000 young people from outside the city here with new homes, even giving them 550 parking spaces on Preston Barracks, while local people are told to get on their bikes. You tell me bluenose what message people get from these actions? Maxwell's Ghost

10:00pm Tue 21 Jan 14

cookie_brighton says...

There are a lot of NON PAYING COUNCIL TAX STUDENTS in Brighton, and MORE to come.........Most of the black bags of rubbish, mattresses and other households furniture which are dumped on the side of our streets is from some of these students, not forgetting the graffiti on our walls, as a resident of Brighton I feel that, as these students live in our city for awhile.....they should pay an amount towards council tax.
I am 60 years of age, paid into the systems in operation all my life, national insurance and income tax...,wore the Queens uniform .........with pride I....received an accident at work which means I am unable to work at present, I am in receipt of E.S.A...........out of this pittance I receive, I have to pay £64 per year...........counc
il tax ( out of my welfare benefit ).........so if I have to pay.....why not the students.......we have the same services, street lights, refuse collection
There are a lot of NON PAYING COUNCIL TAX STUDENTS in Brighton, and MORE to come.........Most of the black bags of rubbish, mattresses and other households furniture which are dumped on the side of our streets is from some of these students, not forgetting the graffiti on our walls, as a resident of Brighton I feel that, as these students live in our city for awhile.....they should pay an amount towards council tax. I am 60 years of age, paid into the systems in operation all my life, national insurance and income tax...,wore the Queens uniform .........with pride I....received an accident at work which means I am unable to work at present, I am in receipt of E.S.A...........out of this pittance I receive, I have to pay £64 per year...........counc il tax ( out of my welfare benefit ).........so if I have to pay.....why not the students.......we have the same services, street lights, refuse collection cookie_brighton

10:08pm Tue 21 Jan 14

brighton bluenose says...

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
Brightonbluenose Eugenius and HJarrs constantly produce PR for the Greens on this site all day. Vast amounts of time are used issuing PR, how they earn a living I cannot imagine.
With this continuous PR have you learned anything about the party's work to help local elderly, vulnerable and young people? Name some high profile people schemes..not transport schemes, real front line helping people in hardship schemes....and don't fall for Bill Randall telling us they have housed 68 people. That's 68 people from the 17,000 on the housing list while the same Green council promise to bring 5,000 young people from outside the city here with new homes, even giving them 550 parking spaces on Preston Barracks, while local people are told to get on their bikes.
You tell me bluenose what message people get from these actions?
You come out with the same tedious crap but fail to answer my question posed above!! Pathetic!
Here's two more for you -
1. You, again correctly, bang on about 17, 000 on the housing list - but that list has been on an upward trajectory for years under previous Tory and Labour administrations so why vote for more of the same?!!
2. You mention 5, 000 extra students - do you REALLY think the Tory/ Labour traitors are going to stop this development
[quote][p][bold]Maxwell's Ghost[/bold] wrote: Brightonbluenose Eugenius and HJarrs constantly produce PR for the Greens on this site all day. Vast amounts of time are used issuing PR, how they earn a living I cannot imagine. With this continuous PR have you learned anything about the party's work to help local elderly, vulnerable and young people? Name some high profile people schemes..not transport schemes, real front line helping people in hardship schemes....and don't fall for Bill Randall telling us they have housed 68 people. That's 68 people from the 17,000 on the housing list while the same Green council promise to bring 5,000 young people from outside the city here with new homes, even giving them 550 parking spaces on Preston Barracks, while local people are told to get on their bikes. You tell me bluenose what message people get from these actions?[/p][/quote]You come out with the same tedious crap but fail to answer my question posed above!! Pathetic! Here's two more for you - 1. You, again correctly, bang on about 17, 000 on the housing list - but that list has been on an upward trajectory for years under previous Tory and Labour administrations so why vote for more of the same?!! 2. You mention 5, 000 extra students - do you REALLY think the Tory/ Labour traitors are going to stop this development brighton bluenose

10:10pm Tue 21 Jan 14

brighton bluenose says...

Somethingsarejustwro
ng
wrote:
brighton bluenose wrote:
We are the 99% wrote:
anubis wrote:
Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge.

The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires!

OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!!

There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding.

FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.
The Greens Aren't fighting or hurting this Tory led Government!
They're hurting ordinary people, struggling to make ends meet!
And the Green fanatical policies, are causing even more, of an added unnecessary financial burden!
Shut up you clown - the unnecessary financial burden is caused by central government cuts to local government funding all caused by decades of Labour/Tory misrule! The Greens are VERY unfortunate that as a new regime they are bearing the brunt of these cuts just as many other councils are across the country
You thick brainless tw4t No wonder the greens are failing in everything they touch if you are an example of the intellect the wasters enjoy

Laughable moron
Get back to your Pot Noodle and onanism you sad **** - one day you'll actually contribute to the debate!
[quote][p][bold]Somethingsarejustwro ng[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]brighton bluenose[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]We are the 99%[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]anubis[/bold] wrote: Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge. The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires! OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!! There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding. FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.[/p][/quote]The Greens Aren't fighting or hurting this Tory led Government! They're hurting ordinary people, struggling to make ends meet! And the Green fanatical policies, are causing even more, of an added unnecessary financial burden![/p][/quote]Shut up you clown - the unnecessary financial burden is caused by central government cuts to local government funding all caused by decades of Labour/Tory misrule! The Greens are VERY unfortunate that as a new regime they are bearing the brunt of these cuts just as many other councils are across the country[/p][/quote]You thick brainless tw4t No wonder the greens are failing in everything they touch if you are an example of the intellect the wasters enjoy Laughable moron[/p][/quote]Get back to your Pot Noodle and onanism you sad **** - one day you'll actually contribute to the debate! brighton bluenose

10:11pm Tue 21 Jan 14

HJarrs says...

I suggest everyone reads Warren Morgan's blog as he suggests above and here it is again;

http://warrenmorgan.

wordpress.com/2014/0

1/20/are-brighton-an

d-hove-residents-bei

ng-asked-to-pay-6-mo

re-a-month-so-the-gr

een-leader-can-keep-

his-job/

The work of a consumate politician, I am sure you will agree.
No mention of the 2% council tax rise prevented by Morgan two years ago for a cheap headline in the Argus - £3million of cuts every year since.
No mention of the extra cuts year upon year that will be made due to the lost revenue if the referendum is not held and won - £5-7 million every year from now on.
No mention of the chaos he has now thrown the council into as the proposed junior partner to the Consevatives!! (yet he is obsessed by Green Party splits!).
But acceptance to do nothing about the Tory cuts agenda.

Labour Party Councillors, party members and voters, I would like you to think back to why you joined and voted for Labour. Like me, I suggest a commitment to decency, fair play, democracy, support for the weakest in society, a better life for the many, the welfare state to help those in need, the NHS.

Look where your party leadership locally has now led you in the chase for power; a coalition with the Conservatives at a time when they are more right wing than ever. How can you let this happen? Your Labour leadership nationally and locally now propose to continue to accept the government's cuts agenda. This council has cut and cut; yes, less than pretty much any council you care to mention and already too far, but it is now time to draw a line as best we can. And we do not draw that line now then when? You did not support the Labour Party to be let down and like this.

You did not join or support the Labour Party to be told by your leader to expect yet more cuts year upon year into the next government just to curry favour with the Daily Mail, yet that is what he did this week. You did not join to privatise services, but that is what has happened, is happening and will continue to happen in your name.

Compared to the Tories, the welfare state, the NHS and council services are now barely more secure if Labour takes power, as they tack once more to the right. This is not what you pay your subs for or give up your time to meet, or tread the streets, this is not what you tell the voters,

The Labour Party is full of decent people who want a better society, but time after time, year in year out you have been let down and not only is this not going to change it is getting worse. The Labour Leadership has failed you, it will do nothing more than tinker at best and in your heart you know this. It has has no answers or commitment to solving the major economic, social and environmental issue of our time. It is long dead a reforming party. But you have not failed, you should expect and demand better, it is time to stood tall once more.

It is time to fight back against the disasterous obsession with austerity and cuts. It is time to bury tribalism; the cuts facing the city and the nation, which are eating at our very social fabric, are too important to play games with for the pursuit of power. Join with the Greens in a non-partisan movement against the cuts, because if the fight back does not start in this city then where and when? I fear knowhere.

If you cannot get change in the Labour Party in the next few days and weeks to protect the most vulnerable (and this is not just about the next budget, the cuts will ratchet down on spending year on year), then it is clearly time to rip up your membership cards (very hard I know from personal experience) and come and join the Greens, because we are fighting for the things you value. Sure, the Greens are not perfect, who is? They have made mistakes along the way, who hasn't? The Greens are a work in progress, but it has made a decent fist of the council, not shying from making necessary and often unpopular decisions in extreme financial conditions and have an excellent MP making waves in the House of commons fighting for causes you believe in. The direction of the Greens is foward, it is the last progressive party. Labour left you long ago, but you could help make the Greens a better party and once more walk tall.

Please don't let yourself be tarred by me "Vote Labour get Tory". Surely, that is an insult too far? Isn't it?
I suggest everyone reads Warren Morgan's blog as he suggests above and here it is again; http://warrenmorgan. wordpress.com/2014/0 1/20/are-brighton-an d-hove-residents-bei ng-asked-to-pay-6-mo re-a-month-so-the-gr een-leader-can-keep- his-job/ The work of a consumate politician, I am sure you will agree. No mention of the 2% council tax rise prevented by Morgan two years ago for a cheap headline in the Argus - £3million of cuts every year since. No mention of the extra cuts year upon year that will be made due to the lost revenue if the referendum is not held and won - £5-7 million every year from now on. No mention of the chaos he has now thrown the council into as the proposed junior partner to the Consevatives!! (yet he is obsessed by Green Party splits!). But acceptance to do nothing about the Tory cuts agenda. Labour Party Councillors, party members and voters, I would like you to think back to why you joined and voted for Labour. Like me, I suggest a commitment to decency, fair play, democracy, support for the weakest in society, a better life for the many, the welfare state to help those in need, the NHS. Look where your party leadership locally has now led you in the chase for power; a coalition with the Conservatives at a time when they are more right wing than ever. How can you let this happen? Your Labour leadership nationally and locally now propose to continue to accept the government's cuts agenda. This council has cut and cut; yes, less than pretty much any council you care to mention and already too far, but it is now time to draw a line as best we can. And we do not draw that line now then when? You did not support the Labour Party to be let down and like this. You did not join or support the Labour Party to be told by your leader to expect yet more cuts year upon year into the next government just to curry favour with the Daily Mail, yet that is what he did this week. You did not join to privatise services, but that is what has happened, is happening and will continue to happen in your name. Compared to the Tories, the welfare state, the NHS and council services are now barely more secure if Labour takes power, as they tack once more to the right. This is not what you pay your subs for or give up your time to meet, or tread the streets, this is not what you tell the voters, The Labour Party is full of decent people who want a better society, but time after time, year in year out you have been let down and not only is this not going to change it is getting worse. The Labour Leadership has failed you, it will do nothing more than tinker at best and in your heart you know this. It has has no answers or commitment to solving the major economic, social and environmental issue of our time. It is long dead a reforming party. But you have not failed, you should expect and demand better, it is time to stood tall once more. It is time to fight back against the disasterous obsession with austerity and cuts. It is time to bury tribalism; the cuts facing the city and the nation, which are eating at our very social fabric, are too important to play games with for the pursuit of power. Join with the Greens in a non-partisan movement against the cuts, because if the fight back does not start in this city then where and when? I fear knowhere. If you cannot get change in the Labour Party in the next few days and weeks to protect the most vulnerable (and this is not just about the next budget, the cuts will ratchet down on spending year on year), then it is clearly time to rip up your membership cards (very hard I know from personal experience) and come and join the Greens, because we are fighting for the things you value. Sure, the Greens are not perfect, who is? They have made mistakes along the way, who hasn't? The Greens are a work in progress, but it has made a decent fist of the council, not shying from making necessary and often unpopular decisions in extreme financial conditions and have an excellent MP making waves in the House of commons fighting for causes you believe in. The direction of the Greens is foward, it is the last progressive party. Labour left you long ago, but you could help make the Greens a better party and once more walk tall. Please don't let yourself be tarred by me "Vote Labour get Tory". Surely, that is an insult too far? Isn't it? HJarrs

10:17pm Tue 21 Jan 14

brighton bluenose says...

Brighton1000 wrote:
Eugenius wrote:
clubrob6 wrote:
If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.
Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea.

Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.
So you're now sherking responsibility for the rubbish chaos away from the green council also? Go and deliver your spin somewhere else. Do you honestly think Brighton residents are that unintelligent that they will believe a word you type? Every post you type, you bat away responsibility. Avoid questions, manipulate what people ask. You are a perfect example of why the majority of us cannot wait to see the back of the greens, And it appears that day may come sooner than it first appeared, What a lovely thought :)
Perhaps you can explain how he was 'sherking' from responsibility for the 'rubbish chaos' - it was merely pointed out that the financial cuts have had a detrimental effect on the service which is hardly -ahem - shirking!!
[quote][p][bold]Brighton1000[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Eugenius[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]clubrob6[/bold] wrote: If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.[/p][/quote]Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea. Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.[/p][/quote]So you're now sherking responsibility for the rubbish chaos away from the green council also? Go and deliver your spin somewhere else. Do you honestly think Brighton residents are that unintelligent that they will believe a word you type? Every post you type, you bat away responsibility. Avoid questions, manipulate what people ask. You are a perfect example of why the majority of us cannot wait to see the back of the greens, And it appears that day may come sooner than it first appeared, What a lovely thought :)[/p][/quote]Perhaps you can explain how he was 'sherking' from responsibility for the 'rubbish chaos' - it was merely pointed out that the financial cuts have had a detrimental effect on the service which is hardly -ahem - shirking!! brighton bluenose

10:28pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Ambo Guy says...

HJarrs wrote:
I suggest everyone reads Warren Morgan's blog as he suggests above and here it is again;

http://warrenmorgan.


wordpress.com/2014/0


1/20/are-brighton-an


d-hove-residents-bei


ng-asked-to-pay-6-mo


re-a-month-so-the-gr


een-leader-can-keep-


his-job/

The work of a consumate politician, I am sure you will agree.
No mention of the 2% council tax rise prevented by Morgan two years ago for a cheap headline in the Argus - £3million of cuts every year since.
No mention of the extra cuts year upon year that will be made due to the lost revenue if the referendum is not held and won - £5-7 million every year from now on.
No mention of the chaos he has now thrown the council into as the proposed junior partner to the Consevatives!! (yet he is obsessed by Green Party splits!).
But acceptance to do nothing about the Tory cuts agenda.

Labour Party Councillors, party members and voters, I would like you to think back to why you joined and voted for Labour. Like me, I suggest a commitment to decency, fair play, democracy, support for the weakest in society, a better life for the many, the welfare state to help those in need, the NHS.

Look where your party leadership locally has now led you in the chase for power; a coalition with the Conservatives at a time when they are more right wing than ever. How can you let this happen? Your Labour leadership nationally and locally now propose to continue to accept the government's cuts agenda. This council has cut and cut; yes, less than pretty much any council you care to mention and already too far, but it is now time to draw a line as best we can. And we do not draw that line now then when? You did not support the Labour Party to be let down and like this.

You did not join or support the Labour Party to be told by your leader to expect yet more cuts year upon year into the next government just to curry favour with the Daily Mail, yet that is what he did this week. You did not join to privatise services, but that is what has happened, is happening and will continue to happen in your name.

Compared to the Tories, the welfare state, the NHS and council services are now barely more secure if Labour takes power, as they tack once more to the right. This is not what you pay your subs for or give up your time to meet, or tread the streets, this is not what you tell the voters,

The Labour Party is full of decent people who want a better society, but time after time, year in year out you have been let down and not only is this not going to change it is getting worse. The Labour Leadership has failed you, it will do nothing more than tinker at best and in your heart you know this. It has has no answers or commitment to solving the major economic, social and environmental issue of our time. It is long dead a reforming party. But you have not failed, you should expect and demand better, it is time to stood tall once more.

It is time to fight back against the disasterous obsession with austerity and cuts. It is time to bury tribalism; the cuts facing the city and the nation, which are eating at our very social fabric, are too important to play games with for the pursuit of power. Join with the Greens in a non-partisan movement against the cuts, because if the fight back does not start in this city then where and when? I fear knowhere.

If you cannot get change in the Labour Party in the next few days and weeks to protect the most vulnerable (and this is not just about the next budget, the cuts will ratchet down on spending year on year), then it is clearly time to rip up your membership cards (very hard I know from personal experience) and come and join the Greens, because we are fighting for the things you value. Sure, the Greens are not perfect, who is? They have made mistakes along the way, who hasn't? The Greens are a work in progress, but it has made a decent fist of the council, not shying from making necessary and often unpopular decisions in extreme financial conditions and have an excellent MP making waves in the House of commons fighting for causes you believe in. The direction of the Greens is foward, it is the last progressive party. Labour left you long ago, but you could help make the Greens a better party and once more walk tall.

Please don't let yourself be tarred by me "Vote Labour get Tory". Surely, that is an insult too far? Isn't it?
Your recent change of tactic is so obvious you're not half as clever as you think you are councillor Jarrs.

You're not even trying to defend the Greens anymore and just attack the Labour Party instead. It's proper gutter politics and shows that you really have no idea how to defend the Greens and their barmy policies on this forum. Ironically enough it's the very same tactic that both Labour and the Tories have been using for years.

You're not that different from them after all are you ?

Vote Green get Labour/Conservative/
UKIP/Lib Dem
[quote][p][bold]HJarrs[/bold] wrote: I suggest everyone reads Warren Morgan's blog as he suggests above and here it is again; http://warrenmorgan. wordpress.com/2014/0 1/20/are-brighton-an d-hove-residents-bei ng-asked-to-pay-6-mo re-a-month-so-the-gr een-leader-can-keep- his-job/ The work of a consumate politician, I am sure you will agree. No mention of the 2% council tax rise prevented by Morgan two years ago for a cheap headline in the Argus - £3million of cuts every year since. No mention of the extra cuts year upon year that will be made due to the lost revenue if the referendum is not held and won - £5-7 million every year from now on. No mention of the chaos he has now thrown the council into as the proposed junior partner to the Consevatives!! (yet he is obsessed by Green Party splits!). But acceptance to do nothing about the Tory cuts agenda. Labour Party Councillors, party members and voters, I would like you to think back to why you joined and voted for Labour. Like me, I suggest a commitment to decency, fair play, democracy, support for the weakest in society, a better life for the many, the welfare state to help those in need, the NHS. Look where your party leadership locally has now led you in the chase for power; a coalition with the Conservatives at a time when they are more right wing than ever. How can you let this happen? Your Labour leadership nationally and locally now propose to continue to accept the government's cuts agenda. This council has cut and cut; yes, less than pretty much any council you care to mention and already too far, but it is now time to draw a line as best we can. And we do not draw that line now then when? You did not support the Labour Party to be let down and like this. You did not join or support the Labour Party to be told by your leader to expect yet more cuts year upon year into the next government just to curry favour with the Daily Mail, yet that is what he did this week. You did not join to privatise services, but that is what has happened, is happening and will continue to happen in your name. Compared to the Tories, the welfare state, the NHS and council services are now barely more secure if Labour takes power, as they tack once more to the right. This is not what you pay your subs for or give up your time to meet, or tread the streets, this is not what you tell the voters, The Labour Party is full of decent people who want a better society, but time after time, year in year out you have been let down and not only is this not going to change it is getting worse. The Labour Leadership has failed you, it will do nothing more than tinker at best and in your heart you know this. It has has no answers or commitment to solving the major economic, social and environmental issue of our time. It is long dead a reforming party. But you have not failed, you should expect and demand better, it is time to stood tall once more. It is time to fight back against the disasterous obsession with austerity and cuts. It is time to bury tribalism; the cuts facing the city and the nation, which are eating at our very social fabric, are too important to play games with for the pursuit of power. Join with the Greens in a non-partisan movement against the cuts, because if the fight back does not start in this city then where and when? I fear knowhere. If you cannot get change in the Labour Party in the next few days and weeks to protect the most vulnerable (and this is not just about the next budget, the cuts will ratchet down on spending year on year), then it is clearly time to rip up your membership cards (very hard I know from personal experience) and come and join the Greens, because we are fighting for the things you value. Sure, the Greens are not perfect, who is? They have made mistakes along the way, who hasn't? The Greens are a work in progress, but it has made a decent fist of the council, not shying from making necessary and often unpopular decisions in extreme financial conditions and have an excellent MP making waves in the House of commons fighting for causes you believe in. The direction of the Greens is foward, it is the last progressive party. Labour left you long ago, but you could help make the Greens a better party and once more walk tall. Please don't let yourself be tarred by me "Vote Labour get Tory". Surely, that is an insult too far? Isn't it?[/p][/quote]Your recent change of tactic is so obvious you're not half as clever as you think you are councillor Jarrs. You're not even trying to defend the Greens anymore and just attack the Labour Party instead. It's proper gutter politics and shows that you really have no idea how to defend the Greens and their barmy policies on this forum. Ironically enough it's the very same tactic that both Labour and the Tories have been using for years. You're not that different from them after all are you ? Vote Green get Labour/Conservative/ UKIP/Lib Dem Ambo Guy

10:47pm Tue 21 Jan 14

dingdong2 says...

The council wants more money to waste on things like the i360 tower when vertical towers have been a total flop in every other seaside town in the UK that has tried one.

Sacking half the councillors would be a good way to start saving money - or even better letting a neighbouring council run Brighton's services rather than having this administration continue ruining Brighton any longer.
The council wants more money to waste on things like the i360 tower when vertical towers have been a total flop in every other seaside town in the UK that has tried one. Sacking half the councillors would be a good way to start saving money - or even better letting a neighbouring council run Brighton's services rather than having this administration continue ruining Brighton any longer. dingdong2

10:52pm Tue 21 Jan 14

brightonpip says...

This survey is just an ill conceived waste of time. Anyone can vote, regardless of whether they live in Brighton or the outer Hebrides. None of the results can provide any kind of meaningful information to "act as a boromen to guide our political leaders". The comments so far are just the usual volleys of political potshots that seen to accompany every story in the Argus, whether is about the bins or a lost dog.

Instead of sticking your new reporter on the streets and wasting her time in the cold, why not do some real journalism for once? I'm sure you readers would benefit from finding out more about those services most at risk from cuts, and interviews with those who work in those areas and the vulnerable people they are able to help. I'd certainly like to be able to make a more informed choice if there is to be a genuine referendum on the matter. Just a thought but seems a better use of argus resources than feeding the trolls on here.
This survey is just an ill conceived waste of time. Anyone can vote, regardless of whether they live in Brighton or the outer Hebrides. None of the results can provide any kind of meaningful information to "act as a boromen to guide our political leaders". The comments so far are just the usual volleys of political potshots that seen to accompany every story in the Argus, whether is about the bins or a lost dog. Instead of sticking your new reporter on the streets and wasting her time in the cold, why not do some real journalism for once? I'm sure you readers would benefit from finding out more about those services most at risk from cuts, and interviews with those who work in those areas and the vulnerable people they are able to help. I'd certainly like to be able to make a more informed choice if there is to be a genuine referendum on the matter. Just a thought but seems a better use of argus resources than feeding the trolls on here. brightonpip

11:14pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Maxwell's Ghost says...

I didn't say the Tories or Labour would Brighton bluenose, but we can now see the Greens aren't doing anything either so time for another change. Also you haven't answered my questions either, what front line services for vulnerable,young and elderly people are the greens delivering.
Try to avoid being belligerent and abusive, just come up with a few schemes the Greens are delivering as HJarrs and councillor Eugenics haven't either.
I didn't say the Tories or Labour would Brighton bluenose, but we can now see the Greens aren't doing anything either so time for another change. Also you haven't answered my questions either, what front line services for vulnerable,young and elderly people are the greens delivering. Try to avoid being belligerent and abusive, just come up with a few schemes the Greens are delivering as HJarrs and councillor Eugenics haven't either. Maxwell's Ghost

11:33pm Tue 21 Jan 14

brighton bluenose says...

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
I didn't say the Tories or Labour would Brighton bluenose, but we can now see the Greens aren't doing anything either so time for another change. Also you haven't answered my questions either, what front line services for vulnerable,young and elderly people are the greens delivering.
Try to avoid being belligerent and abusive, just come up with a few schemes the Greens are delivering as HJarrs and councillor Eugenics haven't either.
But you seem to think kicking the Greens out would vastly improve B&H when, as I've already noted, child poverty, the housing crisis etc etc have reached abysmal levels under previous administrations and you want more of the SAME?!! The point is that the Greens are trying to maintain services and deliver on election promises despite these savage cuts! As you know full well funding for some of the schemes such as 20mph or the dreaded bus and cycle lanes come from other budgets and so do not necessarily impact on the front line services you mention
[quote][p][bold]Maxwell's Ghost[/bold] wrote: I didn't say the Tories or Labour would Brighton bluenose, but we can now see the Greens aren't doing anything either so time for another change. Also you haven't answered my questions either, what front line services for vulnerable,young and elderly people are the greens delivering. Try to avoid being belligerent and abusive, just come up with a few schemes the Greens are delivering as HJarrs and councillor Eugenics haven't either.[/p][/quote]But you seem to think kicking the Greens out would vastly improve B&H when, as I've already noted, child poverty, the housing crisis etc etc have reached abysmal levels under previous administrations and you want more of the SAME?!! The point is that the Greens are trying to maintain services and deliver on election promises despite these savage cuts! As you know full well funding for some of the schemes such as 20mph or the dreaded bus and cycle lanes come from other budgets and so do not necessarily impact on the front line services you mention brighton bluenose

11:43pm Tue 21 Jan 14

brightonian57 says...

If the greens were a trustworthy council, and really would put money towards helping the less fortunate then I guess the rise is acceptable. But as the greens council have lied and cheated their way through there term of office, ignoring consultation results over every scheme the have come up with, fiddling figures as in the Lewes Road vehicle use consultation, taking traffic readings during school half term to fiddle the figures . I wouldn't trust them with a one penny rise. If a council have lost the trust of the voters them it's time for them to go, and go they will
If the greens were a trustworthy council, and really would put money towards helping the less fortunate then I guess the rise is acceptable. But as the greens council have lied and cheated their way through there term of office, ignoring consultation results over every scheme the have come up with, fiddling figures as in the Lewes Road vehicle use consultation, taking traffic readings during school half term to fiddle the figures . I wouldn't trust them with a one penny rise. If a council have lost the trust of the voters them it's time for them to go, and go they will brightonian57

12:06am Wed 22 Jan 14

Gribbet says...

anubis wrote:
Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge.

The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires!

OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!!

There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding.

FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.
Totally agree.
[quote][p][bold]anubis[/bold] wrote: Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge. The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires! OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!! There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding. FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.[/p][/quote]Totally agree. Gribbet

12:24am Wed 22 Jan 14

Gribbet says...

Somethingsarejustwro
ng
wrote:
brighton bluenose wrote:
We are the 99% wrote:
anubis wrote:
Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge.

The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires!

OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!!

There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding.

FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.
The Greens Aren't fighting or hurting this Tory led Government!
They're hurting ordinary people, struggling to make ends meet!
And the Green fanatical policies, are causing even more, of an added unnecessary financial burden!
Shut up you clown - the unnecessary financial burden is caused by central government cuts to local government funding all caused by decades of Labour/Tory misrule! The Greens are VERY unfortunate that as a new regime they are bearing the brunt of these cuts just as many other councils are across the country
You thick brainless tw4t No wonder the greens are failing in everything they touch if you are an example of the intellect the wasters enjoy

Laughable moron
Oh boy, was only a matter of time before this guy piped up.

Come on, what colourful language have you got for me now
[quote][p][bold]Somethingsarejustwro ng[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]brighton bluenose[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]We are the 99%[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]anubis[/bold] wrote: Given a guarantee the additional funds will be used for the social services specified, I would support and vote in favour of the sought for increase in the community charge. The general populace grumbles and complains every day of the week at the savage cuts being launched by this medieval government, determined, by fair means or foul, to destroy social gains of the last century, to destroy (privatise) the Health Service, make the rich richer, and reduce the living standards of the majority of working people to a bare minimum. Hardly surprising -- a government of millionaires! OPPOSITION PARTIES JOIN IN THE PUBLIC COMPLAINTS ---- BUT, apart from occasional 'hot air' speeches in parliamentary sittings (most members of parliament don't turn up to listen to them!), THEY DO nothing and PROPOSE NO MEANINGFUL FUTURE ACTION !!! There are numerous (justified) complaints about Brighton's Green Council -- they are human, they make mistakes (as do we all) .... however, THEY ALONE are going beyond 'verbal grumblings' -- in a POSITIVE manner they are bluntly indicating NON ACCEPTANCE of these Government cuts, or that we must pass these savage cuts onto those least able to defend their own interests ... those who most need the funding. FULL MARKS to the Green proposal -- it's Brighton's chance to set a shining example to the rest of the country; we DO NOT accept the disastrous economic class politics of the Tory government -- and WE WILL FIGHT AGAINST IT, not just In words, but in ACTION.[/p][/quote]The Greens Aren't fighting or hurting this Tory led Government! They're hurting ordinary people, struggling to make ends meet! And the Green fanatical policies, are causing even more, of an added unnecessary financial burden![/p][/quote]Shut up you clown - the unnecessary financial burden is caused by central government cuts to local government funding all caused by decades of Labour/Tory misrule! The Greens are VERY unfortunate that as a new regime they are bearing the brunt of these cuts just as many other councils are across the country[/p][/quote]You thick brainless tw4t No wonder the greens are failing in everything they touch if you are an example of the intellect the wasters enjoy Laughable moron[/p][/quote]Oh boy, was only a matter of time before this guy piped up. Come on, what colourful language have you got for me now Gribbet

1:14am Wed 22 Jan 14

fredflintstone1 says...

brighton bluenose wrote:
Brighton1000 wrote:
Eugenius wrote:
clubrob6 wrote:
If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.
Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea.

Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.
So you're now sherking responsibility for the rubbish chaos away from the green council also? Go and deliver your spin somewhere else. Do you honestly think Brighton residents are that unintelligent that they will believe a word you type? Every post you type, you bat away responsibility. Avoid questions, manipulate what people ask. You are a perfect example of why the majority of us cannot wait to see the back of the greens, And it appears that day may come sooner than it first appeared, What a lovely thought :)
Perhaps you can explain how he was 'sherking' from responsibility for the 'rubbish chaos' - it was merely pointed out that the financial cuts have had a detrimental effect on the service which is hardly -ahem - shirking!!
Afraid that isn't necessarily the case. You and your Green colleagues seem to live in a land where there are no financial constraints - and always another pocket to pick. I guess it's the easy way out, for a party that abdicates responsibility, but isn't keen to give up power.

Could it be that there are poor managers in place who simply aren't up to the job of organising collections efficiently? Did that cross your mind? If you lived in the real world, and talked with Cityclean staff, you'd be left in doubt where the problem lies. Funnily enough, they don't blame your "cuts" but say the problem lies with those in charge, who have been described to me as clueless.
[quote][p][bold]brighton bluenose[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Brighton1000[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Eugenius[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]clubrob6[/bold] wrote: If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.[/p][/quote]Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea. Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.[/p][/quote]So you're now sherking responsibility for the rubbish chaos away from the green council also? Go and deliver your spin somewhere else. Do you honestly think Brighton residents are that unintelligent that they will believe a word you type? Every post you type, you bat away responsibility. Avoid questions, manipulate what people ask. You are a perfect example of why the majority of us cannot wait to see the back of the greens, And it appears that day may come sooner than it first appeared, What a lovely thought :)[/p][/quote]Perhaps you can explain how he was 'sherking' from responsibility for the 'rubbish chaos' - it was merely pointed out that the financial cuts have had a detrimental effect on the service which is hardly -ahem - shirking!![/p][/quote]Afraid that isn't necessarily the case. You and your Green colleagues seem to live in a land where there are no financial constraints - and always another pocket to pick. I guess it's the easy way out, for a party that abdicates responsibility, but isn't keen to give up power. Could it be that there are poor managers in place who simply aren't up to the job of organising collections efficiently? Did that cross your mind? If you lived in the real world, and talked with Cityclean staff, you'd be left in doubt where the problem lies. Funnily enough, they don't blame your "cuts" but say the problem lies with those in charge, who have been described to me as clueless. fredflintstone1

1:21am Wed 22 Jan 14

fredflintstone1 says...

HJarrs wrote:
I suggest everyone reads Warren Morgan's blog as he suggests above and here it is again;

http://warrenmorgan.


wordpress.com/2014/0


1/20/are-brighton-an


d-hove-residents-bei


ng-asked-to-pay-6-mo


re-a-month-so-the-gr


een-leader-can-keep-


his-job/

The work of a consumate politician, I am sure you will agree.
No mention of the 2% council tax rise prevented by Morgan two years ago for a cheap headline in the Argus - £3million of cuts every year since.
No mention of the extra cuts year upon year that will be made due to the lost revenue if the referendum is not held and won - £5-7 million every year from now on.
No mention of the chaos he has now thrown the council into as the proposed junior partner to the Consevatives!! (yet he is obsessed by Green Party splits!).
But acceptance to do nothing about the Tory cuts agenda.

Labour Party Councillors, party members and voters, I would like you to think back to why you joined and voted for Labour. Like me, I suggest a commitment to decency, fair play, democracy, support for the weakest in society, a better life for the many, the welfare state to help those in need, the NHS.

Look where your party leadership locally has now led you in the chase for power; a coalition with the Conservatives at a time when they are more right wing than ever. How can you let this happen? Your Labour leadership nationally and locally now propose to continue to accept the government's cuts agenda. This council has cut and cut; yes, less than pretty much any council you care to mention and already too far, but it is now time to draw a line as best we can. And we do not draw that line now then when? You did not support the Labour Party to be let down and like this.

You did not join or support the Labour Party to be told by your leader to expect yet more cuts year upon year into the next government just to curry favour with the Daily Mail, yet that is what he did this week. You did not join to privatise services, but that is what has happened, is happening and will continue to happen in your name.

Compared to the Tories, the welfare state, the NHS and council services are now barely more secure if Labour takes power, as they tack once more to the right. This is not what you pay your subs for or give up your time to meet, or tread the streets, this is not what you tell the voters,

The Labour Party is full of decent people who want a better society, but time after time, year in year out you have been let down and not only is this not going to change it is getting worse. The Labour Leadership has failed you, it will do nothing more than tinker at best and in your heart you know this. It has has no answers or commitment to solving the major economic, social and environmental issue of our time. It is long dead a reforming party. But you have not failed, you should expect and demand better, it is time to stood tall once more.

It is time to fight back against the disasterous obsession with austerity and cuts. It is time to bury tribalism; the cuts facing the city and the nation, which are eating at our very social fabric, are too important to play games with for the pursuit of power. Join with the Greens in a non-partisan movement against the cuts, because if the fight back does not start in this city then where and when? I fear knowhere.

If you cannot get change in the Labour Party in the next few days and weeks to protect the most vulnerable (and this is not just about the next budget, the cuts will ratchet down on spending year on year), then it is clearly time to rip up your membership cards (very hard I know from personal experience) and come and join the Greens, because we are fighting for the things you value. Sure, the Greens are not perfect, who is? They have made mistakes along the way, who hasn't? The Greens are a work in progress, but it has made a decent fist of the council, not shying from making necessary and often unpopular decisions in extreme financial conditions and have an excellent MP making waves in the House of commons fighting for causes you believe in. The direction of the Greens is foward, it is the last progressive party. Labour left you long ago, but you could help make the Greens a better party and once more walk tall.

Please don't let yourself be tarred by me "Vote Labour get Tory". Surely, that is an insult too far? Isn't it?
You simply don't get it, do you? People in this city have had enough of the Greens' pompous political posturing and irresponsible student politics. If you want to fight a class war, do it at your own expense and not at the expense of local taxpayers. It's time to let the adults take over now.
[quote][p][bold]HJarrs[/bold] wrote: I suggest everyone reads Warren Morgan's blog as he suggests above and here it is again; http://warrenmorgan. wordpress.com/2014/0 1/20/are-brighton-an d-hove-residents-bei ng-asked-to-pay-6-mo re-a-month-so-the-gr een-leader-can-keep- his-job/ The work of a consumate politician, I am sure you will agree. No mention of the 2% council tax rise prevented by Morgan two years ago for a cheap headline in the Argus - £3million of cuts every year since. No mention of the extra cuts year upon year that will be made due to the lost revenue if the referendum is not held and won - £5-7 million every year from now on. No mention of the chaos he has now thrown the council into as the proposed junior partner to the Consevatives!! (yet he is obsessed by Green Party splits!). But acceptance to do nothing about the Tory cuts agenda. Labour Party Councillors, party members and voters, I would like you to think back to why you joined and voted for Labour. Like me, I suggest a commitment to decency, fair play, democracy, support for the weakest in society, a better life for the many, the welfare state to help those in need, the NHS. Look where your party leadership locally has now led you in the chase for power; a coalition with the Conservatives at a time when they are more right wing than ever. How can you let this happen? Your Labour leadership nationally and locally now propose to continue to accept the government's cuts agenda. This council has cut and cut; yes, less than pretty much any council you care to mention and already too far, but it is now time to draw a line as best we can. And we do not draw that line now then when? You did not support the Labour Party to be let down and like this. You did not join or support the Labour Party to be told by your leader to expect yet more cuts year upon year into the next government just to curry favour with the Daily Mail, yet that is what he did this week. You did not join to privatise services, but that is what has happened, is happening and will continue to happen in your name. Compared to the Tories, the welfare state, the NHS and council services are now barely more secure if Labour takes power, as they tack once more to the right. This is not what you pay your subs for or give up your time to meet, or tread the streets, this is not what you tell the voters, The Labour Party is full of decent people who want a better society, but time after time, year in year out you have been let down and not only is this not going to change it is getting worse. The Labour Leadership has failed you, it will do nothing more than tinker at best and in your heart you know this. It has has no answers or commitment to solving the major economic, social and environmental issue of our time. It is long dead a reforming party. But you have not failed, you should expect and demand better, it is time to stood tall once more. It is time to fight back against the disasterous obsession with austerity and cuts. It is time to bury tribalism; the cuts facing the city and the nation, which are eating at our very social fabric, are too important to play games with for the pursuit of power. Join with the Greens in a non-partisan movement against the cuts, because if the fight back does not start in this city then where and when? I fear knowhere. If you cannot get change in the Labour Party in the next few days and weeks to protect the most vulnerable (and this is not just about the next budget, the cuts will ratchet down on spending year on year), then it is clearly time to rip up your membership cards (very hard I know from personal experience) and come and join the Greens, because we are fighting for the things you value. Sure, the Greens are not perfect, who is? They have made mistakes along the way, who hasn't? The Greens are a work in progress, but it has made a decent fist of the council, not shying from making necessary and often unpopular decisions in extreme financial conditions and have an excellent MP making waves in the House of commons fighting for causes you believe in. The direction of the Greens is foward, it is the last progressive party. Labour left you long ago, but you could help make the Greens a better party and once more walk tall. Please don't let yourself be tarred by me "Vote Labour get Tory". Surely, that is an insult too far? Isn't it?[/p][/quote]You simply don't get it, do you? People in this city have had enough of the Greens' pompous political posturing and irresponsible student politics. If you want to fight a class war, do it at your own expense and not at the expense of local taxpayers. It's time to let the adults take over now. fredflintstone1

7:14am Wed 22 Jan 14

Maxwell's Ghost says...

Bluenose, the city has fallen down the carbon table, the city has the lowest level of recycling in the UK and rates have dropped since then greens got elected. They try to solve pollution levels and have absolutely killed my community by creating previously unseen levels of traffic queues by vehicles being pushed off the Lewes road into my street.
They have failed to meet the target to employ apprentices, despite the council having 8,000 employees and hundreds of contractors who could train appetites, they claim to have housed 68 people and then announce they are bringing 5,000 students into town and giving planning permission for key plots of city land for homes for them with parking.
I cannot believe what I read some days.
With regards to students I'm beginning to feel a dame Shirley porter issue arising here with the political composition of the city being manipulated.
Local people have had enough bluenose of supporting freeloaders and the middle class Greens parish council type hanging basket schemes.
My community has suffered under the Greens while we see the students living in joy reaping benefits.
It's gone wrong in front of our eyes bluenose.
Bluenose, the city has fallen down the carbon table, the city has the lowest level of recycling in the UK and rates have dropped since then greens got elected. They try to solve pollution levels and have absolutely killed my community by creating previously unseen levels of traffic queues by vehicles being pushed off the Lewes road into my street. They have failed to meet the target to employ apprentices, despite the council having 8,000 employees and hundreds of contractors who could train appetites, they claim to have housed 68 people and then announce they are bringing 5,000 students into town and giving planning permission for key plots of city land for homes for them with parking. I cannot believe what I read some days. With regards to students I'm beginning to feel a dame Shirley porter issue arising here with the political composition of the city being manipulated. Local people have had enough bluenose of supporting freeloaders and the middle class Greens parish council type hanging basket schemes. My community has suffered under the Greens while we see the students living in joy reaping benefits. It's gone wrong in front of our eyes bluenose. Maxwell's Ghost

10:45am Wed 22 Jan 14

ARealBessie says...

brighton bluenose wrote:
Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
Brightonbluenose Eugenius and HJarrs constantly produce PR for the Greens on this site all day. Vast amounts of time are used issuing PR, how they earn a living I cannot imagine.
With this continuous PR have you learned anything about the party's work to help local elderly, vulnerable and young people? Name some high profile people schemes..not transport schemes, real front line helping people in hardship schemes....and don't fall for Bill Randall telling us they have housed 68 people. That's 68 people from the 17,000 on the housing list while the same Green council promise to bring 5,000 young people from outside the city here with new homes, even giving them 550 parking spaces on Preston Barracks, while local people are told to get on their bikes.
You tell me bluenose what message people get from these actions?
You come out with the same tedious crap but fail to answer my question posed above!! Pathetic!
Here's two more for you -
1. You, again correctly, bang on about 17, 000 on the housing list - but that list has been on an upward trajectory for years under previous Tory and Labour administrations so why vote for more of the same?!!
2. You mention 5, 000 extra students - do you REALLY think the Tory/ Labour traitors are going to stop this development
68 local people have been moved off the 17 000 strong housing waiting list...I must split hairs! Okay, I'm presuming (correct me if I'm wrong) that, included in those figures, are the 36 people who found new homes in old shipping containers at a cost of £156 pw? £156 pw is an awful lot of (social housing) rent for a space that is essentially smaller than your average studio flat - Unless of course the shipping containers are being used for supported/move-on housing and the inflated rents reflect staffing wages If my understanding is correct, then we're not really talking about 36 'new homes' but rather 36 new 'move on' homes... otherwise known as 'temporary housing' which - in real terms - puts our 36 back on the 17 000 strong waiting list leaving the Greens to boast of only 32 'new homes' created for locals (and who knows what sort of 'homes' they are?) That said, if indeed it's a supported, move on housing scheme, then it looks like a winner among all the other loser projects started under the Greens.

Still, even if I'm wrong about that little fudge in figures, 68 new homes for locals versus 5000 new student digs (in reality, temporary housing too) is a shocking indictment of this council's priorities.
I noticed the Greens have very little to say about the link between poverty, and the housing crisis and spiralling rents. Why not look there for massive tax savings for a start?

If I was of a more cynical bent I'd say that this council is pursuing a deliberate social engineering, and political strategy, to create a highly transient, ignorant, easy to manipulate, voting population in order to undermine local democratic processes, and consolidate council control (bit long winded, but I can't think of another way of putting it.)

I'm of the same mind of some other posters on here. The real puppet masters are the various top paid, unelected, unaccountable, council officers sitting pretty behind the scenes (and their paid consultants). After all, they are the one's who come up with the 'figures' that these councillors rely on to reassure/convince the public... They're also the ones who always end up benefiting from this sort of political infighting and loss of voter confidence (It's the old ploy of fixing what's not broken, thus breaking it, chaos ensues, they provide the solution to the chaos, thus keeping themselves permanently employed.) Why are none of these people making public policy ever publicly scrutinised or held to account? By ANY local politicians?? WTF is going on?

As for Labour and Conservatives, their time for a public kicking will come as they reap what their silence and passivity over the last 2 years has sown. Yes they COULD have stopped much of the money draining madness that's been going on. Yet, neither party did. In many cases along with the Greens, both opposition parties voted for some of these bonkers development projects now causing us all so much grief, !n others, they discreetly looked the other way.
That said, till such a time comes, the current, ruling administration is learning the hard way that with political power comes responsibility and accountability to the public electorate. Thank heavens we still have that!

PS. Lesson learned from The Level where the Green Menace and Opposition Party Silence all began... Vote Green, Get Concrete!
Have a good day.
[quote][p][bold]brighton bluenose[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Maxwell's Ghost[/bold] wrote: Brightonbluenose Eugenius and HJarrs constantly produce PR for the Greens on this site all day. Vast amounts of time are used issuing PR, how they earn a living I cannot imagine. With this continuous PR have you learned anything about the party's work to help local elderly, vulnerable and young people? Name some high profile people schemes..not transport schemes, real front line helping people in hardship schemes....and don't fall for Bill Randall telling us they have housed 68 people. That's 68 people from the 17,000 on the housing list while the same Green council promise to bring 5,000 young people from outside the city here with new homes, even giving them 550 parking spaces on Preston Barracks, while local people are told to get on their bikes. You tell me bluenose what message people get from these actions?[/p][/quote]You come out with the same tedious crap but fail to answer my question posed above!! Pathetic! Here's two more for you - 1. You, again correctly, bang on about 17, 000 on the housing list - but that list has been on an upward trajectory for years under previous Tory and Labour administrations so why vote for more of the same?!! 2. You mention 5, 000 extra students - do you REALLY think the Tory/ Labour traitors are going to stop this development[/p][/quote]68 local people have been moved off the 17 000 strong housing waiting list...I must split hairs! Okay, I'm presuming (correct me if I'm wrong) that, included in those figures, are the 36 people who found new homes in old shipping containers at a cost of £156 pw? £156 pw is an awful lot of (social housing) rent for a space that is essentially smaller than your average studio flat - Unless of course the shipping containers are being used for supported/move-on housing and the inflated rents reflect staffing wages If my understanding is correct, then we're not really talking about 36 'new homes' but rather 36 new 'move on' homes... otherwise known as 'temporary housing' which - in real terms - puts our 36 back on the 17 000 strong waiting list leaving the Greens to boast of only 32 'new homes' created for locals (and who knows what sort of 'homes' they are?) That said, if indeed it's a supported, move on housing scheme, then it looks like a winner among all the other loser projects started under the Greens. Still, even if I'm wrong about that little fudge in figures, 68 new homes for locals versus 5000 new student digs (in reality, temporary housing too) is a shocking indictment of this council's priorities. I noticed the Greens have very little to say about the link between poverty, and the housing crisis and spiralling rents. Why not look there for massive tax savings for a start? If I was of a more cynical bent I'd say that this council is pursuing a deliberate social engineering, and political strategy, to create a highly transient, ignorant, easy to manipulate, voting population in order to undermine local democratic processes, and consolidate council control (bit long winded, but I can't think of another way of putting it.) I'm of the same mind of some other posters on here. The real puppet masters are the various top paid, unelected, unaccountable, council officers sitting pretty behind the scenes (and their paid consultants). After all, they are the one's who come up with the 'figures' that these councillors rely on to reassure/convince the public... They're also the ones who always end up benefiting from this sort of political infighting and loss of voter confidence (It's the old ploy of fixing what's not broken, thus breaking it, chaos ensues, they provide the solution to the chaos, thus keeping themselves permanently employed.) Why are none of these people making public policy ever publicly scrutinised or held to account? By ANY local politicians?? WTF is going on? As for Labour and Conservatives, their time for a public kicking will come as they reap what their silence and passivity over the last 2 years has sown. Yes they COULD have stopped much of the money draining madness that's been going on. Yet, neither party did. In many cases along with the Greens, both opposition parties voted for some of these bonkers development projects now causing us all so much grief, !n others, they discreetly looked the other way. That said, till such a time comes, the current, ruling administration is learning the hard way that with political power comes responsibility and accountability to the public electorate. Thank heavens we still have that! PS. Lesson learned from The Level where the Green Menace and Opposition Party Silence all began... Vote Green, Get Concrete! Have a good day. ARealBessie

11:26am Wed 22 Jan 14

Mark63 says...

They have wasted too much money on their anti-car policies which could have been spent on more critically needed services. Greens out!
They have wasted too much money on their anti-car policies which could have been spent on more critically needed services. Greens out! Mark63

4:26pm Wed 22 Jan 14

Brighton1000 says...

brighton bluenose wrote:
Brighton1000 wrote:
Eugenius wrote:
clubrob6 wrote:
If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.
Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea.

Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.
So you're now sherking responsibility for the rubbish chaos away from the green council also? Go and deliver your spin somewhere else. Do you honestly think Brighton residents are that unintelligent that they will believe a word you type? Every post you type, you bat away responsibility. Avoid questions, manipulate what people ask. You are a perfect example of why the majority of us cannot wait to see the back of the greens, And it appears that day may come sooner than it first appeared, What a lovely thought :)
Perhaps you can explain how he was 'sherking' from responsibility for the 'rubbish chaos' - it was merely pointed out that the financial cuts have had a detrimental effect on the service which is hardly -ahem - shirking!!
Blaming cuts, sorry thought even you could see that, The City clean staff say its nothing to do with cuts but poor management.

Have you spoken with Cityclean? Have you visited them? Or do you just sit in an office spouting your spin, trying to blame everything on cuts? When its your pitiful council that couldnt manage a **** up in a brewery.

I fear that perhaps you cant see that past that blue nose of yours, Very sad.
[quote][p][bold]brighton bluenose[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Brighton1000[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Eugenius[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]clubrob6[/bold] wrote: If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.[/p][/quote]Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea. Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.[/p][/quote]So you're now sherking responsibility for the rubbish chaos away from the green council also? Go and deliver your spin somewhere else. Do you honestly think Brighton residents are that unintelligent that they will believe a word you type? Every post you type, you bat away responsibility. Avoid questions, manipulate what people ask. You are a perfect example of why the majority of us cannot wait to see the back of the greens, And it appears that day may come sooner than it first appeared, What a lovely thought :)[/p][/quote]Perhaps you can explain how he was 'sherking' from responsibility for the 'rubbish chaos' - it was merely pointed out that the financial cuts have had a detrimental effect on the service which is hardly -ahem - shirking!![/p][/quote]Blaming cuts, sorry thought even you could see that, The City clean staff say its nothing to do with cuts but poor management. Have you spoken with Cityclean? Have you visited them? Or do you just sit in an office spouting your spin, trying to blame everything on cuts? When its your pitiful council that couldnt manage a **** up in a brewery. I fear that perhaps you cant see that past that blue nose of yours, Very sad. Brighton1000

5:22pm Wed 22 Jan 14

Richada says...

Brighton1000 wrote:
brighton bluenose wrote:
Brighton1000 wrote:
Eugenius wrote:
clubrob6 wrote:
If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.
Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea.

Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.
So you're now sherking responsibility for the rubbish chaos away from the green council also? Go and deliver your spin somewhere else. Do you honestly think Brighton residents are that unintelligent that they will believe a word you type? Every post you type, you bat away responsibility. Avoid questions, manipulate what people ask. You are a perfect example of why the majority of us cannot wait to see the back of the greens, And it appears that day may come sooner than it first appeared, What a lovely thought :)
Perhaps you can explain how he was 'sherking' from responsibility for the 'rubbish chaos' - it was merely pointed out that the financial cuts have had a detrimental effect on the service which is hardly -ahem - shirking!!
Blaming cuts, sorry thought even you could see that, The City clean staff say its nothing to do with cuts but poor management.

Have you spoken with Cityclean? Have you visited them? Or do you just sit in an office spouting your spin, trying to blame everything on cuts? When its your pitiful council that couldnt manage a **** up in a brewery.

I fear that perhaps you cant see that past that blue nose of yours, Very sad.
Probably the window cleaning budget has been cut and they are no longer able to see out of their ivory tower......

......looking more like a pack of cards today.
[quote][p][bold]Brighton1000[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]brighton bluenose[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Brighton1000[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Eugenius[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]clubrob6[/bold] wrote: If the money went to protect social services like looking after our old to keep them independent ETC I would gladly pay more council tax.But the greens are wasteing so much money on projects like the failed 20MPH,spending money filling in bowling greens and planting wild flowers on them the money they spent would have actually kept them open,they did not even open tourist attractions like the mini golf course on hove seafront last year.Im sure if the greens stopped wasting money on stupid schemes money could be directed where it is needed.Recycling has actually dropped under the greens our block has stopped putting it out as it quite often gets left to blow around.[/p][/quote]Who says 20mph is a failure? Let's wait and see the accident figures next year. Councils around the country are bringing in 20mph zones, it's not a particularly radical idea. Agree that the refuse collection delays are a big issue at the moment - another sign that trying to maintain the same service for less money doesn't always work.[/p][/quote]So you're now sherking responsibility for the rubbish chaos away from the green council also? Go and deliver your spin somewhere else. Do you honestly think Brighton residents are that unintelligent that they will believe a word you type? Every post you type, you bat away responsibility. Avoid questions, manipulate what people ask. You are a perfect example of why the majority of us cannot wait to see the back of the greens, And it appears that day may come sooner than it first appeared, What a lovely thought :)[/p][/quote]Perhaps you can explain how he was 'sherking' from responsibility for the 'rubbish chaos' - it was merely pointed out that the financial cuts have had a detrimental effect on the service which is hardly -ahem - shirking!![/p][/quote]Blaming cuts, sorry thought even you could see that, The City clean staff say its nothing to do with cuts but poor management. Have you spoken with Cityclean? Have you visited them? Or do you just sit in an office spouting your spin, trying to blame everything on cuts? When its your pitiful council that couldnt manage a **** up in a brewery. I fear that perhaps you cant see that past that blue nose of yours, Very sad.[/p][/quote]Probably the window cleaning budget has been cut and they are no longer able to see out of their ivory tower...... ......looking more like a pack of cards today. Richada

10:39pm Wed 22 Jan 14

mrs m ward says...

i assume those that are voting for an increase are the same people who
voted the greens in, the majority of which are students and/or do not even
pay council tax.
Stop wasting money and pretending you can not afford the essentials. just
to score political points you useless lot.
i assume those that are voting for an increase are the same people who voted the greens in, the majority of which are students and/or do not even pay council tax. Stop wasting money and pretending you can not afford the essentials. just to score political points you useless lot. mrs m ward

11:01pm Wed 22 Jan 14

getThisCoalitionOut says...

If it were the conservatives in charge you'd have a far higher increase and no chance to vote against it - think on.
If it were the conservatives in charge you'd have a far higher increase and no chance to vote against it - think on. getThisCoalitionOut

11:36am Sun 2 Feb 14

76robmac says...

I wouldn't mind paying an increased council tax if the people who hold the purse strings knew how to spend it correctly not like the bunch of idiots running this council
I wouldn't mind paying an increased council tax if the people who hold the purse strings knew how to spend it correctly not like the bunch of idiots running this council 76robmac

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