Brighton and Hove Albion posts losses of £14.7m

Albion chief executive Paul Barber

Albion chief executive Paul Barber

First published in Sport
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Brighton and Hove Albion has posted a £14.7million loss for last season – up from an £8.6m deficit the previous year.

The club enjoyed a boost in total sales in 2012/13. But an increase in wages and transfer fees along with a fall in TV money has seen the overall losses at the club increase by more than £6m.

The board now faces a race against time to reduce this season’s losses to £8m or face new penalties brought in by the Financial Fair Play regulations (FFP).

Chief executive Paul Barber said: “This set of results shows the reality of football in the Championship in recent years and demonstrates the very high cost of being competitive – with no guarantee of promotion to the Premier League.

“We had the highest average crowd in the Football League last season and we continued to grow revenues we can control but in order to compete at the top end of the Championship, we had to once again rely on another considerable investment from our chairman Tony Bloom.”

The annual accounts, which were released this afternoon, are for the 2012/13 season – their second at the American Express Community Stadium.

There were positives with an overall increase in sales from £22.1m in 2011/12 to £23.3m last season.

There was also a slight increase in ticketing, commercial and retail sales with a boost from £13.8m to £14.3m.

This was expected with the increased capacity at home games. However, overall turnover at the club was pegged back by a huge rise in “football costs”.

The £20.9m bill, up from £14.8m the previous year, is largely from the increase in wages and transfer fees with the club looking to gain promotion to the Premier League.

A fall in money coming in for TV rights (£5.7m to £4.8m this season) along with £1.2m increase in administrative costs has also added to the clubs financial woes.

Describing the £14.7m loss as “a substantial amount of money”, Mr Barber added: “We shouldn’t underestimate how much money that is.

“And we shouldn’t underestimate the contribution that Tony Bloom has made not only to funding those loses but to previous loses.

“We have a responsibility not only to Tony but to the supporters to run the football club as efficiently as we can and reduce those loses as quickly as we can.

“The added incentive is that we now have a rule with FFP which says we have to.”

The FFP, which will be enforced for the first time this season, has been brought in by UEFA to encourage clubs to be more sustainable.

It states that Championship teams must run at an operating loss of no more than £8m or else face penalties.

Although the exact nature of the penalties is not yet known, they are expected to be in the way of fines and transfer restrictions.

Mr Barber told The Argus that reducing the clubs losses to £8m by the end of this season was “tough” but added he was “confident” they would achieve it.

Comments (48)

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5:11pm Wed 5 Feb 14

concernedofBrighton says...

Greedy players out for as much as they can get.

Yes, short career, but why not do as we do in the real world. Re-train for a new career?
Greedy players out for as much as they can get. Yes, short career, but why not do as we do in the real world. Re-train for a new career? concernedofBrighton
  • Score: 6

5:15pm Wed 5 Feb 14

WestStander17 says...

Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m.

Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing!

Vegas?
Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m. Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing! Vegas? WestStander17
  • Score: 9

5:23pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Cory and Trevor says...

FFP penalties had better be very severe. The likes of Forest and Blackburn are not adhering to it by a long chalk, and i bet they're not the only ones.

If a club like Forest gets to the Prem after ignoring FFP rules, benefits from the huge revenue that that brings, only to receive a relatively paltry fine for breaching FFP, then the football authorities will have effectively rewarded cheating.

All will be revealed.
FFP penalties had better be very severe. The likes of Forest and Blackburn are not adhering to it by a long chalk, and i bet they're not the only ones. If a club like Forest gets to the Prem after ignoring FFP rules, benefits from the huge revenue that that brings, only to receive a relatively paltry fine for breaching FFP, then the football authorities will have effectively rewarded cheating. All will be revealed. Cory and Trevor
  • Score: 19

5:23pm Wed 5 Feb 14

sussexram40 says...

Somethings not right.Biggest gates and big losses???
Sounds like financial mis management or is it big payments out on the stadium??
We will have to become a selling club. Get in kids, train them up at the academy then sell them on for a profit.
Should have got more than 2.5m for Bridcutt too, he's already proved he's premier league class
Somethings not right.Biggest gates and big losses??? Sounds like financial mis management or is it big payments out on the stadium?? We will have to become a selling club. Get in kids, train them up at the academy then sell them on for a profit. Should have got more than 2.5m for Bridcutt too, he's already proved he's premier league class sussexram40
  • Score: -12

5:23pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Baldseagull says...

Thank you Tony.
Thank you Tony. Baldseagull
  • Score: 34

5:27pm Wed 5 Feb 14

WiseOldSeagull says...

This should smack everything back into perpective. The future of BHA is in our youth set up and the academy. We quite clearly cannot spend big money and it will be a while before we can spend the kind of sums we spent on CMS unless we sell or big money.

Brian Clough built a European Championsip winning team onhome grown talent and we can do the same. Southampton are doing it right now so it' not impossible. We just need to be realistic about what/who we can bring in to this club to take us to the next level. For me it's little gems like Rodney and investment in the youth that wil be our future. Afterall the most successful Man U we have seen was built on that philosophy so why should we not follow a template that works? It does take time though and we should all be patient.
This should smack everything back into perpective. The future of BHA is in our youth set up and the academy. We quite clearly cannot spend big money and it will be a while before we can spend the kind of sums we spent on CMS unless we sell or big money. Brian Clough built a European Championsip winning team onhome grown talent and we can do the same. Southampton are doing it right now so it' not impossible. We just need to be realistic about what/who we can bring in to this club to take us to the next level. For me it's little gems like Rodney and investment in the youth that wil be our future. Afterall the most successful Man U we have seen was built on that philosophy so why should we not follow a template that works? It does take time though and we should all be patient. WiseOldSeagull
  • Score: 19

5:37pm Wed 5 Feb 14

seegull fly in sky says...

Plum boober sine um plyers lot ov munnys a dooum lottrary tuckit e get e goed plyers. Sell e standium a get linonel messy sine a bryton UEA hurrah um bryton.
Plum boober sine um plyers lot ov munnys a dooum lottrary tuckit e get e goed plyers. Sell e standium a get linonel messy sine a bryton UEA hurrah um bryton. seegull fly in sky
  • Score: -25

5:42pm Wed 5 Feb 14

tyekkonderoga says...

What a lot of people still can't grasp, I feel, is the fact that miracles don't happen overnight. We're in the midst of that 5 Year Plan that a few have spoken of, which might possible turn into a ten year plan.

We must be truly thankful for how much Tony Bloom has and continues to nourish the club. At the moment, Money is perhaps less significant than Time. We have bags of time, a budding training ground about to burst forth like a blue and white rose, a very very good fan base and are in a great position in the league.

The club will go nowhere but up.
What a lot of people still can't grasp, I feel, is the fact that miracles don't happen overnight. We're in the midst of that 5 Year Plan that a few have spoken of, which might possible turn into a ten year plan. We must be truly thankful for how much Tony Bloom has and continues to nourish the club. At the moment, Money is perhaps less significant than Time. We have bags of time, a budding training ground about to burst forth like a blue and white rose, a very very good fan base and are in a great position in the league. The club will go nowhere but up. tyekkonderoga
  • Score: 28

5:42pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Aye Aye says...

As with any business, keeping a tight rein on the overhead is key to financial success. With limited opportunity for exponential growth in revenues, control of expenditure is the cornerstone of any ability there might be to reach the £8M deficit. With only marginal improvement to the income stream over previous year, it's hard to see how the target is to be reached without looking at the cost base, more especially (players) wages and transfer fees. The club cannot continue to depend on the largess of its principal stakeholder, even if FFP legislation allowed it, so the notion of holding on to our most valuable assets (in terms of the playing squad) is at odds with the necessity to move towards break-even.

This, therefore, demonstrates the strategic importance to the business of pursuing our policy of the development squad to (1) provide talent for the first team and (2) generate important revenues in the sale of young stars to bigger, wealthier clubs.

Cost-cutting is a quick fix and is sustainable moving forward. Players will not accept lower wages, clubs will not sell us their talented players at less than book value. Further trimming of the overhead may balance the books this year but sensible investment in the development of young talent, combined with commercial enterprise such as an on-site hotel complex etc. is absolutely the way forward for the Albion and gets my whole-hearted support.

In the meantime, bring on Saturday and let's get three points under our belts!

UTA
As with any business, keeping a tight rein on the overhead is key to financial success. With limited opportunity for exponential growth in revenues, control of expenditure is the cornerstone of any ability there might be to reach the £8M deficit. With only marginal improvement to the income stream over previous year, it's hard to see how the target is to be reached without looking at the cost base, more especially (players) wages and transfer fees. The club cannot continue to depend on the largess of its principal stakeholder, even if FFP legislation allowed it, so the notion of holding on to our most valuable assets (in terms of the playing squad) is at odds with the necessity to move towards break-even. This, therefore, demonstrates the strategic importance to the business of pursuing our policy of the development squad to (1) provide talent for the first team and (2) generate important revenues in the sale of young stars to bigger, wealthier clubs. Cost-cutting is a quick fix and is sustainable moving forward. Players will not accept lower wages, clubs will not sell us their talented players at less than book value. Further trimming of the overhead may balance the books this year but sensible investment in the development of young talent, combined with commercial enterprise such as an on-site hotel complex etc. is absolutely the way forward for the Albion and gets my whole-hearted support. In the meantime, bring on Saturday and let's get three points under our belts! UTA Aye Aye
  • Score: 11

5:45pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Aye Aye says...

Aye Aye wrote:
As with any business, keeping a tight rein on the overhead is key to financial success. With limited opportunity for exponential growth in revenues, control of expenditure is the cornerstone of any ability there might be to reach the £8M deficit. With only marginal improvement to the income stream over previous year, it's hard to see how the target is to be reached without looking at the cost base, more especially (players) wages and transfer fees. The club cannot continue to depend on the largess of its principal stakeholder, even if FFP legislation allowed it, so the notion of holding on to our most valuable assets (in terms of the playing squad) is at odds with the necessity to move towards break-even.

This, therefore, demonstrates the strategic importance to the business of pursuing our policy of the development squad to (1) provide talent for the first team and (2) generate important revenues in the sale of young stars to bigger, wealthier clubs.

Cost-cutting is a quick fix and is sustainable moving forward. Players will not accept lower wages, clubs will not sell us their talented players at less than book value. Further trimming of the overhead may balance the books this year but sensible investment in the development of young talent, combined with commercial enterprise such as an on-site hotel complex etc. is absolutely the way forward for the Albion and gets my whole-hearted support.

In the meantime, bring on Saturday and let's get three points under our belts!

UTA
Sorry, it should read ".Cost-cutting is a quick fix and is NOT sustainable moving forward". Proof read before you post in future AA!!!
[quote][p][bold]Aye Aye[/bold] wrote: As with any business, keeping a tight rein on the overhead is key to financial success. With limited opportunity for exponential growth in revenues, control of expenditure is the cornerstone of any ability there might be to reach the £8M deficit. With only marginal improvement to the income stream over previous year, it's hard to see how the target is to be reached without looking at the cost base, more especially (players) wages and transfer fees. The club cannot continue to depend on the largess of its principal stakeholder, even if FFP legislation allowed it, so the notion of holding on to our most valuable assets (in terms of the playing squad) is at odds with the necessity to move towards break-even. This, therefore, demonstrates the strategic importance to the business of pursuing our policy of the development squad to (1) provide talent for the first team and (2) generate important revenues in the sale of young stars to bigger, wealthier clubs. Cost-cutting is a quick fix and is sustainable moving forward. Players will not accept lower wages, clubs will not sell us their talented players at less than book value. Further trimming of the overhead may balance the books this year but sensible investment in the development of young talent, combined with commercial enterprise such as an on-site hotel complex etc. is absolutely the way forward for the Albion and gets my whole-hearted support. In the meantime, bring on Saturday and let's get three points under our belts! UTA[/p][/quote]Sorry, it should read ".Cost-cutting is a quick fix and is NOT sustainable moving forward". Proof read before you post in future AA!!! Aye Aye
  • Score: 1

5:48pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Robertostarlight says...

sussexram40 wrote:
Somethings not right.Biggest gates and big losses???
Sounds like financial mis management or is it big payments out on the stadium??
We will have to become a selling club. Get in kids, train them up at the academy then sell them on for a profit.
Should have got more than 2.5m for Bridcutt too, he's already proved he's premier league class
It does seem strange that this situation has arisen given the suppot here and perhaps explains our failure to sign anyone of any apparent significance in the transfer window. We are seemingly skint!

I agree that there must be an element of financial mismanagement here, if not now then before this particular management team were in place.

It is not hard to see now why Gus thought that there was no immediate future in the club and why he knew he could get Bridcutt at a bargain price last week. We were desperate for cash and he knew it. If this continues we can probably say goodbye to several more 'stars' in the summer.

Just when it was starting to look good.
[quote][p][bold]sussexram40[/bold] wrote: Somethings not right.Biggest gates and big losses??? Sounds like financial mis management or is it big payments out on the stadium?? We will have to become a selling club. Get in kids, train them up at the academy then sell them on for a profit. Should have got more than 2.5m for Bridcutt too, he's already proved he's premier league class[/p][/quote]It does seem strange that this situation has arisen given the suppot here and perhaps explains our failure to sign anyone of any apparent significance in the transfer window. We are seemingly skint! I agree that there must be an element of financial mismanagement here, if not now then before this particular management team were in place. It is not hard to see now why Gus thought that there was no immediate future in the club and why he knew he could get Bridcutt at a bargain price last week. We were desperate for cash and he knew it. If this continues we can probably say goodbye to several more 'stars' in the summer. Just when it was starting to look good. Robertostarlight
  • Score: -1

5:50pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Albion In Staffs says...

WiseOldSeagull wrote:
This should smack everything back into perpective. The future of BHA is in our youth set up and the academy. We quite clearly cannot spend big money and it will be a while before we can spend the kind of sums we spent on CMS unless we sell or big money.

Brian Clough built a European Championsip winning team onhome grown talent and we can do the same. Southampton are doing it right now so it' not impossible. We just need to be realistic about what/who we can bring in to this club to take us to the next level. For me it's little gems like Rodney and investment in the youth that wil be our future. Afterall the most successful Man U we have seen was built on that philosophy so why should we not follow a template that works? It does take time though and we should all be patient.
WOS, I agree with your overall sentiment, but you're a little awry with your memory on Forest! Of the 22 starting places over the two finals, only a small handful could be termed home grown. Anyway...
I do agree the way forward is with the kids and you are right to say Manchester United proved it. We have a decent crop and while that may mean transfer windows aren't as exciting as at some clubs, long may it continue.
[quote][p][bold]WiseOldSeagull[/bold] wrote: This should smack everything back into perpective. The future of BHA is in our youth set up and the academy. We quite clearly cannot spend big money and it will be a while before we can spend the kind of sums we spent on CMS unless we sell or big money. Brian Clough built a European Championsip winning team onhome grown talent and we can do the same. Southampton are doing it right now so it' not impossible. We just need to be realistic about what/who we can bring in to this club to take us to the next level. For me it's little gems like Rodney and investment in the youth that wil be our future. Afterall the most successful Man U we have seen was built on that philosophy so why should we not follow a template that works? It does take time though and we should all be patient.[/p][/quote]WOS, I agree with your overall sentiment, but you're a little awry with your memory on Forest! Of the 22 starting places over the two finals, only a small handful could be termed home grown. Anyway... I do agree the way forward is with the kids and you are right to say Manchester United proved it. We have a decent crop and while that may mean transfer windows aren't as exciting as at some clubs, long may it continue. Albion In Staffs
  • Score: 1

5:52pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Neville says...

Interesting sets of figures,especially bearing in mind the job cuts,supplier contracts renegotiated,policin
g costs greatly reduced and yet there is a 1.2m deficit on admin.
Player activity in/out and recent transfers should obviously lighten the deficit and again a figure of 6.1m on players wages and fees,again a difficult figure to comprehend when you consider who we have actually bought,also the playing budget was not fully used as yet for this season.
The future is the academy long term but the balancing act is to keep the fan momentum going and keep the season alive to maximise sales and avoid a tail off of fans.
A good cup run now seems priority and Rod Stewart concert and similar,plus World Cup Rugby 2015 will all be part of the plan to get revenue in.
The FFP issue is really clouded with no one really sure what action will be taken with offenders,that is unacceptable from EUFA,the sanctions etc should have been made crystal clear.
The PL is awash with money and it is clear that revenue streams need to be more evenly distributed through the leagues. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer.
Parachute payments need to be reviewed,clubs should not be allowed to offer 3yr plus contracts at PL money,there must be a cap somewhere along the line.
Unfortunately the PL is a cartel with little regard for the lower leagues.
Interesting sets of figures,especially bearing in mind the job cuts,supplier contracts renegotiated,policin g costs greatly reduced and yet there is a 1.2m deficit on admin. Player activity in/out and recent transfers should obviously lighten the deficit and again a figure of 6.1m on players wages and fees,again a difficult figure to comprehend when you consider who we have actually bought,also the playing budget was not fully used as yet for this season. The future is the academy long term but the balancing act is to keep the fan momentum going and keep the season alive to maximise sales and avoid a tail off of fans. A good cup run now seems priority and Rod Stewart concert and similar,plus World Cup Rugby 2015 will all be part of the plan to get revenue in. The FFP issue is really clouded with no one really sure what action will be taken with offenders,that is unacceptable from EUFA,the sanctions etc should have been made crystal clear. The PL is awash with money and it is clear that revenue streams need to be more evenly distributed through the leagues. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Parachute payments need to be reviewed,clubs should not be allowed to offer 3yr plus contracts at PL money,there must be a cap somewhere along the line. Unfortunately the PL is a cartel with little regard for the lower leagues. Neville
  • Score: 13

6:16pm Wed 5 Feb 14

bbb1969 says...

So in summer we lose Greer, Lopez and the loanees. We then use iur younsters and other players. 3 million saved there
So in summer we lose Greer, Lopez and the loanees. We then use iur younsters and other players. 3 million saved there bbb1969
  • Score: 2

6:32pm Wed 5 Feb 14

rolivan says...

Where is the money for the Academy coming from?
Where is the money for the Academy coming from? rolivan
  • Score: 0

6:35pm Wed 5 Feb 14

twonk says...

sussexram40 wrote:
Somethings not right.Biggest gates and big losses???
Sounds like financial mis management or is it big payments out on the stadium??
We will have to become a selling club. Get in kids, train them up at the academy then sell them on for a profit.
Should have got more than 2.5m for Bridcutt too, he's already proved he's premier league class
We did get more than £2.5 M. It was £3.25M plus add ons.
[quote][p][bold]sussexram40[/bold] wrote: Somethings not right.Biggest gates and big losses??? Sounds like financial mis management or is it big payments out on the stadium?? We will have to become a selling club. Get in kids, train them up at the academy then sell them on for a profit. Should have got more than 2.5m for Bridcutt too, he's already proved he's premier league class[/p][/quote]We did get more than £2.5 M. It was £3.25M plus add ons. twonk
  • Score: 0

6:36pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Steveg1958 says...

I'm a bit confused ! (nothing new there !), can someone from the club explain an increase in Admin costs of £1.2 M when they sacked half the staff ?
I'm a bit confused ! (nothing new there !), can someone from the club explain an increase in Admin costs of £1.2 M when they sacked half the staff ? Steveg1958
  • Score: 10

6:37pm Wed 5 Feb 14

OldGull says...

sussexram40 wrote:
Somethings not right.Biggest gates and big losses???
Sounds like financial mis management or is it big payments out on the stadium??
We will have to become a selling club. Get in kids, train them up at the academy then sell them on for a profit.
Should have got more than 2.5m for Bridcutt too, he's already proved he's premier league class
you may remember, the capacity was increased from 22000 to 30000 during last season.
Who do you think paid for that?
Also they have started work on the training facility. The cost of design & planning applications would also need to be paid for.

Setting up such a big operation it must take time before the company sees a profit. In the meantime we have to be patient and grow gradually.
Walk before you can Run
[quote][p][bold]sussexram40[/bold] wrote: Somethings not right.Biggest gates and big losses??? Sounds like financial mis management or is it big payments out on the stadium?? We will have to become a selling club. Get in kids, train them up at the academy then sell them on for a profit. Should have got more than 2.5m for Bridcutt too, he's already proved he's premier league class[/p][/quote]you may remember, the capacity was increased from 22000 to 30000 during last season. Who do you think paid for that? Also they have started work on the training facility. The cost of design & planning applications would also need to be paid for. Setting up such a big operation it must take time before the company sees a profit. In the meantime we have to be patient and grow gradually. Walk before you can Run OldGull
  • Score: 13

6:48pm Wed 5 Feb 14

SMF20 says...

FFP is here to stay and so with that in mind lets do away with transfer fees, which in turn will rid the game of agents and agent fees and lets put a cap on wages based on the division you reside in.

It would give a fair playing field to every club in every division and a players contract would suddenly mean something... You sign for 2 years... You're with that club for 2 years... Negotiation happens 3 months prior to contract end re extension or player walks at end of contract.
No buying promotion, No astronomical fees, No clubs going out of business and a fair playing field for all.

Clubs will still get both promoted and relegated and thus either gain the riches of the division above or lose a bit of bounty should they drop down one.

Players will gain by losing they will not lose out on what might have been elsewhere and will not have their head turned by money should another club show an interest.

It would take a lot of work and setting up but why couldn't this work if everyone knew at outset what they were signing for?

You'd even know your top end salary if you were a player should you get promoted or relegated.

Uta
FFP is here to stay and so with that in mind lets do away with transfer fees, which in turn will rid the game of agents and agent fees and lets put a cap on wages based on the division you reside in. It would give a fair playing field to every club in every division and a players contract would suddenly mean something... You sign for 2 years... You're with that club for 2 years... Negotiation happens 3 months prior to contract end re extension or player walks at end of contract. No buying promotion, No astronomical fees, No clubs going out of business and a fair playing field for all. Clubs will still get both promoted and relegated and thus either gain the riches of the division above or lose a bit of bounty should they drop down one. Players will gain by losing they will not lose out on what might have been elsewhere and will not have their head turned by money should another club show an interest. It would take a lot of work and setting up but why couldn't this work if everyone knew at outset what they were signing for? You'd even know your top end salary if you were a player should you get promoted or relegated. Uta SMF20
  • Score: 1

6:48pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Withdean-er says...

This confirms indisputably that Bloom (subsidising yet further out of his own pocket) and Barber, financially supported Poyet to an extent we couldn't really afford and since outlawed by FFP. In other words, transfer fees/associated agents fees/players wages, on the likes of Bridge (our share of his wages), Vicente, Orlandi, Upson, Lopez, Bruno, Hammond, Crofts, CMS, Hoskins - were far in excess of what our operating cash inflows should have been spent on. A pushy Poyet made his demands, "if only I had this additional player, then ....... ", and the Board fell for it, until enough was enough. Without Bloom, this could have been a repetition of countless other examples of the same, such as pushy Redknapp getting his way with the Portsmouth Board, also Palace, Leicester and Southampton have had one or more insolvencies.

These figures are a reality check for me, in that FFP is a good thing in tempering this madness. We cough up our relatively small contribution on season tickets, programmes and a snack (and then a vocal minority of whiners moan about the increasing cost of that lot), but Bloom meets the vast extra sum, on top of subsidising over £100 on the Amex and Lancing.

Looks like squad quality will have to reduce further to get us within FFP, and we will a mid table club at best, until such time that we get lucky with either an incredible coach, youth policy, or outside investor, to compete with PL parachute payment clubs and the clubs blatantly cheating with their star-studded squad (Forest and Leicester).
This confirms indisputably that Bloom (subsidising yet further out of his own pocket) and Barber, financially supported Poyet to an extent we couldn't really afford and since outlawed by FFP. In other words, transfer fees/associated agents fees/players wages, on the likes of Bridge (our share of his wages), Vicente, Orlandi, Upson, Lopez, Bruno, Hammond, Crofts, CMS, Hoskins - were far in excess of what our operating cash inflows should have been spent on. A pushy Poyet made his demands, "if only I had this additional player, then ....... ", and the Board fell for it, until enough was enough. Without Bloom, this could have been a repetition of countless other examples of the same, such as pushy Redknapp getting his way with the Portsmouth Board, also Palace, Leicester and Southampton have had one or more insolvencies. These figures are a reality check for me, in that FFP is a good thing in tempering this madness. We cough up our relatively small contribution on season tickets, programmes and a snack (and then a vocal minority of whiners moan about the increasing cost of that lot), but Bloom meets the vast extra sum, on top of subsidising over £100 on the Amex and Lancing. Looks like squad quality will have to reduce further to get us within FFP, and we will a mid table club at best, until such time that we get lucky with either an incredible coach, youth policy, or outside investor, to compete with PL parachute payment clubs and the clubs blatantly cheating with their star-studded squad (Forest and Leicester). Withdean-er
  • Score: 11

6:51pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Withdean-er says...

Withdean-er wrote:
This confirms indisputably that Bloom (subsidising yet further out of his own pocket) and Barber, financially supported Poyet to an extent we couldn't really afford and since outlawed by FFP. In other words, transfer fees/associated agents fees/players wages, on the likes of Bridge (our share of his wages), Vicente, Orlandi, Upson, Lopez, Bruno, Hammond, Crofts, CMS, Hoskins - were far in excess of what our operating cash inflows should have been spent on. A pushy Poyet made his demands, "if only I had this additional player, then ....... ", and the Board fell for it, until enough was enough. Without Bloom, this could have been a repetition of countless other examples of the same, such as pushy Redknapp getting his way with the Portsmouth Board, also Palace, Leicester and Southampton have had one or more insolvencies.

These figures are a reality check for me, in that FFP is a good thing in tempering this madness. We cough up our relatively small contribution on season tickets, programmes and a snack (and then a vocal minority of whiners moan about the increasing cost of that lot), but Bloom meets the vast extra sum, on top of subsidising over £100 on the Amex and Lancing.

Looks like squad quality will have to reduce further to get us within FFP, and we will a mid table club at best, until such time that we get lucky with either an incredible coach, youth policy, or outside investor, to compete with PL parachute payment clubs and the clubs blatantly cheating with their star-studded squad (Forest and Leicester).
Correction - Bloom has invested > £100M, not £100!
[quote][p][bold]Withdean-er[/bold] wrote: This confirms indisputably that Bloom (subsidising yet further out of his own pocket) and Barber, financially supported Poyet to an extent we couldn't really afford and since outlawed by FFP. In other words, transfer fees/associated agents fees/players wages, on the likes of Bridge (our share of his wages), Vicente, Orlandi, Upson, Lopez, Bruno, Hammond, Crofts, CMS, Hoskins - were far in excess of what our operating cash inflows should have been spent on. A pushy Poyet made his demands, "if only I had this additional player, then ....... ", and the Board fell for it, until enough was enough. Without Bloom, this could have been a repetition of countless other examples of the same, such as pushy Redknapp getting his way with the Portsmouth Board, also Palace, Leicester and Southampton have had one or more insolvencies. These figures are a reality check for me, in that FFP is a good thing in tempering this madness. We cough up our relatively small contribution on season tickets, programmes and a snack (and then a vocal minority of whiners moan about the increasing cost of that lot), but Bloom meets the vast extra sum, on top of subsidising over £100 on the Amex and Lancing. Looks like squad quality will have to reduce further to get us within FFP, and we will a mid table club at best, until such time that we get lucky with either an incredible coach, youth policy, or outside investor, to compete with PL parachute payment clubs and the clubs blatantly cheating with their star-studded squad (Forest and Leicester).[/p][/quote]Correction - Bloom has invested > £100M, not £100! Withdean-er
  • Score: 3

6:59pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Withdean-er says...

OldGull wrote:
sussexram40 wrote:
Somethings not right.Biggest gates and big losses???
Sounds like financial mis management or is it big payments out on the stadium??
We will have to become a selling club. Get in kids, train them up at the academy then sell them on for a profit.
Should have got more than 2.5m for Bridcutt too, he's already proved he's premier league class
you may remember, the capacity was increased from 22000 to 30000 during last season.
Who do you think paid for that?
Also they have started work on the training facility. The cost of design & planning applications would also need to be paid for.

Setting up such a big operation it must take time before the company sees a profit. In the meantime we have to be patient and grow gradually.
Walk before you can Run
Good sentiments, but factually wrong. The entire cost of the Amex and Lancing, including related professionals fees, are capitalised to Fixed Assets in the Balance Sheet and have no direct impact on losses. Then separately once a capital project is complete, a relatively small depreciation charge is made to the Profit and Loss account annually on the buildings (non-land) element of the capital projects cost, spread say over 50 or 75 years. This is all disclosed in the published audited accounts each year, and are mandatory and normal accounting treatments.

This vast losses really have originated solely from wages and employers national insurance, elec., stock, write of transfer fees over contract lengths, agents fees, rates, match-day transport, grounds maintenance, rent of other premises - exceeding income.
[quote][p][bold]OldGull[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sussexram40[/bold] wrote: Somethings not right.Biggest gates and big losses??? Sounds like financial mis management or is it big payments out on the stadium?? We will have to become a selling club. Get in kids, train them up at the academy then sell them on for a profit. Should have got more than 2.5m for Bridcutt too, he's already proved he's premier league class[/p][/quote]you may remember, the capacity was increased from 22000 to 30000 during last season. Who do you think paid for that? Also they have started work on the training facility. The cost of design & planning applications would also need to be paid for. Setting up such a big operation it must take time before the company sees a profit. In the meantime we have to be patient and grow gradually. Walk before you can Run[/p][/quote]Good sentiments, but factually wrong. The entire cost of the Amex and Lancing, including related professionals fees, are capitalised to Fixed Assets in the Balance Sheet and have no direct impact on losses. Then separately once a capital project is complete, a relatively small depreciation charge is made to the Profit and Loss account annually on the buildings (non-land) element of the capital projects cost, spread say over 50 or 75 years. This is all disclosed in the published audited accounts each year, and are mandatory and normal accounting treatments. This vast losses really have originated solely from wages and employers national insurance, elec., stock, write of transfer fees over contract lengths, agents fees, rates, match-day transport, grounds maintenance, rent of other premises - exceeding income. Withdean-er
  • Score: 6

7:01pm Wed 5 Feb 14

jyan says...

I thought Paul Barber was supposed to sort this out, what a failure. Sack him and replace with someone cheaper and better with getting the books balanced.
I thought Paul Barber was supposed to sort this out, what a failure. Sack him and replace with someone cheaper and better with getting the books balanced. jyan
  • Score: 0

7:14pm Wed 5 Feb 14

pebble counter says...

WestStander17 wrote:
Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m.

Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing!

Vegas?
Are you in love with Vegas?
[quote][p][bold]WestStander17[/bold] wrote: Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m. Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing! Vegas?[/p][/quote]Are you in love with Vegas? pebble counter
  • Score: 5

7:34pm Wed 5 Feb 14

ahseagull says...

In reality the notion of achieving annual losses of £8m a year is not the right target, unless of course Tony Bloom or a n other is prepared to invest £8m every year into the club. The aim should be breakeven. This, or profitability is the only way for any business to survive.
While we all crave premiership football at the Amex survival is more important. Hopefully the last 20 years have tought BHA supporters that.
Here's wishing for survival and success in the Premiership eventually.
In reality the notion of achieving annual losses of £8m a year is not the right target, unless of course Tony Bloom or a n other is prepared to invest £8m every year into the club. The aim should be breakeven. This, or profitability is the only way for any business to survive. While we all crave premiership football at the Amex survival is more important. Hopefully the last 20 years have tought BHA supporters that. Here's wishing for survival and success in the Premiership eventually. ahseagull
  • Score: 5

7:59pm Wed 5 Feb 14

kentgull2 says...

pebble counter wrote:
WestStander17 wrote: Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m. Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing! Vegas?
Are you in love with Vegas?
Can't understand why Vegas is held in such high esteem, he watches about three televised games a season and is looked upon as the voice of authority on all things Albion , despite numerous of his posts proving he is anything but!!!
[quote][p][bold]pebble counter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]WestStander17[/bold] wrote: Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m. Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing! Vegas?[/p][/quote]Are you in love with Vegas?[/p][/quote]Can't understand why Vegas is held in such high esteem, he watches about three televised games a season and is looked upon as the voice of authority on all things Albion , despite numerous of his posts proving he is anything but!!! kentgull2
  • Score: 4

8:00pm Wed 5 Feb 14

WestStander17 says...

pebble counter wrote:
WestStander17 wrote:
Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m.

Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing!

Vegas?
Are you in love with Vegas?
Its a great place! Have you been? If not, you should!
[quote][p][bold]pebble counter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]WestStander17[/bold] wrote: Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m. Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing! Vegas?[/p][/quote]Are you in love with Vegas?[/p][/quote]Its a great place! Have you been? If not, you should! WestStander17
  • Score: 1

8:02pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Aldrington Halt says...

Steveg1958 wrote:
I'm a bit confused ! (nothing new there !), can someone from the club explain an increase in Admin costs of £1.2 M when they sacked half the staff ?
Barber's cut?
[quote][p][bold]Steveg1958[/bold] wrote: I'm a bit confused ! (nothing new there !), can someone from the club explain an increase in Admin costs of £1.2 M when they sacked half the staff ?[/p][/quote]Barber's cut? Aldrington Halt
  • Score: -2

8:05pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Aldrington Halt says...

Spell checker Ben James! Losses not loses, come on you're paid for this?
Spell checker Ben James! Losses not loses, come on you're paid for this? Aldrington Halt
  • Score: 0

8:06pm Wed 5 Feb 14

To baldly go says...

Steveg1958 wrote:
I'm a bit confused ! (nothing new there !), can someone from the club explain an increase in Admin costs of £1.2 M when they sacked half the staff ?
Sg, the Admin costs are 2012/13 season, the staff cut backs go towards 2013/14 season costs. Last season the club were still learning how the stadium ticked plus you had extra staff bought in as the capacity was increased, now they know how it runs a bit better they can manage with less staff.
[quote][p][bold]Steveg1958[/bold] wrote: I'm a bit confused ! (nothing new there !), can someone from the club explain an increase in Admin costs of £1.2 M when they sacked half the staff ?[/p][/quote]Sg, the Admin costs are 2012/13 season, the staff cut backs go towards 2013/14 season costs. Last season the club were still learning how the stadium ticked plus you had extra staff bought in as the capacity was increased, now they know how it runs a bit better they can manage with less staff. To baldly go
  • Score: 2

8:28pm Wed 5 Feb 14

Joel'sGrandad says...

I'm not an accountant. Wouldn't want to be a cost of everything, value of nothing merchant.
What I do know is if we're making these losses with our budget then our rivals must be making much,much bigger losses and will pay the penalty over FFP.
Let's hope the League will do what it promises and do the right thing.
Accordingly let's hope our great club will stop these losses without endangering our Championship status.
It's going to be tough but we don't need star players(already) just develop our scouting network and pick up good prospects and develop them ourselves.
This explains our failure to sign some players in the window.
But I'd rather we stayed a good Championship side at the moment rather than get in the PL and end up like Pompey.
I'm not an accountant. Wouldn't want to be a cost of everything, value of nothing merchant. What I do know is if we're making these losses with our budget then our rivals must be making much,much bigger losses and will pay the penalty over FFP. Let's hope the League will do what it promises and do the right thing. Accordingly let's hope our great club will stop these losses without endangering our Championship status. It's going to be tough but we don't need star players(already) just develop our scouting network and pick up good prospects and develop them ourselves. This explains our failure to sign some players in the window. But I'd rather we stayed a good Championship side at the moment rather than get in the PL and end up like Pompey. Joel'sGrandad
  • Score: 7

8:31pm Wed 5 Feb 14

gordongull says...

Vegas is my favourite wind-up merchant on this site :)
Vegas is my favourite wind-up merchant on this site :) gordongull
  • Score: 0

8:51pm Wed 5 Feb 14

pablobrowno says...

Something is drastically wrong with the game (we knew that) when a team like Brighton cannot break even with a brand new stadium (less maintenance) and the biggest crowds in the second tier. It's like a football version of the housing bubble, rich investors have inflated transfer fees and wages far beyond a sustainable level. At one point there must be a collapse, but it must be the prices and wages rather than the football league clubs themselves!!

Shocking really....
Something is drastically wrong with the game (we knew that) when a team like Brighton cannot break even with a brand new stadium (less maintenance) and the biggest crowds in the second tier. It's like a football version of the housing bubble, rich investors have inflated transfer fees and wages far beyond a sustainable level. At one point there must be a collapse, but it must be the prices and wages rather than the football league clubs themselves!! Shocking really.... pablobrowno
  • Score: 12

9:03pm Wed 5 Feb 14

HJarrs says...

B&H Albion is no doubt one of the most fan friendly clubs in the country. It sets a really good example and I have enjoyed my visits to the stadium. However, football in this country is a financial basket case. From the figures above, the Albion is making losses of £14.7million for a turnover of £23.3 million. That is a loss of 63%, thank goodness for the munificence of Tony Bloom! There is no prospect of breaking even, despite getting 30000 a week. Without a rich benefactor, the Albion would be immediately placed into bankruptcy along with pretty much the rest of the football league and Premiership. That considered, the fair play rules are probably a saviour for a sport unable to save itself. Once the new rules are brought in, I hope they ratchet down on the debt levels and make clubs a profitable proposition.

Ultimately, I would like clubs to follow the German model of fan ownership, I have had a great time watching football there in full stadiums at half the price it costs here and the clubs are not taken over by rich foreigners who only want the club as a trinket. That must be the way to go?
B&H Albion is no doubt one of the most fan friendly clubs in the country. It sets a really good example and I have enjoyed my visits to the stadium. However, football in this country is a financial basket case. From the figures above, the Albion is making losses of £14.7million for a turnover of £23.3 million. That is a loss of 63%, thank goodness for the munificence of Tony Bloom! There is no prospect of breaking even, despite getting 30000 a week. Without a rich benefactor, the Albion would be immediately placed into bankruptcy along with pretty much the rest of the football league and Premiership. That considered, the fair play rules are probably a saviour for a sport unable to save itself. Once the new rules are brought in, I hope they ratchet down on the debt levels and make clubs a profitable proposition. Ultimately, I would like clubs to follow the German model of fan ownership, I have had a great time watching football there in full stadiums at half the price it costs here and the clubs are not taken over by rich foreigners who only want the club as a trinket. That must be the way to go? HJarrs
  • Score: 6

9:05pm Wed 5 Feb 14

gordongull says...

Pompey have set the ball rolling!
Pompey have set the ball rolling! gordongull
  • Score: 0

10:03pm Wed 5 Feb 14

gordongull says...

gordongull wrote:
Pompey have set the ball rolling!
This refers to HJarrs comment re: fan-owned clubs, though it could easily be mistaken as referring to the subject of the thread.
We could all tell the manager to play two up front!
[quote][p][bold]gordongull[/bold] wrote: Pompey have set the ball rolling![/p][/quote]This refers to HJarrs comment re: fan-owned clubs, though it could easily be mistaken as referring to the subject of the thread. We could all tell the manager to play two up front! gordongull
  • Score: 0

12:21am Thu 6 Feb 14

EastWorthingExocetMissile says...

At the start of the season there was numerous posters on here arguing that we should have bought Wayne bridge and outbid reading in wages for his services. He is reportedly on £26,000 a week there and would have broken our wage structure. The most we pay is reportedly £12,000 a week.
The buy your wAy to success route by rich benefactors only works if the benefactor stays alive for ever even if he passionately supports the club. Just look At jack walker at Blackburn.
If bloom died tommorrow as did our previous directors in a helicopter crash in 1984, we would again spiral into debt.
The club needs to be self - sustainable in the long term and the training academy is about this. It may take a few years but so be it. But it will test the nerve and loyalty of our new found supporters. The club has no choice but to accept this and cut his cloth accordingly.
The fact that the club split the season tickets monthly, ( hardly any other clubs do this) hopefully will encourage people to still keep coming and paying the money. But I would be reluctant to raise season ticket prices above inflation this year as I feel this will cause own exodus. People must remember that we sold thousands of new season tickets after we beat Blackpool 6-1 last year at home and people though we may well reach the premiership. These people were always going to be hard to retain and many clearly don't come know despite having paid for there ticket, judging by the frequent gaps in the crowd.
At the start of the season there was numerous posters on here arguing that we should have bought Wayne bridge and outbid reading in wages for his services. He is reportedly on £26,000 a week there and would have broken our wage structure. The most we pay is reportedly £12,000 a week. The buy your wAy to success route by rich benefactors only works if the benefactor stays alive for ever even if he passionately supports the club. Just look At jack walker at Blackburn. If bloom died tommorrow as did our previous directors in a helicopter crash in 1984, we would again spiral into debt. The club needs to be self - sustainable in the long term and the training academy is about this. It may take a few years but so be it. But it will test the nerve and loyalty of our new found supporters. The club has no choice but to accept this and cut his cloth accordingly. The fact that the club split the season tickets monthly, ( hardly any other clubs do this) hopefully will encourage people to still keep coming and paying the money. But I would be reluctant to raise season ticket prices above inflation this year as I feel this will cause own exodus. People must remember that we sold thousands of new season tickets after we beat Blackpool 6-1 last year at home and people though we may well reach the premiership. These people were always going to be hard to retain and many clearly don't come know despite having paid for there ticket, judging by the frequent gaps in the crowd. EastWorthingExocetMissile
  • Score: 5

1:21am Thu 6 Feb 14

WestStander17 says...

kentgull2 wrote:
pebble counter wrote:
WestStander17 wrote: Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m. Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing! Vegas?
Are you in love with Vegas?
Can't understand why Vegas is held in such high esteem, he watches about three televised games a season and is looked upon as the voice of authority on all things Albion , despite numerous of his posts proving he is anything but!!!
I often disagree with Vegas' opinions on the Football side of things (although I think he does very well to follow everything as closely as he does) but he does seem to know about the ins and outs of the FFP rules, through research I guess. Certainly more than I do as, to be honest, it doesn't really interest me!

I think its great if we are one of the few clubs that actually adhere to it but, from what I can see, there is some risk to that as if the punishments are small, everyone is better off breaking the rules and we will be at a handicap on the field.
[quote][p][bold]kentgull2[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]pebble counter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]WestStander17[/bold] wrote: Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m. Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing! Vegas?[/p][/quote]Are you in love with Vegas?[/p][/quote]Can't understand why Vegas is held in such high esteem, he watches about three televised games a season and is looked upon as the voice of authority on all things Albion , despite numerous of his posts proving he is anything but!!![/p][/quote]I often disagree with Vegas' opinions on the Football side of things (although I think he does very well to follow everything as closely as he does) but he does seem to know about the ins and outs of the FFP rules, through research I guess. Certainly more than I do as, to be honest, it doesn't really interest me! I think its great if we are one of the few clubs that actually adhere to it but, from what I can see, there is some risk to that as if the punishments are small, everyone is better off breaking the rules and we will be at a handicap on the field. WestStander17
  • Score: 3

8:04am Thu 6 Feb 14

Plantpot says...

Soccer is unsustainable as it stands. For as long as clubs pay eye watering salaries in return for players simply turning up, there will be a problem. I am amazed that the fans (or customers as they really are) haven't yet worked out that they are there simply to support other people's lifestyles.

At least the bankers only get huge sums of money when they deliver huge profits or achieve their objectives.
Soccer is unsustainable as it stands. For as long as clubs pay eye watering salaries in return for players simply turning up, there will be a problem. I am amazed that the fans (or customers as they really are) haven't yet worked out that they are there simply to support other people's lifestyles. At least the bankers only get huge sums of money when they deliver huge profits or achieve their objectives. Plantpot
  • Score: -5

8:06am Thu 6 Feb 14

Plantpot says...

If Tony Bloom continues to subsidise the club, how does that fall within the financial fair play rules? Money going into infrastructure is effectively a subsidy of the playing side.
If Tony Bloom continues to subsidise the club, how does that fall within the financial fair play rules? Money going into infrastructure is effectively a subsidy of the playing side. Plantpot
  • Score: -3

9:17am Thu 6 Feb 14

SUSSEX_LIONESS says...

totally agree on the FFP issues, with Forest, Blackburn, QPR mentioned as clubs who will stop at nothing to reach the promised land of the Premiership.
Palace and Cardiff did that and it pays even if you come straight back down with parachutes. FFP fines need to be maxed with massive points deductions as well as the paltry fines that are issued.
Still Albion have the Amex and we have the best Chairman in the UK! Albion Management need to rock the AMEX with Internationals and Pop concerts (bring on Fat Boy!) Big thanks to Norman there.
totally agree on the FFP issues, with Forest, Blackburn, QPR mentioned as clubs who will stop at nothing to reach the promised land of the Premiership. Palace and Cardiff did that and it pays even if you come straight back down with parachutes. FFP fines need to be maxed with massive points deductions as well as the paltry fines that are issued. Still Albion have the Amex and we have the best Chairman in the UK! Albion Management need to rock the AMEX with Internationals and Pop concerts (bring on Fat Boy!) Big thanks to Norman there. SUSSEX_LIONESS
  • Score: 0

9:19am Thu 6 Feb 14

pwlr1966 says...

I see LEEDS are on TV AGAIN, perhaps FFS should look into the way games/teams are shown on TV and share the money accross the football league instead of the few teams who are always shown
I see LEEDS are on TV AGAIN, perhaps FFS should look into the way games/teams are shown on TV and share the money accross the football league instead of the few teams who are always shown pwlr1966
  • Score: 2

2:27pm Thu 6 Feb 14

bIsleybill says...

Tony = super fan!

FFP better have teeth!
Tony = super fan! FFP better have teeth! bIsleybill
  • Score: 1

4:37pm Thu 6 Feb 14

VegasSeagull says...

WestStander17 wrote:
kentgull2 wrote:
pebble counter wrote:
WestStander17 wrote: Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m. Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing! Vegas?
Are you in love with Vegas?
Can't understand why Vegas is held in such high esteem, he watches about three televised games a season and is looked upon as the voice of authority on all things Albion , despite numerous of his posts proving he is anything but!!!
I often disagree with Vegas' opinions on the Football side of things (although I think he does very well to follow everything as closely as he does) but he does seem to know about the ins and outs of the FFP rules, through research I guess. Certainly more than I do as, to be honest, it doesn't really interest me!

I think its great if we are one of the few clubs that actually adhere to it but, from what I can see, there is some risk to that as if the punishments are small, everyone is better off breaking the rules and we will be at a handicap on the field.
I think some maybe missing how the FFP rules will, eventually, work in our favor, IF we can get our losses in order.
As soon as we reach the required break even status, and we will do that very quickly compared to most other clubs, we will have a period of time when we can buy players when others can not, and that will because other clubs will still be trying to claw back losses, and they might even have an embargo placed on them.

The big issue all clubs will face is just how much they can afford to pay in wages and transfer fees whilst bringing down their losses. My guess is that the figures will be low and if we are among the first clubs to reach break even status we will be able to buy the better players at a lower cost in both fees and wages.
If we reach our target loss figure this year we will still operate at a loss of 8 million, it is possible that we might clear that debt in two further seasons, break even in season, 2016/17. From that time on we will have a massive advantage over every club that is not at the same stage as us. We will also have our new academy up and running and one would hope by that time producing players for free, or almost free. The FFP rules could result in promotion for Brighton if, we can compete with the clubs receiving parachute payments, and I think we will be able to do so. We just missed out last year and we are in with a chance this year, two years when we have taken on clubs with parachute payments. The FFP hurts whilst you are trying to comply but once you reach the main goal of the FFP, those very rules work in your favor, we just need to make sure that we are one of the first clubs at our level to fully comply.
[quote][p][bold]WestStander17[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]kentgull2[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]pebble counter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]WestStander17[/bold] wrote: Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m. Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing! Vegas?[/p][/quote]Are you in love with Vegas?[/p][/quote]Can't understand why Vegas is held in such high esteem, he watches about three televised games a season and is looked upon as the voice of authority on all things Albion , despite numerous of his posts proving he is anything but!!![/p][/quote]I often disagree with Vegas' opinions on the Football side of things (although I think he does very well to follow everything as closely as he does) but he does seem to know about the ins and outs of the FFP rules, through research I guess. Certainly more than I do as, to be honest, it doesn't really interest me! I think its great if we are one of the few clubs that actually adhere to it but, from what I can see, there is some risk to that as if the punishments are small, everyone is better off breaking the rules and we will be at a handicap on the field.[/p][/quote]I think some maybe missing how the FFP rules will, eventually, work in our favor, IF we can get our losses in order. As soon as we reach the required break even status, and we will do that very quickly compared to most other clubs, we will have a period of time when we can buy players when others can not, and that will because other clubs will still be trying to claw back losses, and they might even have an embargo placed on them. The big issue all clubs will face is just how much they can afford to pay in wages and transfer fees whilst bringing down their losses. My guess is that the figures will be low and if we are among the first clubs to reach break even status we will be able to buy the better players at a lower cost in both fees and wages. If we reach our target loss figure this year we will still operate at a loss of 8 million, it is possible that we might clear that debt in two further seasons, break even in season, 2016/17. From that time on we will have a massive advantage over every club that is not at the same stage as us. We will also have our new academy up and running and one would hope by that time producing players for free, or almost free. The FFP rules could result in promotion for Brighton if, we can compete with the clubs receiving parachute payments, and I think we will be able to do so. We just missed out last year and we are in with a chance this year, two years when we have taken on clubs with parachute payments. The FFP hurts whilst you are trying to comply but once you reach the main goal of the FFP, those very rules work in your favor, we just need to make sure that we are one of the first clubs at our level to fully comply. VegasSeagull
  • Score: 4

9:06pm Sat 8 Feb 14

Captain Haddock says...

Aye Aye wrote:
As with any business, keeping a tight rein on the overhead is key to financial success. With limited opportunity for exponential growth in revenues, control of expenditure is the cornerstone of any ability there might be to reach the £8M deficit. With only marginal improvement to the income stream over previous year, it's hard to see how the target is to be reached without looking at the cost base, more especially (players) wages and transfer fees. The club cannot continue to depend on the largess of its principal stakeholder, even if FFP legislation allowed it, so the notion of holding on to our most valuable assets (in terms of the playing squad) is at odds with the necessity to move towards break-even. This, therefore, demonstrates the strategic importance to the business of pursuing our policy of the development squad to (1) provide talent for the first team and (2) generate important revenues in the sale of young stars to bigger, wealthier clubs. Cost-cutting is a quick fix and is sustainable moving forward. Players will not accept lower wages, clubs will not sell us their talented players at less than book value. Further trimming of the overhead may balance the books this year but sensible investment in the development of young talent, combined with commercial enterprise such as an on-site hotel complex etc. is absolutely the way forward for the Albion and gets my whole-hearted support. In the meantime, bring on Saturday and let's get three points under our belts! UTA
Superbly succinct and accurate statement on the state of affairs for us and football as a whole.

The policy to recruit future talent both in the longer and shorter term to the ends described by you above is already afoot in earnest.

We have attained players who may join the first team set-up anywhere in the next 18 months but also younger, rawer recruits for longer-term development.

This is indeed a crucial aspect of our model that has been foreseen by Tony B...thankfully!
[quote][p][bold]Aye Aye[/bold] wrote: As with any business, keeping a tight rein on the overhead is key to financial success. With limited opportunity for exponential growth in revenues, control of expenditure is the cornerstone of any ability there might be to reach the £8M deficit. With only marginal improvement to the income stream over previous year, it's hard to see how the target is to be reached without looking at the cost base, more especially (players) wages and transfer fees. The club cannot continue to depend on the largess of its principal stakeholder, even if FFP legislation allowed it, so the notion of holding on to our most valuable assets (in terms of the playing squad) is at odds with the necessity to move towards break-even. This, therefore, demonstrates the strategic importance to the business of pursuing our policy of the development squad to (1) provide talent for the first team and (2) generate important revenues in the sale of young stars to bigger, wealthier clubs. Cost-cutting is a quick fix and is sustainable moving forward. Players will not accept lower wages, clubs will not sell us their talented players at less than book value. Further trimming of the overhead may balance the books this year but sensible investment in the development of young talent, combined with commercial enterprise such as an on-site hotel complex etc. is absolutely the way forward for the Albion and gets my whole-hearted support. In the meantime, bring on Saturday and let's get three points under our belts! UTA[/p][/quote]Superbly succinct and accurate statement on the state of affairs for us and football as a whole. The policy to recruit future talent both in the longer and shorter term to the ends described by you above is already afoot in earnest. We have attained players who may join the first team set-up anywhere in the next 18 months but also younger, rawer recruits for longer-term development. This is indeed a crucial aspect of our model that has been foreseen by Tony B...thankfully! Captain Haddock
  • Score: 0

8:42am Sun 9 Feb 14

Captain Haddock says...

Plantpot wrote:
Soccer is unsustainable as it stands. For as long as clubs pay eye watering salaries in return for players simply turning up, there will be a problem. I am amazed that the fans (or customers as they really are) haven't yet worked out that they are there simply to support other people's lifestyles. At least the bankers only get huge sums of money when they deliver huge profits or achieve their objectives.
I'm amazed you think we don't. The point is we can't do anything about it. Boycotting matches could be done I suppose but as we are FANS that would never happen.

I know you'll never understand the joy or complicated nature of the relationship between a fan and it's club - nobody that refers to our great game as 'Soccer' (other than other English language-speaking countries' citizens) ever could, but it is as it is. The FFP initiative is the long-overdue sensible action necessary to force the hands of the greedier clubs / owners which in turn forces the hands of the real trouble-sources: the players and agents, who have had the power for too long.

Re: bankers: do they really only gain bonuses for success? I don't think so. Refer to economic history of the last ten years for details.
[quote][p][bold]Plantpot[/bold] wrote: Soccer is unsustainable as it stands. For as long as clubs pay eye watering salaries in return for players simply turning up, there will be a problem. I am amazed that the fans (or customers as they really are) haven't yet worked out that they are there simply to support other people's lifestyles. At least the bankers only get huge sums of money when they deliver huge profits or achieve their objectives.[/p][/quote]I'm amazed you think we don't. The point is we can't do anything about it. Boycotting matches could be done I suppose but as we are FANS that would never happen. I know you'll never understand the joy or complicated nature of the relationship between a fan and it's club - nobody that refers to our great game as 'Soccer' (other than other English language-speaking countries' citizens) ever could, but it is as it is. The FFP initiative is the long-overdue sensible action necessary to force the hands of the greedier clubs / owners which in turn forces the hands of the real trouble-sources: the players and agents, who have had the power for too long. Re: bankers: do they really only gain bonuses for success? I don't think so. Refer to economic history of the last ten years for details. Captain Haddock
  • Score: 0

8:52am Sun 9 Feb 14

Captain Haddock says...

pwlr1966 wrote:
I see LEEDS are on TV AGAIN, perhaps FFS should look into the way games/teams are shown on TV and share the money accross the football league instead of the few teams who are always shown
Yes how many times have they been on now this season? It's about treble our appearances. I know it's the tv company's opinion that the biggest clubs with the biggest draw sell more advertising etc etc but they are rewarding Leeds for their support - surely the fans should be the ones doing that - rather than for what they bring to the league. Leeds bore me. They aren't entertaining in style and look a tired record.
[quote][p][bold]pwlr1966[/bold] wrote: I see LEEDS are on TV AGAIN, perhaps FFS should look into the way games/teams are shown on TV and share the money accross the football league instead of the few teams who are always shown[/p][/quote]Yes how many times have they been on now this season? It's about treble our appearances. I know it's the tv company's opinion that the biggest clubs with the biggest draw sell more advertising etc etc but they are rewarding Leeds for their support - surely the fans should be the ones doing that - rather than for what they bring to the league. Leeds bore me. They aren't entertaining in style and look a tired record. Captain Haddock
  • Score: 0

8:55am Sun 9 Feb 14

Captain Haddock says...

VegasSeagull wrote:
WestStander17 wrote:
kentgull2 wrote:
pebble counter wrote:
WestStander17 wrote: Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m. Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing! Vegas?
Are you in love with Vegas?
Can't understand why Vegas is held in such high esteem, he watches about three televised games a season and is looked upon as the voice of authority on all things Albion , despite numerous of his posts proving he is anything but!!!
I often disagree with Vegas' opinions on the Football side of things (although I think he does very well to follow everything as closely as he does) but he does seem to know about the ins and outs of the FFP rules, through research I guess. Certainly more than I do as, to be honest, it doesn't really interest me!

I think its great if we are one of the few clubs that actually adhere to it but, from what I can see, there is some risk to that as if the punishments are small, everyone is better off breaking the rules and we will be at a handicap on the field.
I think some maybe missing how the FFP rules will, eventually, work in our favor, IF we can get our losses in order.
As soon as we reach the required break even status, and we will do that very quickly compared to most other clubs, we will have a period of time when we can buy players when others can not, and that will because other clubs will still be trying to claw back losses, and they might even have an embargo placed on them.

The big issue all clubs will face is just how much they can afford to pay in wages and transfer fees whilst bringing down their losses. My guess is that the figures will be low and if we are among the first clubs to reach break even status we will be able to buy the better players at a lower cost in both fees and wages.
If we reach our target loss figure this year we will still operate at a loss of 8 million, it is possible that we might clear that debt in two further seasons, break even in season, 2016/17. From that time on we will have a massive advantage over every club that is not at the same stage as us. We will also have our new academy up and running and one would hope by that time producing players for free, or almost free. The FFP rules could result in promotion for Brighton if, we can compete with the clubs receiving parachute payments, and I think we will be able to do so. We just missed out last year and we are in with a chance this year, two years when we have taken on clubs with parachute payments. The FFP hurts whilst you are trying to comply but once you reach the main goal of the FFP, those very rules work in your favor, we just need to make sure that we are one of the first clubs at our level to fully comply.
Agree and hope you are right regards rewards.
[quote][p][bold]VegasSeagull[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]WestStander17[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]kentgull2[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]pebble counter[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]WestStander17[/bold] wrote: Isn't the most important part of this story the last sentence? They are still confident of getting it back down to the magical £8m. Hate to think what some of the Championship clubs are doing! Vegas?[/p][/quote]Are you in love with Vegas?[/p][/quote]Can't understand why Vegas is held in such high esteem, he watches about three televised games a season and is looked upon as the voice of authority on all things Albion , despite numerous of his posts proving he is anything but!!![/p][/quote]I often disagree with Vegas' opinions on the Football side of things (although I think he does very well to follow everything as closely as he does) but he does seem to know about the ins and outs of the FFP rules, through research I guess. Certainly more than I do as, to be honest, it doesn't really interest me! I think its great if we are one of the few clubs that actually adhere to it but, from what I can see, there is some risk to that as if the punishments are small, everyone is better off breaking the rules and we will be at a handicap on the field.[/p][/quote]I think some maybe missing how the FFP rules will, eventually, work in our favor, IF we can get our losses in order. As soon as we reach the required break even status, and we will do that very quickly compared to most other clubs, we will have a period of time when we can buy players when others can not, and that will because other clubs will still be trying to claw back losses, and they might even have an embargo placed on them. The big issue all clubs will face is just how much they can afford to pay in wages and transfer fees whilst bringing down their losses. My guess is that the figures will be low and if we are among the first clubs to reach break even status we will be able to buy the better players at a lower cost in both fees and wages. If we reach our target loss figure this year we will still operate at a loss of 8 million, it is possible that we might clear that debt in two further seasons, break even in season, 2016/17. From that time on we will have a massive advantage over every club that is not at the same stage as us. We will also have our new academy up and running and one would hope by that time producing players for free, or almost free. The FFP rules could result in promotion for Brighton if, we can compete with the clubs receiving parachute payments, and I think we will be able to do so. We just missed out last year and we are in with a chance this year, two years when we have taken on clubs with parachute payments. The FFP hurts whilst you are trying to comply but once you reach the main goal of the FFP, those very rules work in your favor, we just need to make sure that we are one of the first clubs at our level to fully comply.[/p][/quote]Agree and hope you are right regards rewards. Captain Haddock
  • Score: 0

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