‘It's time the Greens weren’t quite so white’

In a wide-ranging interview with The Argus, the Brighton Pavilion MP said her party was “very white” and should be focused on becoming more ethnically diverse.

She said if Brexit causes damage to Britain she would never stop campaigning for membership of the EU, even if she secured – and lost – a referendum on the final deal.

And she has concerns environmental policy is “going backwards” under this Government.

The city party called her leadership a “shining light for all” in the age of Donald Trump.

Ms Lucas, 57, will remain an MP and said she could not imagine a more fulfilling job than representing Brighton in Westminster.

She told The Argus: “We have a reputation for being a very white party, and sadly that is still the case, but we want to make bigger inroads in terms of encouraging more people from ethnic minority backgrounds to play their role in the party too.

“We’ve certainly made sure Greens of colour get the funding they need to do the work they’ve set out for themselves.

“I would point to Magid Magid, our new mayor in Sheffield, a Somalian refugee, who has hit the ground running – just Google his name. And there’s Cleo Lake, our mayor in Bristol.

“I’m not saying that’s all because of us, obviously it’s because they’re brilliant people. But investing in Greens of colour ... I think has helped to drive that forward.”

She said the next leader might come from an ethnic minority background but refused to back a potential successor.

Under Green Party rules each leader serves two years before having to seek re-election.

Since 2016 Ms Lucas has led the party jointly with Jonathan Bartley, head of Lambeth Council’s Green group. 

She led the party from 2008 to 2014, and became the Greens’ first and only MP when she pulled off a surprise victory in Brighton Pavilion in 2010.

Last night the city’s Greens called their outgoing leader a “shining light”.

Sue Shanks, chairwoman of Brighton and Hove Green Party, said: “In a post-Brexit, president Trump world, Caroline has been a shining light, not just for Greens, but for all of us who stand for a more just and equitable future.”

THE CAROLINE LUCAS INTERVIEW

Joel Adams: I understand you’ve made a decision about the leadership?

Caroline Lucas: In the Green Party we stand for re-election every two years.

I’ve taken the decision not to put my hat in the ring when nominations open tomorrow.

That’s partly because I feel many of the things I wanted to do, when I was asked to come back to the leadership, are now well in frame.

And also it is an opportunity to ensure more voices can be heard, and we can showcase more of the undoubted talent we have in the party. So that’s why I’m stepping aside.

When did you come to this decision?

It’s been growing over the last few months.

When I was approached to take up the leadership, it had been quite a challenging time for the party.

I don’t think it was any secret that after Corbyn was elected it was challenging, in terms of him moving into the space we’d carved out for ourselves. So in a sense I felt I was coming to help give the party confidence and help steer us through that next period.

But in that time Jonathan Bartley and I have been able to put in place some really important foundations to build on, in terms of making sure the investments are there in our regional staffing so we can build up the party as an election machine.

And I’d argue we’re beginning to see that pay off already with our best-ever local election results this month.

Is it fair to say in terms of achievements, you’ve been focused internally on strengthening the party?

That certainly has been a central part of what we needed to do.

Part of that was updating the structures of the party that haven’t changed much since the 1970s, and I would say part of what we’ve been doing is building more stable foundations.

We’re looking at how our conferences work. At the moment on the one hand you can say our conferences are very democratic because member can show up and vote. But you can also argue if you happen to have carer responsibilities, or can’t afford to get to conference, then that’s not as inclusive as we’d like to be, so we’re exploring more digital ways of making the party more inclusive.

And we want to make the party more diverse.

We have a reputation for being a very white party, and sadly that is still the case, but we want to make bigger inroads in terms of encouraging more people from ethnic minority backgrounds to play their role in the party too.

What have you done in that area and what’s left for your successor

We’ve certainly made sure Greens of colour get the funding they need to do the work they’ve set out for themselves.

So we have a really active group in the party who are advising strategists to reach out to communities of colour.

I would point to Magid Magid, our new mayor in Sheffield, a Somalian refugee, who has hit the ground running - just google his name. And there’s Cleo Lake, our mayor in Bristol.

So we’re seeing some of these changes coming through.

And I’m not saying that’s all because of us, obviously it’s because they’re brilliant people.

But investing in Greens of colour, as an organisation, and trying to give them a greater profile within the party and a greater voice, I think has helped to drive that forward

Is it conceivable someone from an ethnic minority takes your place?

I certainly think that’s conceivable. The Guardian mentioned Cleo in Bristol. I don’t want to pre-empt people who might be thinking of putting their names forward but there are certainly many who could, and I think the party would be incredibly receptive and supportive of that.

Would it be cause for satisfaction if the Greens had the first ethnic minority leader?

I don’t want to comment on that before the elections open, that would be interpreted in some parts of the party as support for one candidate above another - which I’m not doing.

But certainly I’d say we want the party to be as inclusive and diverse as possible, we want the party to look like the country we’re hoping to represent, and therefore we want as many people from as many different backgrounds to go the whole way.

What will be your focus now?

I have very strong feelings about Brexit and the more I see in terms of the absolute dog’s breakfast that the government is making of it, the more worried I get.

Here in Brighton I speak to business leaders who are desperately worried about staff.

For example our tourism industry is vital to our economy and absolutely depends on people from other countries being able to come here and work without worry, without doubts about their welcome or status.

So the tourism industry is worried, the universities are worried, some of the big organisations like Amex are worried - and that’s before we even get to the risk of staff shortages in the NHS.

What do you think your chances are of achieving a second referendum?

To be honest right now I think it’s fifty/fifty, I really do.

I would challenge you on the language. It’s not a second referendum re-running the first.

It’s a People’s Vote - which is a phrase that’s been credited to me so I’m very proud of that - on the final deal.

If you lost People’s Vote 52/48 on the final terms of the deal, would you quietly go along with the result?

I think if that were to happen, it would be very difficult to move straight to trying to challenge that result.

But I’m not saying that in ten years’ time or more, if our worst fears come to light, we wouldn’t then continue to campaign.  Democracy is never one instant, it evolves.

I can certainly say, the level of the campaign we’re seeing now for the People’s Vote, I’m not imagining that were we to lose that it would suddenly translate into another campaign, that’s not credible.

But I do think that once the realities of Brexit set in - if they are anywhere near as serious as we fear - then certainly I think it would be our responsibility to keep campaigning about it.

How will you be more effective when you’re no longer leader of a national party?

It’s partly about time. Being the leader of a party carries with it a lot of responsibilities that are internal as well as external.

I think by handing over the leadership, hopefully I’ll still have some profile by virtue of being the only Green MP in Parliament, but I’ll also have more time I think for Brexit campaigning, on climate campaigning, and also being present in Brighton.

Is it not an impossible task, as Natalie Bennett found in some ways, to lead a party when you are not its one and only MP?

I would challenge that that was a problem for Natalie actually, she built up a really strong profile for herself, she was in the media an awful lot.

In fact you could argue - and it’s one of the reasons for doing co-leadership for the last couple of years - that if I’m getting media coverage anyway by virtue of being an MP, we want to share that more widely.

You’ve talked about stepping down with your aims underway. But obviously you’re upset about fracking, private road use is up, the price of public transport continues to rise. You can point to electoral success but are you concerned that policy is going backwards on the environment?

I am concerned that in many areas policy is going backwards, and at the risk of talking about Brexit too much I think Brexit will have a very negative impact of environmental issues.

We know in so many instances its been the EU pushing us forward - on plastics for instance - not motivation from our government

And fracking makes a mockery of any aspiration by this government to be a truly green government.

They are going ahead with fracking, they are allowing open cast coal mines to go ahead - this is why we need more Greens being elected.

You’ve been 1 of 650 MPs, but are you not frustrated by the lack of progress you’ve been able to make on policy, given there is a broad demographic and international move to being more environmentally aware?

I am frustrated that progress hasn’t been faster and more effective towards a greener future.

As a single MP sadly I can’t make laws on my own but what I can do is put issues on the agenda that otherwise wouldn’t be there.

And I’d argue my presence in Westminster has kept the focus on fracking, and has pushed Labour now to adopt the same policy.

When I was first there their policy was not anti fracking and now it is.

And on issues like nuclear power, I would love to see more parties at Westminster recognise that nuclear power is a major diversion from our true energy needs, it won’t make the difference we’re told it will in shifting us to a low carbon future, and yet we’re seeing the government proceeding with Hinkley for instance.

MP WILL REMAIN MP

Caroline Lucas was keen to reassure Argus readers that while she is stepping down from the national leadership role, she will remain an MP for the city.

She said: “I would like to stress that I have absolutely no plans to be stepping down from my Westminster seat.

“I can’t imagine a job more fulfilling and more of a privilege than being MP for Brighton Pavilion.

“I absolutely love it and I want to continue.”

The country’s only Green Party MP, Ms Lucas was first elected to the seat in 2005.

That year she saw off Labour candidate Nancy Platts, who this year became a city councillor for the first time.

The Green majority of 1,200 votes grew five years later to nearly 8,000, and at last year’s snap election there was a further five per cent swing to Ms Lucas, who now sits on a majority of nearly 15,000.

She lives near London Road in Brighton.