The ArgusPoyet rues dropped points (From The Argus)

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Poyet rues dropped points

The Argus: Gus Poyet would not blame his keeper Gus Poyet would not blame his keeper

Gus Poyet refused to blame goalkeeper Tomasz Kuszczak after the goalkeeper’s error meant Albion had to settle for a 2-2 draw at Birmingham.

The Pole fumbled Nikola Zigic’s header over the line in the second minute of stoppage time to deny Albion a victory they deserved.

However, not for the first time this season, they were left cursing not being able to see out victory.

Poyet said: “It has happened to us too many times. Sometimes you have to give credit to the opposition, sometimes it is because of your own mistakes. I am used to it, so I am no more or less disappointed than normal.

“I didn't say anything to Tomasz. We accept mistakes. Everybody makes mistakes in football. It's about not making any more, nothing else.

“We didn't start well. We were not in the mentality of making a difference, just waiting for things to happen. The best thing that happened to us was the goal.

“As soon as we conceded we started playing more aggressive and trying to go forward. After that I thought it was a matter of time for us to score two or three or whatever.

“In the second half it was about trying to score another one. We didn't and as soon as Zigic and Marlon King went on you knew there would be 150,000 balls in the box.

“I think Tomasz only had to make one save, so I didn't see it (equaliser) coming at all.”

Comments (50)

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6:03pm Sat 19 Jan 13

hove park seagull says...

We should be at the very least ten points better off!!!
We should be at the very least ten points better off!!! hove park seagull
  • Score: 0

6:24pm Sat 19 Jan 13

Godstone Gull says...

Blackburn could get the backlash from this. I can see us putting 5 past them.
Blackburn could get the backlash from this. I can see us putting 5 past them. Godstone Gull
  • Score: 0

6:40pm Sat 19 Jan 13

HOVEPARKRESIDENT says...

TYPICAL BRIGHTON!
All these wasted points will cost Brighton big time come the end of the season. Could be the difference between Championship and League One football next season.
TYPICAL BRIGHTON! All these wasted points will cost Brighton big time come the end of the season. Could be the difference between Championship and League One football next season. HOVEPARKRESIDENT
  • Score: 0

6:46pm Sat 19 Jan 13

gusset snatcher says...

Pathetic, same old story yet again........ they're mean't to be professional footballers bought from overseas far and wide...... not village idiots virtually kicking the ball in their own net...... heads would roll if I had my way... IGWAM
Pathetic, same old story yet again........ they're mean't to be professional footballers bought from overseas far and wide...... not village idiots virtually kicking the ball in their own net...... heads would roll if I had my way... IGWAM gusset snatcher
  • Score: 0

6:49pm Sat 19 Jan 13

HOVEPARKRESIDENT says...

gusset snatcher wrote:
Pathetic, same old story yet again........ they're mean't to be professional footballers bought from overseas far and wide...... not village idiots virtually kicking the ball in their own net...... heads would roll if I had my way... IGWAM
Ouch!! Your gonna be in trouble for speaking the truth on this site!!
[quote][p][bold]gusset snatcher[/bold] wrote: Pathetic, same old story yet again........ they're mean't to be professional footballers bought from overseas far and wide...... not village idiots virtually kicking the ball in their own net...... heads would roll if I had my way... IGWAM[/p][/quote]Ouch!! Your gonna be in trouble for speaking the truth on this site!! HOVEPARKRESIDENT
  • Score: 0

6:59pm Sat 19 Jan 13

Godstone Gull says...

First dropped points this year and the trolls are back. had a tough time didn't you boys.
First dropped points this year and the trolls are back. had a tough time didn't you boys. Godstone Gull
  • Score: 0

7:18pm Sat 19 Jan 13

WestStander17 says...

Disappointing to let 2 more points out our grasp but, again, cast our minds back a few years, would we be pulling our hair out at a 2-2 away to Birmingham? If that's our main problem right now in the Championship, it shows just how far we have come. With Gus in charge, we will continue to improve. Onwards and gradually, smoothly upwards!
Disappointing to let 2 more points out our grasp but, again, cast our minds back a few years, would we be pulling our hair out at a 2-2 away to Birmingham? If that's our main problem right now in the Championship, it shows just how far we have come. With Gus in charge, we will continue to improve. Onwards and gradually, smoothly upwards! WestStander17
  • Score: 0

7:30pm Sat 19 Jan 13

VegasSeagull says...

I am not sure how I feel about this result.
Our shot stopper made an error and that error cost us two points. The same shot stopper has done as much as anyone, and more than some, to get us to where we are.

We went one down and came back to take the lead so that is good, and the three points looked like ours but two slipped away.

When a keeper makes an error it often leads to a goal, the rest of the players can make errors and not usually give up a goal.

I feel down because we didn't get three points but on this occasion, I don't think I want to blame the keeper, even if it was his fumble. He is still the best keeper in the division and as good as many in the prem.
I am not sure how I feel about this result. Our shot stopper made an error and that error cost us two points. The same shot stopper has done as much as anyone, and more than some, to get us to where we are. We went one down and came back to take the lead so that is good, and the three points looked like ours but two slipped away. When a keeper makes an error it often leads to a goal, the rest of the players can make errors and not usually give up a goal. I feel down because we didn't get three points but on this occasion, I don't think I want to blame the keeper, even if it was his fumble. He is still the best keeper in the division and as good as many in the prem. VegasSeagull
  • Score: 0

7:35pm Sat 19 Jan 13

pablobrowno says...

Indeed it is more about the reaction a keeper makes to a costly mistake like that one than the mistake itself. Tom will come good I'm sure!!
Indeed it is more about the reaction a keeper makes to a costly mistake like that one than the mistake itself. Tom will come good I'm sure!! pablobrowno
  • Score: 0

7:37pm Sat 19 Jan 13

KeefyH44 says...

Double digit GD and 2nd meanest defence in the league and only 6 gamemes lost. Only two other teams compare. If we'd not drawn so many we WOULD be 10 points better off and we'd be in automatic promotion or at least 3rd in the table but we're improving slowly. If Ulloa lives up to his billing we could still do a 'Reading'!
Double digit GD and 2nd meanest defence in the league and only 6 gamemes lost. Only two other teams compare. If we'd not drawn so many we WOULD be 10 points better off and we'd be in automatic promotion or at least 3rd in the table but we're improving slowly. If Ulloa lives up to his billing we could still do a 'Reading'! KeefyH44
  • Score: 0

7:54pm Sat 19 Jan 13

rolivan says...

gusset snatcher wrote:
Pathetic, same old story yet again........ they're mean't to be professional footballers bought from overseas far and wide...... not village idiots virtually kicking the ball in their own net...... heads would roll if I had my way... IGWAM
I think the last time I looked Greer is a Scot qnd El Abd is a local they qre not quite up to the Standard required. Tomas cqnnot be expected to stop everything
[quote][p][bold]gusset snatcher[/bold] wrote: Pathetic, same old story yet again........ they're mean't to be professional footballers bought from overseas far and wide...... not village idiots virtually kicking the ball in their own net...... heads would roll if I had my way... IGWAM[/p][/quote]I think the last time I looked Greer is a Scot qnd El Abd is a local they qre not quite up to the Standard required. Tomas cqnnot be expected to stop everything rolivan
  • Score: 0

8:16pm Sat 19 Jan 13

Alfie T says...

VegasSeagull wrote:
I am not sure how I feel about this result.
Our shot stopper made an error and that error cost us two points. The same shot stopper has done as much as anyone, and more than some, to get us to where we are.

We went one down and came back to take the lead so that is good, and the three points looked like ours but two slipped away.

When a keeper makes an error it often leads to a goal, the rest of the players can make errors and not usually give up a goal.

I feel down because we didn't get three points but on this occasion, I don't think I want to blame the keeper, even if it was his fumble. He is still the best keeper in the division and as good as many in the prem.
I'm over the disappointment now, no criticism of TK, no one will be feeling worse than him tonight. We are still in a great position with a game in hand. Bring on the gooners, would love to cause another cup shock.
[quote][p][bold]VegasSeagull[/bold] wrote: I am not sure how I feel about this result. Our shot stopper made an error and that error cost us two points. The same shot stopper has done as much as anyone, and more than some, to get us to where we are. We went one down and came back to take the lead so that is good, and the three points looked like ours but two slipped away. When a keeper makes an error it often leads to a goal, the rest of the players can make errors and not usually give up a goal. I feel down because we didn't get three points but on this occasion, I don't think I want to blame the keeper, even if it was his fumble. He is still the best keeper in the division and as good as many in the prem.[/p][/quote]I'm over the disappointment now, no criticism of TK, no one will be feeling worse than him tonight. We are still in a great position with a game in hand. Bring on the gooners, would love to cause another cup shock. Alfie T
  • Score: 0

8:27pm Sat 19 Jan 13

The Phantom says...

Have seen the goals on telly now - Barnes' goal was terrific and Lopez struck his volley well (great cross from Bridge). Really odd error by TK - not even sure how it happened having watch it two or three times. As Gus says it is how he reacts next time out. Poor marking on the first goal but not sure who was meant to be picking up Caldwell. Shame about the wonder save from Hammond at the end. Felt today was the easier of the two away games as surely Blackburn have it in them at some point to play well. I guess we shall see on Tuesday P.S. - no Andrew Crofts in the squad today - injured or not selected?
Have seen the goals on telly now - Barnes' goal was terrific and Lopez struck his volley well (great cross from Bridge). Really odd error by TK - not even sure how it happened having watch it two or three times. As Gus says it is how he reacts next time out. Poor marking on the first goal but not sure who was meant to be picking up Caldwell. Shame about the wonder save from Hammond at the end. Felt today was the easier of the two away games as surely Blackburn have it in them at some point to play well. I guess we shall see on Tuesday P.S. - no Andrew Crofts in the squad today - injured or not selected? The Phantom
  • Score: 0

8:37pm Sat 19 Jan 13

ballantrrae says...

rolivan wrote:
gusset snatcher wrote:
Pathetic, same old story yet again........ they're mean't to be professional footballers bought from overseas far and wide...... not village idiots virtually kicking the ball in their own net...... heads would roll if I had my way... IGWAM
I think the last time I looked Greer is a Scot qnd El Abd is a local they qre not quite up to the Standard required. Tomas cqnnot be expected to stop everything
Good point Rolivan that Kuszczak can't do everything.
Our CBs don't help Kuszczak by being dominant in the air in our own penalty box which puts more pressure on Tomaz.
Kuszczak has been outstanding this season and his error today is the first I can remember. One should not forget his brilliant save earlier in the match without which we might have come away with nothing.
Clark has an enviable record against us (none of his sides have lost against us) and we are now in the happy position of not playing against his team again this season.
The lack of a CB who is strong in the air might be the reason that Poyet bid for the young Dutch defender and wants to signa CB.
The other comment worth considering is our lack of a midfielder with physical presence to win the ball and ensure we don't start defending too deep at the end of matches which is what we seem to be doing. By sitting back we put more pressure on our defence.
Let's hope Ulloa's clearance comes through in time for Tuesday and that Poyet is able to bring in the extra players he wants over the next 12 days. UTA.
[quote][p][bold]rolivan[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]gusset snatcher[/bold] wrote: Pathetic, same old story yet again........ they're mean't to be professional footballers bought from overseas far and wide...... not village idiots virtually kicking the ball in their own net...... heads would roll if I had my way... IGWAM[/p][/quote]I think the last time I looked Greer is a Scot qnd El Abd is a local they qre not quite up to the Standard required. Tomas cqnnot be expected to stop everything[/p][/quote]Good point Rolivan that Kuszczak can't do everything. Our CBs don't help Kuszczak by being dominant in the air in our own penalty box which puts more pressure on Tomaz. Kuszczak has been outstanding this season and his error today is the first I can remember. One should not forget his brilliant save earlier in the match without which we might have come away with nothing. Clark has an enviable record against us (none of his sides have lost against us) and we are now in the happy position of not playing against his team again this season. The lack of a CB who is strong in the air might be the reason that Poyet bid for the young Dutch defender and wants to signa CB. The other comment worth considering is our lack of a midfielder with physical presence to win the ball and ensure we don't start defending too deep at the end of matches which is what we seem to be doing. By sitting back we put more pressure on our defence. Let's hope Ulloa's clearance comes through in time for Tuesday and that Poyet is able to bring in the extra players he wants over the next 12 days. UTA. ballantrrae
  • Score: 0

8:39pm Sat 19 Jan 13

hannover seagull says...

As I was walking on the Knoll
I stumbled on a little Troll
Lager cans were evident
His name was Hove park Resident

Get back in your box

UTA.................
.
As I was walking on the Knoll I stumbled on a little Troll Lager cans were evident His name was Hove park Resident Get back in your box UTA................. . hannover seagull
  • Score: 0

8:48pm Sat 19 Jan 13

Gazza by the sea says...

A pretty fair summary by Gus. Unfortunate error but keepers make mistakes occasionally. Truth is the game should have been safe by then. We do have the core of a very good footballing team but there are still a few who, when put under pressure, are simply not clever enough to play Gus's cool passing game. And the need for the centre forward with presence is stark.

Great to see Vicente again - and the magic is certainly still there.

And a great first half from Barnes - and how the keeper reacted to the Dicker header at the end is beyond me. So nearly pulled it out of the bag at the death.

No idea what Gus sees in the Southampton loanee - anonymous and pedestrian throughout.

Gus Poyet's Spanish (speaking) army!
A pretty fair summary by Gus. Unfortunate error but keepers make mistakes occasionally. Truth is the game should have been safe by then. We do have the core of a very good footballing team but there are still a few who, when put under pressure, are simply not clever enough to play Gus's cool passing game. And the need for the centre forward with presence is stark. Great to see Vicente again - and the magic is certainly still there. And a great first half from Barnes - and how the keeper reacted to the Dicker header at the end is beyond me. So nearly pulled it out of the bag at the death. No idea what Gus sees in the Southampton loanee - anonymous and pedestrian throughout. Gus Poyet's Spanish (speaking) army! Gazza by the sea
  • Score: 0

8:58pm Sat 19 Jan 13

Vince says...

In the last 5 minutes of matches, we couldn't defend Colditz. For some reason we defend far too deep, constantly give the ball straight back to the opposition, ball watch/fail to pick up players, and forget our possession football, which perhaps is why Gus is keen to get some more defenders in.

I agree with other posters that we should continue our attacking play and possession in the last 10 minutes, rather than just throw more defender/midfield subs in there in our increasingly futile attempts to hang onto a slender lead.

It has already been shown in the past that Will Hoskins is better than anyone else at keeping possession. I remember the game against Newcastle last year, when Hoskins brilliantly kept possession in the last 5 minutes. He was doing the same against Bolton when Hammond stupidly gave the ball away, and allowed them to break away and score at the death.

What has Hoskins done wrong in recent matches to not merit even 10 minutes on the field???

Gus's fault in my opinion for being too cautious, and making the wrong substitutions when we are ahead. Gus is far too cautious. Fortune favours the brave. Attack is the best form of defence.
In the last 5 minutes of matches, we couldn't defend Colditz. For some reason we defend far too deep, constantly give the ball straight back to the opposition, ball watch/fail to pick up players, and forget our possession football, which perhaps is why Gus is keen to get some more defenders in. I agree with other posters that we should continue our attacking play and possession in the last 10 minutes, rather than just throw more defender/midfield subs in there in our increasingly futile attempts to hang onto a slender lead. It has already been shown in the past that Will Hoskins is better than anyone else at keeping possession. I remember the game against Newcastle last year, when Hoskins brilliantly kept possession in the last 5 minutes. He was doing the same against Bolton when Hammond stupidly gave the ball away, and allowed them to break away and score at the death. What has Hoskins done wrong in recent matches to not merit even 10 minutes on the field??? Gus's fault in my opinion for being too cautious, and making the wrong substitutions when we are ahead. Gus is far too cautious. Fortune favours the brave. Attack is the best form of defence. Vince
  • Score: 0

9:03pm Sat 19 Jan 13

Vince says...

Also, for Gus to say he didn't see the equaliser coming at all. What about Greer's amazing intercepion with 5 minutes to go.

The point is we should be playing the same, controlled football in the last 10 minutes that we have for the first 80.

If the other team throws caution to the wind and more men forward, they will leave huge gaps at the back, so we should have the players on the field like Hoskins, Buckley and Lua Lua to take advantage and keep play up the other end.
Also, for Gus to say he didn't see the equaliser coming at all. What about Greer's amazing intercepion with 5 minutes to go. The point is we should be playing the same, controlled football in the last 10 minutes that we have for the first 80. If the other team throws caution to the wind and more men forward, they will leave huge gaps at the back, so we should have the players on the field like Hoskins, Buckley and Lua Lua to take advantage and keep play up the other end. Vince
  • Score: 0

10:35pm Sat 19 Jan 13

The Phantom says...

Vince wrote:
In the last 5 minutes of matches, we couldn't defend Colditz. For some reason we defend far too deep, constantly give the ball straight back to the opposition, ball watch/fail to pick up players, and forget our possession football, which perhaps is why Gus is keen to get some more defenders in.

I agree with other posters that we should continue our attacking play and possession in the last 10 minutes, rather than just throw more defender/midfield subs in there in our increasingly futile attempts to hang onto a slender lead.

It has already been shown in the past that Will Hoskins is better than anyone else at keeping possession. I remember the game against Newcastle last year, when Hoskins brilliantly kept possession in the last 5 minutes. He was doing the same against Bolton when Hammond stupidly gave the ball away, and allowed them to break away and score at the death.

What has Hoskins done wrong in recent matches to not merit even 10 minutes on the field???

Gus's fault in my opinion for being too cautious, and making the wrong substitutions when we are ahead. Gus is far too cautious. Fortune favours the brave. Attack is the best form of defence.
Not sure that bringing on Buckley and Vicente can be considered negative changes. Wasn't at the game so difficult to comment but had it not been for a very rare but very poor error from Kuszczak in stoppage time, we would have won the game and everyone would have been happy. We are not the strongest team in the air but then neither are Barcelona who we are in effect an inferior model of. Zigic would win balls in the air against anyone, it is how you defend and react to those headers. Everything was fine with his header at the end - no real power and directed straight at Kuszczak. Just a shame he fumble it in.
[quote][p][bold]Vince[/bold] wrote: In the last 5 minutes of matches, we couldn't defend Colditz. For some reason we defend far too deep, constantly give the ball straight back to the opposition, ball watch/fail to pick up players, and forget our possession football, which perhaps is why Gus is keen to get some more defenders in. I agree with other posters that we should continue our attacking play and possession in the last 10 minutes, rather than just throw more defender/midfield subs in there in our increasingly futile attempts to hang onto a slender lead. It has already been shown in the past that Will Hoskins is better than anyone else at keeping possession. I remember the game against Newcastle last year, when Hoskins brilliantly kept possession in the last 5 minutes. He was doing the same against Bolton when Hammond stupidly gave the ball away, and allowed them to break away and score at the death. What has Hoskins done wrong in recent matches to not merit even 10 minutes on the field??? Gus's fault in my opinion for being too cautious, and making the wrong substitutions when we are ahead. Gus is far too cautious. Fortune favours the brave. Attack is the best form of defence.[/p][/quote]Not sure that bringing on Buckley and Vicente can be considered negative changes. Wasn't at the game so difficult to comment but had it not been for a very rare but very poor error from Kuszczak in stoppage time, we would have won the game and everyone would have been happy. We are not the strongest team in the air but then neither are Barcelona who we are in effect an inferior model of. Zigic would win balls in the air against anyone, it is how you defend and react to those headers. Everything was fine with his header at the end - no real power and directed straight at Kuszczak. Just a shame he fumble it in. The Phantom
  • Score: 0

10:53pm Sat 19 Jan 13

Vince says...

The Phantom wrote:
Vince wrote: In the last 5 minutes of matches, we couldn't defend Colditz. For some reason we defend far too deep, constantly give the ball straight back to the opposition, ball watch/fail to pick up players, and forget our possession football, which perhaps is why Gus is keen to get some more defenders in. I agree with other posters that we should continue our attacking play and possession in the last 10 minutes, rather than just throw more defender/midfield subs in there in our increasingly futile attempts to hang onto a slender lead. It has already been shown in the past that Will Hoskins is better than anyone else at keeping possession. I remember the game against Newcastle last year, when Hoskins brilliantly kept possession in the last 5 minutes. He was doing the same against Bolton when Hammond stupidly gave the ball away, and allowed them to break away and score at the death. What has Hoskins done wrong in recent matches to not merit even 10 minutes on the field??? Gus's fault in my opinion for being too cautious, and making the wrong substitutions when we are ahead. Gus is far too cautious. Fortune favours the brave. Attack is the best form of defence.
Not sure that bringing on Buckley and Vicente can be considered negative changes. Wasn't at the game so difficult to comment but had it not been for a very rare but very poor error from Kuszczak in stoppage time, we would have won the game and everyone would have been happy. We are not the strongest team in the air but then neither are Barcelona who we are in effect an inferior model of. Zigic would win balls in the air against anyone, it is how you defend and react to those headers. Everything was fine with his header at the end - no real power and directed straight at Kuszczak. Just a shame he fumble it in.
OK - but Hoskins holds the ball up so well, has great close control - I would have had him on - not Buckley, who was giving the ball away quite a lot. I can't understand why he was left on the bench.
Vicente was good in the time he came on - but we should push up more - not defend deep every time. I've seen it at the AMEX - against Derby when the same result could easily have happened.
[quote][p][bold]The Phantom[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Vince[/bold] wrote: In the last 5 minutes of matches, we couldn't defend Colditz. For some reason we defend far too deep, constantly give the ball straight back to the opposition, ball watch/fail to pick up players, and forget our possession football, which perhaps is why Gus is keen to get some more defenders in. I agree with other posters that we should continue our attacking play and possession in the last 10 minutes, rather than just throw more defender/midfield subs in there in our increasingly futile attempts to hang onto a slender lead. It has already been shown in the past that Will Hoskins is better than anyone else at keeping possession. I remember the game against Newcastle last year, when Hoskins brilliantly kept possession in the last 5 minutes. He was doing the same against Bolton when Hammond stupidly gave the ball away, and allowed them to break away and score at the death. What has Hoskins done wrong in recent matches to not merit even 10 minutes on the field??? Gus's fault in my opinion for being too cautious, and making the wrong substitutions when we are ahead. Gus is far too cautious. Fortune favours the brave. Attack is the best form of defence.[/p][/quote]Not sure that bringing on Buckley and Vicente can be considered negative changes. Wasn't at the game so difficult to comment but had it not been for a very rare but very poor error from Kuszczak in stoppage time, we would have won the game and everyone would have been happy. We are not the strongest team in the air but then neither are Barcelona who we are in effect an inferior model of. Zigic would win balls in the air against anyone, it is how you defend and react to those headers. Everything was fine with his header at the end - no real power and directed straight at Kuszczak. Just a shame he fumble it in.[/p][/quote]OK - but Hoskins holds the ball up so well, has great close control - I would have had him on - not Buckley, who was giving the ball away quite a lot. I can't understand why he was left on the bench. Vicente was good in the time he came on - but we should push up more - not defend deep every time. I've seen it at the AMEX - against Derby when the same result could easily have happened. Vince
  • Score: 0

11:17pm Sat 19 Jan 13

The Phantom says...

Vince wrote:
The Phantom wrote:
Vince wrote: In the last 5 minutes of matches, we couldn't defend Colditz. For some reason we defend far too deep, constantly give the ball straight back to the opposition, ball watch/fail to pick up players, and forget our possession football, which perhaps is why Gus is keen to get some more defenders in. I agree with other posters that we should continue our attacking play and possession in the last 10 minutes, rather than just throw more defender/midfield subs in there in our increasingly futile attempts to hang onto a slender lead. It has already been shown in the past that Will Hoskins is better than anyone else at keeping possession. I remember the game against Newcastle last year, when Hoskins brilliantly kept possession in the last 5 minutes. He was doing the same against Bolton when Hammond stupidly gave the ball away, and allowed them to break away and score at the death. What has Hoskins done wrong in recent matches to not merit even 10 minutes on the field??? Gus's fault in my opinion for being too cautious, and making the wrong substitutions when we are ahead. Gus is far too cautious. Fortune favours the brave. Attack is the best form of defence.
Not sure that bringing on Buckley and Vicente can be considered negative changes. Wasn't at the game so difficult to comment but had it not been for a very rare but very poor error from Kuszczak in stoppage time, we would have won the game and everyone would have been happy. We are not the strongest team in the air but then neither are Barcelona who we are in effect an inferior model of. Zigic would win balls in the air against anyone, it is how you defend and react to those headers. Everything was fine with his header at the end - no real power and directed straight at Kuszczak. Just a shame he fumble it in.
OK - but Hoskins holds the ball up so well, has great close control - I would have had him on - not Buckley, who was giving the ball away quite a lot. I can't understand why he was left on the bench.
Vicente was good in the time he came on - but we should push up more - not defend deep every time. I've seen it at the AMEX - against Derby when the same result could easily have happened.
Rather strange that since his goal against Newcastle, Hoskins seems to have fallen down the pecking order a little (even before Ulloa was signed). Not been impressed by CMS recently anyway, so would have him starting ahead of him. For all CMS's hard running he has been having precious few meaningful touches. With Barnes starting ahead of Hoskins against Derby and Gus praising his performance today, I am not sure that Hoskins has any great future at the club. Hope he stays and gets a chance but have my doubts that will happen. Agree we do sit too deep when defending with a lead - may be something to do with the lack of pace in the centre back positions.
[quote][p][bold]Vince[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]The Phantom[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Vince[/bold] wrote: In the last 5 minutes of matches, we couldn't defend Colditz. For some reason we defend far too deep, constantly give the ball straight back to the opposition, ball watch/fail to pick up players, and forget our possession football, which perhaps is why Gus is keen to get some more defenders in. I agree with other posters that we should continue our attacking play and possession in the last 10 minutes, rather than just throw more defender/midfield subs in there in our increasingly futile attempts to hang onto a slender lead. It has already been shown in the past that Will Hoskins is better than anyone else at keeping possession. I remember the game against Newcastle last year, when Hoskins brilliantly kept possession in the last 5 minutes. He was doing the same against Bolton when Hammond stupidly gave the ball away, and allowed them to break away and score at the death. What has Hoskins done wrong in recent matches to not merit even 10 minutes on the field??? Gus's fault in my opinion for being too cautious, and making the wrong substitutions when we are ahead. Gus is far too cautious. Fortune favours the brave. Attack is the best form of defence.[/p][/quote]Not sure that bringing on Buckley and Vicente can be considered negative changes. Wasn't at the game so difficult to comment but had it not been for a very rare but very poor error from Kuszczak in stoppage time, we would have won the game and everyone would have been happy. We are not the strongest team in the air but then neither are Barcelona who we are in effect an inferior model of. Zigic would win balls in the air against anyone, it is how you defend and react to those headers. Everything was fine with his header at the end - no real power and directed straight at Kuszczak. Just a shame he fumble it in.[/p][/quote]OK - but Hoskins holds the ball up so well, has great close control - I would have had him on - not Buckley, who was giving the ball away quite a lot. I can't understand why he was left on the bench. Vicente was good in the time he came on - but we should push up more - not defend deep every time. I've seen it at the AMEX - against Derby when the same result could easily have happened.[/p][/quote]Rather strange that since his goal against Newcastle, Hoskins seems to have fallen down the pecking order a little (even before Ulloa was signed). Not been impressed by CMS recently anyway, so would have him starting ahead of him. For all CMS's hard running he has been having precious few meaningful touches. With Barnes starting ahead of Hoskins against Derby and Gus praising his performance today, I am not sure that Hoskins has any great future at the club. Hope he stays and gets a chance but have my doubts that will happen. Agree we do sit too deep when defending with a lead - may be something to do with the lack of pace in the centre back positions. The Phantom
  • Score: 0

7:24am Sun 20 Jan 13

MHubbs says...

Listened to second half on radio, so like us all, disappointed with the final result.
Even on the radio you could feel the swell of pressure as Brighton dug into the penalty area for the final stand.
After games like the Bolton match, you would think they had learnt their lesson. Having said that, I have seen Liverpool, Chelsea, Man City, Arsenal and even Man Utd do the same on crucial games against opposition who throw everything at them for the last 10 minutes, so we can only expect so much from the boys.
TK has more than earned a mistake, his saved already earning us some pints up to know. Mistakes happen now and then, that's footy.

My concern is well stated above. Hoskins absence? Why? I think it's a real shame that just after his confidence booster against the Toon, that he has sat out two games. We often hear that Gus likes the boys to fight for and win their chances, but it must be pretty gauling for WH to have done this and to then get the chop. It's not like Macca doesn't give his best, but he is hardly prolific!
Of they can put the Blackburnatcj to bed then they are right back on it for sure, but a dray away at Ewood might just leave us a little too much to do?

The only this in our favour being the continued inconsistencies of the teams above and around us which continues to Thrace the door to the playoffs ajar😕
Listened to second half on radio, so like us all, disappointed with the final result. Even on the radio you could feel the swell of pressure as Brighton dug into the penalty area for the final stand. After games like the Bolton match, you would think they had learnt their lesson. Having said that, I have seen Liverpool, Chelsea, Man City, Arsenal and even Man Utd do the same on crucial games against opposition who throw everything at them for the last 10 minutes, so we can only expect so much from the boys. TK has more than earned a mistake, his saved already earning us some pints up to know. Mistakes happen now and then, that's footy. My concern is well stated above. Hoskins absence? Why? I think it's a real shame that just after his confidence booster against the Toon, that he has sat out two games. We often hear that Gus likes the boys to fight for and win their chances, but it must be pretty gauling for WH to have done this and to then get the chop. It's not like Macca doesn't give his best, but he is hardly prolific! Of they can put the Blackburnatcj to bed then they are right back on it for sure, but a dray away at Ewood might just leave us a little too much to do? The only this in our favour being the continued inconsistencies of the teams above and around us which continues to Thrace the door to the playoffs ajar😕 MHubbs
  • Score: 0

7:29am Sun 20 Jan 13

LAWgull says...

With the exception of Cardiff every team in this division is struggling for wins notice how many drawn games every week. Also noted Noone was unused sub yesterday first time since his move ???
With the exception of Cardiff every team in this division is struggling for wins notice how many drawn games every week. Also noted Noone was unused sub yesterday first time since his move ??? LAWgull
  • Score: 0

8:26am Sun 20 Jan 13

jcd1972 says...

yes agree with Vince's posts. This conceding late goals due to an emphasis on defending a lead when we've been the better side until the last 15/20 minutes is becoming a chronic problem. The goalkeeper error is a bit of a red herring. It's currently costing us a play off place. Other sides have to attack more to get back in the match so we ought to be able to hit them on the break - Hoskins is surely the best option for this as was the case vs Newcastle. Instead we take off our recognised striker who at least defends from the front and have Barnes as a striker who does not have the pace to exploit these sort of situations. We need to continue to have a positive approach in the last quarter of an hour rather than choking on a lead. It seems as though other teams are invited to attack us and it's 'the alamo' mentality. I feel it's the manager's job to address this.

I don't mean to be too critical but I don't think it''s much of a point any more to say 5/10 years ago we would have settled for this result. Yes that's the case but Gus has had money to spend on players.
yes agree with Vince's posts. This conceding late goals due to an emphasis on defending a lead when we've been the better side until the last 15/20 minutes is becoming a chronic problem. The goalkeeper error is a bit of a red herring. It's currently costing us a play off place. Other sides have to attack more to get back in the match so we ought to be able to hit them on the break - Hoskins is surely the best option for this as was the case vs Newcastle. Instead we take off our recognised striker who at least defends from the front and have Barnes as a striker who does not have the pace to exploit these sort of situations. We need to continue to have a positive approach in the last quarter of an hour rather than choking on a lead. It seems as though other teams are invited to attack us and it's 'the alamo' mentality. I feel it's the manager's job to address this. I don't mean to be too critical but I don't think it''s much of a point any more to say 5/10 years ago we would have settled for this result. Yes that's the case but Gus has had money to spend on players. jcd1972
  • Score: 0

9:23am Sun 20 Jan 13

Jonathan Mouette says...

I for one would not be surprised if Will Hoskins packed his bags and walked. It doesn't seem to make a jot of difference how he plays, he won't be able to displace the city banker Ashley Barnes. Having now read the Twitter reports on the match I cannot believe the Andy Naylor tweets or those from BHAFC. TK's error is the turning point but AB's blast over the bar, another closer to the corner flag (just after David's goal - no Ashley, the scenario of whatever he does you can do doesn't work in your case!), stepping over the ball when it would have been easier to tap it in... all this is just a normal part of AB's game and we shouldn't expect more.. TK on the other hand...! No, AB for all his lack of ball control and inability to read a game continues to get the nod over someone who can actually turn a game. I fail to understand but no doubt a long line of ex-pats who haven't actually seen a game in months will put me right.
I for one would not be surprised if Will Hoskins packed his bags and walked. It doesn't seem to make a jot of difference how he plays, he won't be able to displace the city banker Ashley Barnes. Having now read the Twitter reports on the match I cannot believe the Andy Naylor tweets or those from BHAFC. TK's error is the turning point but AB's blast over the bar, another closer to the corner flag (just after David's goal - no Ashley, the scenario of whatever he does you can do doesn't work in your case!), stepping over the ball when it would have been easier to tap it in... all this is just a normal part of AB's game and we shouldn't expect more.. TK on the other hand...! No, AB for all his lack of ball control and inability to read a game continues to get the nod over someone who can actually turn a game. I fail to understand but no doubt a long line of ex-pats who haven't actually seen a game in months will put me right. Jonathan Mouette
  • Score: 0

9:53am Sun 20 Jan 13

dave from bexill says...

Jonathan Mouette wrote:
I for one would not be surprised if Will Hoskins packed his bags and walked. It doesn't seem to make a jot of difference how he plays, he won't be able to displace the city banker Ashley Barnes. Having now read the Twitter reports on the match I cannot believe the Andy Naylor tweets or those from BHAFC. TK's error is the turning point but AB's blast over the bar, another closer to the corner flag (just after David's goal - no Ashley, the scenario of whatever he does you can do doesn't work in your case!), stepping over the ball when it would have been easier to tap it in... all this is just a normal part of AB's game and we shouldn't expect more.. TK on the other hand...! No, AB for all his lack of ball control and inability to read a game continues to get the nod over someone who can actually turn a game. I fail to understand but no doubt a long line of ex-pats who haven't actually seen a game in months will put me right.
He certainly divides opinion does our Ashley.
[quote][p][bold]Jonathan Mouette[/bold] wrote: I for one would not be surprised if Will Hoskins packed his bags and walked. It doesn't seem to make a jot of difference how he plays, he won't be able to displace the city banker Ashley Barnes. Having now read the Twitter reports on the match I cannot believe the Andy Naylor tweets or those from BHAFC. TK's error is the turning point but AB's blast over the bar, another closer to the corner flag (just after David's goal - no Ashley, the scenario of whatever he does you can do doesn't work in your case!), stepping over the ball when it would have been easier to tap it in... all this is just a normal part of AB's game and we shouldn't expect more.. TK on the other hand...! No, AB for all his lack of ball control and inability to read a game continues to get the nod over someone who can actually turn a game. I fail to understand but no doubt a long line of ex-pats who haven't actually seen a game in months will put me right.[/p][/quote]He certainly divides opinion does our Ashley. dave from bexill
  • Score: 0

9:57am Sun 20 Jan 13

patcham albion says...

I met a man on the train last week who is a personal friend of one of our better players(no names),the said player according to this man is highly unimpressed with the fitness training at the club and the fitness levels of a lot of the team,could this have anything to do with the way we continually dominate for 85 mins then concede?
I met a man on the train last week who is a personal friend of one of our better players(no names),the said player according to this man is highly unimpressed with the fitness training at the club and the fitness levels of a lot of the team,could this have anything to do with the way we continually dominate for 85 mins then concede? patcham albion
  • Score: 0

10:04am Sun 20 Jan 13

wiseman of hove says...

Since Hoskins excellent performance against Newcastle (which came as no surprise to me or many other posters) he has been rooted to the bench and seen six substitutions in the Derby and Birmingham game. Will he ever get another opportunity?
Since Hoskins excellent performance against Newcastle (which came as no surprise to me or many other posters) he has been rooted to the bench and seen six substitutions in the Derby and Birmingham game. Will he ever get another opportunity? wiseman of hove
  • Score: 0

10:13am Sun 20 Jan 13

TokyoPete says...

Disappointed like everyone else. Having said that, conceding in injury time wasn't such a gut wrenching experience this time around as it's happened so often before. However, in the greater scheme of things an away point equals promotion/play-off form and the important statistic is, thus far this season; we've lost just six games. Typically promoted/ play off teams can 'afford' to lose ten/fifteen games respectively. The key is gonna be home form and whether new signing Leonardo Ulloa sticks it in on a regular basis. All said and done, with nineteen games remaining. 'It ain't over 'till it's over.'
UTA(lbion)
Disappointed like everyone else. Having said that, conceding in injury time wasn't such a gut wrenching experience this time around as it's happened so often before. However, in the greater scheme of things an away point equals promotion/play-off form and the important statistic is, thus far this season; we've lost just six games. Typically promoted/ play off teams can 'afford' to lose ten/fifteen games respectively. The key is gonna be home form and whether new signing Leonardo Ulloa sticks it in on a regular basis. All said and done, with nineteen games remaining. 'It ain't over 'till it's over.' UTA(lbion) TokyoPete
  • Score: 0

11:12am Sun 20 Jan 13

midfield dynamo says...

I think we often look vulnerable at the back, to set pieces and break-aways. We need CBs who can dominate and the keeper needs to take charge.
I'd like us to play like Swansea - this means more movement and taking risks, but it can pay off. Watching Swansea sur le box last night was a joy; the left back taking a risk moving forward and eventually scoring was a joy to watch. As soon as he went forward one of the CBs moved over to cover.
I think we often look vulnerable at the back, to set pieces and break-aways. We need CBs who can dominate and the keeper needs to take charge. I'd like us to play like Swansea - this means more movement and taking risks, but it can pay off. Watching Swansea sur le box last night was a joy; the left back taking a risk moving forward and eventually scoring was a joy to watch. As soon as he went forward one of the CBs moved over to cover. midfield dynamo
  • Score: 0

11:33am Sun 20 Jan 13

Hovite says...

Jonathan Mouette, I'm not having a go, but to suggest that Hoskins would pack his bags and go is an over reaction.

Maybe if it was a pub team he might spit the dummy, but Hoskins is a pro.

Saying you wouldn't be surprised if he left is the same as saying you'd be surprised if he stays."

If he wanted to pack his bags he has about 10 days to do it.
Jonathan Mouette, I'm not having a go, but to suggest that Hoskins would pack his bags and go is an over reaction. Maybe if it was a pub team he might spit the dummy, but Hoskins is a pro. Saying you wouldn't be surprised if he left is the same as saying you'd be surprised if he stays." If he wanted to pack his bags he has about 10 days to do it. Hovite
  • Score: 0

11:55am Sun 20 Jan 13

Jonathan Mouette says...

Hovite wrote:
Jonathan Mouette, I'm not having a go, but to suggest that Hoskins would pack his bags and go is an over reaction.

Maybe if it was a pub team he might spit the dummy, but Hoskins is a pro.

Saying you wouldn't be surprised if he left is the same as saying you'd be surprised if he stays."

If he wanted to pack his bags he has about 10 days to do it.
Thanks Hovite. You're quite right of course. I wouldn't be surprised if he did because that is exactly what I would have done back in those heady days when I was indeed able to play - even at a level slightly better than the local pub team. Watching someone playing in your place, knowing you are better in just about every aspect, must be galling. I sincerely hope that WH has more patience than me and that he does indeed stick aroud - and that his undoubted talent finally gets recognised.
[quote][p][bold]Hovite[/bold] wrote: Jonathan Mouette, I'm not having a go, but to suggest that Hoskins would pack his bags and go is an over reaction. Maybe if it was a pub team he might spit the dummy, but Hoskins is a pro. Saying you wouldn't be surprised if he left is the same as saying you'd be surprised if he stays." If he wanted to pack his bags he has about 10 days to do it.[/p][/quote]Thanks Hovite. You're quite right of course. I wouldn't be surprised if he did because that is exactly what I would have done back in those heady days when I was indeed able to play - even at a level slightly better than the local pub team. Watching someone playing in your place, knowing you are better in just about every aspect, must be galling. I sincerely hope that WH has more patience than me and that he does indeed stick aroud - and that his undoubted talent finally gets recognised. Jonathan Mouette
  • Score: 0

12:16pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Hovite says...

Hoskins knows that he is integral to the squad but Gus had to give Vicente a run out in the side.

By the way JM I highly rate WH, and I am pretty sure Gus likes what he sees.

Apart from anything else, getting paid 7-10 £k a week for sitting on the bench softens the blow. ;o)
Hoskins knows that he is integral to the squad but Gus had to give Vicente a run out in the side. By the way JM I highly rate WH, and I am pretty sure Gus likes what he sees. Apart from anything else, getting paid 7-10 £k a week for sitting on the bench softens the blow. ;o) Hovite
  • Score: 0

12:18pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Vince says...

patcham albion wrote:
I met a man on the train last week who is a personal friend of one of our better players(no names),the said player according to this man is highly unimpressed with the fitness training at the club and the fitness levels of a lot of the team,could this have anything to do with the way we continually dominate for 85 mins then concede?
This might be true. I was amazed at how exhausted Will Hoskins looked (when being interviewed after the Newcastle game) as he had only played about 20 minutes. Perhaps this is the reason he isn't getting games, as maybe in training he hasn't got the energy that others have. Obviously, some players are match fit, those who are playing week in week out, but Will Hoskins,, Dobbie and other fringe players don't have that advantage. What incentive is there for players to bust a gut in training, when they know the most time on the pitch they are going to get is 10 minutes, even though privately they know they have more skill than players like AB?
[quote][p][bold]patcham albion[/bold] wrote: I met a man on the train last week who is a personal friend of one of our better players(no names),the said player according to this man is highly unimpressed with the fitness training at the club and the fitness levels of a lot of the team,could this have anything to do with the way we continually dominate for 85 mins then concede?[/p][/quote]This might be true. I was amazed at how exhausted Will Hoskins looked (when being interviewed after the Newcastle game) as he had only played about 20 minutes. Perhaps this is the reason he isn't getting games, as maybe in training he hasn't got the energy that others have. Obviously, some players are match fit, those who are playing week in week out, but Will Hoskins,, Dobbie and other fringe players don't have that advantage. What incentive is there for players to bust a gut in training, when they know the most time on the pitch they are going to get is 10 minutes, even though privately they know they have more skill than players like AB? Vince
  • Score: 0

12:27pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Hovite says...

Vince are you serious?

What is the incentive to bust a gut in training? If you don't know that, give up tying to think about it.

And patcham albion," Oh I met a man on the train, I can't say a name..... Blah Blah Blah......... is that the best you can do? lol
Vince are you serious? What is the incentive to bust a gut in training? If you don't know that, give up tying to think about it. And patcham albion," Oh I met a man on the train, I can't say a name..... Blah Blah Blah......... is that the best you can do? lol Hovite
  • Score: 0

12:36pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Vince says...

Hovite wrote:
Vince are you serious? What is the incentive to bust a gut in training? If you don't know that, give up tying to think about it. And patcham albion," Oh I met a man on the train, I can't say a name..... Blah Blah Blah......... is that the best you can do? lol
Look if Hoskins shows the skill and effort in training that he does on the pitch, then Gus would be an idiot not to play him. One can only surmise that he doesn't, otherwise how come he isn't being played?
[quote][p][bold]Hovite[/bold] wrote: Vince are you serious? What is the incentive to bust a gut in training? If you don't know that, give up tying to think about it. And patcham albion," Oh I met a man on the train, I can't say a name..... Blah Blah Blah......... is that the best you can do? lol[/p][/quote]Look if Hoskins shows the skill and effort in training that he does on the pitch, then Gus would be an idiot not to play him. One can only surmise that he doesn't, otherwise how come he isn't being played? Vince
  • Score: 0

12:51pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Vince says...

Furthermore, Gus has gone on record before, as saying that Will is a great player to bring on towards the end, as he does hold the ball up very well - something that CMS is not very good at. So why wasn't he brought on? I think he used Vicente instead of him (but he could have used both and taken barnes off) because he was itching to get Vicente on the pitch - having missed out against Derby because of Orlandi's astonishing failure to score from 2 yards out.
Furthermore, Gus has gone on record before, as saying that Will is a great player to bring on towards the end, as he does hold the ball up very well - something that CMS is not very good at. So why wasn't he brought on? I think he used Vicente instead of him (but he could have used both and taken barnes off) because he was itching to get Vicente on the pitch - having missed out against Derby because of Orlandi's astonishing failure to score from 2 yards out. Vince
  • Score: 0

1:04pm Sun 20 Jan 13

patcham albion says...

Hovite wrote:
Vince are you serious?

What is the incentive to bust a gut in training? If you don't know that, give up tying to think about it.

And patcham albion," Oh I met a man on the train, I can't say a name..... Blah Blah Blah......... is that the best you can do? lol
I have no need to tell porkies hovite and I only speculated on if what the gent said could have had some base.Would you seriously expect me to name the player?
[quote][p][bold]Hovite[/bold] wrote: Vince are you serious? What is the incentive to bust a gut in training? If you don't know that, give up tying to think about it. And patcham albion," Oh I met a man on the train, I can't say a name..... Blah Blah Blah......... is that the best you can do? lol[/p][/quote]I have no need to tell porkies hovite and I only speculated on if what the gent said could have had some base.Would you seriously expect me to name the player? patcham albion
  • Score: 0

1:22pm Sun 20 Jan 13

wiseman of hove says...

Vince wrote:
Furthermore, Gus has gone on record before, as saying that Will is a great player to bring on towards the end, as he does hold the ball up very well - something that CMS is not very good at. So why wasn't he brought on? I think he used Vicente instead of him (but he could have used both and taken barnes off) because he was itching to get Vicente on the pitch - having missed out against Derby because of Orlandi's astonishing failure to score from 2 yards out.
The odd thing about Hoskins' continuing omission is that he was not an 'inherited' player - our manager signed him at a shrewd price, and as I posted a couple of weeks, described him as technically very gifted, able to play off the last mans shoulder and able to hold the ball up - so lets keep him on the bench and let him watch the matches!.
[quote][p][bold]Vince[/bold] wrote: Furthermore, Gus has gone on record before, as saying that Will is a great player to bring on towards the end, as he does hold the ball up very well - something that CMS is not very good at. So why wasn't he brought on? I think he used Vicente instead of him (but he could have used both and taken barnes off) because he was itching to get Vicente on the pitch - having missed out against Derby because of Orlandi's astonishing failure to score from 2 yards out.[/p][/quote]The odd thing about Hoskins' continuing omission is that he was not an 'inherited' player - our manager signed him at a shrewd price, and as I posted a couple of weeks, described him as technically very gifted, able to play off the last mans shoulder and able to hold the ball up - so lets keep him on the bench and let him watch the matches!. wiseman of hove
  • Score: 0

1:30pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Hovite says...

So you know that this guy you met on the train isn't telling you porkies?

Let me get this right, a player is going around complaining about the fitness training at the club?

People say a lot of things, giving it the old name dropping and my mates mate says....... It's hardly first hand info?

Even if it were true I wouldn't take it as the gospel truth based on some post on here.
So you know that this guy you met on the train isn't telling you porkies? Let me get this right, a player is going around complaining about the fitness training at the club? People say a lot of things, giving it the old name dropping and my mates mate says....... It's hardly first hand info? Even if it were true I wouldn't take it as the gospel truth based on some post on here. Hovite
  • Score: 0

1:31pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Hovite says...

Hovite wrote:
So you know that this guy you met on the train isn't telling you porkies?

Let me get this right, a player is going around complaining about the fitness training at the club?

People say a lot of things, giving it the old name dropping and my mates mate says....... It's hardly first hand info?

Even if it were true I wouldn't take it as the gospel truth based on some post on here.
Ref: patcham albion
[quote][p][bold]Hovite[/bold] wrote: So you know that this guy you met on the train isn't telling you porkies? Let me get this right, a player is going around complaining about the fitness training at the club? People say a lot of things, giving it the old name dropping and my mates mate says....... It's hardly first hand info? Even if it were true I wouldn't take it as the gospel truth based on some post on here.[/p][/quote]Ref: patcham albion Hovite
  • Score: 0

1:37pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Hovite says...

Vince wrote:
Furthermore, Gus has gone on record before, as saying that Will is a great player to bring on towards the end, as he does hold the ball up very well - something that CMS is not very good at. So why wasn't he brought on? I think he used Vicente instead of him (but he could have used both and taken barnes off) because he was itching to get Vicente on the pitch - having missed out against Derby because of Orlandi's astonishing failure to score from 2 yards out.
But you don't know what the result would have been had Hoskins come on for Barnes.

Orlandi and Lopez came off and were replaced by Buckly and Dicker, fresh legs and like for like. Makes sense to me.

CMS had to come off because he was tired, and putting Vicente on wasn't a bad move.

Orlandi's miss wasn't an astonishing failure but feel free to embellish it the way you wish.

For what it's worth if TK didn't fluff it at the end, there would be nothing to complain about, it would have gone down as a good away win.

If you always want to be guaranteed of a winning end you need to be watching a James Bond film, not a football match.
[quote][p][bold]Vince[/bold] wrote: Furthermore, Gus has gone on record before, as saying that Will is a great player to bring on towards the end, as he does hold the ball up very well - something that CMS is not very good at. So why wasn't he brought on? I think he used Vicente instead of him (but he could have used both and taken barnes off) because he was itching to get Vicente on the pitch - having missed out against Derby because of Orlandi's astonishing failure to score from 2 yards out.[/p][/quote]But you don't know what the result would have been had Hoskins come on for Barnes. Orlandi and Lopez came off and were replaced by Buckly and Dicker, fresh legs and like for like. Makes sense to me. CMS had to come off because he was tired, and putting Vicente on wasn't a bad move. Orlandi's miss wasn't an astonishing failure but feel free to embellish it the way you wish. For what it's worth if TK didn't fluff it at the end, there would be nothing to complain about, it would have gone down as a good away win. If you always want to be guaranteed of a winning end you need to be watching a James Bond film, not a football match. Hovite
  • Score: 0

3:50pm Sun 20 Jan 13

jcd1972 says...

Hovite - if it happens once then ok. But it's happened at least 3 or 4 times this season and we've been lucky to avoid dropping points on other occasions when we've attempted to hang on to a lead. It's something that needs to be addressed in terms of attitude when holding a lead, not hidden under the carpet and saying it's the keeper's fault. Why are we good enough to dominate the first 70/75 minutes and then allow the other side to dominate the last 15/20 minutes?
Hovite - if it happens once then ok. But it's happened at least 3 or 4 times this season and we've been lucky to avoid dropping points on other occasions when we've attempted to hang on to a lead. It's something that needs to be addressed in terms of attitude when holding a lead, not hidden under the carpet and saying it's the keeper's fault. Why are we good enough to dominate the first 70/75 minutes and then allow the other side to dominate the last 15/20 minutes? jcd1972
  • Score: 0

4:40pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Tony the tiger eastbourne says...

gusset snatcher wrote:
Pathetic, same old story yet again........ they're mean't to be professional footballers bought from overseas far and wide...... not village idiots virtually kicking the ball in their own net...... heads would roll if I had my way... IGWAM
Bloody hell its dumber & dumber on again with their usual moaning on this and that. Come on fellas show us your true feelings on the matter, do you follow the Albion as a supporter or are due you follow the scum!!
[quote][p][bold]gusset snatcher[/bold] wrote: Pathetic, same old story yet again........ they're mean't to be professional footballers bought from overseas far and wide...... not village idiots virtually kicking the ball in their own net...... heads would roll if I had my way... IGWAM[/p][/quote]Bloody hell its dumber & dumber on again with their usual moaning on this and that. Come on fellas show us your true feelings on the matter, do you follow the Albion as a supporter or are due you follow the scum!! Tony the tiger eastbourne
  • Score: 0

5:04pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Hovite says...

jcd1972 wrote:
Hovite - if it happens once then ok. But it's happened at least 3 or 4 times this season and we've been lucky to avoid dropping points on other occasions when we've attempted to hang on to a lead. It's something that needs to be addressed in terms of attitude when holding a lead, not hidden under the carpet and saying it's the keeper's fault. Why are we good enough to dominate the first 70/75 minutes and then allow the other side to dominate the last 15/20 minutes?
Of course it has to be addressed and I am sure it has.

Any team that is down one goal will always put the pressure on in the last 15 minutes. Maybe with Ulloa he will be an outlet for us, someone to aim for when we are on the back foot.

It is nervy and they need to learn to play the game out as a team. What does Gus tell them? Remember at the end of the game don't panic and make any mistakes.

Prehaps they don't listen to him.
[quote][p][bold]jcd1972[/bold] wrote: Hovite - if it happens once then ok. But it's happened at least 3 or 4 times this season and we've been lucky to avoid dropping points on other occasions when we've attempted to hang on to a lead. It's something that needs to be addressed in terms of attitude when holding a lead, not hidden under the carpet and saying it's the keeper's fault. Why are we good enough to dominate the first 70/75 minutes and then allow the other side to dominate the last 15/20 minutes?[/p][/quote]Of course it has to be addressed and I am sure it has. Any team that is down one goal will always put the pressure on in the last 15 minutes. Maybe with Ulloa he will be an outlet for us, someone to aim for when we are on the back foot. It is nervy and they need to learn to play the game out as a team. What does Gus tell them? Remember at the end of the game don't panic and make any mistakes. Prehaps they don't listen to him. Hovite
  • Score: 0

5:35pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Freeloaders says...

Vince wrote:
patcham albion wrote:
I met a man on the train last week who is a personal friend of one of our better players(no names),the said player according to this man is highly unimpressed with the fitness training at the club and the fitness levels of a lot of the team,could this have anything to do with the way we continually dominate for 85 mins then concede?
This might be true. I was amazed at how exhausted Will Hoskins looked (when being interviewed after the Newcastle game) as he had only played about 20 minutes. Perhaps this is the reason he isn't getting games, as maybe in training he hasn't got the energy that others have. Obviously, some players are match fit, those who are playing week in week out, but Will Hoskins,, Dobbie and other fringe players don't have that advantage. What incentive is there for players to bust a gut in training, when they know the most time on the pitch they are going to get is 10 minutes, even though privately they know they have more skill than players like AB?
The reason Hoskins is not on the pitch is the same reason Dunk & Croft are not.The thing is Gus knows the same as me about them thank God.Thats why Norwich wanted Croft out asap.Plus thats why know other clubs were after Hoskins when we signed.Everyone in football knew what he was like at Watford.Just like the words got around about that other freeloader Dunk.
[quote][p][bold]Vince[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]patcham albion[/bold] wrote: I met a man on the train last week who is a personal friend of one of our better players(no names),the said player according to this man is highly unimpressed with the fitness training at the club and the fitness levels of a lot of the team,could this have anything to do with the way we continually dominate for 85 mins then concede?[/p][/quote]This might be true. I was amazed at how exhausted Will Hoskins looked (when being interviewed after the Newcastle game) as he had only played about 20 minutes. Perhaps this is the reason he isn't getting games, as maybe in training he hasn't got the energy that others have. Obviously, some players are match fit, those who are playing week in week out, but Will Hoskins,, Dobbie and other fringe players don't have that advantage. What incentive is there for players to bust a gut in training, when they know the most time on the pitch they are going to get is 10 minutes, even though privately they know they have more skill than players like AB?[/p][/quote]The reason Hoskins is not on the pitch is the same reason Dunk & Croft are not.The thing is Gus knows the same as me about them thank God.Thats why Norwich wanted Croft out asap.Plus thats why know other clubs were after Hoskins when we signed.Everyone in football knew what he was like at Watford.Just like the words got around about that other freeloader Dunk. Freeloaders
  • Score: 0

8:40pm Sun 20 Jan 13

VegasSeagull says...

Having read all the posts, on all the threads since the result, it is quite clear that most of the comments are based on personal favs and have nothing to do with much else.

Hoskins fans want him to have a run of games, Barnes detractors don't want him to start. CMS detractors don't think he should start as often as he does.
We even have those with personal favs decrying how the subs are selected and used, or not as the case might be.

Whilst all this fav players stuff is understandable and expected I don't understand how it can be turned into derisive comments about Gus and his ability to select winning teams.

Sould we all not have a favourite manager, the one thta got us where we are. If we believe in Gus Poyet then we should believe in his slections and how he uses them.
We get to voice opinions after the result is known, he has to make decisions prior to a ball being kicked.

I don't see how you can be behind our team and not be behind our manager. You either trust Poyet to use your favourite player/players in the best way he sees fit or you don't. Those that don't seem to be down on Gus just because your fav doesn't get to do what you think he should.

I trust Poyet and Bloom, they both know a whole lot more than I do. If another club pips us to the post of the playoffs or promotion should we make them, it just might be that the other team is better, that shouldn't mean that Gus and Bloom have let us down.
Having read all the posts, on all the threads since the result, it is quite clear that most of the comments are based on personal favs and have nothing to do with much else. Hoskins fans want him to have a run of games, Barnes detractors don't want him to start. CMS detractors don't think he should start as often as he does. We even have those with personal favs decrying how the subs are selected and used, or not as the case might be. Whilst all this fav players stuff is understandable and expected I don't understand how it can be turned into derisive comments about Gus and his ability to select winning teams. Sould we all not have a favourite manager, the one thta got us where we are. If we believe in Gus Poyet then we should believe in his slections and how he uses them. We get to voice opinions after the result is known, he has to make decisions prior to a ball being kicked. I don't see how you can be behind our team and not be behind our manager. You either trust Poyet to use your favourite player/players in the best way he sees fit or you don't. Those that don't seem to be down on Gus just because your fav doesn't get to do what you think he should. I trust Poyet and Bloom, they both know a whole lot more than I do. If another club pips us to the post of the playoffs or promotion should we make them, it just might be that the other team is better, that shouldn't mean that Gus and Bloom have let us down. VegasSeagull
  • Score: 0

10:21pm Sun 20 Jan 13

Vince says...

VegasSeagull wrote:
Having read all the posts, on all the threads since the result, it is quite clear that most of the comments are based on personal favs and have nothing to do with much else. Hoskins fans want him to have a run of games, Barnes detractors don't want him to start. CMS detractors don't think he should start as often as he does. We even have those with personal favs decrying how the subs are selected and used, or not as the case might be. Whilst all this fav players stuff is understandable and expected I don't understand how it can be turned into derisive comments about Gus and his ability to select winning teams. Sould we all not have a favourite manager, the one thta got us where we are. If we believe in Gus Poyet then we should believe in his slections and how he uses them. We get to voice opinions after the result is known, he has to make decisions prior to a ball being kicked. I don't see how you can be behind our team and not be behind our manager. You either trust Poyet to use your favourite player/players in the best way he sees fit or you don't. Those that don't seem to be down on Gus just because your fav doesn't get to do what you think he should. I trust Poyet and Bloom, they both know a whole lot more than I do. If another club pips us to the post of the playoffs or promotion should we make them, it just might be that the other team is better, that shouldn't mean that Gus and Bloom have let us down.
I'm totally behind our manager who has achieved amazing things at our club. He is still learning the job however, and is not immune from making mistakes. Even the great Brian Clough and Peter Taylor made mistakes, and they quickly rectified them. The manager is, in effect the servant of the club, as is the chairman and board of directors. Even the players are servants of the club. The real owners are the supporters - because without them there would be no club, and the players would get no wages and thus be out of a job.

The supporters have a voice - not all the voices always say the same thing -but usually on important issues the supporters are united in a common cause - like the great effort to get rid of Archer and Bellotti.
The supporters being the lifeblood of the club have a right to voice opinions. I sometimes criticise thingd the manager does it is not negativity - it is meant to be constructive. If enough people say the same thing - then sometimes the guys who have been appointed to make decisions might be influenced. If they don't listen - for e.g. because they passionately believe they are right - they stand or fall by their own sword. Supporters air their views because they CARE about the club. I don't subscribe to VegasSeagull's view that we should believe in the manager's selections whatever they are. That is behaving like sheep.
I DO believe we should always SUPPORT the team, but if the manager is not getting the results (and I don't include Gus in this supposition - as he has done a fantastic job) then supporters have a right to protest.
In any case half the fun of being a football fan is voicing an opinion. We all like to pretend we are managers, and to state who we would have picked etc. That is not being disloyal or negative. It is caring about OUR CLUB!
[quote][p][bold]VegasSeagull[/bold] wrote: Having read all the posts, on all the threads since the result, it is quite clear that most of the comments are based on personal favs and have nothing to do with much else. Hoskins fans want him to have a run of games, Barnes detractors don't want him to start. CMS detractors don't think he should start as often as he does. We even have those with personal favs decrying how the subs are selected and used, or not as the case might be. Whilst all this fav players stuff is understandable and expected I don't understand how it can be turned into derisive comments about Gus and his ability to select winning teams. Sould we all not have a favourite manager, the one thta got us where we are. If we believe in Gus Poyet then we should believe in his slections and how he uses them. We get to voice opinions after the result is known, he has to make decisions prior to a ball being kicked. I don't see how you can be behind our team and not be behind our manager. You either trust Poyet to use your favourite player/players in the best way he sees fit or you don't. Those that don't seem to be down on Gus just because your fav doesn't get to do what you think he should. I trust Poyet and Bloom, they both know a whole lot more than I do. If another club pips us to the post of the playoffs or promotion should we make them, it just might be that the other team is better, that shouldn't mean that Gus and Bloom have let us down.[/p][/quote]I'm totally behind our manager who has achieved amazing things at our club. He is still learning the job however, and is not immune from making mistakes. Even the great Brian Clough and Peter Taylor made mistakes, and they quickly rectified them. The manager is, in effect the servant of the club, as is the chairman and board of directors. Even the players are servants of the club. The real owners are the supporters - because without them there would be no club, and the players would get no wages and thus be out of a job. The supporters have a voice - not all the voices always say the same thing -but usually on important issues the supporters are united in a common cause - like the great effort to get rid of Archer and Bellotti. The supporters being the lifeblood of the club have a right to voice opinions. I sometimes criticise thingd the manager does it is not negativity - it is meant to be constructive. If enough people say the same thing - then sometimes the guys who have been appointed to make decisions might be influenced. If they don't listen - for e.g. because they passionately believe they are right - they stand or fall by their own sword. Supporters air their views because they CARE about the club. I don't subscribe to VegasSeagull's view that we should believe in the manager's selections whatever they are. That is behaving like sheep. I DO believe we should always SUPPORT the team, but if the manager is not getting the results (and I don't include Gus in this supposition - as he has done a fantastic job) then supporters have a right to protest. In any case half the fun of being a football fan is voicing an opinion. We all like to pretend we are managers, and to state who we would have picked etc. That is not being disloyal or negative. It is caring about OUR CLUB! Vince
  • Score: 0

11:31am Mon 21 Jan 13

Hovite says...

VegasSeagull wrote:
Having read all the posts, on all the threads since the result, it is quite clear that most of the comments are based on personal favs and have nothing to do with much else.

Hoskins fans want him to have a run of games, Barnes detractors don't want him to start. CMS detractors don't think he should start as often as he does.
We even have those with personal favs decrying how the subs are selected and used, or not as the case might be.

Whilst all this fav players stuff is understandable and expected I don't understand how it can be turned into derisive comments about Gus and his ability to select winning teams.

Sould we all not have a favourite manager, the one thta got us where we are. If we believe in Gus Poyet then we should believe in his slections and how he uses them.
We get to voice opinions after the result is known, he has to make decisions prior to a ball being kicked.

I don't see how you can be behind our team and not be behind our manager. You either trust Poyet to use your favourite player/players in the best way he sees fit or you don't. Those that don't seem to be down on Gus just because your fav doesn't get to do what you think he should.

I trust Poyet and Bloom, they both know a whole lot more than I do. If another club pips us to the post of the playoffs or promotion should we make them, it just might be that the other team is better, that shouldn't mean that Gus and Bloom have let us down.
Have to say that is great summary.

Every decision that Gus has to make is with firsthand knowledge, and he has to integrate the team slowly. It took a bit of time for Orlandi and even longer for Lopez. Gus also knows that Hoskins fits in well. This is building a team for the future and there are many reasons for selections, not because players are out of favour.
[quote][p][bold]VegasSeagull[/bold] wrote: Having read all the posts, on all the threads since the result, it is quite clear that most of the comments are based on personal favs and have nothing to do with much else. Hoskins fans want him to have a run of games, Barnes detractors don't want him to start. CMS detractors don't think he should start as often as he does. We even have those with personal favs decrying how the subs are selected and used, or not as the case might be. Whilst all this fav players stuff is understandable and expected I don't understand how it can be turned into derisive comments about Gus and his ability to select winning teams. Sould we all not have a favourite manager, the one thta got us where we are. If we believe in Gus Poyet then we should believe in his slections and how he uses them. We get to voice opinions after the result is known, he has to make decisions prior to a ball being kicked. I don't see how you can be behind our team and not be behind our manager. You either trust Poyet to use your favourite player/players in the best way he sees fit or you don't. Those that don't seem to be down on Gus just because your fav doesn't get to do what you think he should. I trust Poyet and Bloom, they both know a whole lot more than I do. If another club pips us to the post of the playoffs or promotion should we make them, it just might be that the other team is better, that shouldn't mean that Gus and Bloom have let us down.[/p][/quote]Have to say that is great summary. Every decision that Gus has to make is with firsthand knowledge, and he has to integrate the team slowly. It took a bit of time for Orlandi and even longer for Lopez. Gus also knows that Hoskins fits in well. This is building a team for the future and there are many reasons for selections, not because players are out of favour. Hovite
  • Score: 0

10:01am Tue 22 Jan 13

tug509 says...

jcd1972 wrote:
yes agree with Vince's posts. This conceding late goals due to an emphasis on defending a lead when we've been the better side until the last 15/20 minutes is becoming a chronic problem. The goalkeeper error is a bit of a red herring. It's currently costing us a play off place. Other sides have to attack more to get back in the match so we ought to be able to hit them on the break - Hoskins is surely the best option for this as was the case vs Newcastle. Instead we take off our recognised striker who at least defends from the front and have Barnes as a striker who does not have the pace to exploit these sort of situations. We need to continue to have a positive approach in the last quarter of an hour rather than choking on a lead. It seems as though other teams are invited to attack us and it's 'the alamo' mentality. I feel it's the manager's job to address this.

I don't mean to be too critical but I don't think it''s much of a point any more to say 5/10 years ago we would have settled for this result. Yes that's the case but Gus has had money to spend on players.
Very well put,excellent post jcd imho. UTA
[quote][p][bold]jcd1972[/bold] wrote: yes agree with Vince's posts. This conceding late goals due to an emphasis on defending a lead when we've been the better side until the last 15/20 minutes is becoming a chronic problem. The goalkeeper error is a bit of a red herring. It's currently costing us a play off place. Other sides have to attack more to get back in the match so we ought to be able to hit them on the break - Hoskins is surely the best option for this as was the case vs Newcastle. Instead we take off our recognised striker who at least defends from the front and have Barnes as a striker who does not have the pace to exploit these sort of situations. We need to continue to have a positive approach in the last quarter of an hour rather than choking on a lead. It seems as though other teams are invited to attack us and it's 'the alamo' mentality. I feel it's the manager's job to address this. I don't mean to be too critical but I don't think it''s much of a point any more to say 5/10 years ago we would have settled for this result. Yes that's the case but Gus has had money to spend on players.[/p][/quote]Very well put,excellent post jcd imho. UTA tug509
  • Score: 0

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