The ArgusBrighton school in "posh uniform" row (From The Argus)

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Brighton school in "posh uniform" row

The Argus: ROW: The new blazer ROW: The new blazer

Parents have accused a city secondary of "trying to be a public school" after it announced pupils would have to wear royal blue ties and blazers from September.

The row has flared at Varndean School, in Balfour Road, Brighton, after new headteacher William Deighan announced it would be getting rid of the white polo shirts and navy sweaters currently worn by children.

Parents have accused the school of forcing an unnecessary cost on them, making their children wear uncomfortable clothes and trying to create a different image to what the school had when they chose it for their youngsters.

Emma Funnell, whose daughter Jade, 15, will be joined at Varndean by her son Rhys, 11, in September, said: "They are trying to make the school something it isn't. It makes it seem like a private school. The children will be targets for abuse, they will be the only ones in the city with ties and blazers."

At each of the other eight secondaries in Brighton and Hove pupils wear polo shirts and sweaters.

Other parents said they were unhappy at the £20 cost for each blazer and tie, which would be on top of the price of trousers and shirts and suggested a vote among pupils about the new uniforms had been deliberately rigged.

One mother, who asked not to be named, said: "My eldest is in his final year there and voted in favour of it, and said his friends did as well, to try to stitch up everyone who'll have to wear it.

"My youngest will have to wear it and all of his friends voted against it."

Varndean said it would be cheaper to buy the blazer and tie than two of the current polo shirts, at £7 each, and two sweatshirts, at £9.

It will be sold at cost at the school and shops in the city. They said the uniform had been supported by a small margin in votes among pupils, parents and staff.

Mr Deighan said the change had been made to distinguish the school from others in the area.

Its current uniform is almost identical to the one worn by pupils at neighbouring Dorothy Stringer, in Loder Road, and staff said there had been having identification issues.

Mr Deighan said: "Our students are proud of their school and want to be identifiable in the local community.

"The new uniform is clear and simple, if slightly more traditional than Varndean is used to and will make a clear distinction between clothes for school and home life.”

Despite the opposition, some parents have supported the change.

Phoebe Oliver, from Preston Park, whose daughter goes to the school, said: "It looks absolutely brilliant. I think if you dress up for work or school your concentration levels are better."

Several Sussex schools have shifted back to ties and blazers in recent years. There was fierce opposition to the move at Seaford Head Community College in 2007 but others at Durrington High in Worthing and Ringmer Community College, near Lewes, have proved a success.

Amanda French, from Ringmer Community College, said: "It's had a huge impact. The children were all for it and they have really embraced it."

Comments (66)

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9:18am Wed 1 Apr 09

Sweepster says...

I have seen these kids going to and from school. Somedays it is hard to tell if it's a "wear your own clothes to school day"; skinny jeans. hoodys, etc.

What is wrong with these parents? "It's not the image the school had when chosen????? Move them then! Poor little Billy not allowed to wear his scruffy polo shirt anymore.

What is wrong with a school wanting to improve it's public image? The kids currently look so scruffy.
Shirt and Ties - all the way!!! Go Varndean!
I have seen these kids going to and from school. Somedays it is hard to tell if it's a "wear your own clothes to school day"; skinny jeans. hoodys, etc. What is wrong with these parents? "It's not the image the school had when chosen????? Move them then! Poor little Billy not allowed to wear his scruffy polo shirt anymore. What is wrong with a school wanting to improve it's public image? The kids currently look so scruffy. Shirt and Ties - all the way!!! Go Varndean! Sweepster
  • Score: -2

9:21am Wed 1 Apr 09

Human Machine says...

I went to Cardinal Newman in the days when maroon blazers and maroon, gold and white ties were the uniform. We survived and so will they.

Personally I think it gave us pride in our appearance and our school. It wasn't a public school but due to the high standards of education and behavious at the time it felt like one and gave me an excellent education.
I went to Cardinal Newman in the days when maroon blazers and maroon, gold and white ties were the uniform. We survived and so will they. Personally I think it gave us pride in our appearance and our school. It wasn't a public school but due to the high standards of education and behavious at the time it felt like one and gave me an excellent education. Human Machine
  • Score: 0

9:47am Wed 1 Apr 09

Nick Brighton says...

IF it has a positive influence on behaviour both in and out of the school, then I'm for it. Give it 5 years and see what happens. £20? Three packets of ciggies; Three bottles of wine. Not an enormous price to pay.
IF it has a positive influence on behaviour both in and out of the school, then I'm for it. Give it 5 years and see what happens. £20? Three packets of ciggies; Three bottles of wine. Not an enormous price to pay. Nick Brighton
  • Score: -1

9:49am Wed 1 Apr 09

fascinator says...

Here is an excercise for Varndean pupils: -
How many grammatical errors can you find in Alan G Skinner's comments above?

Children don't look smart to us middle aged people whatever they wear. Ties will be not be knotted to our satisfaction, shirts will not be tucked into trousers and shoelaces may even be incorrectly tied! Their appearance will be that of unkempt youngsters whatever uniform they are forced to wear.
I just hope that like young people for countless generations, the vast majority of them turn into responsible adults, and don't feel the need to give us a diatribe like Mr. Skinner's
Here is an excercise for Varndean pupils: - How many grammatical errors can you find in Alan G Skinner's comments above? Children don't look smart to us middle aged people whatever they wear. Ties will be not be knotted to our satisfaction, shirts will not be tucked into trousers and shoelaces may even be incorrectly tied! Their appearance will be that of unkempt youngsters whatever uniform they are forced to wear. I just hope that like young people for countless generations, the vast majority of them turn into responsible adults, and don't feel the need to give us a diatribe like Mr. Skinner's fascinator
  • Score: 0

10:11am Wed 1 Apr 09

ecw says...

My son is in year 7 at Varndean. My initial reaction was disappointment that this new uniform had been introduced (mainly because I have recently spent money on his current one!) but I can also appreciate the desire to lift standards, and I think it will do this but must be enforced across all pupils. The trouble with the current uniform policy is that it does allow trendiness to creep in (as someone above noted, skinny jeans and hoodies) Hopefully a blazer and tie will ensure consistent standards (and certainly no chance to be trendy with this one!)
My son is in year 7 at Varndean. My initial reaction was disappointment that this new uniform had been introduced (mainly because I have recently spent money on his current one!) but I can also appreciate the desire to lift standards, and I think it will do this but must be enforced across all pupils. The trouble with the current uniform policy is that it does allow trendiness to creep in (as someone above noted, skinny jeans and hoodies) Hopefully a blazer and tie will ensure consistent standards (and certainly no chance to be trendy with this one!) ecw
  • Score: 0

10:13am Wed 1 Apr 09

Alan G Skinner says...

With educational standards in freefall fascinator, many kids would not know how to spot grammatical errors. This is not media hype either; I have it on good authority from secondary school teachers, working out of the better secondary schools in the City, that standards a woefully low.
With educational standards in freefall fascinator, many kids would not know how to spot grammatical errors. This is not media hype either; I have it on good authority from secondary school teachers, working out of the better secondary schools in the City, that standards a woefully low. Alan G Skinner
  • Score: 0

10:20am Wed 1 Apr 09

hoveboy says...

Of course some of the parents hate the idea of the new uniform! While their children set off to school in shirts, ties and blazers, they're left at home watching Jeremy Kyle with their greasy hair scraped back with a scrunchy, in their ill fitting velour tracksuits with their big fat bellies hanging out.
Of course some of the parents hate the idea of the new uniform! While their children set off to school in shirts, ties and blazers, they're left at home watching Jeremy Kyle with their greasy hair scraped back with a scrunchy, in their ill fitting velour tracksuits with their big fat bellies hanging out. hoveboy
  • Score: 0

10:41am Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

Let's be honest no parent or child voted in favour of this wasteful and pompous uniforms. And someone will be making a lot of money out of this.
Why not to reinforce the actual uniform code. Is Varndean mimicking private school uniform pretending that it is any better than any other secondary school in the city?, after all the education standards of secondary school in B&H are mediocre in the national league tables, changing to this unappropriated uniform it's not going to improve education standards. And a chosen business will be making a lot of money out of it.
Let's be honest no parent or child voted in favour of this wasteful and pompous uniforms. And someone will be making a lot of money out of this. Why not to reinforce the actual uniform code. Is Varndean mimicking private school uniform pretending that it is any better than any other secondary school in the city?, after all the education standards of secondary school in B&H are mediocre in the national league tables, changing to this unappropriated uniform it's not going to improve education standards. And a chosen business will be making a lot of money out of it. Txa
  • Score: 0

11:07am Wed 1 Apr 09

tonyinbrighton says...

Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..
Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view.. tonyinbrighton
  • Score: 0

11:14am Wed 1 Apr 09

Frank Booth says...

I think that, in principle, it's a good idea. But why couldn't it haven't been the dark red blazers that Varndean used to have, coupled with the red and black ties. Blue blazers just don't seem right for Varndean.
I think that, in principle, it's a good idea. But why couldn't it haven't been the dark red blazers that Varndean used to have, coupled with the red and black ties. Blue blazers just don't seem right for Varndean. Frank Booth
  • Score: 0

11:20am Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

The actual uniform allow you to buy more clothes for a cheaper prices and wider avaibility in the shops. This unpractical blazers are sinthetic and children will be sweating, and won't be wearing them, you can't forze children to wear them if they're hot. The younger children still need to play, and will look very uncomfortable playing with this blazers. Children are children they don't have to look like adult(everybody is complaining that children are growning too fast).

Today april the 1th

sw fool-idea
The actual uniform allow you to buy more clothes for a cheaper prices and wider avaibility in the shops. This unpractical blazers are sinthetic and children will be sweating, and won't be wearing them, you can't forze children to wear them if they're hot. The younger children still need to play, and will look very uncomfortable playing with this blazers. Children are children they don't have to look like adult(everybody is complaining that children are growning too fast). Today april the 1th sw fool-idea Txa
  • Score: 0

11:35am Wed 1 Apr 09

snerper says...

Looking at that kid's blazer made me realise that Stevie Wonder should stick to singing and leave tailoring to the professionals! Was that jacket made for Billy Bunter?
Looking at that kid's blazer made me realise that Stevie Wonder should stick to singing and leave tailoring to the professionals! Was that jacket made for Billy Bunter? snerper
  • Score: 0

12:35pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

tonyinbrighton wrote:
Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..
1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform.
[quote][p][bold]tonyinbrighton[/bold] wrote: Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..[/p][/quote]1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform. Txa
  • Score: 0

12:51pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

hoveboy wrote:
Of course some of the parents hate the idea of the new uniform! While their children set off to school in shirts, ties and blazers, they're left at home watching Jeremy Kyle with their greasy hair scraped back with a scrunchy, in their ill fitting velour tracksuits with their big fat bellies hanging out.
I think you're stereotyping and watching too much the Royle family kind of series. I assure you that not amount of smart-fake uniform/suit can hide the inadequacies, physical irregularities of some of the school staff.
[quote][p][bold]hoveboy[/bold] wrote: Of course some of the parents hate the idea of the new uniform! While their children set off to school in shirts, ties and blazers, they're left at home watching Jeremy Kyle with their greasy hair scraped back with a scrunchy, in their ill fitting velour tracksuits with their big fat bellies hanging out. [/p][/quote]I think you're stereotyping and watching too much the Royle family kind of series. I assure you that not amount of smart-fake uniform/suit can hide the inadequacies, physical irregularities of some of the school staff. Txa
  • Score: 0

1:09pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

To be specific if you're fat you won't be disguide yourself with your best suit, you go on diet. No change of posh school uniform is going to improve the standard of educacion, why not to address the real problems.
To be specific if you're fat you won't be disguide yourself with your best suit, you go on diet. No change of posh school uniform is going to improve the standard of educacion, why not to address the real problems. Txa
  • Score: 0

1:36pm Wed 1 Apr 09

qweqwe says...

As an adult I applaud this decision, but putting my former child hat on I'll alternatively proclaim NO WAY are you gonna get me into that spiffy rubbish.
As an adult I applaud this decision, but putting my former child hat on I'll alternatively proclaim NO WAY are you gonna get me into that spiffy rubbish. qweqwe
  • Score: 0

1:53pm Wed 1 Apr 09

oldskool_raver says...

When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two.

My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing!
When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two. My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing! oldskool_raver
  • Score: 0

1:53pm Wed 1 Apr 09

uslot says...

they are having the same uniform at kingmanor in shoreham,what with the change to an academy and the posh new uniform they really do think that people will think its a good school,how shocked will they be when they realise its just a polished turd
they are having the same uniform at kingmanor in shoreham,what with the change to an academy and the posh new uniform they really do think that people will think its a good school,how shocked will they be when they realise its just a polished turd uslot
  • Score: 0

1:59pm Wed 1 Apr 09

oldskool_raver says...

Txa wrote:
tonyinbrighton wrote: Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..
1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform.
Txa, i think you may have missed out the manufacturing costs when you made, what looks to be a shop profits calculation of 30k.
[quote][p][bold]Txa[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]tonyinbrighton[/bold] wrote: Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..[/p][/quote]1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform.[/p][/quote]Txa, i think you may have missed out the manufacturing costs when you made, what looks to be a shop profits calculation of 30k. oldskool_raver
  • Score: 0

2:01pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

oldskool_raver wrote:
When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two. My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing!
have you actually bother to ask your child what he would prefer?
[quote][p][bold]oldskool_raver[/bold] wrote: When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two. My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing![/p][/quote]have you actually bother to ask your child what he would prefer? Txa
  • Score: 0

2:21pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

oldskool_raver wrote:
Txa wrote:
tonyinbrighton wrote: Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..
1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform.
Txa, i think you may have missed out the manufacturing costs when you made, what looks to be a shop profits calculation of 30k.
Yes, but if you add the rest of the uniform, it will surpass that amount. And don't forget this is only one school, they will try to spread to the rest of the city schools. Thousand in profits to be made. How much influence this uniform business have over schools?, How much are schools profiting?. Those are uniform with an exclusive school logo, and the only place you can buy is in the school. According to the LEA school uniforms have to be plenty available in the high street shops rather than a sole supplier.

sw profit-profit
[quote][p][bold]oldskool_raver[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Txa[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]tonyinbrighton[/bold] wrote: Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..[/p][/quote]1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform.[/p][/quote]Txa, i think you may have missed out the manufacturing costs when you made, what looks to be a shop profits calculation of 30k.[/p][/quote]Yes, but if you add the rest of the uniform, it will surpass that amount. And don't forget this is only one school, they will try to spread to the rest of the city schools. Thousand in profits to be made. How much influence this uniform business have over schools?, How much are schools profiting?. Those are uniform with an exclusive school logo, and the only place you can buy is in the school. According to the LEA school uniforms have to be plenty available in the high street shops rather than a sole supplier. sw profit-profit Txa
  • Score: 0

2:30pm Wed 1 Apr 09

oldskool_raver says...

Txa wrote:
oldskool_raver wrote: When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two. My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing!
have you actually bother to ask your child what he would prefer?
No i haven't 'bothered' to ask him, mainly because he is currently at school. Knowing my child as i do, i'm sure he'll say the current uniform is preferable.
What he prefers is irrelevant, he will be attending a school that has a uniform policy. As a pupil of the school he will have to abide by the schools uniform policy. Varndean is the school that HE chose to put as first preference. HE has made his choice of which schools rules he's going to have to stick to, whether he likes it or not.
[quote][p][bold]Txa[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]oldskool_raver[/bold] wrote: When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two. My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing![/p][/quote]have you actually bother to ask your child what he would prefer?[/p][/quote]No i haven't 'bothered' to ask him, mainly because he is currently at school. Knowing my child as i do, i'm sure he'll say the current uniform is preferable. What he prefers is irrelevant, he will be attending a school that has a uniform policy. As a pupil of the school he will have to abide by the schools uniform policy. Varndean is the school that HE chose to put as first preference. HE has made his choice of which schools rules he's going to have to stick to, whether he likes it or not. oldskool_raver
  • Score: 0

2:39pm Wed 1 Apr 09

snerper says...

hoveboy wrote:
Of course some of the parents hate the idea of the new uniform! While their children set off to school in shirts, ties and blazers, they're left at home watching Jeremy Kyle with their greasy hair scraped back with a scrunchy, in their ill fitting velour tracksuits with their big fat bellies hanging out.
Hoveboy,
I've told our Waynetta to keep the curtains shut while you're about, I hate the idea that she turns you on so much! You're very observant though she is a cracker mate, innit!
[quote][p][bold]hoveboy[/bold] wrote: Of course some of the parents hate the idea of the new uniform! While their children set off to school in shirts, ties and blazers, they're left at home watching Jeremy Kyle with their greasy hair scraped back with a scrunchy, in their ill fitting velour tracksuits with their big fat bellies hanging out. [/p][/quote]Hoveboy, I've told our Waynetta to keep the curtains shut while you're about, I hate the idea that she turns you on so much! You're very observant though she is a cracker mate, innit! snerper
  • Score: 0

2:41pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

oldskool_raver wrote:
Txa wrote:
oldskool_raver wrote: When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two. My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing!
have you actually bother to ask your child what he would prefer?
No i haven't 'bothered' to ask him, mainly because he is currently at school. Knowing my child as i do, i'm sure he'll say the current uniform is preferable. What he prefers is irrelevant, he will be attending a school that has a uniform policy. As a pupil of the school he will have to abide by the schools uniform policy. Varndean is the school that HE chose to put as first preference. HE has made his choice of which schools rules he's going to have to stick to, whether he likes it or not.
The school has already a uniform policy, they has already have to abide by the schools uniform policy. Trying to be smart it doesnot mean your child will get the 1st of the three preferences. He doesn't choose the school's rules, the school rules are already in place. ;)
[quote][p][bold]oldskool_raver[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Txa[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]oldskool_raver[/bold] wrote: When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two. My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing![/p][/quote]have you actually bother to ask your child what he would prefer?[/p][/quote]No i haven't 'bothered' to ask him, mainly because he is currently at school. Knowing my child as i do, i'm sure he'll say the current uniform is preferable. What he prefers is irrelevant, he will be attending a school that has a uniform policy. As a pupil of the school he will have to abide by the schools uniform policy. Varndean is the school that HE chose to put as first preference. HE has made his choice of which schools rules he's going to have to stick to, whether he likes it or not.[/p][/quote]The school has already a uniform policy, they has already have to abide by the schools uniform policy. Trying to be smart it doesnot mean your child will get the 1st of the three preferences. He doesn't choose the school's rules, the school rules are already in place. ;) Txa
  • Score: 0

3:40pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Tye says...

Txa wrote:
tonyinbrighton wrote: Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..
1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform.
Txa - So cynical - knowing the price of everything and the vALUE of Nothing :(

actually it surprises me that some parents complain about the cost of the sKool uniform - Its not much - indeed when kids are "free" to wear their own clothes the kids that do NOT have the £100 trainers and the "correct" Polos at £50 (shall I carry on?) are bullied and laughed at - much better to stay with a smart uniform!
[quote][p][bold]Txa[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]tonyinbrighton[/bold] wrote: Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..[/p][/quote]1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform.[/p][/quote]Txa - So cynical - knowing the price of everything and the vALUE of Nothing :( actually it surprises me that some parents complain about the cost of the sKool uniform - Its not much - indeed when kids are "free" to wear their own clothes the kids that do NOT have the £100 trainers and the "correct" Polos at £50 (shall I carry on?) are bullied and laughed at - much better to stay with a smart uniform! Tye
  • Score: 0

3:49pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Brap Brap says...

Actually, they did this to a few of the state schools near Oxford. Looks great, changed the attitude too.

What's wrong with it anyway? You can't all wear trackies and string vests to school
Actually, they did this to a few of the state schools near Oxford. Looks great, changed the attitude too. What's wrong with it anyway? You can't all wear trackies and string vests to school Brap Brap
  • Score: 0

4:19pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

Tye wrote:
Txa wrote:
tonyinbrighton wrote: Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..
1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform.
Txa - So cynical - knowing the price of everything and the vALUE of Nothing :( actually it surprises me that some parents complain about the cost of the sKool uniform - Its not much - indeed when kids are "free" to wear their own clothes the kids that do NOT have the £100 trainers and the "correct" Polos at £50 (shall I carry on?) are bullied and laughed at - much better to stay with a smart uniform!
I know where the VALUE is and not in a ridiculous school uniform. I've never wear my children with £100 trainers, and the "chav" polo shirts are 3 for a fiver, unless of course you wear blaziers. Here is the whole irony!

btw oldskool_raver, my missspelling it doesn't stop my message going through, but show how rude person you are (not for addressing the spellings but for trying to put me down doing so)
[quote][p][bold]Tye[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Txa[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]tonyinbrighton[/bold] wrote: Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..[/p][/quote]1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform.[/p][/quote]Txa - So cynical - knowing the price of everything and the vALUE of Nothing :( actually it surprises me that some parents complain about the cost of the sKool uniform - Its not much - indeed when kids are "free" to wear their own clothes the kids that do NOT have the £100 trainers and the "correct" Polos at £50 (shall I carry on?) are bullied and laughed at - much better to stay with a smart uniform![/p][/quote]I know where the VALUE is and not in a ridiculous school uniform. I've never wear my children with £100 trainers, and the "chav" polo shirts are 3 for a fiver, unless of course you wear blaziers. Here is the whole irony! btw oldskool_raver, my missspelling it doesn't stop my message going through, but show how rude person you are (not for addressing the spellings but for trying to put me down doing so) Txa
  • Score: 0

4:32pm Wed 1 Apr 09

geewhizz says...

Txa,

on the subject of businesses making profits from school uniforms,

you're quite right in what the LEA has dictated about school uniforms being widely available in a number of shops, however this is for different reasons to your argument.

the main reason (I'm talking from a retailer's point of view,here) is that no shop owner would want 1500 school children arrive at their door with at least one parent/guardian to buy a garment worth £20.

In one of my businesses, we had a contract to supply a local school with goods, and I pulled out of it, for the reason that it was entirely unprofitable.

You may think that £30,000 is a lot to make for the blazers, however you forget the number of sales hours invovled in actually getting a child to fit a jacket, and all the while listening to the complaints of the child and under this policy, the compliants of the parent/guardian with the child.

The words -busy fool - come to mind when anyone is involved in supplying school uniforms and to this extent, those clothing retailers that remain would not want a contract such as this one.

I certainly wouldn't want it for my business, and while I don't speak for my colleagues, I cannot think of one clothing retailer that would welcome 1500 school children making what can only be a grudge purpose, clogging up their shop and loosing them more valuable business.

In this instance, your argument for 'profit' is entirely incorrect.

And if you do think it's such a great retailing deal, I'd suggest you phone the school and offer to run the 'profitable' contract for them, as there will be few, if any retailers who will want to touch this contract with a barge pole.

The LEA have opted for multi-retail outlets, primarily as no one retail outlet was interested in taking the contract.

Next time you're out and about, look in any newsagents window and you'll see the notices 'only 2 schoolchildren in the shop at any one time' and so on.

Txa, on the subject of businesses making profits from school uniforms, you're quite right in what the LEA has dictated about school uniforms being widely available in a number of shops, however this is for different reasons to your argument. the main reason (I'm talking from a retailer's point of view,here) is that no shop owner would want 1500 school children arrive at their door with at least one parent/guardian to buy a garment worth £20. In one of my businesses, we had a contract to supply a local school with goods, and I pulled out of it, for the reason that it was entirely unprofitable. You may think that £30,000 is a lot to make for the blazers, however you forget the number of sales hours invovled in actually getting a child to fit a jacket, and all the while listening to the complaints of the child and under this policy, the compliants of the parent/guardian with the child. The words -busy fool - come to mind when anyone is involved in supplying school uniforms and to this extent, those clothing retailers that remain would not want a contract such as this one. I certainly wouldn't want it for my business, and while I don't speak for my colleagues, I cannot think of one clothing retailer that would welcome 1500 school children making what can only be a grudge purpose, clogging up their shop and loosing them more valuable business. In this instance, your argument for 'profit' is entirely incorrect. And if you do think it's such a great retailing deal, I'd suggest you phone the school and offer to run the 'profitable' contract for them, as there will be few, if any retailers who will want to touch this contract with a barge pole. The LEA have opted for multi-retail outlets, primarily as no one retail outlet was interested in taking the contract. Next time you're out and about, look in any newsagents window and you'll see the notices 'only 2 schoolchildren in the shop at any one time' and so on. geewhizz
  • Score: 0

4:34pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

uslot wrote:
they are having the same uniform at kingmanor in shoreham,what with the change to an academy and the posh new uniform they really do think that people will think its a good school,how shocked will they be when they realise its just a polished turd
Absolutely spot on, the NEW IMAGE THING is what count, isn't it?
[quote][p][bold]uslot[/bold] wrote: they are having the same uniform at kingmanor in shoreham,what with the change to an academy and the posh new uniform they really do think that people will think its a good school,how shocked will they be when they realise its just a polished turd[/p][/quote]Absolutely spot on, the NEW IMAGE THING is what count, isn't it? Txa
  • Score: 0

4:47pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

geewhizz wrote:
Txa, on the subject of businesses making profits from school uniforms, you're quite right in what the LEA has dictated about school uniforms being widely available in a number of shops, however this is for different reasons to your argument. the main reason (I'm talking from a retailer's point of view,here) is that no shop owner would want 1500 school children arrive at their door with at least one parent/guardian to buy a garment worth £20. In one of my businesses, we had a contract to supply a local school with goods, and I pulled out of it, for the reason that it was entirely unprofitable. You may think that £30,000 is a lot to make for the blazers, however you forget the number of sales hours invovled in actually getting a child to fit a jacket, and all the while listening to the complaints of the child and under this policy, the compliants of the parent/guardian with the child. The words -busy fool - come to mind when anyone is involved in supplying school uniforms and to this extent, those clothing retailers that remain would not want a contract such as this one. I certainly wouldn't want it for my business, and while I don't speak for my colleagues, I cannot think of one clothing retailer that would welcome 1500 school children making what can only be a grudge purpose, clogging up their shop and loosing them more valuable business. In this instance, your argument for 'profit' is entirely incorrect. And if you do think it's such a great retailing deal, I'd suggest you phone the school and offer to run the 'profitable' contract for them, as there will be few, if any retailers who will want to touch this contract with a barge pole. The LEA have opted for multi-retail outlets, primarily as no one retail outlet was interested in taking the contract. Next time you're out and about, look in any newsagents window and you'll see the notices 'only 2 schoolchildren in the shop at any one time' and so on.
My argument for profit is totally correct. If it wouldn't be profitable, they wouldn't be making them. We're in a recession and any money to be made is good money.

They're already wearing uniforms, they have to enforze to wear them, that is the problem.

The LEA... not only for that, they have to make sure the uniforms are available for all different kind of people' incomes.

The last paragraph has nothing to relate with the school uniform.
[quote][p][bold]geewhizz[/bold] wrote: Txa, on the subject of businesses making profits from school uniforms, you're quite right in what the LEA has dictated about school uniforms being widely available in a number of shops, however this is for different reasons to your argument. the main reason (I'm talking from a retailer's point of view,here) is that no shop owner would want 1500 school children arrive at their door with at least one parent/guardian to buy a garment worth £20. In one of my businesses, we had a contract to supply a local school with goods, and I pulled out of it, for the reason that it was entirely unprofitable. You may think that £30,000 is a lot to make for the blazers, however you forget the number of sales hours invovled in actually getting a child to fit a jacket, and all the while listening to the complaints of the child and under this policy, the compliants of the parent/guardian with the child. The words -busy fool - come to mind when anyone is involved in supplying school uniforms and to this extent, those clothing retailers that remain would not want a contract such as this one. I certainly wouldn't want it for my business, and while I don't speak for my colleagues, I cannot think of one clothing retailer that would welcome 1500 school children making what can only be a grudge purpose, clogging up their shop and loosing them more valuable business. In this instance, your argument for 'profit' is entirely incorrect. And if you do think it's such a great retailing deal, I'd suggest you phone the school and offer to run the 'profitable' contract for them, as there will be few, if any retailers who will want to touch this contract with a barge pole. The LEA have opted for multi-retail outlets, primarily as no one retail outlet was interested in taking the contract. Next time you're out and about, look in any newsagents window and you'll see the notices 'only 2 schoolchildren in the shop at any one time' and so on. [/p][/quote]My argument for profit is totally correct. If it wouldn't be profitable, they wouldn't be making them. We're in a recession and any money to be made is good money. They're already wearing uniforms, they have to enforze to wear them, that is the problem. The LEA... not only for that, they have to make sure the uniforms are available for all different kind of people' incomes. The last paragraph has nothing to relate with the school uniform. Txa
  • Score: 0

5:07pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Jo PP says...

I don't know about Varndean but having to see the Stringer kids day in, day out, it seems that:
a)they do seem to have a school uniform - Black. Anything black.
b)make-up seems to be the norm for all ages
c) obligatory fag in mouth either in or just outside school gate

I expect teachers will be afraid to enforce any uniform rules as it will 'infringe' the kids rights....
I don't know about Varndean but having to see the Stringer kids day in, day out, it seems that: a)they do seem to have a school uniform - Black. Anything black. b)make-up seems to be the norm for all ages c) obligatory fag in mouth either in or just outside school gate I expect teachers will be afraid to enforce any uniform rules as it will 'infringe' the kids rights.... Jo PP
  • Score: 0

6:08pm Wed 1 Apr 09

oldskool_raver says...

Txa wrote:
Tye wrote:
Txa wrote:
tonyinbrighton wrote: Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..
1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform.
Txa - So cynical - knowing the price of everything and the vALUE of Nothing :( actually it surprises me that some parents complain about the cost of the sKool uniform - Its not much - indeed when kids are "free" to wear their own clothes the kids that do NOT have the £100 trainers and the "correct" Polos at £50 (shall I carry on?) are bullied and laughed at - much better to stay with a smart uniform!
I know where the VALUE is and not in a ridiculous school uniform. I've never wear my children with £100 trainers, and the "chav" polo shirts are 3 for a fiver, unless of course you wear blaziers. Here is the whole irony! btw oldskool_raver, my missspelling it doesn't stop my message going through, but show how rude person you are (not for addressing the spellings but for trying to put me down doing so)
Txa, i wasn't pointing out your spellings, to be honest i didn't even notice. The reason i put 'bothered' the way i did, was because you asked me if i'd 'bothered' to ask him, in a way to insinuate that i do not ask my child his opinion and i found that rude. He has now given me his opinion and as i said he would, he prefers the current uniform. When i said to you that he made the choice of which schools rules he would prefer to abide by, he was fully aware that the schools all have rules and there is a uniform policy already in place. He is also completely aware that he does not make the rules. When he told me the 3 schools he would prefer to attend he was certainly under no illusions that because he wanted to go there, that he would definately go there. It was as I said, his preference.
[quote][p][bold]Txa[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tye[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Txa[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]tonyinbrighton[/bold] wrote: Don't see many people getting rich flogging a £20 blazer and tie! All schools should have a uniform in my view..[/p][/quote]1,500 pupils approx. at £20 per head 30k( not so bad for the school shop, for such a mindless decision, and this without counting the rest of the uniform.[/p][/quote]Txa - So cynical - knowing the price of everything and the vALUE of Nothing :( actually it surprises me that some parents complain about the cost of the sKool uniform - Its not much - indeed when kids are "free" to wear their own clothes the kids that do NOT have the £100 trainers and the "correct" Polos at £50 (shall I carry on?) are bullied and laughed at - much better to stay with a smart uniform![/p][/quote]I know where the VALUE is and not in a ridiculous school uniform. I've never wear my children with £100 trainers, and the "chav" polo shirts are 3 for a fiver, unless of course you wear blaziers. Here is the whole irony! btw oldskool_raver, my missspelling it doesn't stop my message going through, but show how rude person you are (not for addressing the spellings but for trying to put me down doing so) [/p][/quote]Txa, i wasn't pointing out your spellings, to be honest i didn't even notice. The reason i put 'bothered' the way i did, was because you asked me if i'd 'bothered' to ask him, in a way to insinuate that i do not ask my child his opinion and i found that rude. He has now given me his opinion and as i said he would, he prefers the current uniform. When i said to you that he made the choice of which schools rules he would prefer to abide by, he was fully aware that the schools all have rules and there is a uniform policy already in place. He is also completely aware that he does not make the rules. When he told me the 3 schools he would prefer to attend he was certainly under no illusions that because he wanted to go there, that he would definately go there. It was as I said, his preference. oldskool_raver
  • Score: 0

6:30pm Wed 1 Apr 09

cheezburger says...

A hair cut wouldnt go amiss either.
A hair cut wouldnt go amiss either. cheezburger
  • Score: 0

7:16pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Pebbles says...

There is nothing wrong with a school uniform that employs a smart blazer, tie ans so on.

1: It stops all the "branding" competion.

2: It gives the sense of beloning.

Much the same as a football teams colours.
There is nothing wrong with a school uniform that employs a smart blazer, tie ans so on. 1: It stops all the "branding" competion. 2: It gives the sense of beloning. Much the same as a football teams colours. Pebbles
  • Score: 0

7:16pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Guerrero says...

I went to Varndean in the 70's.
Our uniform was great for getting picked on by the kids from Fawcett and Stringer.
I soon learned how to fight though.
Useful things uniforms.
I went to Varndean in the 70's. Our uniform was great for getting picked on by the kids from Fawcett and Stringer. I soon learned how to fight though. Useful things uniforms. Guerrero
  • Score: 0

8:20pm Wed 1 Apr 09

oldskool_raver says...

Pebbles wrote:
There is nothing wrong with a school uniform that employs a smart blazer, tie ans so on. 1: It stops all the "branding" competion. 2: It gives the sense of beloning. Much the same as a football teams colours.
I completely agree with you.
[quote][p][bold]Pebbles[/bold] wrote: There is nothing wrong with a school uniform that employs a smart blazer, tie ans so on. 1: It stops all the "branding" competion. 2: It gives the sense of beloning. Much the same as a football teams colours.[/p][/quote]I completely agree with you. oldskool_raver
  • Score: 0

9:12pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

oldskool_raver wrote:
Pebbles wrote: There is nothing wrong with a school uniform that employs a smart blazer, tie ans so on. 1: It stops all the "branding" competion. 2: It gives the sense of beloning. Much the same as a football teams colours.
I completely agree with you.
Those points perfectly apply to the current uniform code. The advantage of the current uniforms is that they got the majority support from the parents and the children, (so the half battle is already wan). Now they have to enforce their uniform rules. it's been a total neglect from the school, a good excuse?

I just can not see the practicality and functionality of this blazers apart for adult posh look, it's not rain prove (most of the children walk to school),too warm when the weather is good, to rigid for allowing movements.
[quote][p][bold]oldskool_raver[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Pebbles[/bold] wrote: There is nothing wrong with a school uniform that employs a smart blazer, tie ans so on. 1: It stops all the "branding" competion. 2: It gives the sense of beloning. Much the same as a football teams colours.[/p][/quote]I completely agree with you.[/p][/quote]Those points perfectly apply to the current uniform code. The advantage of the current uniforms is that they got the majority support from the parents and the children, (so the half battle is already wan). Now they have to enforce their uniform rules. it's been a total neglect from the school, a good excuse? I just can not see the practicality and functionality of this blazers apart for adult posh look, it's not rain prove (most of the children walk to school),too warm when the weather is good, to rigid for allowing movements. Txa
  • Score: 0

9:16pm Wed 1 Apr 09

Txa says...

rigid for rigidity= stiff
rigid for rigidity= stiff Txa
  • Score: 0

12:49am Thu 2 Apr 09

Pebbles says...

Wearing a blazer back in the 70's at the old Nevill Comprehensive didnt do me any harm. Mind you... the tear-drop collars should have been banned! :)
Wearing a blazer back in the 70's at the old Nevill Comprehensive didnt do me any harm. Mind you... the tear-drop collars should have been banned! :) Pebbles
  • Score: 0

1:36am Thu 2 Apr 09

Brightonscouse says...

I can remeber bei ng told the whole point in a School uniform is to

a) Have a sense of unity between the pupils and stop the i've got a better pair of trainers then you one upmanship

b) Distinguish between school time and leisure time. Pretty much the same reason why we wear suits/uniforms to work.

As it is the "uniforms" today arn't much different between what kids would wear outside of home anyway.
This leads to a lack of discipline or association with the fact that they're there to learn and not arse about all day.

I think it can only be a good thing and might instill a bit of discipline,manners and decency in the kids.
But that's just me being idealistic.
I can remeber bei ng told the whole point in a School uniform is to a) Have a sense of unity between the pupils and stop the i've got a better pair of trainers then you one upmanship b) Distinguish between school time and leisure time. Pretty much the same reason why we wear suits/uniforms to work. As it is the "uniforms" today arn't much different between what kids would wear outside of home anyway. This leads to a lack of discipline or association with the fact that they're there to learn and not arse about all day. I think it can only be a good thing and might instill a bit of discipline,manners and decency in the kids. But that's just me being idealistic. Brightonscouse
  • Score: 0

7:23am Thu 2 Apr 09

stan bailey says...

Jo PP wrote:
I don't know about Varndean but having to see the Stringer kids day in, day out, it seems that:
a)they do seem to have a school uniform - Black. Anything black.
b)make-up seems to be the norm for all ages
c) obligatory fag in mouth either in or just outside school gate

I expect teachers will be afraid to enforce any uniform rules as it will 'infringe' the kids rights....
Spot on, don't know what they are moaning about, at least the blazer will have a pocket for the fags and mascara, because they don't seem to have school bags to keep them in. Do they have pens and books or is they old fashioned?
[quote][p][bold]Jo PP[/bold] wrote: I don't know about Varndean but having to see the Stringer kids day in, day out, it seems that: a)they do seem to have a school uniform - Black. Anything black. b)make-up seems to be the norm for all ages c) obligatory fag in mouth either in or just outside school gate I expect teachers will be afraid to enforce any uniform rules as it will 'infringe' the kids rights....[/p][/quote]Spot on, don't know what they are moaning about, at least the blazer will have a pocket for the fags and mascara, because they don't seem to have school bags to keep them in. Do they have pens and books or is they old fashioned? stan bailey
  • Score: 0

8:11am Thu 2 Apr 09

JKW says...

I work around all of London and the inner city kids wear Uniforms each day so Varndean won't be any different..the ones who don't like just won't show likes it's always been.
I work around all of London and the inner city kids wear Uniforms each day so Varndean won't be any different..the ones who don't like just won't show likes it's always been. JKW
  • Score: 0

8:32am Thu 2 Apr 09

tt1 says...

I cannot believe the majority of the comments already posted. The new head is simply trying to raise standards which, perhaps, were allowed to fall somewhat by the previous head. People are moaning that the students look a mess and that standards have fallen and when someone tries to do something about it, they moan again. The cost of the uniform is a far site less than what the kids already wear, ie real ugg boots, jack wills hoodies etc. etc. How can parents moan about the £20 cost when they probably brought their children ipods, new phones, or nike trainers for Christmas? Kids grow so a new uniform has to be brought most years anyhow - does it actually matter where is it brought from? Seaford Head and Ringmer have gone back to blazers, Priory in Lewes will be doing the same from September. What really is the problem - can people not cope with change. What will they encourage their children to do in their careers, not go into a profession because of what they might have to wear?? I think this is a brilliant idea and I completely support the new head in what he is trying to do.
I cannot believe the majority of the comments already posted. The new head is simply trying to raise standards which, perhaps, were allowed to fall somewhat by the previous head. People are moaning that the students look a mess and that standards have fallen and when someone tries to do something about it, they moan again. The cost of the uniform is a far site less than what the kids already wear, ie real ugg boots, jack wills hoodies etc. etc. How can parents moan about the £20 cost when they probably brought their children ipods, new phones, or nike trainers for Christmas? Kids grow so a new uniform has to be brought most years anyhow - does it actually matter where is it brought from? Seaford Head and Ringmer have gone back to blazers, Priory in Lewes will be doing the same from September. What really is the problem - can people not cope with change. What will they encourage their children to do in their careers, not go into a profession because of what they might have to wear?? I think this is a brilliant idea and I completely support the new head in what he is trying to do. tt1
  • Score: 0

9:59am Thu 2 Apr 09

Osama bin there says...

It's an excellent idea and one that should be rolled out for every school in Brighton and Hove.
It stops kids misbehaving on the way to and from school because they are easily identifiable.
As for the cost - it would almost certainly be cheaper than the designer gear some of them insist on wearing now.
Bring it on.
It's an excellent idea and one that should be rolled out for every school in Brighton and Hove. It stops kids misbehaving on the way to and from school because they are easily identifiable. As for the cost - it would almost certainly be cheaper than the designer gear some of them insist on wearing now. Bring it on. Osama bin there
  • Score: 0

10:25am Thu 2 Apr 09

Txa says...

tt1 wrote:
I cannot believe the majority of the comments already posted. The new head is simply trying to raise standards which, perhaps, were allowed to fall somewhat by the previous head. People are moaning that the students look a mess and that standards have fallen and when someone tries to do something about it, they moan again. The cost of the uniform is a far site less than what the kids already wear, ie real ugg boots, jack wills hoodies etc. etc. How can parents moan about the £20 cost when they probably brought their children ipods, new phones, or nike trainers for Christmas? Kids grow so a new uniform has to be brought most years anyhow - does it actually matter where is it brought from? Seaford Head and Ringmer have gone back to blazers, Priory in Lewes will be doing the same from September. What really is the problem - can people not cope with change. What will they encourage their children to do in their careers, not go into a profession because of what they might have to wear?? I think this is a brilliant idea and I completely support the new head in what he is trying to do.
It will be interesting to know if you or others that opine like you, are parents or not (since it's relevance to the discussion).

You don't rise standards changing the uniform, don't you?, unless of course for you following dressing code orders are more important than education and learning.

Children don't look a mess and standard are not following, but I dont think it's very good a continue change of headteachers (last year my child hadn't art teacher for 2 terms).
There is not actual prove that changing the uniform it will improve the uniform wearing, on the contrary with the luck of support of parents and pupils it could be even make it worse.

Another point is that instead of make uni-sex blazers, apparently they have make a different one for boys and girls, so it could not be used for the brothers or sisters, well done Vardean!
[quote][p][bold]tt1[/bold] wrote: I cannot believe the majority of the comments already posted. The new head is simply trying to raise standards which, perhaps, were allowed to fall somewhat by the previous head. People are moaning that the students look a mess and that standards have fallen and when someone tries to do something about it, they moan again. The cost of the uniform is a far site less than what the kids already wear, ie real ugg boots, jack wills hoodies etc. etc. How can parents moan about the £20 cost when they probably brought their children ipods, new phones, or nike trainers for Christmas? Kids grow so a new uniform has to be brought most years anyhow - does it actually matter where is it brought from? Seaford Head and Ringmer have gone back to blazers, Priory in Lewes will be doing the same from September. What really is the problem - can people not cope with change. What will they encourage their children to do in their careers, not go into a profession because of what they might have to wear?? I think this is a brilliant idea and I completely support the new head in what he is trying to do.[/p][/quote]It will be interesting to know if you or others that opine like you, are parents or not (since it's relevance to the discussion). You don't rise standards changing the uniform, don't you?, unless of course for you following dressing code orders are more important than education and learning. Children don't look a mess and standard are not following, but I dont think it's very good a continue change of headteachers (last year my child hadn't art teacher for 2 terms). There is not actual prove that changing the uniform it will improve the uniform wearing, on the contrary with the luck of support of parents and pupils it could be even make it worse. Another point is that instead of make uni-sex blazers, apparently they have make a different one for boys and girls, so it could not be used for the brothers or sisters, well done Vardean! Txa
  • Score: 0

10:55am Thu 2 Apr 09

Txa says...

To end off for the ones they haven't get it, schools are the mirrow of our society. The sad thing is that they start looking more and more like a police state. The people who in our behalf are protesting and attending this demostrations against injustice and war, they are heroes, without them our society wouldn't improve, even the demostration against the war was worth it.

So to this demostrators, you've got my respect and whole support!

sw revolution-viva!
To end off for the ones they haven't get it, schools are the mirrow of our society. The sad thing is that they start looking more and more like a police state. The people who in our behalf are protesting and attending this demostrations against injustice and war, they are heroes, without them our society wouldn't improve, even the demostration against the war was worth it. So to this demostrators, you've got my respect and whole support! sw revolution-viva! Txa
  • Score: 0

1:20pm Thu 2 Apr 09

oldskool_raver says...

Txa wrote:
tt1 wrote: I cannot believe the majority of the comments already posted. The new head is simply trying to raise standards which, perhaps, were allowed to fall somewhat by the previous head. People are moaning that the students look a mess and that standards have fallen and when someone tries to do something about it, they moan again. The cost of the uniform is a far site less than what the kids already wear, ie real ugg boots, jack wills hoodies etc. etc. How can parents moan about the £20 cost when they probably brought their children ipods, new phones, or nike trainers for Christmas? Kids grow so a new uniform has to be brought most years anyhow - does it actually matter where is it brought from? Seaford Head and Ringmer have gone back to blazers, Priory in Lewes will be doing the same from September. What really is the problem - can people not cope with change. What will they encourage their children to do in their careers, not go into a profession because of what they might have to wear?? I think this is a brilliant idea and I completely support the new head in what he is trying to do.
It will be interesting to know if you or others that opine like you, are parents or not (since it's relevance to the discussion). You don't rise standards changing the uniform, don't you?, unless of course for you following dressing code orders are more important than education and learning. Children don't look a mess and standard are not following, but I dont think it's very good a continue change of headteachers (last year my child hadn't art teacher for 2 terms). There is not actual prove that changing the uniform it will improve the uniform wearing, on the contrary with the luck of support of parents and pupils it could be even make it worse. Another point is that instead of make uni-sex blazers, apparently they have make a different one for boys and girls, so it could not be used for the brothers or sisters, well done Vardean!
Txa, as you know i do have children. One of them will be attending Varndean so my opinion on this subject, as far as i'm concerned, is relevant.
Have you ever had the pleasure of sitting on the 26 or 46 bus at the end of the school day? I have. I want to know which school the kids are from when they are giving abuse to the bus driver, swearing, pushing and throwing things at the window of the bus. I'm sure the driver would like to be able to identify which school they are from as well, so he can complain about behaviour to the school concerned. As it stands they both get tarnished with the same brush. The schools uniform policy states that they have to wear uniform with the school logo on already but when they are barging past you it's hard to tell which schools logo they have on their white polo shirts. Your conspiracy theory that someone is going to make a lot of money from changing the school uniform is rubbish. The cost of a fleece and polo shirt currently stands at £18 this makes the blazer and tie £2 more, add into it a white shirt which costs £3.50 for a pack of 2 in Asda and you have a grand increase of £3.75, to the cost of the uniform.
You mention in a previous post that blazers are not waterproof and they are too hot in warm weather. As far as i'm aware jumpers and fleeces aren't waterproof and you can get hot wearing them. They will still be allowed to take the blazers off in hot weather, the same as they are allowed to take off the fleeces now. But you'll be able to see by the white shirt and tie which school they are from.
I don't understand what your problem is with the school changing their uniform in the hope that it reflects the good standards the school has. Of course there is no proof that it will change anything. But whats the harm in trying? If the parents are really that against the uniform then they should try to place their child in a different school. A parents job is to teach their child to respect and obey the rules of school and society.
I'm just wondering if wearing a Macdonalds or Adsa uniform makes it look as if they are part of a police state as you seem to say that school uniform does, or is it just a simple way of being able to tell who works there?
As for your last points about demonstrations against the war, where does this fit into a school uniform debate? Do you think you can start a revolution in the country by protesting against a school uniform? I know you have to start somewhere but i think you may need to start further up the heirachy.
[quote][p][bold]Txa[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]tt1[/bold] wrote: I cannot believe the majority of the comments already posted. The new head is simply trying to raise standards which, perhaps, were allowed to fall somewhat by the previous head. People are moaning that the students look a mess and that standards have fallen and when someone tries to do something about it, they moan again. The cost of the uniform is a far site less than what the kids already wear, ie real ugg boots, jack wills hoodies etc. etc. How can parents moan about the £20 cost when they probably brought their children ipods, new phones, or nike trainers for Christmas? Kids grow so a new uniform has to be brought most years anyhow - does it actually matter where is it brought from? Seaford Head and Ringmer have gone back to blazers, Priory in Lewes will be doing the same from September. What really is the problem - can people not cope with change. What will they encourage their children to do in their careers, not go into a profession because of what they might have to wear?? I think this is a brilliant idea and I completely support the new head in what he is trying to do.[/p][/quote]It will be interesting to know if you or others that opine like you, are parents or not (since it's relevance to the discussion). You don't rise standards changing the uniform, don't you?, unless of course for you following dressing code orders are more important than education and learning. Children don't look a mess and standard are not following, but I dont think it's very good a continue change of headteachers (last year my child hadn't art teacher for 2 terms). There is not actual prove that changing the uniform it will improve the uniform wearing, on the contrary with the luck of support of parents and pupils it could be even make it worse. Another point is that instead of make uni-sex blazers, apparently they have make a different one for boys and girls, so it could not be used for the brothers or sisters, well done Vardean![/p][/quote]Txa, as you know i do have children. One of them will be attending Varndean so my opinion on this subject, as far as i'm concerned, is relevant. Have you ever had the pleasure of sitting on the 26 or 46 bus at the end of the school day? I have. I want to know which school the kids are from when they are giving abuse to the bus driver, swearing, pushing and throwing things at the window of the bus. I'm sure the driver would like to be able to identify which school they are from as well, so he can complain about behaviour to the school concerned. As it stands they both get tarnished with the same brush. The schools uniform policy states that they have to wear uniform with the school logo on already but when they are barging past you it's hard to tell which schools logo they have on their white polo shirts. Your conspiracy theory that someone is going to make a lot of money from changing the school uniform is rubbish. The cost of a fleece and polo shirt currently stands at £18 this makes the blazer and tie £2 more, add into it a white shirt which costs £3.50 for a pack of 2 in Asda and you have a grand increase of £3.75, to the cost of the uniform. You mention in a previous post that blazers are not waterproof and they are too hot in warm weather. As far as i'm aware jumpers and fleeces aren't waterproof and you can get hot wearing them. They will still be allowed to take the blazers off in hot weather, the same as they are allowed to take off the fleeces now. But you'll be able to see by the white shirt and tie which school they are from. I don't understand what your problem is with the school changing their uniform in the hope that it reflects the good standards the school has. Of course there is no proof that it will change anything. But whats the harm in trying? If the parents are really that against the uniform then they should try to place their child in a different school. A parents job is to teach their child to respect and obey the rules of school and society. I'm just wondering if wearing a Macdonalds or Adsa uniform makes it look as if they are part of a police state as you seem to say that school uniform does, or is it just a simple way of being able to tell who works there? As for your last points about demonstrations against the war, where does this fit into a school uniform debate? Do you think you can start a revolution in the country by protesting against a school uniform? I know you have to start somewhere but i think you may need to start further up the heirachy. oldskool_raver
  • Score: 0

2:09pm Thu 2 Apr 09

Txa says...

oldskool_raver

Oh dear, and I was thinking that the main reason to wear school uniform were for the benefits of the parents and children.(Anyway you couldn't identify children wearing the same uniform, could you?, and tarry the whole school with the same brush)

You can judge a society for the way their treat their old and their young. How true.
But I don't expect you understand it. :P
oldskool_raver Oh dear, and I was thinking that the main reason to wear school uniform were for the benefits of the parents and children.(Anyway you couldn't identify children wearing the same uniform, could you?, and tarry the whole school with the same brush) You can judge a society for the way their treat their old and their young. How true. But I don't expect you understand it. :P Txa
  • Score: 0

2:10pm Thu 2 Apr 09

MzEden says...

They are going to have the same uniform at KMCC. They already have a uniform of black trousers / skirts, (easily bought at all clothes shops) black shoes, (easily bought at all shoe shops)and polo shirts in different colours depending on year, available from the school at between £6 and £8 each and a jumper again approx. £8 - £10 each. The bottom half can be cheaply picked up at a supermarket, the top half is more expensive but still less expensive than blazers. I'd say the majority of the pupils wear this.
They are planning to change the bottom half from black to navy (harder to find cheaply)add shirts, which unless they are off a good quality / expensive material will be see through and add clip on ties and blazers. From a parents view polo shirts and jumpers are easier to launder than shirts and blazers, you can buy them a size or 2 larger than they need so they won't grow out of them before you 'have' to buy more. You can't do that with shirts and blazers, they look like they're wearing Dads clothes. And for those who say £20 is not that expensive, it's not just £20. It's £20 on top of everything else that you have to get them. To kit them out for a new school year can easily cost £150 and that's not designer labels. In these lean economic times the choice between buying a blazer that you know they are not going to wear and food is a reality for many!
They are going to have the same uniform at KMCC. They already have a uniform of black trousers / skirts, (easily bought at all clothes shops) black shoes, (easily bought at all shoe shops)and polo shirts in different colours depending on year, available from the school at between £6 and £8 each and a jumper again approx. £8 - £10 each. The bottom half can be cheaply picked up at a supermarket, the top half is more expensive but still less expensive than blazers. I'd say the majority of the pupils wear this. They are planning to change the bottom half from black to navy (harder to find cheaply)add shirts, which unless they are off a good quality / expensive material will be see through and add clip on ties and blazers. From a parents view polo shirts and jumpers are easier to launder than shirts and blazers, you can buy them a size or 2 larger than they need so they won't grow out of them before you 'have' to buy more. You can't do that with shirts and blazers, they look like they're wearing Dads clothes. And for those who say £20 is not that expensive, it's not just £20. It's £20 on top of everything else that you have to get them. To kit them out for a new school year can easily cost £150 and that's not designer labels. In these lean economic times the choice between buying a blazer that you know they are not going to wear and food is a reality for many! MzEden
  • Score: 0

2:13pm Thu 2 Apr 09

Txa says...

Well say, MzEden.
Well say, MzEden. Txa
  • Score: 0

2:29pm Thu 2 Apr 09

El Burro says...

**** straight, I was a much better student before they abolished the mandatory tie @ Cardinal Newman. In schools where unifmrs are more relaxed, you usually find that the girls are more interested in fashion than anything, and perhaps an idiosyncratic uniform will help them become more rounded individuals, instead of forming closed groups whereby entry is permitted only on the basis of fashion tastes.
**** straight, I was a much better student before they abolished the mandatory tie @ Cardinal Newman. In schools where unifmrs are more relaxed, you usually find that the girls are more interested in fashion than anything, and perhaps an idiosyncratic uniform will help them become more rounded individuals, instead of forming closed groups whereby entry is permitted only on the basis of fashion tastes. El Burro
  • Score: 0

2:37pm Thu 2 Apr 09

Human Machine says...

Txa, reading your posts throughout this thread has made my eyes water, mainly because of the knees-bent, running-around construction of your sentences.
Txa, reading your posts throughout this thread has made my eyes water, mainly because of the knees-bent, running-around construction of your sentences. Human Machine
  • Score: 0

4:03pm Thu 2 Apr 09

Txa says...

Human Machine wrote:
Txa, reading your posts throughout this thread has made my eyes water, mainly because of the knees-bent, running-around construction of your sentences.
glad you enjoy it! :D
[quote][p][bold]Human Machine[/bold] wrote: Txa, reading your posts throughout this thread has made my eyes water, mainly because of the knees-bent, running-around construction of your sentences. [/p][/quote]glad you enjoy it! :D Txa
  • Score: 0

4:36pm Thu 2 Apr 09

witchy1 says...

oldskool_raver wrote:
Txa wrote:
oldskool_raver wrote: When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two. My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing!
have you actually bother to ask your child what he would prefer?
No i haven't 'bothered' to ask him, mainly because he is currently at school. Knowing my child as i do, i'm sure he'll say the current uniform is preferable. What he prefers is irrelevant, he will be attending a school that has a uniform policy. As a pupil of the school he will have to abide by the schools uniform policy. Varndean is the school that HE chose to put as first preference. HE has made his choice of which schools rules he's going to have to stick to, whether he likes it or not.
See this is what we should see more of.A parent who is telling the child not the other way around.Well done for being a parent who isnt afraid to be a parent.(If you know what i mean).So many people will say" oh my kids dont want to wear it".well tough its the rules get over it.
[quote][p][bold]oldskool_raver[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Txa[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]oldskool_raver[/bold] wrote: When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two. My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing![/p][/quote]have you actually bother to ask your child what he would prefer?[/p][/quote]No i haven't 'bothered' to ask him, mainly because he is currently at school. Knowing my child as i do, i'm sure he'll say the current uniform is preferable. What he prefers is irrelevant, he will be attending a school that has a uniform policy. As a pupil of the school he will have to abide by the schools uniform policy. Varndean is the school that HE chose to put as first preference. HE has made his choice of which schools rules he's going to have to stick to, whether he likes it or not.[/p][/quote]See this is what we should see more of.A parent who is telling the child not the other way around.Well done for being a parent who isnt afraid to be a parent.(If you know what i mean).So many people will say" oh my kids dont want to wear it".well tough its the rules get over it. witchy1
  • Score: 0

6:26pm Thu 2 Apr 09

Txa says...

witchy1 wrote:
oldskool_raver wrote:
Txa wrote:
oldskool_raver wrote: When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two. My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing!
have you actually bother to ask your child what he would prefer?
No i haven't 'bothered' to ask him, mainly because he is currently at school. Knowing my child as i do, i'm sure he'll say the current uniform is preferable. What he prefers is irrelevant, he will be attending a school that has a uniform policy. As a pupil of the school he will have to abide by the schools uniform policy. Varndean is the school that HE chose to put as first preference. HE has made his choice of which schools rules he's going to have to stick to, whether he likes it or not.
See this is what we should see more of.A parent who is telling the child not the other way around.Well done for being a parent who isnt afraid to be a parent.(If you know what i mean).So many people will say" oh my kids dont want to wear it".well tough its the rules get over it.
How ironic the parents who cannot control their own children probably ask the schools to do the work for them. More nanny state, please!? ahah ah I'm loving it!
[quote][p][bold]witchy1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]oldskool_raver[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Txa[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]oldskool_raver[/bold] wrote: When i attended Varndean, blazers were no longer part of the uniform. However, the boys still had to wear ties, the girls had to wear distinctive blue and white shirts and trainers were not allowed. Not wearing the correct uniform got us a detention. We simply looked smart! Our uniform was also very different to the uniform at Dorothy Stringer. Now it's very hard to tell the difference between the two. My son is starting at Varndean in September and i am pleased that he will go to school looking smarter than he would if he were wearing the current uniform. Whenever i go by the school i think they all look scruffy and i feel it's a shame. It gives the impression that the school has low standards, when in reality it's a good school, with high standards. Children taking pride in their appearance encourages them to have pride in themselves. In my opinion, that is £20 well spent. You're more likely to be ridiculed for not wearing the right 'brand name' trainers than you are because you're wearing a uniform that 1000 or so other kids are wearing![/p][/quote]have you actually bother to ask your child what he would prefer?[/p][/quote]No i haven't 'bothered' to ask him, mainly because he is currently at school. Knowing my child as i do, i'm sure he'll say the current uniform is preferable. What he prefers is irrelevant, he will be attending a school that has a uniform policy. As a pupil of the school he will have to abide by the schools uniform policy. Varndean is the school that HE chose to put as first preference. HE has made his choice of which schools rules he's going to have to stick to, whether he likes it or not.[/p][/quote]See this is what we should see more of.A parent who is telling the child not the other way around.Well done for being a parent who isnt afraid to be a parent.(If you know what i mean).So many people will say" oh my kids dont want to wear it".well tough its the rules get over it. [/p][/quote]How ironic the parents who cannot control their own children probably ask the schools to do the work for them. More nanny state, please!? ahah ah I'm loving it! Txa
  • Score: 0

12:38pm Fri 3 Apr 09

realitycheque says...

"never argue with a fool. They quickly bring you down to their level and then beat you with experience."
"never argue with a fool. They quickly bring you down to their level and then beat you with experience." realitycheque
  • Score: 0

4:30pm Fri 3 Apr 09

Txa says...

realitycheque wrote:
"never argue with a fool. They quickly bring you down to their level and then beat you with experience."
don't worry, I won't ;)
[quote][p][bold]realitycheque[/bold] wrote: "never argue with a fool. They quickly bring you down to their level and then beat you with experience."[/p][/quote]don't worry, I won't ;) Txa
  • Score: 0

8:47am Sat 4 Apr 09

Acheron says...

Txa,

As a teacher I would rather have a parent who tells their kid how it is rather than encourages their kid to disagree with the school because they don't want to, but that is an aside to the debate (and you brought it up, so don't whinge!)

Onto the matter at hand. Having taugh for a few years now I was at Varndean when the previous head had just started. At the time, Vardean was considered one of the better schools to go to. His frist action was to give way to the kids on the shoes aspect of the school uniform on the grounds that the kids would wear the rest of the uniform correctly. Obviously as most of us would have realised at the time, this was the start of a slippery slope as he was passing power to the students rather than with the teachers and himself, where is should be. At the time, myself and some others said that it was a foolish move and so it has turned out. Varndean is now a shadow of it's former self and many of the comments made by others about their students behaviour are a testament to this.

You seem convinced that how someone dresses has no bearing on how they behave. Sadly, for you, there is plenty of research that shoves that idea out the window. While obviously there are expetions to every rule (so please don't try to use that as an excuse because on that basis no research could ever be justified). To give you just one piece of research (there is more out there) it is well recognised that when it comes to examinations, students perform far better if they are dressed smart than scruffy (and this was done with the same students before you spout anything about different pupils of differing ability).

On a final note, where I grew up, wearing a polo and a jumper would have made me stand out, the norm was blazers and ties (for public and state schools alike). I liked it to be honest, 4 pockets for keeping pens and other stuff in without the risk of it falling out (can't do that with a jumper and as a teacher it always amazes me how many kids don't come to school with even basic equipment), plus it got me ready for the world of work where jacket and tie was the norm.

Now one question for you to answer please (I haven't seen you answer this one, but appologies if I've missed it). Can I ask what is wrong with a school wanting thier students to look respectable and do you believe that a polo and jumper is smarter than a blazer.
Txa, As a teacher I would rather have a parent who tells their kid how it is rather than encourages their kid to disagree with the school because they don't want to, but that is an aside to the debate (and you brought it up, so don't whinge!) Onto the matter at hand. Having taugh for a few years now I was at Varndean when the previous head had just started. At the time, Vardean was considered one of the better schools to go to. His frist action was to give way to the kids on the shoes aspect of the school uniform on the grounds that the kids would wear the rest of the uniform correctly. Obviously as most of us would have realised at the time, this was the start of a slippery slope as he was passing power to the students rather than with the teachers and himself, where is should be. At the time, myself and some others said that it was a foolish move and so it has turned out. Varndean is now a shadow of it's former self and many of the comments made by others about their students behaviour are a testament to this. You seem convinced that how someone dresses has no bearing on how they behave. Sadly, for you, there is plenty of research that shoves that idea out the window. While obviously there are expetions to every rule (so please don't try to use that as an excuse because on that basis no research could ever be justified). To give you just one piece of research (there is more out there) it is well recognised that when it comes to examinations, students perform far better if they are dressed smart than scruffy (and this was done with the same students before you spout anything about different pupils of differing ability). On a final note, where I grew up, wearing a polo and a jumper would have made me stand out, the norm was blazers and ties (for public and state schools alike). I liked it to be honest, 4 pockets for keeping pens and other stuff in without the risk of it falling out (can't do that with a jumper and as a teacher it always amazes me how many kids don't come to school with even basic equipment), plus it got me ready for the world of work where jacket and tie was the norm. Now one question for you to answer please (I haven't seen you answer this one, but appologies if I've missed it). Can I ask what is wrong with a school wanting thier students to look respectable and do you believe that a polo and jumper is smarter than a blazer. Acheron
  • Score: 0

12:28pm Sat 4 Apr 09

Txa says...

Definitions:
Uniforms: everything that is not allowed is forbidden.
Dress code: everything that is not forbidden is allowed.

Efficiency of wearing uniform; an study published in The Journal of Education Research by David L.Brunsme, of the University of Alabama, and Kerry A.Rockque, of the University of Notre Dame stated that student uniforms neither improved attendance and discipline not decreased drug use. According to B&R, uniforms did not significantly improve academic prerformance or student's actitudes toward school, peer-group relations were not improved, and that uniforms had a negative effect on student attitudes and academic achievement.

http://www.geocities
.com/school_uniforms
/abstract98.html

I'll add that neither it doesn't improve parents-school relations.

Common arguments against school uniforms:

. they violate the student's right to self-expressions.
. they are costly.
. the over-size-fits-all does not suit all student's body shapes.
. many uniforms are not gender neutral, which may had to explotation or discrimination.

To answer to you question, yes uniforms represent staid respetability, unadventurous conformism and narrow-mindedness.

But I support the actual dressing code because is functional for children and practical and cheap for parents, many of us are stragling financially, I don't want to see my children ostracise by the school, narrowing more and more our choices.
Definitions: Uniforms: everything that is not allowed is forbidden. Dress code: everything that is not forbidden is allowed. Efficiency of wearing uniform; an study published in The Journal of Education Research by David L.Brunsme, of the University of Alabama, and Kerry A.Rockque, of the University of Notre Dame stated that student uniforms neither improved attendance and discipline not decreased drug use. According to B&R, uniforms did not significantly improve academic prerformance or student's actitudes toward school, peer-group relations were not improved, and that uniforms had a negative effect on student attitudes and academic achievement. http://www.geocities .com/school_uniforms /abstract98.html I'll add that neither it doesn't improve parents-school relations. Common arguments against school uniforms: . they violate the student's right to self-expressions. . they are costly. . the over-size-fits-all does not suit all student's body shapes. . many uniforms are not gender neutral, which may had to explotation or discrimination. To answer to you question, yes uniforms represent staid respetability, unadventurous conformism and narrow-mindedness. But I support the actual dressing code because is functional for children and practical and cheap for parents, many of us are stragling financially, I don't want to see my children ostracise by the school, narrowing more and more our choices. Txa
  • Score: 0

1:35pm Sat 4 Apr 09

TheInsider says...

I can't believe these parents are whining about the cost when they are happy to shell out £120 for a pair of trainers made in a sweat shop and £500 on a lap top for their baby's birthdays so their little darlings can surf the **** net from their bedrooms and stay up till the small ours MSN-ing each other. Oh and don't forget the ski-ing trips.
Wake up parents and stop whining. Change is part of life, your kids will face it in the workplace and in their private lives and those able to adapt are the ones who survive.
A uniform, although not popular, enables all children to be equal rather than poorer kids being made to feel disenfranchised from an early age by not having a weekly change of £60 hoodie.
Next step, all proms to be banned and the return of the school disco in just jeans and a cab home.
No wonder kids are suffering anxiety and madness with the pressures of materialism shoved upon them by their parents.

I can't believe these parents are whining about the cost when they are happy to shell out £120 for a pair of trainers made in a sweat shop and £500 on a lap top for their baby's birthdays so their little darlings can surf the **** net from their bedrooms and stay up till the small ours MSN-ing each other. Oh and don't forget the ski-ing trips. Wake up parents and stop whining. Change is part of life, your kids will face it in the workplace and in their private lives and those able to adapt are the ones who survive. A uniform, although not popular, enables all children to be equal rather than poorer kids being made to feel disenfranchised from an early age by not having a weekly change of £60 hoodie. Next step, all proms to be banned and the return of the school disco in just jeans and a cab home. No wonder kids are suffering anxiety and madness with the pressures of materialism shoved upon them by their parents. TheInsider
  • Score: 0

5:30pm Sat 4 Apr 09

Txa says...

Speak for yourself TheInsider.

Students are already wearing a comfortable uniform at Varndean.

Yes agree, get rid of these ridiculous proms.
No the materialism is not imposed for the parents, the media and society are to blame. And Schools want to go the totally opposite direction so putting as much pressure on them.

I'm not surprised that children in the U.K are in a mess, they are constantly blamed for all our society ills.

LET OUR CHILDREN ALONE!
Speak for yourself TheInsider. Students are already wearing a comfortable uniform at Varndean. Yes agree, get rid of these ridiculous proms. No the materialism is not imposed for the parents, the media and society are to blame. And Schools want to go the totally opposite direction so putting as much pressure on them. I'm not surprised that children in the U.K are in a mess, they are constantly blamed for all our society ills. LET OUR CHILDREN ALONE! Txa
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5:37pm Sat 4 Apr 09

Txa says...

LEAVE OUR CHILDREN ALONE!

ps; if the argus will allow us to correct our posts, we wouldn't need so many extra posts.
LEAVE OUR CHILDREN ALONE! ps; if the argus will allow us to correct our posts, we wouldn't need so many extra posts. Txa
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9:34pm Sat 4 Apr 09

TheInsider says...

The media and society are to blame!!!!!! So are parents and children not part of society. I can't believe you actually wrote that post. Everything in life is always someone else's fault.
Next you will be saying society is to blame for kids being fat.
As for the media (newspapers, magazines, tv channels)they are funded by people buying them. If you stopped buying the crap, buying Sky tv packages, watching celebrity nonsense, the media (apart from serious news) would not report it.
What you have just said is the sort of idiotic thing the people who mourned Princess Diana used to say...poor Diana killed by the media ....actually she was killed by the people who bought the magazines with her photos in that prompted lorry drivers, bin men and any other tom, dick or harry to pick up a camera and follow her about in the hope of flogging photos for huge amounts of cash.
If people had not bought the mags, the pictures would have had no value. The very people laying flowers were the ones who helped her meet her end.
Society and the media are to blame. That made me laugh out loud.

The media and society are to blame!!!!!! So are parents and children not part of society. I can't believe you actually wrote that post. Everything in life is always someone else's fault. Next you will be saying society is to blame for kids being fat. As for the media (newspapers, magazines, tv channels)they are funded by people buying them. If you stopped buying the crap, buying Sky tv packages, watching celebrity nonsense, the media (apart from serious news) would not report it. What you have just said is the sort of idiotic thing the people who mourned Princess Diana used to say...poor Diana killed by the media ....actually she was killed by the people who bought the magazines with her photos in that prompted lorry drivers, bin men and any other tom, dick or harry to pick up a camera and follow her about in the hope of flogging photos for huge amounts of cash. If people had not bought the mags, the pictures would have had no value. The very people laying flowers were the ones who helped her meet her end. Society and the media are to blame. That made me laugh out loud. TheInsider
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10:15am Sun 5 Apr 09

Txa says...

TheInsider wrote:
The media and society are to blame!!!!!! So are parents and children not part of society. I can't believe you actually wrote that post. Everything in life is always someone else's fault. Next you will be saying society is to blame for kids being fat. As for the media (newspapers, magazines, tv channels)they are funded by people buying them. If you stopped buying the crap, buying Sky tv packages, watching celebrity nonsense, the media (apart from serious news) would not report it. What you have just said is the sort of idiotic thing the people who mourned Princess Diana used to say...poor Diana killed by the media ....actually she was killed by the people who bought the magazines with her photos in that prompted lorry drivers, bin men and any other tom, dick or harry to pick up a camera and follow her about in the hope of flogging photos for huge amounts of cash. If people had not bought the mags, the pictures would have had no value. The very people laying flowers were the ones who helped her meet her end. Society and the media are to blame. That made me laugh out loud.
ahahahahahahah...!

Princess Diana + uniforms, typical Saturday night discussions.
[quote][p][bold]TheInsider[/bold] wrote: The media and society are to blame!!!!!! So are parents and children not part of society. I can't believe you actually wrote that post. Everything in life is always someone else's fault. Next you will be saying society is to blame for kids being fat. As for the media (newspapers, magazines, tv channels)they are funded by people buying them. If you stopped buying the crap, buying Sky tv packages, watching celebrity nonsense, the media (apart from serious news) would not report it. What you have just said is the sort of idiotic thing the people who mourned Princess Diana used to say...poor Diana killed by the media ....actually she was killed by the people who bought the magazines with her photos in that prompted lorry drivers, bin men and any other tom, dick or harry to pick up a camera and follow her about in the hope of flogging photos for huge amounts of cash. If people had not bought the mags, the pictures would have had no value. The very people laying flowers were the ones who helped her meet her end. Society and the media are to blame. That made me laugh out loud. [/p][/quote]ahahahahahahah...! Princess Diana + uniforms, typical Saturday night discussions. Txa
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5:00pm Tue 7 Apr 09

MarcoPolo says...

Kids vote YES for uniform, parents vote YES for uniform, Governors vote YES for uniform, teachers vote YES for uniform. Where's the problem?
Kids vote YES for uniform, parents vote YES for uniform, Governors vote YES for uniform, teachers vote YES for uniform. Where's the problem? MarcoPolo
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2:07pm Wed 8 Apr 09

Txa says...

MarcoPolo wrote:
Kids vote YES for uniform, parents vote YES for uniform, Governors vote YES for uniform, teachers vote YES for uniform. Where's the problem?
No, students voted against, and parents consultation probably voted against. Head and teachers don't have to wear the new uniform, so they don't have a vote, so it's a matter of concerned to only students and parents.
SCHOOLS MIRROW OUR SOCIETY AND SCHOOLS' HEADS OUR GOVERNMENTS AND COUNCILS.
democracy? how democratic we want our society to be?
[quote][p][bold]MarcoPolo[/bold] wrote: Kids vote YES for uniform, parents vote YES for uniform, Governors vote YES for uniform, teachers vote YES for uniform. Where's the problem?[/p][/quote]No, students voted against, and parents consultation probably voted against. Head and teachers don't have to wear the new uniform, so they don't have a vote, so it's a matter of concerned to only students and parents. SCHOOLS MIRROW OUR SOCIETY AND SCHOOLS' HEADS OUR GOVERNMENTS AND COUNCILS. democracy? how democratic we want our society to be? Txa
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