Albion must be careful with David contract (From The Argus)

Contact roulette is a game we have to play but now Spanish Dave has shown himself to be the 'real deal' i would imagine that we would be making moves to secure his services. He is Premiership quality and wherever we are next season, he is the type of utility player we can't afford to be without. There are others in the same situation who would not be able to make the grade if we went up. It's a question of whether individual deals can be brokered before addressing the overall squad. Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore?

Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore? No. The pondlife also known as agents would never allow it.

Jonathan Mouette wrote:
Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore? No. The pondlife also known as agents would never allow it.

Pondlife perhaps, but a necessary evil.

fairweathersupporter wrote:
Contact roulette is a game we have to play but now Spanish Dave has shown himself to be the 'real deal' i would imagine that we would be making moves to secure his services. He is Premiership quality and wherever we are next season, he is the type of utility player we can't afford to be without. There are others in the same situation who would not be able to make the grade if we went up. It's a question of whether individual deals can be brokered before addressing the overall squad. Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore?

Agree with Fairweather... Spanish Dave's perfromance on Saturday was Premiership standard. He revelled in the free role he had and showed a remarkable engine. His corner delivery was also of the highest quality - Ulloa scored from one in the second half but there were also 2 in the first where he picked out Will Buckley on the edge of the area, allowing Bucks to get decent shots on goal.

Ironic that on the transfer deadline day, he was the least heralded of the four signings Gus made and signed for the least amount of time (yes I know Hammond was a loan). He's shown himself to be the best of the lot and the one that ideally we'd have liked on a long term deal.

On the plus side is the fact that he clearly likes it here so hopefully he'll commit to join us again next season and beyond.

Jonathan Mouette wrote:
Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore? No. The pondlife also known as agents would never allow it.

The late great Sam Goldwyn said: "a verbal agreement isn't worth the paper it's written on". Nuff said!

'Don't panic Mr mannering' springs to mind. We all know that a lot hinges on the end of season senario. keep winning and get us up and nobody will want to leave by choice and we will be able to pay them very good wages. That said compared to the rest of society they are now.
Yes even if we don't go up on current performances we would want to keep him however if he wants and gets a better offer else where so be it ,no room at BHA for people who want away.let them go.

I hope he stays and signs on for a further few years. He does seem to get better and better the more he plays. He's also very versatile and does appear to really love playing for the Albion. Let's hope the prospect of promotion and/or the prospect of playing at Wembley is sufficient to get him to sign for a further period.

Hope we dont leave contract dealings too long Players of spanish Daves talents are the key to our success. Lose them & we are going to struggle promoted or or otherwise. Theyve changed our style of play all over the park. Its also the Agents i worry about.But they wont go away.

Until we know what division we will be playing in next season we cannot work out how much he would get paid.

It is not in the player's interest or the club's interest to do this business until the end of the season.

Old Scrote of the Amex wrote:

Jonathan Mouette wrote:
Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore? No. The pondlife also known as agents would never allow it.

Pondlife perhaps, but a necessary evil.

I don't think they are necessary.
Any reasonably intelligent person should be able to negotiate their own deal. Surely not all footballers can be that thick?

Vicente -Free.
Calderon -Free.
Bruno -Free.
David -Free.
Orlandi - Neg.
Kuszcak -Free
Bridcutt -Free.

It just shows there are top players out there who are available for very little if not free. When we are lucky enough to get hold these players it is in our interest to "look after them". Unfortunately and frankly not on merit, English players are too expensive and the only way we will get more English players into our squad is by bringing them through the academy.

Hovite wrote:
Until we know what division we will be playing in next season we cannot work out how much he would get paid.

It is not in the player's interest or the club's interest to do this business until the end of the season.

Could they not work on a double deal same contract just a different salary depending where we play next season
Might even give the players more thrust to push for promotion
Could be a win win for everybody
just a thought
UTA

I thought Spanish Dave was a revelation in the centre of the park on Saturday...surely a position he should retain even when Vicente and Bridders are back.

He may want a shot at the premiership sooner rather than later at his stage in his career. But personally I'd prefer to be a big fish pulling the strings at the Amex (premiership or championship) than a fringe reserve utility player at a "bigger" club. (Same goes for Gus as a manager!)

jockithenoo wrote:

Hovite wrote: Until we know what division we will be playing in next season we cannot work out how much he would get paid. It is not in the player's interest or the club's interest to do this business until the end of the season.

Could they not work on a double deal same contract just a different salary depending where we play next season Might even give the players more thrust to push for promotion Could be a win win for everybody just a thought UTA

I'm sure deals like this exist to secure the future services of players (apart from the associated bonusues).

BTW i don't know what contact roulette is but i obviously meant 'contract'. And my gentleman's agreement comment was with a wry smile. Spanish Dave seems happy here and whilst the big fish in little pond does not always appeal due to some of the sums of money involved; he didn't moan and has gone on to prove himself worthy of a starting berth. Come what (in) May, i think he'll stay,,,

jockithenoo wrote:

Hovite wrote:
Until we know what division we will be playing in next season we cannot work out how much he would get paid.

It is not in the player's interest or the club's interest to do this business until the end of the season.

Could they not work on a double deal same contract just a different salary depending where we play next season
Might even give the players more thrust to push for promotion
Could be a win win for everybody
just a thought
UTA

I guess they could do, though I don't think a financial incentive will make the players want the Prem more than they already do.

What we have to do is work out a balanced and fair pay structure where players wages are realistic and not one player earning 10 or £20k a week more than another player.

Bridge is on £90k a week through Man C, but I think paying any more than 20 - £25k a week in the Prem for any player is unrealistic for us.

I would prefer the club attended to contracts when the season is over and it wouldn’t benefit any party trying to sort something out now. The players and manager should just be focused on promotion, contracts are too time consuming and they should just be talking football and enjoying the season.

Claude Back wrote:

Old Scrote of the Amex wrote:

Jonathan Mouette wrote:
Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore? No. The pondlife also known as agents would never allow it.

Pondlife perhaps, but a necessary evil.

I don't think they are necessary.
Any reasonably intelligent person should be able to negotiate their own deal. Surely not all footballers can be that thick?

It's not a case of being thick, but the clubs would eat them alive and spit out the carcass. The players have to look after themselves, and to do that they need to employ someone wanting to the same. Also, players should concentrate on the playing side and let someone else look after the business side.

Hard to believe that it is less than six months since we signed him and fellow Spaniard Orlandi - Two of our best signings in years...We must try and keep them.

I would agree with Jock, offer a deal that covers both contingenies. This deal if we go up and that deal if we don't.

We have a new shirt sponsor, you can bet that what ever the deal is with them it changes if we get promoted, assuming that it runs longer than the end of this season, treat the players the same.

The contracts cannot be sorted or even discussed until the end of the season UNLESS a bit of clever dealing is done--as has been suggested--- to do a 'double' contract deal, thereby giving a little more incentive to stay. But then again we have to add the Agents into the melting pot who will no doubt be scouting around to try and get a better deal for their player, elsewhere--because there is a lot of money in it for them. Lots to consider and at the time it will be a very nervous time for all. Like all above I HOPE we can keep ALL our good players who are on contract with us---as for the loan players, big question mark because of wages--aka Bridge and Upson. To a greater degree it is up to the squad to get us into the Premiership and that will be an added insentive to stay put---I hope so!!

With regard to Bridge and Upson, and thinking of what they might do come next season, I think Upson will stay and Bridge might go.

I don't see Prem teams wanting to sign them for anything more than cover, if they stay with us, they will get more playing time.
Upson, I think, would accept a reasonable offer for his future services, Bridge might be lured to my side of the pond, big money awaits him here.

I am sure Hammond would like to stay but promotion might see him get little playing time.

Promotion might see the end of Greer's time with Brighton, especially if Upson stays.

I am pretty confident that Dunk and Dicker will move on no matter what.

Of course all that I have written could be, and probably is, pure garbage and I wouldn't have any problem with those that think it is as I am not sure about all of it myself.





,

Old Scrote of the Amex wrote:

Claude Back wrote:

Old Scrote of the Amex wrote:

Jonathan Mouette wrote:
Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore? No. The pondlife also known as agents would never allow it.

Pondlife perhaps, but a necessary evil.

I don't think they are necessary.
Any reasonably intelligent person should be able to negotiate their own deal. Surely not all footballers can be that thick?

It's not a case of being thick, but the clubs would eat them alive and spit out the carcass. The players have to look after themselves, and to do that they need to employ someone wanting to the same. Also, players should concentrate on the playing side and let someone else look after the business side.

As I understand it negotiating players (and indeed managers/coaches) contracts is a very drawn out and complex issue these days and probably an absolute nightmare. That's why Gus and the players are likely to have little direct involvement. Signing an "unknown" from Spain like David Lopez has been great business, but now that he's become more of a name other clubs are likely to fancy him, which of course puts his negotiators in a much stronger bargaining position.Conversely, someone like El-Abd who's heart is totally in Brighton is likely to sign any new(fair) contract with no hesitation.
I'm assuming that we are paying Upson's wages during his loan period, and wonder if the amount is what we'd pay our own player rather than an amount equivalent to his earnings at Stoke. If so he may me be happy to sign for us permanently. With regards to Bridge, I think Vegas is probably right and he may wish to try his hand in the USA. Could be his girlfriend also fancies that being a singer and may also feel the States offers a better opportunity for her. Of course these are all imponderables at present and it's likely to be a very busy summer wherever we are come May.

VegasSeagull wrote:
With regard to Bridge and Upson, and thinking of what they might do come next season, I think Upson will stay and Bridge might go. I don't see Prem teams wanting to sign them for anything more than cover, if they stay with us, they will get more playing time. Upson, I think, would accept a reasonable offer for his future services, Bridge might be lured to my side of the pond, big money awaits him here. I am sure Hammond would like to stay but promotion might see him get little playing time. Promotion might see the end of Greer's time with Brighton, especially if Upson stays. I am pretty confident that Dunk and Dicker will move on no matter what. Of course all that I have written could be, and probably is, pure garbage and I wouldn't have any problem with those that think it is as I am not sure about all of it myself. ,

Good post Vegas. Looks like you covered your backside all round.

Old Scrote of the Amex wrote:

Claude Back wrote:

Old Scrote of the Amex wrote:

Jonathan Mouette wrote:
Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore? No. The pondlife also known as agents would never allow it.

Pondlife perhaps, but a necessary evil.

I don't think they are necessary.
Any reasonably intelligent person should be able to negotiate their own deal. Surely not all footballers can be that thick?

It's not a case of being thick, but the clubs would eat them alive and spit out the carcass. The players have to look after themselves, and to do that they need to employ someone wanting to the same. Also, players should concentrate on the playing side and let someone else look after the business side.

It is the last part of your comment, namely "let someone else look after the business side", which has allowed all aspects of football financing to spiral out of control over the years.
I'm with JM and Claude on this, agents are NOT necessary!

VegasSeagull wrote:
I would agree with Jock, offer a deal that covers both contingenies. This deal if we go up and that deal if we don't.

We have a new shirt sponsor, you can bet that what ever the deal is with them it changes if we get promoted, assuming that it runs longer than the end of this season, treat the players the same.

Spot on about shirt sponsor.

Jonathan Mouette wrote:
Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore? No. The pondlife also known as agents would never allow it.

Sad to say 100% spot on.But we need to be talking with David now if you know what i mean.

Hovite wrote:
Until we know what division we will be playing in next season we cannot work out how much he would get paid.

It is not in the player's interest or the club's interest to do this business until the end of the season.

Very good post again Mr,Hovite.But like i said above it would not hurt to have a long chat with David if you know what i mean.

VegasSeagull wrote:
With regard to Bridge and Upson, and thinking of what they might do come next season, I think Upson will stay and Bridge might go.

I don't see Prem teams wanting to sign them for anything more than cover, if they stay with us, they will get more playing time.
Upson, I think, would accept a reasonable offer for his future services, Bridge might be lured to my side of the pond, big money awaits him here.

I am sure Hammond would like to stay but promotion might see him get little playing time.

Promotion might see the end of Greer's time with Brighton, especially if Upson stays.

I am pretty confident that Dunk and Dicker will move on no matter what.

Of course all that I have written could be, and probably is, pure garbage and I wouldn't have any problem with those that think it is as I am not sure about all of it myself.





,

Deff not garbage Vegas.I can't see much wrong with it.

I think David is having the time of his life,He`s loved by all of us,he has lots of spanish mates,everyone wants him here,and he is scoring goals with a smile on his face,the man is Albion.!!!UTA

Dr Baldhead wrote:

fairweathersupporter wrote:
Contact roulette is a game we have to play but now Spanish Dave has shown himself to be the 'real deal' i would imagine that we would be making moves to secure his services. He is Premiership quality and wherever we are next season, he is the type of utility player we can't afford to be without. There are others in the same situation who would not be able to make the grade if we went up. It's a question of whether individual deals can be brokered before addressing the overall squad. Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore?

Agree with Fairweather... Spanish Dave's perfromance on Saturday was Premiership standard. He revelled in the free role he had and showed a remarkable engine. His corner delivery was also of the highest quality - Ulloa scored from one in the second half but there were also 2 in the first where he picked out Will Buckley on the edge of the area, allowing Bucks to get decent shots on goal.

Ironic that on the transfer deadline day, he was the least heralded of the four signings Gus made and signed for the least amount of time (yes I know Hammond was a loan). He's shown himself to be the best of the lot and the one that ideally we'd have liked on a long term deal.

On the plus side is the fact that he clearly likes it here so hopefully he'll commit to join us again next season and beyond.

I also agree Dr Baldhead with you and fairweathersupporter and I suspect so do alot of other supporters.
One of the things I noticed on Saturday was how deep Lopez was prepared to go to collect the ball. Quite often he was playing behind Hammond.
I really hope that Poyet and Co get him to extend his stay soon.
A midfield of Buckley, Lopez, Bridcutt, Hammond & Orlandi which I expect tomorrow night with the prospect of Vicente coming off the bench looks decidedly useful.
Fingers crossed for another positive result tomorrow.

I like the honesty of the manager posing the question that it might have been a mistake not playing David sooner after his signing. He seemed to have to wait an inordinate amount of time before getting a berth. The manager cannot get every decision right - he gets enough right for me and to have secured both Orlandi and David in the summer transfer window has turned out to be fantastic business. I'm presuming Orlandi signed for a decent period.
I'm sure the club will do everything possible to keep both of them. I'd love to see them both at the Amex for many years to come.

BobbyLaverick wrote:

Old Scrote of the Amex wrote:

Claude Back wrote:

Old Scrote of the Amex wrote:

Jonathan Mouette wrote:
Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore? No. The pondlife also known as agents would never allow it.

Pondlife perhaps, but a necessary evil.

I don't think they are necessary.
Any reasonably intelligent person should be able to negotiate their own deal. Surely not all footballers can be that thick?

It's not a case of being thick, but the clubs would eat them alive and spit out the carcass. The players have to look after themselves, and to do that they need to employ someone wanting to the same. Also, players should concentrate on the playing side and let someone else look after the business side.

It is the last part of your comment, namely "let someone else look after the business side", which has allowed all aspects of football financing to spiral out of control over the years.
I'm with JM and Claude on this, agents are NOT necessary!

Actually the real problem with agents is that they sometimes forget that they are just an agent working for a principal (a footballer) and begin to imagine that it's the other way round !
Good agents do a great job and can offer skills to their clients which those clients are unlikely to have.

Nearly high noon for you Vegas mate,i honestly believe Wayne,and Matt will stay,......i have no doubt, because we are quality now,both players and teams are looking at us,and saying ssht we got this lot,or their going places,we want a piece of that.For all the junk inbetween that we have suffered the team we have now is the, BRIGHTON AND HOVE ALBION...As the big mans gift for all those years. UTA

Poyet said: “We are asking ourselves now whether we made a mistake not playing him at the beginning of the season.

The answer is "yes" Gus. Too cautious. You are quite right re the contract. If he leaves hopefully we won't go back to letting whoever fancies picking up the ball take the penalties

Well done for signing such a great player in the first place!!

Less cautious seems to be working incredibly well these past 5 matches

tonytowner1 wrote:
Poyet said: “We are asking ourselves now whether we made a mistake not playing him at the beginning of the season.

The answer is "yes" Gus. Too cautious. You are quite right re the contract. If he leaves hopefully we won't go back to letting whoever fancies picking up the ball take the penalties

Well done for signing such a great player in the first place!!

Less cautious seems to be working incredibly well these past 5 matches

Are you mad,he will stay,we love him,he knows that,he also knows we are for better things. UTA

tug509 wrote:
Nearly high noon for you Vegas mate,i honestly believe Wayne,and Matt will stay,......i have no doubt, because we are quality now,both players and teams are looking at us,and saying ssht we got this lot,or their going places,we want a piece of that.For all the junk inbetween that we have suffered the team we have now is the, BRIGHTON AND HOVE ALBION...As the big mans gift for all those years. UTA

Yep as I write it's just past, 'high noon.' Oddly enough the temps reach their highets here at 5pm, and not at midday as it does on most places.

Whilst I think both are having a ball playing in the stripes I think there is more chance of Upson staying than Bridge.

Stoke's manager told Upson, 'go earn yourself a contract with Brighton,' I think he knows it's the best thing for the player.
Bridge is on massive money right now and if we don't go up no way could we even come close to meeting what he can earn over here.
Neither player was required by their clubs as prem defenders, no other prem clubs took loan options on them, it seems as though the prem has written them off.

It might be that promotion would be enough to keep Bridge, maybe on a one year deal and then he boards a plane, on elast hoorah.

Claude Back wrote:

Old Scrote of the Amex wrote:

Jonathan Mouette wrote:
Is there anything like a 'gentleman's agreement' anymore? No. The pondlife also known as agents would never allow it.

Pondlife perhaps, but a necessary evil.

I don't think they are necessary.
Any reasonably intelligent person should be able to negotiate their own deal. Surely not all footballers can be that thick?

Surely you are not so thick as to think that most players would be better off without ever using one?

Vegas, i cant help myself,i truly think this bunch of lads will do the biz for us,and stick around for the Mighty Albion,we are good,very good in fact,these guys aren`t stupid,look at Leo,he recognises a good thing.We are the want to be at club. UTA

Eddy B wrote:
I thought Spanish Dave was a revelation in the centre of the park on Saturday...surely a position he should retain even when Vicente and Bridders are back. He may want a shot at the premiership sooner rather than later at his stage in his career. But personally I'd prefer to be a big fish pulling the strings at the Amex (premiership or championship) than a fringe reserve utility player at a "bigger" club. (Same goes for Gus as a manager!)

In response to your last sentence, what would be a fringe reserve utility manager at a "bigger" club?? Oh yes, I forgot, I suppose Rafa at Chelsea more or less fits that role.

tug509 wrote:
Vegas, i cant help myself,i truly think this bunch of lads will do the biz for us,and stick around for the Mighty Albion,we are good,very good in fact,these guys aren`t stupid,look at Leo,he recognises a good thing.We are the want to be at club. UTA

Hehe. I sense you are starting to get rather excited at The Albion's prospects, Tug! ;0)

Captain Haddock wrote:

tug509 wrote:
Vegas, i cant help myself,i truly think this bunch of lads will do the biz for us,and stick around for the Mighty Albion,we are good,very good in fact,these guys aren`t stupid,look at Leo,he recognises a good thing.We are the want to be at club. UTA

Hehe. I sense you are starting to get rather excited at The Albion's prospects, Tug! ;0)

Does it show Captain,i must admit i feel a bit like a kid on Christmas eve!. UTA