Brighton and Hove residents to be consulted on 'unrealistic' park and ride (From The Argus)

If it has anything to do with the moronic greens we will just have more bicycle racks and all the car parks would be turned into allotments.

It would seem that the Greens have made up their minds ahead of this consultation. Wouldn't be the first time. They are opposed to people coming to the city by car, and apparently believe "no-one in their right mind" will want to drive into the National Park.

Warren Morgan wrote:
It would seem that the Greens have made up their minds ahead of this consultation. Wouldn't be the first time. They are opposed to people coming to the city by car, and apparently believe "no-one in their right mind" will want to drive into the National Park.

it's not possible to build a car park of a suitable size within a national park. full stop. Thats why a consultation is pointless.

It's ludicrous the national park boundary was seemingly dreamt up independently of the need for Brighton to expand it's infrastructure. You simply can't hem a city in so tightly by trunk roads.

Anyway, most 'right-minded' people agree that, national park or not, a large car park needs to be built at the A23/A27 junction near Patcham. A sacrifice of 1 or 2 acres would improve the air quality, standard of living and access to the city for millions of people every year.

They could quite easily create an underground car park at Patcham, more or less like the one in Regency Square. Enter by a slip road and tunnel from the A23 southbound, then exit south towards the A23/A27 junction. Link that by tram into the Old Steine. Introduce a congestion charge beyond that point.

Concrete over the Downs or try to reduce the number of cars in the city? That's the simple choice. You can't have both.

But seeing as petrol prices are going to be increasing quite dramatically over the next 50 years, unless a new form of energy is found, less and less cars will be coming into the city. Concreting over the Downs seems like a bit of a waste to me.

Now what would be good for the city is affordable public transport. I never use the buses as they're too expensive and I hate to see all my money going to a bunch of rich fat cats paying themselves huge dividends.

censored wrote:
It's ludicrous the national park boundary was seemingly dreamt up independently of the need for Brighton to expand it's infrastructure. You simply can't hem a city in so tightly by trunk roads.

Anyway, most 'right-minded' people agree that, national park or not, a large car park needs to be built at the A23/A27 junction near Patcham. A sacrifice of 1 or 2 acres would improve the air quality, standard of living and access to the city for millions of people every year.

Right on the money. Absolutely right.
The flippin Greens are trying to price all the motorists out of the city, but without providing any sort of viable alternative.
Sacrifices HAVE to be made if the aim is to reduce the number of vehicles entering the city - and that sacrifice has to be a small part of the national park. There is nowhere else, and without a proper park and ride scheme fit for the next couple of decades, everything else is just dicking around.
But of course that's what the Greens are good at.

So a consultation that will be ignored anyway because it's not possible to follow through on. Sounds to me like a deliberate mismanagement of council funds. Bad enough in any financial year, but at a time when we are repeatedly told about cuts limiting services, to take this action shows just how morally bankrupt the council in when it comes to spending out taxes!

Is Sussex University exempt from the National Parks as it seems to be able to expand when it wants.Why not Toads Hall it is big enough?Asda at Hollingbury could be used if they turnthe present carpark into multi-storey.

Why don't the Council study what has been achieved at Truro. It is a model of what is possible in the countryside and even the contruction is "green".

graham_Seagull wrote:

Warren Morgan wrote:
It would seem that the Greens have made up their minds ahead of this consultation. Wouldn't be the first time. They are opposed to people coming to the city by car, and apparently believe "no-one in their right mind" will want to drive into the National Park.

it's not possible to build a car park of a suitable size within a national park. full stop. Thats why a consultation is pointless.

But the water board can build what they like at waterhall.......

If we do not accept that a Park & ride at the junction of the A27 A23 that people would willingly use is to avoid the crawl into the city centre is probably the only way to cure congestion and pollution.

A forward thinking, bold, rise to the occasion council is what is needed not a bunch a soppy limp gits who have vowed to consult the public on park and ride plans but already admitted that any potential scheme is “unrealistic”. FFS

Interestingly I see that Pete West is appalled at the suggestion of concreting over the National Park to create a car park but, like his muesli eating colleagues apparently has no problem in concreting over them to create a larger traveller park !! Double standards methinks.

Underground car park and underground travellers park solve both problems.

Hove Actually wrote:

graham_Seagull wrote:

Warren Morgan wrote: It would seem that the Greens have made up their minds ahead of this consultation. Wouldn't be the first time. They are opposed to people coming to the city by car, and apparently believe "no-one in their right mind" will want to drive into the National Park.

it's not possible to build a car park of a suitable size within a national park. full stop. Thats why a consultation is pointless.

But the water board can build what they like at waterhall....... If we do not accept that a Park & ride at the junction of the A27 A23 that people would willingly use is to avoid the crawl into the city centre is probably the only way to cure congestion and pollution. A forward thinking, bold, rise to the occasion council is what is needed not a bunch a soppy limp gits who have vowed to consult the public on park and ride plans but already admitted that any potential scheme is “unrealistic”. FFS

A park and ride would only reduce town centre pollution if a car park space was removed from a town centre car park for each one provide at a park and ride, otherwise a park and ride would initially reduce town centre traffic, which would then suck in traffic as drivers find it easier to drive in.
As the council pick up huge revenue from town centre car parks it ain't gonna happen, do pollution doesn't get better nor does congestion.

Pete west has the cheek of the devil. His party is allowing the football club to build a new car park while reducing the lewes road to that car park to a single lane in each direction.
Contradiction, stupidity and elitism allowing some people to use cars and build car parks while others are being forced out of vehicles.
Does mr west have a season ticket?

Hove Actually wrote:

graham_Seagull wrote:

Warren Morgan wrote: It would seem that the Greens have made up their minds ahead of this consultation. Wouldn't be the first time. They are opposed to people coming to the city by car, and apparently believe "no-one in their right mind" will want to drive into the National Park.

it's not possible to build a car park of a suitable size within a national park. full stop. Thats why a consultation is pointless.

But the water board can build what they like at waterhall....... If we do not accept that a Park & ride at the junction of the A27 A23 that people would willingly use is to avoid the crawl into the city centre is probably the only way to cure congestion and pollution. A forward thinking, bold, rise to the occasion council is what is needed not a bunch a soppy limp gits who have vowed to consult the public on park and ride plans but already admitted that any potential scheme is “unrealistic”. FFS

'water board building at Waterhall'? Not sure what you mean there as I haven't seen anything built at waterhall.

Bearing in mind national park regs are set at a national level, would you recommend the council spend £millions of our cash seeking to over throw the national park planning regs to get a parking ride - it would have to go to the highest court in the land for a decision as opponents would push it all the way, and would most likely leave our council with a legal fee of tens of millions which we would have to pay for.
Hence pushing down the path of building on the national park is plain silly all round.

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
Pete west has the cheek of the devil. His party is allowing the football club to build a new car park while reducing the lewes road to that car park to a single lane in each direction.
Contradiction, stupidity and elitism allowing some people to use cars and build car parks while others are being forced out of vehicles.
Does mr west have a season ticket?

The Greens never campaigned against the stadium either. Total hypocrites.

The lewes road is a key route to get onto to A27 and at peak times is used by business traffic and HGVs servicing the city.
It will be reduced to one lane in the misguided belief that more students will cycle to the two unis.
I met two business leaders in the city who have said they will re locate out of Brighton if that happens and will also charge extra to come back into the city to do work for residents as the travel time will increase.
Really poor planning. Very few people cycle in the city because of the hills in many areas.
Only us hardened cyclists can be bothers with the bear road ascent or new England hill.
This isn't flat Oxford or Cambridge.
Can the argus please check how many of our councillors cycle.

censored wrote:
It's ludicrous the national park boundary was seemingly dreamt up independently of the need for Brighton to expand it's infrastructure. You simply can't hem a city in so tightly by trunk roads.

Anyway, most 'right-minded' people agree that, national park or not, a large car park needs to be built at the A23/A27 junction near Patcham. A sacrifice of 1 or 2 acres would improve the air quality, standard of living and access to the city for millions of people every year.

that is just one of 4 places that needs a big car park. yet again the council is hiding its collective head in the sand.

davyboy wrote:

censored wrote:
It's ludicrous the national park boundary was seemingly dreamt up independently of the need for Brighton to expand it's infrastructure. You simply can't hem a city in so tightly by trunk roads.

Anyway, most 'right-minded' people agree that, national park or not, a large car park needs to be built at the A23/A27 junction near Patcham. A sacrifice of 1 or 2 acres would improve the air quality, standard of living and access to the city for millions of people every year.

that is just one of 4 places that needs a big car park. yet again the council is hiding its collective head in the sand.

I refer to my earlier comment; if its in the national park it would go all the way to the high court for a decision on building in a national park, which in turn would cost tens of millions £, and precendents say the council would lose.
That means you, me, would pick up a tens of millions bill for the council and the other sides (National trust, national park authority etc etc)......it would be stupidity to stumble into that situation and you would crucify the council if they did.

How much is this consultation set to cost? In the current financial situation we're funding some idiots curiosity for unviable theories
How about lowering the ever escalating bus and taxi fares to promote their use?

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
The lewes road is a key route to get onto to A27 and at peak times is used by business traffic and HGVs servicing the city.
It will be reduced to one lane in the misguided belief that more students will cycle to the two unis.
I met two business leaders in the city who have said they will re locate out of Brighton if that happens and will also charge extra to come back into the city to do work for residents as the travel time will increase.
Really poor planning. Very few people cycle in the city because of the hills in many areas.
Only us hardened cyclists can be bothers with the bear road ascent or new England hill.
This isn't flat Oxford or Cambridge.
Can the argus please check how many of our councillors cycle.

Just to balance that out, I spoke to a business leader the other day who was really happy these cycle lanes are getting built. He employs 100 people located near Brighton station, most of whom are happy to travle to work by foot, bike or public transport.

He wants to bring his kids up in the city and he felt that cycle lanes are definitely the way forward to ensure they have as safe an upbringing as possible.

Oh, and I disagree with the fact that very few people cycle in the city. And even more will once it becomes safe to go out there without competing for road space with buses and trucks.

pekkers wrote:
How much is this consultation set to cost? In the current financial situation we're funding some idiots curiosity for unviable theories
How about lowering the ever escalating bus and taxi fares to promote their use?

I agree. Make bus travel free - the business case for funding that in comparison to fixing numerous raod schemes would I'm sure be a no brainer.

Now let me think - where are the biggest car parks in Hove ... aaah - of course:
One right opposite Hove Town Hall, and the other ... erm ...... inside the Kings House council offices complex, yes thats right, that huge building with panoramic views of Hove Lawns and the coast. Surely these would be the first that the greens would want to close / or make available to the park and ride??

Having just read you comments you all have short memoirs of the park & ride .WHY can,t we go back to with dean know the football has gone from with dean you have paking places already for you + room for bus .!!!!!?