Developer accused of deception over Brighton Marina plans (From The Argus)

Too right! The photos are amazingingly misleading and have been Photoshopped. True before and afters show that the proposed development will ruin views of Lewes Crescent. The buildings would totally dominate. The planning committee's decision was right - there should be no building above the height of the cliffs, as was the intention of the Marina Act of Parliament. Let's hope the inspector throws it out.

The Marina is one of the most poorly designed environments in the city. It needs redevelopment. We also need affordable housing and places for people to live. At the moment there is hardly any affordable housing in the city, despite huge demand. So all these rich people with houses and sea views should shut up and stop being so selfish. Who cares if the developers have spruced up the images, anyone writing a proposal should make it look as good as possible if they want it to be approved. I wish these Brighton & Hove nimbies would stop rejecting proposals for developments that would be of huge benefit to the city, just because they are afraid of change!

The Marina is one of the most poorly designed environments in the city. It needs redevelopment. We also need affordable housing and places for people to live. At the moment there is hardly any affordable housing in the city, despite huge demand. So all these rich people with houses and sea views should shut up and stop being so selfish. Who cares if the developers have spruced up the images, anyone writing a proposal should make it look as good as possible if they want it to be approved. I wish these Brighton & Hove nimbies would stop rejecting proposals for developments that would be of huge benefit to the city, just because they are afraid of change!

digitalvigilante wrote:
The Marina is one of the most poorly designed environments in the city. It needs redevelopment. We also need affordable housing and places for people to live. At the moment there is hardly any affordable housing in the city, despite huge demand. So all these rich people with houses and sea views should shut up and stop being so selfish. Who cares if the developers have spruced up the images, anyone writing a proposal should make it look as good as possible if they want it to be approved. I wish these Brighton & Hove nimbies would stop rejecting proposals for developments that would be of huge benefit to the city, just because they are afraid of change!

Yes we do need places for people to live, but the rest of your argument is facile. You say the Marina is 'one of the most poorly designed environments in the city' but you then say we should let developers 'spruce up' their images so they no longer represent what will actually be built. Isn't that how you get 'poorly designed environments'?

High Wire wrote:

digitalvigilante wrote:
The Marina is one of the most poorly designed environments in the city. It needs redevelopment. We also need affordable housing and places for people to live. At the moment there is hardly any affordable housing in the city, despite huge demand. So all these rich people with houses and sea views should shut up and stop being so selfish. Who cares if the developers have spruced up the images, anyone writing a proposal should make it look as good as possible if they want it to be approved. I wish these Brighton & Hove nimbies would stop rejecting proposals for developments that would be of huge benefit to the city, just because they are afraid of change!

Yes we do need places for people to live, but the rest of your argument is facile. You say the Marina is 'one of the most poorly designed environments in the city' but you then say we should let developers 'spruce up' their images so they no longer represent what will actually be built. Isn't that how you get 'poorly designed environments'?

Well I don't think the Marina could actually get any worse! The new development would also increase trade for existing businesses and make the Marina a more appealing place to visit. Of course they are going to make their proposal look good, they would hardly be doing themselves any favours if they made the images unnappealing!

The panorama of the shoreline should be protected. We are stewards of our environment and should not destroy it for future generations. Having buildings taller than the cliffs will be an abomination. The Marina Act should be enforced as intended. It was only an extremely technical detail that allowed the previous Labour administration to allow permission in the first place.

digitalvigilante wrote:

High Wire wrote:

digitalvigilante wrote: The Marina is one of the most poorly designed environments in the city. It needs redevelopment. We also need affordable housing and places for people to live. At the moment there is hardly any affordable housing in the city, despite huge demand. So all these rich people with houses and sea views should shut up and stop being so selfish. Who cares if the developers have spruced up the images, anyone writing a proposal should make it look as good as possible if they want it to be approved. I wish these Brighton & Hove nimbies would stop rejecting proposals for developments that would be of huge benefit to the city, just because they are afraid of change!

Yes we do need places for people to live, but the rest of your argument is facile. You say the Marina is 'one of the most poorly designed environments in the city' but you then say we should let developers 'spruce up' their images so they no longer represent what will actually be built. Isn't that how you get 'poorly designed environments'?

Well I don't think the Marina could actually get any worse! The new development would also increase trade for existing businesses and make the Marina a more appealing place to visit. Of course they are going to make their proposal look good, they would hardly be doing themselves any favours if they made the images unnappealing!

Great argument Digital - 'Who cares what it looks like, it can't be any worse than what's already there'! Except we all have to live with it for the next few decades!!!
What exactly is wrong with demanding more from the developers than just shoehorning a crapulent development into a tiny space to maximise their profit?
And your last sentence is banal - if the pictures have been doctored to try to 'sell' the development then we're being fed a lie. Let me show you a picture of a Ferrari but hand you a Skoda once you've paid your money.
Don't we have enough examples of poor developments in this city?

salty_pete wrote:
The panorama of the shoreline should be protected. We are stewards of our environment and should not destroy it for future generations. Having buildings taller than the cliffs will be an abomination. The Marina Act should be enforced as intended. It was only an extremely technical detail that allowed the previous Labour administration to allow permission in the first place.

This is a city, not a national park. If you want views of natural beauty go and live in the new forest or on the dorset coast. You cant prevent other developments from going ahead just because they are near your patch. The same thing happened to the King Alfred development because of a bunch of moaning old gits, and the rest of us lose out.

High Wire wrote:

digitalvigilante wrote:

High Wire wrote:

digitalvigilante wrote: The Marina is one of the most poorly designed environments in the city. It needs redevelopment. We also need affordable housing and places for people to live. At the moment there is hardly any affordable housing in the city, despite huge demand. So all these rich people with houses and sea views should shut up and stop being so selfish. Who cares if the developers have spruced up the images, anyone writing a proposal should make it look as good as possible if they want it to be approved. I wish these Brighton & Hove nimbies would stop rejecting proposals for developments that would be of huge benefit to the city, just because they are afraid of change!

Yes we do need places for people to live, but the rest of your argument is facile. You say the Marina is 'one of the most poorly designed environments in the city' but you then say we should let developers 'spruce up' their images so they no longer represent what will actually be built. Isn't that how you get 'poorly designed environments'?

Well I don't think the Marina could actually get any worse! The new development would also increase trade for existing businesses and make the Marina a more appealing place to visit. Of course they are going to make their proposal look good, they would hardly be doing themselves any favours if they made the images unnappealing!

Great argument Digital - 'Who cares what it looks like, it can't be any worse than what's already there'! Except we all have to live with it for the next few decades!!!
What exactly is wrong with demanding more from the developers than just shoehorning a crapulent development into a tiny space to maximise their profit?
And your last sentence is banal - if the pictures have been doctored to try to 'sell' the development then we're being fed a lie. Let me show you a picture of a Ferrari but hand you a Skoda once you've paid your money.
Don't we have enough examples of poor developments in this city?

But in reality, would you be happy with any development that obscures your beloved view? I have seen the designs and I think they look fine, any particular complaints you have about them? What would need to happen in order for you to be happy with them? We also have examples of great developments, and as it stands the Marina is certainly not one of them!!! And in response to your 'buying a ferrari' comment, ferrari are hardly going to display a blurry picture of their car covered in mud against an ugly background are they? no, its going to be polished, airbrushed and photoshopped until its perfect. Stop moaning and stunting the city's growth!

I don't know why the South Downs National Park did not include the chalk cliffs as far as Black Rock anyway ? Then there would be no question of highrise blocks obscuring the cliffs.

nothing seems to get done in Brighton, its turned into a stagnant Victorian backwater due to Nimbies, perhaps we ought to knock down all the tower blocks and anything that spoils your precious view, and we all stick to selling candy floss and cockles on the beach for day trippers. Idiots.

security word: rich nimbies

I actually live on the marina, and I am not against a considerate redelevopment, however what has been put forward is just daft! The marina infrastructure can't cope with small events, and the road structure that has been put forward simply won't work.

This whole "nimbies" name calling is immature - should we just pass developmentss through because people feel we should move forward, or should things be carefully thought through and done for the right reasons.
Maybe some of these nimbie name callers should remember the mess that some of the 1960's tower blocks cause in some inner cities and how they have had to be pulled down.

And as for the "rich nimbies" comment -well quite a few people on the marina live in the village square area of the marina, where the flat price is below the national average. So in a nut shell we aren't rich.... but we have worked hard, and have mortgages and care deeply about the area in which we live - so please show some consideration - if you are able. It might be nice!

As much as I am happy with a considered development here I actually feel the problem with the marina isn't the marina - its the people who run it. X-leisure don't care about the people who live on the marina, the marina or brighton - the care purely about making money.
The management of X-leisure have been nothing but rude to the people who live on the marina and show complete disrespect for people here.
They put the rent up to the shops, forcing them to close and thus running dowm the area - but i guess thats what they want, run down the marina, hence forcing a redevelopment.....

sussexone, Btn says...
3:36pm Wed 18 Nov 09

nothing seems to get done in Brighton, its turned into a stagnant Victorian backwater due to Nimbies, perhaps we ought to knock down all the tower blocks and anything that spoils your precious view, and we all stick to selling candy floss and cockles on the beach for day trippers. Idiots.

security word: rich nimbies

===============

i agree with this. the development would be good for starters. but brighton as a whole & particularly these message boards are afflicted by people who are anti pretty much everything. thats why nothing gets done - but it does give them lots to moan about (particularly on here).

I guess I must be a NIMBY then! Except I don't live close to the Marina so maybe your 'insult' doesn't stick. And I do want development so your name-calling is probably misplaced. However I believe that the way a city is built makes a big difference to the quality of people's lives. I'm all for good development (and no-one above has said anything different so I fail to see where the childish NIMBY name-callers are coming from). I also think that demanding honesty from companies makes good sense (remember, that's what the actual story is about). But if all this means that I'm a NIMBY then I'm ok with that.
If Brighton is a 'stagnant Victorian backwater', accepting any old bit of development is not going to improve it. Architectural heritage is not a bad thing - it just depends what you do with it. Glasgow is, architecturally, the most complete Victorian city in Britain. But it's now a modern, vibrant and successful place because it learnt to build on the good bits and get rid of the bad bits.
I have a more positive view of the future of Brighton than Sussexone and Mothy and it requires a LOT of development. However it doesn't mean accepting the first development proposed by a developer (who apparently has to fudge photos to make their plans acceptable). Over-developing, and over-focussing, on one bit of Brighton is not going to make this a great place to live.

Anything that improves the current "down market" feel of the Marina has to be a benefit.

nobody could disagree with you chrisbrighton - they need to demolish Asda and the three leisure sheds and build some nice swanky restaurants there instead with nice colourful poles for patrons to park their gondolas