Brighton and Hove leaders desperate to improve Western Road

Preston Street part of the proposed 'West Laine' Preston Street part of the proposed 'West Laine'

Only a few years ago, the area around Western Road in Brighton bustled with shoppers and hungry customers.

For decades the district was a go-to destination for visitors leaving the seafront and major hotels.

But the recession has hit the area hard with rows of empty homes and shabby shopfronts.

Business leaders now complain shoppers and tourists have deserted the district in favour of the fashionable boutique shops in the North Laine.

In April, a survey by the Federation of Small Businesses found 40% of shops in the area were now lying vacant.

Hordes of street drinkers are now a regular sight in doorways and on park benches in nearby Norfolk Square.

As Brighton and Hove City Council move ahead with plans to build the i360 in front of Regency Square, city leaders are desperate to revitalise the troubled district before the tourists arrive in their droves.

Andrew Burnyeat is chair of the Brighton Business Improvement District and manager of Icom, a computer repair shop in Preston Street.

He said: “The area from Western Road to Norfolk Square certainly does not look as good as it did five or six years ago.

“I think the whole area has been depressed for a while. We’ve made improvements in recent months but there’s definitely a long way to go.”

'Soaring rents'

Many traders around Western Road are in dire straits as they face soaring rents and plummeting profits.

Trevor Freeman, chairman of the Brighton and Hove Federation of Small Businesses, said landlords were often to blame for the empty shops.

He said: “Around that way it’s becoming impossible for many small shops to stay afloat.

“The problem is many are tied into contracts with upward escalation clauses.

“This means their rent can only go up, not down, and that is unacceptable in the current climate.

“Some unsympathetic landlords put the rent up without taking into account the prevailing circumstances.

“So there needs to be concerted action from tenants and the authorities to make sure this doesn’t happen.

“Another solution would be for the council to break up the larger empty properties into littler units so smaller businesses have the chance to get started.

“I also think government need to lower business rates in times of stress by targeting struggling areas like Western Road and Preston Street to boost trade.

“All this would take is a bit of clever thinking.”

Rename as West Laine

One idea to revitalise the Western Road area is to revive its historic name in a bid to attract visitors.

Councillor Jason Kitcat, leader of Brighton and Hove City Council, suggested that the district become known again as the West Laine.

In years gone by the West Laine was one of five fields that surrounded Brighton including the North Laine, Hilly Laine and Little Laine.

Coun Kitcat said a rebrand could help the neighbourhood emulate the success of the North Laine, famed for its boutique shops and cafes.

He said: “The area around Preston Street, Norfolk Square and Western Road is somewhat divided. As a wider area it doesn’t really have an identity.

“Calling it the West Laine could potentially generate more interest and customers. I think the idea could have a really positive impact and could generate a real sense of community.

“As we move forward with the i360 tower it might help to change how people feel about the area.”

What can be done to impove Western Road? Share your opinions below

Comments(75)

Kate234 says...
6:45pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Scrap parking charge rises and in fact lower charges from last year to encourage people to come to the City. It costs too much now to drive to Preston Street to eat and have you seen the charges in Norfolk Square? This removes footfall. Also give Jason Kitkat a large cheque to resign. Everyone has their price and it would be worth it as opposed to having years more damage inflicted on the city. This would allow another political party to look at parking and the issues facing businesses instead of having a party in power that won't be happy until every single shop is boarded up and is instrumental in making this happen. Don't care which one - no other party could surely inflict as much damage on the city as the greens are doing at the moment with their ill thought out tax on local jobs and employment (which is in effect what these parking charge rises are).

southwicker2 says...
6:46pm Fri 13 Jul 12

If anyone seiously thinks just changing the name are (to anything you like) is suddenly going to magic away all the issues they must be stark raving mad. Research, investment, logic and good design would be a far better option in my opinion. Reasonable rents and rates would also attract businesses to the area I'm sure. Regards high rents, surely a landlord would prefer a lesser rent than no rent at all, so increasing them in the current economic climate is surely ultimatelty counter-productive.

rolivan says...
6:50pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Here's an idea why doesn't Local Government put their money where their mouth is and use Pension Funds to buy parts of Brighton and Hove and completely redevelop areas.We don't want SKysrapers everwhere but it isn't economical to have single and double storey Commercial buildings in the City Centre surely.Just think of all of the Money that was "invested" in Iceland at supposedly high rates,has that mone been recouped.

Abrightonian says...
6:56pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Lowering parking costs in the area would give traders an immediate filip. West Laine, Babylon, Kitcatland. call it what you will. It won't make much difference until it's tidied up.

GraemeDavis says...
7:27pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Astronomic parking charges and council-created traffic jams are killing Brighton and Hove. We need parking costs at sane levels and an end to anti-motorist policies.

As a professional historical linguist I would like to point out that Laine (in North Laine) is simply a spelling variant of lane (despite the published false etymologies which invent an Anglo-Saxon origin). If a new name for the area helps let's call it West Lanes (like The Lanes).

jamesbandenburg says...
7:42pm Fri 13 Jul 12

The main reason I never bother with Western Road is that it's constantly snarled up with hundreds of buses queuing to get to the Churchill Square stops and belching out carcinogenic blue smoke. It's a complete eyesore. Is it really necessary having so many routes running down Western Road? A shuttle that runs between Portslade station and the Old Steine would reduce about 90% of the buses running down the road. Let's not forget that this road that is predominantly closed to cars had one of the highest levels of pollution in the city...

power_ranger says...
7:44pm Fri 13 Jul 12

The problem here is the parking charges.

I voted green. NEVER again. Talk about backstabbing your own constituency with lunatic ideals that looked good on paper, but obviously not working in reality.

U-turn now and you might still have a tiny minority of voters to start fresh with.

Continue on your current path and no one will be sad to see you go.

No one.

bug eye says...
7:48pm Fri 13 Jul 12

blaming landlords is silly as they would rather a shop with a tenant than without they are not stupid. full shops then in turn push rents up anyway. parking charges need a serious rethink, allowing the most eco cars to to use bus lanes and park for free. west laine needs an identity with uniform shop fronts and an individual colour scheme perhaps with all buildings painted to a scheme. the area needs to be known as an art quarter, designer quarter or food quarter etc not a cheap off licence quarter as it is now. it needs better paving and contemporary lighting and planting and possibly a shared space like new road. the council need to play their part.

martyt says...
7:49pm Fri 13 Jul 12

the last time i went in to Brighton
was the last time i will be going in to Brighton i cant afford the parking charges and shop ,and with free parking at out of town stores it makes every thing cheaper ,the greens are making
the city center greener by all but banning cars and killing off the jobs in the city with it parking charges ,but on the plus side the great unwashed can pitch a tent and cycle were ever they want too

rolivan says...
7:50pm Fri 13 Jul 12

jamesbandenburg wrote:
The main reason I never bother with Western Road is that it's constantly snarled up with hundreds of buses queuing to get to the Churchill Square stops and belching out carcinogenic blue smoke. It's a complete eyesore. Is it really necessary having so many routes running down Western Road? A shuttle that runs between Portslade station and the Old Steine would reduce about 90% of the buses running down the road. Let's not forget that this road that is predominantly closed to cars had one of the highest levels of pollution in the city...
I have been saying this for ages.The Shuttle could run in 2 circular routes between Palmeira Sq and the Steine some doing the Seafront and some doing Davigdor and the Station.With the main Shuttle going back and forth along Western Rd.

quedula says...
8:28pm Fri 13 Jul 12

GraemeDavis wrote:
Astronomic parking charges and council-created traffic jams are killing Brighton and Hove. We need parking costs at sane levels and an end to anti-motorist policies.

As a professional historical linguist I would like to point out that Laine (in North Laine) is simply a spelling variant of lane (despite the published false etymologies which invent an Anglo-Saxon origin). If a new name for the area helps let's call it West Lanes (like The Lanes).
Perhaps you should point this out to the compilers of the Oxford English Dictionary. Until then I'm happy to use their definition of "laine", namely, "a name given to certain tracts of arable land at the foot of the Sussex Downs."

Morpheus says...
8:29pm Fri 13 Jul 12

The clue to the issue might be the sudden change when Western Road changes to Church Road. Is the council so clueless that they cannot see the cause of the problem?

Lady Smith says...
8:39pm Fri 13 Jul 12

rolivan wrote:
Here's an idea why doesn't Local Government put their money where their mouth is and use Pension Funds to buy parts of Brighton and Hove and completely redevelop areas.We don't want SKysrapers everwhere but it isn't economical to have single and double storey Commercial buildings in the City Centre surely.Just think of all of the Money that was "invested" in Iceland at supposedly high rates,has that mone been recouped.
Sorry - is there a sentence and a point somewhere in here?

rolivan says...
8:49pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Lady Smith wrote:
rolivan wrote:
Here's an idea why doesn't Local Government put their money where their mouth is and use Pension Funds to buy parts of Brighton and Hove and completely redevelop areas.We don't want SKysrapers everwhere but it isn't economical to have single and double storey Commercial buildings in the City Centre surely.Just think of all of the Money that was "invested" in Iceland at supposedly high rates,has that mone been recouped.
Sorry - is there a sentence and a point somewhere in here?
Yes there is! there are thousands of delapidated buildings in the Centre of Brighton and Hove that are relics of the past.At some point the Hotchpotch of Shops and Business Premises need to be Redeveloped,the sooner the better.

mimseycal says...
8:54pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Parking charges are certainly a huge issue. But it isn't that alone. The sheer number of buses, the constant belching of fumes, the honking and the blocked pavements where people stand and wait for the next bus make the area torture to navigate in wheelchair; as does the shoddy pavement.

It needs to become far more user friendly and less bus friendly.

HJarrs says...
8:58pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Well, apparently all we need to do is turn B&H into a huge free car park and...hey presto! All the worlds ills are solved. Oh, except then with all the traffic you turn it into London Rd, nice!

Frankly, I don't buy the parking comments from the above. I am sure that some footfall is affected by parking charges and I do think they are too high, but I also don't think that those put off by the parking charges are a significant proportion of the market, as it has always been a pain to park around there anyway.

Unfortunately, this area has been in rapid decline for all my time in B&H and had gone down way before the Green administration took office.

One think would that would definately help would be if there were to be an attraction on the seafront in that area that would draw people to that end of town. Hmmm, lets see. How about a tower people could go up? That's always a winner.

george smith says...
8:59pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Abrightonian wrote:
Lowering parking costs in the area would give traders an immediate filip. West Laine, Babylon, Kitcatland. call it what you will. It won't make much difference until it's tidied up.
With their marxist tendancies Kitkatgrad would probably be more suitable

GraemeDavis says...
9:01pm Fri 13 Jul 12

quedula wrote:
GraemeDavis wrote:
Astronomic parking charges and council-created traffic jams are killing Brighton and Hove. We need parking costs at sane levels and an end to anti-motorist policies.

As a professional historical linguist I would like to point out that Laine (in North Laine) is simply a spelling variant of lane (despite the published false etymologies which invent an Anglo-Saxon origin). If a new name for the area helps let's call it West Lanes (like The Lanes).
Perhaps you should point this out to the compilers of the Oxford English Dictionary. Until then I'm happy to use their definition of "laine", namely, "a name given to certain tracts of arable land at the foot of the Sussex Downs."
The OED indeed gives the definition you set out, but also points out that it is "local", in this case a Sussex Downs variant spelling. It lists five archaic examples of this variant spelling - all deriving from a single late eighteenth century source. The OED does not give an etymology (though many books on Brighton give a spurious etymology).

If people wish to use the form "Laine" as a bit of fun then this is fine, but it is just an eighteenth century spelling variant. The use in Brighton's North Laine is not old - the idea of this name was revived in the 1930s and put into use fifty or sixty years ago.

Laine is as false as ye olde English tea shoppe - a form which is also in the OED.

mimseycal says...
9:20pm Fri 13 Jul 12

HJarrs wrote:
Well, apparently all we need to do is turn B&H into a huge free car park and...hey presto! All the worlds ills are solved. Oh, except then with all the traffic you turn it into London Rd, nice!

Frankly, I don't buy the parking comments from the above. I am sure that some footfall is affected by parking charges and I do think they are too high, but I also don't think that those put off by the parking charges are a significant proportion of the market, as it has always been a pain to park around there anyway.

Unfortunately, this area has been in rapid decline for all my time in B&H and had gone down way before the Green administration took office.

One think would that would definately help would be if there were to be an attraction on the seafront in that area that would draw people to that end of town. Hmmm, lets see. How about a tower people could go up? That's always a winner.
Tell me HJarrs, just out of interest mind you. If 79 people out of a total 100 told you that they don't eat steamed carrots, would you still insist on serving it to them?

deanaprior says...
9:24pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Looking at the photo , if they pedestrianised Preston Street and the roads adjacent to Western road it would be lovely.
Like the Laines try closing it off to traffic on Sundays put tables out on the pavements then if this works close it permanently.
The answer isn't more cars, its less.

s_james says...
9:44pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Pedestrianising Preston St is a great idea. HJarrs also talks a lot of sense. Fair play to the Greens for highlighting the issue and trying to get something done - I don't recall previous administrations doing anything except tarting up Norfolk Square a bit

HJarrs says...
9:45pm Fri 13 Jul 12

mimseycal wrote:
HJarrs wrote:
Well, apparently all we need to do is turn B&H into a huge free car park and...hey presto! All the worlds ills are solved. Oh, except then with all the traffic you turn it into London Rd, nice!

Frankly, I don't buy the parking comments from the above. I am sure that some footfall is affected by parking charges and I do think they are too high, but I also don't think that those put off by the parking charges are a significant proportion of the market, as it has always been a pain to park around there anyway.

Unfortunately, this area has been in rapid decline for all my time in B&H and had gone down way before the Green administration took office.

One think would that would definately help would be if there were to be an attraction on the seafront in that area that would draw people to that end of town. Hmmm, lets see. How about a tower people could go up? That's always a winner.
Tell me HJarrs, just out of interest mind you. If 79 people out of a total 100 told you that they don't eat steamed carrots, would you still insist on serving it to them?
Don't remember seeing steamed carrots in the article.

However, I do note that the major issue seemed to be Landlords raising rents and I should imagine that is where the rot set in, now compounded by a squeeze on disposable incomes.
Nobody wants to pay parking charges, I don't when I drive, but in the part of town I don't believe it is really the issue. If you made parking free I doubt it would make that much difference as the place is no longer attractive enough to drive to. Not only that but large volumes of traffic put people off. The Laines would not be so popular if there was not someform of restraint on car traffic. We should look to provide sufficient access for those with mobility impairement first and foremost when planning car access.

Maxwell's Ghost says...
10:03pm Fri 13 Jul 12

I was in town last Friday night and then shopping Saturday and Sunday and I was shocked at how empty shops and restaurants were. I got chatting to a young lad serving in one shop who said things had been pretty bad for
Weeks.
Now isn't really the time to
Have such high Parking charges and the bad news about the charges seems to have travelled to towns nearby so perhaps out of towners are now staying away by habit.

mimseycal says...
10:04pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Steamed carrots weren't in the article. It was just a question which you have not answered. Well, you have really but never mind that.

Reflect on your post says...
10:15pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
I was in town last Friday night and then shopping Saturday and Sunday and I was shocked at how empty shops and restaurants were. I got chatting to a young lad serving in one shop who said things had been pretty bad for
Weeks.
Now isn't really the time to
Have such high Parking charges and the bad news about the charges seems to have travelled to towns nearby so perhaps out of towners are now staying away by habit.
Perhaps if you were 'in town' a little more often you wouldn't be so 'shocked'. I make a point of spending what is left of my hard earned (after paying taxes to support those who are happy not to contribute), locally; maybe instead of moaning about students, you should too?

Reflect on your post says...
10:20pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
I was in town last Friday night and then shopping Saturday and Sunday and I was shocked at how empty shops and restaurants were. I got chatting to a young lad serving in one shop who said things had been pretty bad for
Weeks.
Now isn't really the time to
Have such high Parking charges and the bad news about the charges seems to have travelled to towns nearby so perhaps out of towners are now staying away by habit.
Perhaps if you were 'in town' a little more often you wouldn't be so 'shocked'. I make a point of spending what is left of my hard earned (after paying taxes to support those who are happy not to contribute), locally; maybe instead of moaning about students, you should too?

george smith says...
10:27pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Reflect on your post wrote:
Maxwell's Ghost wrote: I was in town last Friday night and then shopping Saturday and Sunday and I was shocked at how empty shops and restaurants were. I got chatting to a young lad serving in one shop who said things had been pretty bad for Weeks. Now isn't really the time to Have such high Parking charges and the bad news about the charges seems to have travelled to towns nearby so perhaps out of towners are now staying away by habit.
Perhaps if you were 'in town' a little more often you wouldn't be so 'shocked'. I make a point of spending what is left of my hard earned (after paying taxes to support those who are happy not to contribute), locally; maybe instead of moaning about students, you should too?
Well aren't you the lucky one, not everyone can afford the cost of going into the city, parking and buses are both expensive from the outskirts

saveHOVE says...
11:05pm Fri 13 Jul 12

Totally naive to believe that just renaming the area 'West Laine' would do very much. Quite like the idea of the ORIGINAL West Laine area getting that designation however....just because.

The demographic is at fault. People over 25 were the Western Road (and arguably North Street) core type of customer. The North Laine was always the funky bit and a magnet for the young and of course this is a student town masquerading as a bonafide 'city' whilst enjoying the status of 'city'.

Unless the demographic balance is corrected, this can only get worse.

All 'yoof' wants from the city is funky shops, clubs, the Duke of York, pubs and bars - oh, and lawns to party on where they can leave their disposable barbecues and beer bottles/cans behind for an adult to clear away.

If the will to reduce the student population is not there (it isn't) then 'moving with the times' is the only solution.

This woud mean looking at the areas above shops and assessing whether or not the empty shops could be returned to residential use.

Breaking up that length of road from The Old Steine, along North Street, continuing along Western Road to Palmeira Square so that it becomes mixed development (homes down to pavement level, with street entrances, shops, cafes and offices) instead of the monoculture of tacky and constantly churning this 'n that small shops would be A Good Thing.

saveHOVE says...
11:09pm Fri 13 Jul 12

GraemeDavis wrote:
Astronomic parking charges and council-created traffic jams are killing Brighton and Hove. We need parking costs at sane levels and an end to anti-motorist policies. As a professional historical linguist I would like to point out that Laine (in North Laine) is simply a spelling variant of lane (despite the published false etymologies which invent an Anglo-Saxon origin). If a new name for the area helps let's call it West Lanes (like The Lanes).
The word 'laine' means field. Look at old maps of Brighton. They were so designated THEN without 'lanes'.

Reflect on your post says...
11:09pm Fri 13 Jul 12

george smith wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
Maxwell's Ghost wrote: I was in town last Friday night and then shopping Saturday and Sunday and I was shocked at how empty shops and restaurants were. I got chatting to a young lad serving in one shop who said things had been pretty bad for Weeks. Now isn't really the time to Have such high Parking charges and the bad news about the charges seems to have travelled to towns nearby so perhaps out of towners are now staying away by habit.
Perhaps if you were 'in town' a little more often you wouldn't be so 'shocked'. I make a point of spending what is left of my hard earned (after paying taxes to support those who are happy not to contribute), locally; maybe instead of moaning about students, you should too?
Well aren't you the lucky one, not everyone can afford the cost of going into the city, parking and buses are both expensive from the outskirts
George, its all about priorities...

saveHOVE says...
11:10pm Fri 13 Jul 12

P.S. 'laine' in French means 'wool' - as in sheep. It may be that the use of the word 'laine' to refer to fields involved their use for sheep.

saveHOVE says...
11:18pm Fri 13 Jul 12

GraemeDavis wrote:
quedula wrote:
GraemeDavis wrote: Astronomic parking charges and council-created traffic jams are killing Brighton and Hove. We need parking costs at sane levels and an end to anti-motorist policies. As a professional historical linguist I would like to point out that Laine (in North Laine) is simply a spelling variant of lane (despite the published false etymologies which invent an Anglo-Saxon origin). If a new name for the area helps let's call it West Lanes (like The Lanes).
Perhaps you should point this out to the compilers of the Oxford English Dictionary. Until then I'm happy to use their definition of "laine", namely, "a name given to certain tracts of arable land at the foot of the Sussex Downs."
The OED indeed gives the definition you set out, but also points out that it is "local", in this case a Sussex Downs variant spelling. It lists five archaic examples of this variant spelling - all deriving from a single late eighteenth century source. The OED does not give an etymology (though many books on Brighton give a spurious etymology). If people wish to use the form "Laine" as a bit of fun then this is fine, but it is just an eighteenth century spelling variant. The use in Brighton's North Laine is not old - the idea of this name was revived in the 1930s and put into use fifty or sixty years ago. Laine is as false as ye olde English tea shoppe - a form which is also in the OED.
Weren't Sussex and Normandy once much closer than now? Both physically and politically? The French word 'laine' is entirely logical for vernacular reference to a field.

quedula says...
4:27am Sat 14 Jul 12

saveHOVE wrote:
GraemeDavis wrote:
Astronomic parking charges and council-created traffic jams are killing Brighton and Hove. We need parking costs at sane levels and an end to anti-motorist policies. As a professional historical linguist I would like to point out that Laine (in North Laine) is simply a spelling variant of lane (despite the published false etymologies which invent an Anglo-Saxon origin). If a new name for the area helps let's call it West Lanes (like The Lanes).
The word 'laine' means field. Look at old maps of Brighton. They were so designated THEN without 'lanes'.
Exactly. Why would the old map makers call a field a "lane" and then misspell it?

mycroftmill says...
6:04am Sat 14 Jul 12

Living in Mid Sussex Brighton used to be our default Town for shopping and eating out. Not now, the cost of parking and running the the traffic calming gauntlet has made us look elsewhere.

Reflect on your post says...
6:29am Sat 14 Jul 12

mycroftmill wrote:
Living in Mid Sussex Brighton used to be our default Town for shopping and eating out. Not now, the cost of parking and running the the traffic calming gauntlet has made us look elsewhere.
Well that's good news then, if we could only discourage more people like you from staying away then Brighton would be a much better place.

george smith says...
7:40am Sat 14 Jul 12

Reflect on your post wrote:
george smith wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
Maxwell's Ghost wrote: I was in town last Friday night and then shopping Saturday and Sunday and I was shocked at how empty shops and restaurants were. I got chatting to a young lad serving in one shop who said things had been pretty bad for Weeks. Now isn't really the time to Have such high Parking charges and the bad news about the charges seems to have travelled to towns nearby so perhaps out of towners are now staying away by habit.
Perhaps if you were 'in town' a little more often you wouldn't be so 'shocked'. I make a point of spending what is left of my hard earned (after paying taxes to support those who are happy not to contribute), locally; maybe instead of moaning about students, you should too?
Well aren't you the lucky one, not everyone can afford the cost of going into the city, parking and buses are both expensive from the outskirts
George, its all about priorities...
You prioritise giving you money to NCP?!!!

Reflect on your post says...
7:48am Sat 14 Jul 12

george smith wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
george smith wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
Maxwell's Ghost wrote: I was in town last Friday night and then shopping Saturday and Sunday and I was shocked at how empty shops and restaurants were. I got chatting to a young lad serving in one shop who said things had been pretty bad for Weeks. Now isn't really the time to Have such high Parking charges and the bad news about the charges seems to have travelled to towns nearby so perhaps out of towners are now staying away by habit.
Perhaps if you were 'in town' a little more often you wouldn't be so 'shocked'. I make a point of spending what is left of my hard earned (after paying taxes to support those who are happy not to contribute), locally; maybe instead of moaning about students, you should too?
Well aren't you the lucky one, not everyone can afford the cost of going into the city, parking and buses are both expensive from the outskirts
George, its all about priorities...
You prioritise giving you money to NCP?!!!
You don't have to be so lazy George and you don't have to use NCP even if you insist on using a car.

As I said, its all about priorities and clearly yours are all about you!

Maxwell's Ghost says...
8:38am Sat 14 Jul 12

Don't feed the troll

fred clause says...
8:58am Sat 14 Jul 12

As usual Kitkat has his head buried in the sand renaming it wont change a thing we need action to lower rents and parking charges only then is there a chance things might improve,unfortunatel
y The Greens wont do any of that so onwards into slumville goes our Town.

Reflect on your post says...
9:06am Sat 14 Jul 12

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
Don't feed the troll
Couldn't agree more Maxwell. I am fed up of people coming on here making extremely blinkered statements then chiseling away to try to force their views on others. Bottom line is it is us locals and investors who will make the city vibrant and not the council. George and his ilk will get what they deserve.

GraemeDavis says...
9:54am Sat 14 Jul 12

I don't really see that a renaming of the area would help - but if it is renamed then please something other than West Laine.

Some of the comments on this thread demonstrate how much people want Laine to be something other than what it is. It turns up in three volumes of an agricultural treatise right at the end of the eighteenth century, is repeated in one or two nineteenth century texts (one is disputed) while the comprehensive OED lists it as a local use precisely because it has these four or five occurrences. It is simply a spelling variant of lane. It has nothing to do with French laine (wool). The popular usage of the form is a twentieth century invention. It is a fake. The undoubted fact that this wrong spelling has four or five occurrences which the OED correctly notes exist does not alter the fact that it is an invention.

Of course if we could have some affordable car parking in the area I would use it even if called Ye Olde Weste Laine Car Parke!

Number Six says...
10:52am Sat 14 Jul 12

When i lived in Brighton, and in Hove, Western Road was always clogged with buses making it highly unattractive and not a little dangerous. Someine please tell me, why is it necessary for those leviathans to go all the way along Westen Road and out the other side. How many people get on a bus in say, Hangleton and get off in Patcham? Why doesn't the bus from Hangleton go down to Palmeira Square, turn round and go back. Or the bus from Patcham turn round at the old Steine and go back. All you need is a fleet of shuttle buses going from Palmeira Square to Old Steine and from the Station to the seafront. You could even make it tourist friendly by haviing trams or somesuch.

As for drunks in Norfolk Square, I lived there forty years ago and it was a hangout for them then. No change there, then

Reflect on your post says...
11:13am Sat 14 Jul 12

Number Six wrote:
When i lived in Brighton, and in Hove, Western Road was always clogged with buses making it highly unattractive and not a little dangerous. Someine please tell me, why is it necessary for those leviathans to go all the way along Westen Road and out the other side. How many people get on a bus in say, Hangleton and get off in Patcham? Why doesn't the bus from Hangleton go down to Palmeira Square, turn round and go back. Or the bus from Patcham turn round at the old Steine and go back. All you need is a fleet of shuttle buses going from Palmeira Square to Old Steine and from the Station to the seafront. You could even make it tourist friendly by haviing trams or somesuch.

As for drunks in Norfolk Square, I lived there forty years ago and it was a hangout for them then. No change there, then
Street drinkers are in my opinion Brighton's biggest issue and until these vagrants are removed from the streets, I honestly can't see the city being attractive. The second biggest issue is the morons who take pity on them helping to sustain their position-no funds,no purpose-and then maybe they will leave, perhaps even seeking employment and coming out of the benefits system. Excuse me can you spare me 90p for my bus fare home please?....Yeah right!

quedula says...
12:15pm Sat 14 Jul 12

Number Six wrote:
When i lived in Brighton, and in Hove, Western Road was always clogged with buses making it highly unattractive and not a little dangerous. Someine please tell me, why is it necessary for those leviathans to go all the way along Westen Road and out the other side. How many people get on a bus in say, Hangleton and get off in Patcham? Why doesn't the bus from Hangleton go down to Palmeira Square, turn round and go back. Or the bus from Patcham turn round at the old Steine and go back. All you need is a fleet of shuttle buses going from Palmeira Square to Old Steine and from the Station to the seafront. You could even make it tourist friendly by haviing trams or somesuch.

As for drunks in Norfolk Square, I lived there forty years ago and it was a hangout for them then. No change there, then
I strongly agree. Have often thought the same myself. Probably the shuttle buses could even be electric.

Another question is why do the buses have to go in front of Churchill Square? Why aren't they diverted down West St., along Regency Road, under the mall, and then by a short stretch of reinstated Clarence Street, back to Western Road?

Hove Speaking says...
12:32pm Sat 14 Jul 12

I have previously contacted Brighton & Hove buses re:express routes to which they said it would be to difficult to work out which bus stops to make express, well they do it in London, so get on with it! What happened to the tram idea all along the seafront? Thought once the Greens got in that would have been right up their street?Western Road looks like a poor relation to London Road and that's saying something!

inmegarden says...
12:33pm Sat 14 Jul 12

mimseycal wrote:
Parking charges are certainly a huge issue. But it isn't that alone. The sheer number of buses, the constant belching of fumes, the honking and the blocked pavements where people stand and wait for the next bus make the area torture to navigate in wheelchair; as does the shoddy pavement.

It needs to become far more user friendly and less bus friendly.
Too right !
I also have trouble with 'street hawkers' who position their 'trolly's of tat' at right angles across the pavement. Outside of M+S recently the pavement was restricted to 8 feet wide by these idiots.

Dealing with idiots says...
1:59pm Sat 14 Jul 12

People often forget that the council is a major landlord in the city. If they chose to lower the rents of the shops and offices they, actually we own, then when it came to rent review time, business would be able to demonstrate in their negotiations that there were lower rents in their area. More shops occupied therefore more business rates into local services.

davyboy says...
4:36pm Sat 14 Jul 12

on my frequent visits to the city, i get accosted numerous times by people 'collecting' for charity. it is, in my opinion, a form of begging. that puts me off straight away, as does seeing street drinkers and big issue sellers who always ask you to buy. if i want to give to charity, i will do it direct, and if i want a big issue, i will come to you. i never bring the car because of the parking charges, preferring to use the buses, which are very clean and frequent. i can understand why traders won't start up there, as rents must be astronomical. the streets should be steam cleaned on a regular basis, and fast food outlets be forced to clear up their rubbish. it is not nice to walk along at 10am and see mountains of trade waste still to be collected. this should all be done by 6am, and the pavements washed down afterwards. it happens abroad, so why not here? oh yes, cost! the whole city needs a good clean up, but the council seem to spend money on stupid things, rather than necessary ones.

Borrom says...
5:16pm Sat 14 Jul 12

bug eye wrote:
blaming landlords is silly as they would rather a shop with a tenant than without they are not stupid. full shops then in turn push rents up anyway. parking charges need a serious rethink, allowing the most eco cars to to use bus lanes and park for free. west laine needs an identity with uniform shop fronts and an individual colour scheme perhaps with all buildings painted to a scheme. the area needs to be known as an art quarter, designer quarter or food quarter etc not a cheap off licence quarter as it is now. it needs better paving and contemporary lighting and planting and possibly a shared space like new road. the council need to play their part.
That's the first sensible comment I've seen. The rest have been the usual self-interested, navel-gazing rubbish about the Greens being useless, and the poor motor car no longer ruling the World. Well, get used to it, drivers. There are too many of you, so something's got be done to control you, for all our sakes.

D5 says...
5:55pm Sat 14 Jul 12

mycroftmill wrote:
Living in Mid Sussex Brighton used to be our default Town for shopping and eating out. Not now, the cost of parking and running the the traffic calming gauntlet has made us look elsewhere.
I cycle in from steyning most days. the bus is £2.20 each way. Not exactly a massive expense is it? A pint is about £4, wish people on here would perhaps consider cycling and walking even. Fat gits. Brighton is great and im sure it isnt the parking that makes it look utterly horrible, id say its the plethora of bl00dy street drinkers sat in doorways all over the city. Is street drinking illegal or is it part of Brightons "ambiance" etc

Where is the common sence says...
6:15pm Sat 14 Jul 12

Name change is a rusbbish idea call a turd by any other name its still a turd......

what needs to be done is simple create more parking spaces reduce the cost of the existing spaces, make western road more accessible by simplifying the road systems.

Buses need to be reduced in the city center crossing western road is a game of russian roulette at the best of times.

Full time street cleaners working round the clock and an obvious police presence to deter illegal street vendors and beggers.....

Reflect on your post says...
6:59pm Sat 14 Jul 12

Have any of you guys encountered the nice gentlemen dressed as superman / spiderman down in the lanes selling charity badges / key-rings?

Would love to know more, especially how much of the donation actually goes to charity? I may be wrong however my sense is that these guys are getting very rich from this!

HJarrs says...
8:10pm Sat 14 Jul 12

Reflect on your post wrote:
Have any of you guys encountered the nice gentlemen dressed as superman / spiderman down in the lanes selling charity badges / key-rings?

Would love to know more, especially how much of the donation actually goes to charity? I may be wrong however my sense is that these guys are getting very rich from this!
They still about! Every time I saw them I couldn't find a PC to ask them a few searching questions.

Definately dodgy.

HJarrs says...
8:15pm Sat 14 Jul 12

I do love the "I can't afford to park" line. Having spent thousands to own and run a car, a few quid in parking occasionally seems like very little to me.

I get the feeling that if parking were free it would not drum up much extra trade in town. If you have experienced Holmbush hell on a busy Saturday, people are quite willing to put themselves to considerable inconvenience to live the dream of out of town shopping.

Nigel Furness says...
9:44pm Sat 14 Jul 12

So Jason Kitcat as Leader of the Council thinks the answer to Western Road's problems of dereliction is a simple rebranding as the West Laine district? What a pity as ward councillor for Regency he doesn't take the trouble to ensure that council workmen replace the defective paving slabs in Western Road like for like, rather than pathetic patches of blacktop thereby contributing to its rundown appearance.

mimseycal says...
9:57pm Sat 14 Jul 12

HJarrs wrote:
I do love the "I can't afford to park" line. Having spent thousands to own and run a car, a few quid in parking occasionally seems like very little to me.

I get the feeling that if parking were free it would not drum up much extra trade in town. If you have experienced Holmbush hell on a busy Saturday, people are quite willing to put themselves to considerable inconvenience to live the dream of out of town shopping.
I think you misunderstand ... it isn't I cannot afford to park. I refuse to enrich a council's coffers beyond the statutory when the same council does not seem all that concerned about making the town's amenities more suitable to my needs.

A dilapidated pavement, queues of buses, droves of people standing around waiting for those self same buses. No enforcement regarding street furniture, no easy access public loos ... the list goes on.

Wanting value for money is not meanness but sound economic principles and quite frankly, with the current parking charges being what they are, Brighton is far from value for money.

HJarrs says...
10:08pm Sat 14 Jul 12

mimseycal wrote:
HJarrs wrote:
I do love the "I can't afford to park" line. Having spent thousands to own and run a car, a few quid in parking occasionally seems like very little to me.

I get the feeling that if parking were free it would not drum up much extra trade in town. If you have experienced Holmbush hell on a busy Saturday, people are quite willing to put themselves to considerable inconvenience to live the dream of out of town shopping.
I think you misunderstand ... it isn't I cannot afford to park. I refuse to enrich a council's coffers beyond the statutory when the same council does not seem all that concerned about making the town's amenities more suitable to my needs.

A dilapidated pavement, queues of buses, droves of people standing around waiting for those self same buses. No enforcement regarding street furniture, no easy access public loos ... the list goes on.

Wanting value for money is not meanness but sound economic principles and quite frankly, with the current parking charges being what they are, Brighton is far from value for money.
I would quite agree with you that there is much to do. I went to Shoreham recently and I like what they have done with the pedestrainisation of East Street. There seemed to be a lot more people about despite the weather. A high quality, well thought out street scape is certainly important.

frida_3 says...
1:30am Sun 15 Jul 12

Get that John Lewis department Store put into Western Road, That will bring in the shoppers. When is Brighton going to get its J.Lewis Dept store and others? many cities already have. It's about time people of this so called 'new city' had high class department stores not just the Lanes for shopping

Kate234 says...
2:28am Sun 15 Jul 12

s_james wrote:
Pedestrianising Preston St is a great idea. HJarrs also talks a lot of sense. Fair play to the Greens for highlighting the issue and trying to get something done - I don't recall previous administrations doing anything except tarting up Norfolk Square a bit
If you pedestrianised Preston Street all the restaurants would lose their takeaway business as at the moment driving up Preston street is the only way to collect food from here. Parking in Regency Square car park is much too expensive and also quite dangerous for women in the evening.

Kate234 says...
2:37am Sun 15 Jul 12

D5 wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Living in Mid Sussex Brighton used to be our default Town for shopping and eating out. Not now, the cost of parking and running the the traffic calming gauntlet has made us look elsewhere.
I cycle in from steyning most days. the bus is £2.20 each way. Not exactly a massive expense is it? A pint is about £4, wish people on here would perhaps consider cycling and walking even. Fat gits. Brighton is great and im sure it isnt the parking that makes it look utterly horrible, id say its the plethora of bl00dy street drinkers sat in doorways all over the city. Is street drinking illegal or is it part of Brightons "ambiance" etc
I seriously considered not giving a job to someone from Steyning. The bus might costs £2.20 but it is quicker commuting to London by train than catching the bus from Steyning to Brighton (and the buses are far less frequent). He is now having to drive but because of the price of parking is having to dump his car miles away and walk into town.

quedula says...
7:49am Sun 15 Jul 12

frida_3 wrote:
Get that John Lewis department Store put into Western Road, That will bring in the shoppers. When is Brighton going to get its J.Lewis Dept store and others? many cities already have. It's about time people of this so called 'new city' had high class department stores not just the Lanes for shopping
. .and how do you do that? I'm sure John Lewis would come to Brighton if they thought it worthwhile.

george smith says...
1:20pm Sun 15 Jul 12

quedula wrote:
frida_3 wrote: Get that John Lewis department Store put into Western Road, That will bring in the shoppers. When is Brighton going to get its J.Lewis Dept store and others? many cities already have. It's about time people of this so called 'new city' had high class department stores not just the Lanes for shopping
. .and how do you do that? I'm sure John Lewis would come to Brighton if they thought it worthwhile.
years ago there was a Libertys. in East street, but that gave up as well

mycroftmill says...
1:21pm Sun 15 Jul 12

Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Living in Mid Sussex Brighton used to be our default Town for shopping and eating out. Not now, the cost of parking and running the the traffic calming gauntlet has made us look elsewhere.
Well that's good news then, if we could only discourage more people like you from staying away then Brighton would be a much better place.
Not a businessman then. Or if you are, not for long.

ghost bus driver says...
5:41pm Sun 15 Jul 12

deanaprior wrote:
Looking at the photo , if they pedestrianised Preston Street and the roads adjacent to Western road it would be lovely.
Like the Laines try closing it off to traffic on Sundays put tables out on the pavements then if this works close it permanently.
The answer isn't more cars, its less.
It worked for George Street in Hove. That is a far more pleasant place to be than Preston Street is.

Reflect on your post says...
7:46pm Sun 15 Jul 12

mycroftmill wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Living in Mid Sussex Brighton used to be our default Town for shopping and eating out. Not now, the cost of parking and running the the traffic calming gauntlet has made us look elsewhere.
Well that's good news then, if we could only discourage more people like you from staying away then Brighton would be a much better place.
Not a businessman then. Or if you are, not for long.
Strange comment. I would like to see common sense prevail and a balance for the people who live in Brighton, the people who live and work in Brighton and everyone else.

guitarmanzz says...
10:20pm Sun 15 Jul 12

GraemeDavis wrote:
Astronomic parking charges and council-created traffic jams are killing Brighton and Hove. We need parking costs at sane levels and an end to anti-motorist policies.

As a professional historical linguist I would like to point out that Laine (in North Laine) is simply a spelling variant of lane (despite the published false etymologies which invent an Anglo-Saxon origin). If a new name for the area helps let's call it West Lanes (like The Lanes).
You are bang on GraemeDavis>Council created traffic jams!! S*itkat and his cronies are destroying the city/town with their insane traffic calming policies! god help us when they reduce grand parade to one lane and the queue goes back to pycombe..oh but the pollution levels will be ok and they wont be fined for it yeh>???? yeh right!! its all nuts now

mycroftmill says...
6:36am Mon 16 Jul 12

Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Living in Mid Sussex Brighton used to be our default Town for shopping and eating out. Not now, the cost of parking and running the the traffic calming gauntlet has made us look elsewhere.
Well that's good news then, if we could only discourage more people like you from staying away then Brighton would be a much better place.
Not a businessman then. Or if you are, not for long.
Strange comment. I would like to see common sense prevail and a balance for the people who live in Brighton, the people who live and work in Brighton and everyone else.
The strange comment here is the response to my original posting :-

“if we could only discourage more people like you from staying away then Brighton would be a much better place”.

Your xenophobic comment is at odds with Brighton’s ethos of inclusiveness and, hopefully, not the view of the majority. If it isn’t petition the Council to change the Welcome to Brighton signs at the City’s boundaries to something you think would discourage more people like me.

Reflect on your post says...
7:58pm Mon 16 Jul 12

mycroftmill wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Living in Mid Sussex Brighton used to be our default Town for shopping and eating out. Not now, the cost of parking and running the the traffic calming gauntlet has made us look elsewhere.
Well that's good news then, if we could only discourage more people like you from staying away then Brighton would be a much better place.
Not a businessman then. Or if you are, not for long.
Strange comment. I would like to see common sense prevail and a balance for the people who live in Brighton, the people who live and work in Brighton and everyone else.
The strange comment here is the response to my original posting :-

“if we could only discourage more people like you from staying away then Brighton would be a much better place”.

Your xenophobic comment is at odds with Brighton’s ethos of inclusiveness and, hopefully, not the view of the majority. If it isn’t petition the Council to change the Welcome to Brighton signs at the City’s boundaries to something you think would discourage more people like me.
My comment is of course far from xenophobic, however as your own comments suggest that a few pounds influences you to such a degree then I am more than happy for you to stay away. Best wishes

mycroftmill says...
8:28am Tue 17 Jul 12

Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Living in Mid Sussex Brighton used to be our default Town for shopping and eating out. Not now, the cost of parking and running the the traffic calming gauntlet has made us look elsewhere.
Well that's good news then, if we could only discourage more people like you from staying away then Brighton would be a much better place.
Not a businessman then. Or if you are, not for long.
Strange comment. I would like to see common sense prevail and a balance for the people who live in Brighton, the people who live and work in Brighton and everyone else.
The strange comment here is the response to my original posting :-

“if we could only discourage more people like you from staying away then Brighton would be a much better place”.

Your xenophobic comment is at odds with Brighton’s ethos of inclusiveness and, hopefully, not the view of the majority. If it isn’t petition the Council to change the Welcome to Brighton signs at the City’s boundaries to something you think would discourage more people like me.
My comment is of course far from xenophobic, however as your own comments suggest that a few pounds influences you to such a degree then I am more than happy for you to stay away. Best wishes
And best wishes to you in the Tyrol.

Roy Pennington says...
9:42am Tue 17 Jul 12

and there used to be a "Dog Kennel Laine" just north of the Royal Pavilion....

Reflect on your post says...
9:58pm Tue 17 Jul 12

mycroftmill wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Reflect on your post wrote:
mycroftmill wrote:
Living in Mid Sussex Brighton used to be our default Town for shopping and eating out. Not now, the cost of parking and running the the traffic calming gauntlet has made us look elsewhere.
Well that's good news then, if we could only discourage more people like you from staying away then Brighton would be a much better place.
Not a businessman then. Or if you are, not for long.
Strange comment. I would like to see common sense prevail and a balance for the people who live in Brighton, the people who live and work in Brighton and everyone else.
The strange comment here is the response to my original posting :-

“if we could only discourage more people like you from staying away then Brighton would be a much better place”.

Your xenophobic comment is at odds with Brighton’s ethos of inclusiveness and, hopefully, not the view of the majority. If it isn’t petition the Council to change the Welcome to Brighton signs at the City’s boundaries to something you think would discourage more people like me.
My comment is of course far from xenophobic, however as your own comments suggest that a few pounds influences you to such a degree then I am more than happy for you to stay away. Best wishes
And best wishes to you in the Tyrol.
Feel free to drop by when you are prepared to make a realistic contribution towards the infrastructure you will be using. In the interim, best wishes for your life in isolation.

Joshiman says...
11:12am Wed 18 Jul 12

So obvious.Parking charges.Doesnt take a genius to work this out.In the old days you could stop outside a burger/kebab/chinese
/indian takeaway for a few minutes and move on.No wonder business's are closing down.Especially restaurants/takeaway
s etc

odear says...
11:22am Thu 19 Jul 12

Forget the buses and the parking it's the people problem in that area.the drinking holes there need tidying up.so much has gone on in there area of late

Reg's Dad says...
12:26pm Thu 19 Jul 12

As a recent mover to the area, I'm fortunate that I can rely on public transport - but as so many have mention the parking charge increase that was put through a few months ago is very short sighted. Brighton may well be snarled up at busy times - but most of this is caused by the permenant log jam of buses going from the Steine to Western Road. But the cost to park a car will become prohibative. This may be the Greens intention - but it will drive out shoppers as well as commerce and Brighton will end up looking like Hastings in the 90s.

Aligned with parking charges, too many buses, is the charge for public transport. a 1.70 fee went to 2.00 GBP - 18% increase - why?
Forcing a new commercial area to develop in the town will only rob income from elsewhere - you need to develop overall prosperity - not for just one small area. If the shops and restuarants don't offer what the comsumer wants , well, they're not going to survive , no matter what incentives are offered.
Lastly, what has been tactfully refered to as "street drinkers". Brighton has a problem - and it looks like a major one. This doesn't just apply to Western Road - but the whole of Brighton. I guess if it's with their human rights to drink all day, then it's within my human rights not to be pestered .... Isn't street drinking illegal?

Bromine Chambers says...
11:45am Fri 20 Jul 12

Absolutely ludicrous comments here complaining about "parking charges" on Preston Street! In reality, people park all day on its western pavement on the double yellow lines, same for Stone Street - "parking enforcement officers" seldom do a thing.

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