Mystery over Vicente return

10:18am Tuesday 9th October 2012 in Sport By Andy Naylor

Fallen idol. Will Vicente be ready for Boro? Fallen idol. Will Vicente be ready for Boro?

Albion return to action against Middlesbrough on Saturday week but will Vicente be there to join them?


  The Seagulls could certainly do with their chief unlocker of defences, especially now that teams are setting up to stop them both at home and away.


  Whether the enigmatic Spaniard will be available though remains a mystery, even to members of the inner sanctum at The Amex.


  According to the latest update from manager Gus Poyet, Vicente is scheduled to resume full training with the squad after the international break, together with hamstrung leading marksman Craig Mackail-Smith.


  The former Valencia playmaker cut a rather forlorn figure playing as a central striker in Mackail-Smith's absence in the opening match of the season, the Capital One Cup defeat at Swindon on August 14.


  He came on a week later for the last eight minutes of Albion's first home game of the campaign, the goalless draw against Cardiff. We have not seen him since, because of a thigh tendon injury.


  Poyet and his staff have not seen that much of Vicente either. He has been stuck for much of the time in the treatment room at the other end of the training ground at the University of Sussex sports complex at Falmer, across the road from the Stadium.


  Poyet's assistant, Mauricio Taricco, said: "It must be a really difficult time for him, frustrating that he cannot be playing. The important thing is that he keeps looking forward and trying to get back and we are going to be there for him.


  "He's quiet. It's difficult. He's not with us a lot of the time as well. We haven't got the greatest facilities in the world. All the injured players are on the other side of the training ground.


  "You see him maybe when you are having lunch, not as often as in other places where the medical room is close to where everybody is. It's difficult to have a lot of contact with injured players so you don't really know a lot about it.


  "Obviously, you know through the doctor and the physios, but you don't have that daily contact with the players that are fit, so it's difficult to say.


  "We imagine that it's difficult for him, because when you are injured that is the worst time for a football player."

Comments(70)

Gee Jay says...
10:35am Tue 9 Oct 12

Tanno, if the management team want contact with players that are in the treatment area, then they should get off their backsides and get themselves over there, or make the time to go over.
Never mind 'We haven't got the best facilities in the world' It's a brand new stadium for heaven's sake!
What will happen at Lancing, if the management team are at the Amex?
If Vincente is viewed as such an important piece of the jigsaw, then surely Gus, Tanno or Charlie should be over in the treatment area on a very regular basis to keep, not only Mr V. but any other players like Will Hoskins, feeling as though they are still very much part of the squad.

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Bob! says...
10:49am Tue 9 Oct 12

It does seem strange that the management team do not make the time to speak to the players receiving treatment, and that those players are not in team meetings.
I'm sure that it will be easier at Lancing as everybody will be in the same building for the majority of the time

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4everaseagull says...
10:55am Tue 9 Oct 12

Gee Jay wrote:
Tanno, if the management team want contact with players that are in the treatment area, then they should get off their backsides and get themselves over there, or make the time to go over.
Never mind 'We haven't got the best facilities in the world' It's a brand new stadium for heaven's sake!
What will happen at Lancing, if the management team are at the Amex?
If Vincente is viewed as such an important piece of the jigsaw, then surely Gus, Tanno or Charlie should be over in the treatment area on a very regular basis to keep, not only Mr V. but any other players like Will Hoskins, feeling as though they are still very much part of the squad.
I couldn't agree more Gee Jay. All very odd. I appreciate that during a normal day when the players train at the Uni Vicente is in the treatment room but surely just so as to keep the guys spirits up one of the management team should be dropping in to see how he is doing and with Will H as well. Either that or they have given up on him. Reminds me of how Fabio Capello managed. By all accounts if you are fit and playing great if however you are injured and out of the team Capello viewed it that you "were no good to me" until you were fit!

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ballantrrae says...
11:06am Tue 9 Oct 12

Gee Jay wrote:
Tanno, if the management team want contact with players that are in the treatment area, then they should get off their backsides and get themselves over there, or make the time to go over.
Never mind 'We haven't got the best facilities in the world' It's a brand new stadium for heaven's sake!
What will happen at Lancing, if the management team are at the Amex?
If Vincente is viewed as such an important piece of the jigsaw, then surely Gus, Tanno or Charlie should be over in the treatment area on a very regular basis to keep, not only Mr V. but any other players like Will Hoskins, feeling as though they are still very much part of the squad.
I second your 'common sense' posting Gee Jay.
Keeping in regular touch with injured players especially someone like Vicente living in a foreign country seems a minimum requirement.

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Jonathan Mouette says...
11:07am Tue 9 Oct 12

This attitude certainly explains a lot with regard to Will Hoskins who hasn't been mentioned in dispatches for quite a while... If it is indeed true that there is little or no contact with the injured then he has probably forgotten who he is even playing for... Much as there are so many things to admire at the club there are things which come to light and never cease to amaze me. Oh well.

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pjwilk says...
11:09am Tue 9 Oct 12

About time we pulled the plug on Vicente he is obviously a liability,should have let him stay where he was.We need players who are not injury prone.OK he is good when fit but when is he fit.

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Alan G Skinner says...
11:32am Tue 9 Oct 12

pjwilk wrote:
About time we pulled the plug on Vicente he is obviously a liability,should have let him stay where he was.We need players who are not injury prone.OK he is good when fit but when is he fit.
If you want to "Pull the plug", you have clearly not seen Vicente play!! When he gets fit, watching him is worth the ticket alone. He is breathtaking.

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wiseman of hove says...
11:42am Tue 9 Oct 12

As everybody has posted, ridiculous state of affairs. Excellent post by Gee Jay.
The comments attributed to the assistant manager are quite ludicrous - must be some mistake in the reporting.

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Gibseagull says...
11:49am Tue 9 Oct 12

Its bizarre if the management team do not make more effort to keep in touch with injured players, as is implied in this piece. With Mackail-Smith, Vicente and Hoskins all injured and with each of these players (yes, that includes Hoskins!) being key to our future success you would have thought they would make an extra effort to try and ensure they do not feel isolated or left out. This applies particularly to Vicente who is fairly introverted anyway by the sound of it. Add that to the fact that he's a long way from home, doesn't speak much English, probably finds the weather depressing and probably feels pretty isolated anyway then it becomes a serious ommission on "the management's" part.

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SMF20 says...
11:56am Tue 9 Oct 12

If MT has been quoted correctly and the management team are indeed not showing much of an interest in those on the treatment table then for me there is only one possible excuse and even then its pretty lame one and that is that the management team have made the decision that these players are not in squad plans moving forward. We all know what talent Vicente and indeed Hoskins have but maybe, just maybe Gp and his team have given up on them.

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heathgate says...
12:18pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Its appalling that the club dont give us a decent injury update once week or fortnight. They make a big song and dance about signing up all these high flying medical personnel, surely the progress or otherwise of the injured players is just a matter of record?..... come on Albion, what's the flam in score?

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kentseagull says...
12:24pm Tue 9 Oct 12

I dont think the management team are at the Amex - i think the point is that the management are taking training on the training pitches whilst injured players are being rehabilitated at the same site, however quite far away. It would seem sensible for the management to try and cheer them up a bit though...rather than a quick hello at lunchtime.

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wiseman of hove says...
12:56pm Tue 9 Oct 12

heathgate wrote:
Its appalling that the club dont give us a decent injury update once week or fortnight. They make a big song and dance about signing up all these high flying medical personnel, surely the progress or otherwise of the injured players is just a matter of record?..... come on Albion, what's the flam in score?
Yes - we have been told that we have fantastic people in place, Chief Executive, Head of Football Operations , Head of Sports Medicine etc etc and then along comes a report like this which quite rightly has been treated with derision.

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seagullsays says...
12:58pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Won't bother adding my thoughts regarding this lack of man-management skill, as they are along the same lines as those posted above. However, and I may be in the minority, but I've virtually given up on Vicente anyway.

I'm not sure he wants to be here after the contract issues of the summer, and his injury record, which has been an issue for him for years, just doesn't seem to improve. Whilst I agree with Alan Skinner, he is a terrific player to watch, he just doesn't play enough. Is it time to move on, cancel his contract and let him go to Elche (or wherever it was that he wanted to go to). Maybe this would free up some extra funds for the big striker.

Just my thoughts, which count for nothing, but there they are anyway!

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rolivan says...
1:12pm Tue 9 Oct 12

wiseman of hove wrote:
As everybody has posted, ridiculous state of affairs. Excellent post by Gee Jay.
The comments attributed to the assistant manager are quite ludicrous - must be some mistake in the reporting.
This report was pulled from the Interview Tanno did last week before the Derby game if you want to see it in full just go to the seagulls site.As for the updates re injuries Gus and Tanno always give updates if the questions are asked by the reporters at the press conferences on a weekly basis.Most of what you read on here is available on the website there is never any real news that is unavailable.I mentioned about Vicente to Johnny and Warren in a phone in a couple of weeks ago when I asked if there was something other than an injury that was keeping him from playing and Warren said straight away it was a Tendon problem.Although I am a great admirer of Vicente we were doing well without him up until Macca got injured.It seems Macca has become the Talisman.

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mark5 says...
1:16pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Seagullsays, do not put yourself down! Your thoughts and opinions are in my view spot on! My thoughts on Vicente are very well documented on this site, over a long period, often to the point of attracting derision from my fellow contributers! There is no mystery over Vicente at all. He does not want to play for us as demonstrated in his activities over the summer and Gus has exercised the clause in his contract, effectively making him stay! The result is a pointless stalemate, with Vicente permanently injured or struggling, while making the odd cameo appearance to keep himself in the public eye for when his contract ends! And yes he is a quality player without doubt,and could do a great job for us, but he won't!! Time to end the farce and "mystery" and move him on. I have no insight into the complexities of his contract, but if money could then be allocated for a decent alternative striker, then great!

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wiseman of hove says...
1:27pm Tue 9 Oct 12

rolivan wrote:
wiseman of hove wrote:
As everybody has posted, ridiculous state of affairs. Excellent post by Gee Jay.
The comments attributed to the assistant manager are quite ludicrous - must be some mistake in the reporting.
This report was pulled from the Interview Tanno did last week before the Derby game if you want to see it in full just go to the seagulls site.As for the updates re injuries Gus and Tanno always give updates if the questions are asked by the reporters at the press conferences on a weekly basis.Most of what you read on here is available on the website there is never any real news that is unavailable.I mentioned about Vicente to Johnny and Warren in a phone in a couple of weeks ago when I asked if there was something other than an injury that was keeping him from playing and Warren said straight away it was a Tendon problem.Although I am a great admirer of Vicente we were doing well without him up until Macca got injured.It seems Macca has become the Talisman.
Thanks - will do.
As for mark 5's posting, hard to dsagree with his comments. The saga just seems to drag on endlessly.

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VegasSeagull says...
1:51pm Tue 9 Oct 12

I think the article has got it wrong or at least is being interpreted wrongly.
CMS, Hoskins and Vicente, all getting treatment at the same facility and the facility is not in the same place as the training facilities. Does anyone really think that Gus is not on the ball regarding how CMS is doing?

Schedules are almost certainly the problem. Training starts at a fixed time, medical treatment is scheduled to suit the staff and equipment availability. Vicente might get 2 hours treatment at a time when the squad, coaches and management are all out on the field. CMS might get his treatment earlier or later and Hoskins too, and there will be time when they overlap.

If Gus is not making the trip to check on CMS then why would he make the trip to check on nayone else when right now we really need CMS back at work.

Schedules and location are the problem and I guess when we get our new training ground these issues will go away. I don't think that Vicente is being sidelined any more than CMS or Hoskins is, it's just a matter of logistics.

When the three of them get back to light training it won't be with the coaches the medical team will supervise that work. I am sure that Gus gets a daily report on his players and that for him there are no mysteries.

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BobbyLaverick says...
1:54pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Vicente? Who is Vicente?

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Jonathan Mouette says...
1:58pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Jonathan Mouette wrote:
This attitude certainly explains a lot with regard to Will Hoskins who hasn't been mentioned in dispatches for quite a while... If it is indeed true that there is little or no contact with the injured then he has probably forgotten who he is even playing for... Much as there are so many things to admire at the club there are things which come to light and never cease to amaze me. Oh well.
I wonder if the top management team has the same communication problems with the development squad - are they aware, for example, that there are not one but two strikers who would appreciate the confidence boost of squad selection particlarly when automatic first team regulars are unavailable...

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pjwilk says...
2:02pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Alan G Skinner wrote:
pjwilk wrote:
About time we pulled the plug on Vicente he is obviously a liability,should have let him stay where he was.We need players who are not injury prone.OK he is good when fit but when is he fit.
If you want to "Pull the plug", you have clearly not seen Vicente play!! When he gets fit, watching him is worth the ticket alone. He is breathtaking.
Yes i have seen Vicente and very good he is,but he has not influenced results very much.He is another Michael Owen,once he leaves Brighton no body will take a risk on sighning him.Once you get a lame duck name, even if he is playing the situation,it sticks.

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wiseman of hove says...
2:06pm Tue 9 Oct 12

pjwilk wrote:
Alan G Skinner wrote:
pjwilk wrote:
About time we pulled the plug on Vicente he is obviously a liability,should have let him stay where he was.We need players who are not injury prone.OK he is good when fit but when is he fit.
If you want to "Pull the plug", you have clearly not seen Vicente play!! When he gets fit, watching him is worth the ticket alone. He is breathtaking.
Yes i have seen Vicente and very good he is,but he has not influenced results very much.He is another Michael Owen,once he leaves Brighton no body will take a risk on sighning him.Once you get a lame duck name, even if he is playing the situation,it sticks.
Hardly a surprise that Owen is out injured again. All those ridulous stories how playing with Crouch would get him back into the England team.

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VegasSeagull says...
2:09pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Vicente is a slow healer, he always has been. When he played for one of his teams, I forget which one, his recovery was so long in the making he blamed the medical staff, he said it was their fault that he didn't have a quick healing. He is now with us and again his injury is taking a long time to heal, but this time he has a different medical team working on him. To be fair to him and the medical team the amount of time that he is taking to heal, from this particular injury, should be compared to how long it has taken other players to heal from the same injury. I would like to hear from our top medic, perhaps he could tell us whether the duration of Vicente's absence should be expected or if it is abnormaly long.

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SMF20 says...
2:19pm Tue 9 Oct 12

As good a player as Vicente is I do find myself starting to wain in my belief that he actually wants to play for us. These supposed niggles seem to last months when he is involved and i have to say that maybe it is time to let him move on. Id love for him to be completely dedicated to us and for him to play for the rest of the season and guide us to the promised land. I just cant see it happening though. I find myself wondering why as an employee it is not asked to come and at least attend training sessions once his treatment on the table is finished for the day. I wouldnt mind hedging a bet that as soon as CMS is off the table, he is driving himself over to meet up with the rest of the squad to keep involved.

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mikeygit says...
2:57pm Tue 9 Oct 12

I think the management 'statement' over Vicente is the biggest load of 'bull' I have heard. What boss or manager would have a member of staff long term sick and not know how he was??? Must have thought we came over on the last banana boat!!! Vicente was a BIG gamble when we took him on and that has been proved. He had a reputation for being injured, that is why Valencia got fed up with him. He may be the best thing when he plays--no doubt--but we cannot afford a good forward, of course we cannot when we are paying Vicentes high wages for being off. This is history repeating itself from last year. We cannot afford to have expensive players like him just collecting their wages and not even stepping onto the playing pitch. Sorry I may be saying things SOME will disagree with but enough is enough and some serious decisions have got to be made over Vicentes future at BHA.

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rolivan says...
3:09pm Tue 9 Oct 12

People keep saying about how it is costing the club money but nobody knows exactly what is in His contract.He might been on a pay per play or just a basic plus appearances.I am sure the club knew they were getting an injury prone player and the contract would reflect this.

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namgo49 says...
3:13pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Alan G Skinner wrote:
pjwilk wrote:
About time we pulled the plug on Vicente he is obviously a liability,should have let him stay where he was.We need players who are not injury prone.OK he is good when fit but when is he fit.
If you want to "Pull the plug", you have clearly not seen Vicente play!! When he gets fit, watching him is worth the ticket alone. He is breathtaking.
The guy clearly doesn't want to be here that's why he doesn't join in. What the Assistant Manager said was a thin disguise of the truth.

Yes he's good when he plays but the trouble is he don't play enough. We were ill advised to take up the option but then perhaps we thought we would get a fee for him from the Spanish club.

Time to let him go for everyones sake!!

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saraman says...
3:22pm Tue 9 Oct 12

seagullsays wrote:
Won't bother adding my thoughts regarding this lack of man-management skill, as they are along the same lines as those posted above. However, and I may be in the minority, but I've virtually given up on Vicente anyway. I'm not sure he wants to be here after the contract issues of the summer, and his injury record, which has been an issue for him for years, just doesn't seem to improve. Whilst I agree with Alan Skinner, he is a terrific player to watch, he just doesn't play enough. Is it time to move on, cancel his contract and let him go to Elche (or wherever it was that he wanted to go to). Maybe this would free up some extra funds for the big striker. Just my thoughts, which count for nothing, but there they are anyway!
Hi, Seagullsays, I agree with your thoughts about Elche but moreover it is my belief that is was all of a big smoke screen and Gus unfortunately did't see through it. He never did want to come back so colluded with Elche on the basis that they wanted to sign him. Vicente didn't have the guts to tell GP that he didn't want to come back. Out of sheer bloodymindedness I would keep Vicente here until season end just to frustrate him as he has us. There I know it appears to be petty but the blokes driving me nuts.

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KeefyH44 says...
3:38pm Tue 9 Oct 12

seagullsays wrote:
Won't bother adding my thoughts regarding this lack of man-management skill, as they are along the same lines as those posted above. However, and I may be in the minority, but I've virtually given up on Vicente anyway.

I'm not sure he wants to be here after the contract issues of the summer, and his injury record, which has been an issue for him for years, just doesn't seem to improve. Whilst I agree with Alan Skinner, he is a terrific player to watch, he just doesn't play enough. Is it time to move on, cancel his contract and let him go to Elche (or wherever it was that he wanted to go to). Maybe this would free up some extra funds for the big striker.

Just my thoughts, which count for nothing, but there they are anyway!
My thoughts exactly. When Gus invoked that clause I fully expected this to happen. You can take a horse to water...... Bit like trying to force that glove on O J Simpson's hand!!!

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seagullsays says...
3:42pm Tue 9 Oct 12

And there was me thinking I'd be in the minority!

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saraman says...
3:49pm Tue 9 Oct 12

KeefyH44 wrote:
seagullsays wrote: Won't bother adding my thoughts regarding this lack of man-management skill, as they are along the same lines as those posted above. However, and I may be in the minority, but I've virtually given up on Vicente anyway. I'm not sure he wants to be here after the contract issues of the summer, and his injury record, which has been an issue for him for years, just doesn't seem to improve. Whilst I agree with Alan Skinner, he is a terrific player to watch, he just doesn't play enough. Is it time to move on, cancel his contract and let him go to Elche (or wherever it was that he wanted to go to). Maybe this would free up some extra funds for the big striker. Just my thoughts, which count for nothing, but there they are anyway!
My thoughts exactly. When Gus invoked that clause I fully expected this to happen. You can take a horse to water...... Bit like trying to force that glove on O J Simpson's hand!!!
Have I missed something there Keefy? What's the O J Simpson thing with gloves?

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Hugo-Worthing says...
4:36pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Here's a novel thought......
Why NOT speculate continuely and at great length, on the possible issues involved, I see the same comments,by the same people, repeatedly regurgitating the same old concerns regarding Vicente's attitude/commitment/
injury.

Lets just wait until we have a statement from the club which reveals the full situation?

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Far gull says...
5:02pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Agree with many of above comments. If v ever plays again great if not so be it he will be on a basic plus play bonus am sure. I want team of players commited rest can rot ,tosee v at the end of last term a joy. Poor form or injury can be excused but these articles are sometimes just to fill a void. V maybe injury prone but when he did turn up ! Dobbie ?? 3yr contract ,! Thats scandalous! But fergie has bought some duff very expensive talent over the yrs ( veron28million !) So gus getting one or two duff ones must be kept in perspective.

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born again seagull says...
5:34pm Tue 9 Oct 12

On the other hand, Tarrico suggests that Vicente is pretty down about the injury and it must be frustrating for him. I trust in our management team and am sure they will be doing everything to get him fit. He is a football player, loves the game and probably wishes that come Middlesbrough he could get back to full fitness and take his place in this fantasic team of ours. Alaswe heans we will have to e patient and wait. One hing is for sure, if he were a fully fit player over the last two years, he would be playing in the Premiership and be one of the top players. He is easily that good!

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namgo49 says...
5:45pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Hugo-Worthing wrote:
Here's a novel thought......
Why NOT speculate continuely and at great length, on the possible issues involved, I see the same comments,by the same people, repeatedly regurgitating the same old concerns regarding Vicente's attitude/commitment/

injury.

Lets just wait until we have a statement from the club which reveals the full situation?
You won't get the facts from the club. We are left to make our own judgements.

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born again seagull says...
6:00pm Tue 9 Oct 12

namgo49 wrote:
Hugo-Worthing wrote:
Here's a novel thought......
Why NOT speculate continuely and at great length, on the possible issues involved, I see the same comments,by the same people, repeatedly regurgitating the same old concerns regarding Vicente's attitude/commitment/


injury.

Lets just wait until we have a statement from the club which reveals the full situation?
You won't get the facts from the club. We are left to make our own judgements.
The article gives the facts from the club, you just have to choose whether to accept them.

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saraman says...
6:00pm Tue 9 Oct 12

namgo49 wrote:
Hugo-Worthing wrote: Here's a novel thought...... Why NOT speculate continuely and at great length, on the possible issues involved, I see the same comments,by the same people, repeatedly regurgitating the same old concerns regarding Vicente's attitude/commitment/ injury. Lets just wait until we have a statement from the club which reveals the full situation?
You won't get the facts from the club. We are left to make our own judgements.
Quite right Hugo. Vicente has become an embarressment to the Albion. That's why we will not get a definitive report.

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fratsomrover says...
6:03pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Cant say it's any great mystery to me. The guy is fantastic when he plays, but that will be very little. Reminds me of Darren Anderton when he went to Spurs. His nickname was "sicknote".
On another note, why are professional sportsmen like Vicente, Hoskins and to a degree, Buckley, so prone to injury. They get the greatest medical treatment possible yet are so seldom fit to do a days work. Barnes, Bridcutt, Greer play week in week out, always in the thick of things and are able to maintain their fitness and health, whilst others play a game or two and are then crocked for weeks. It's not as if they have broken legs, it's always something muscular. Professional sportsmen should be able to maintain their fitness longer than normal people.
If I was off work sick as much as these two guys, I'd get the sack.

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KeefyH44 says...
6:23pm Tue 9 Oct 12

saraman wrote:
KeefyH44 wrote:
seagullsays wrote: Won't bother adding my thoughts regarding this lack of man-management skill, as they are along the same lines as those posted above. However, and I may be in the minority, but I've virtually given up on Vicente anyway. I'm not sure he wants to be here after the contract issues of the summer, and his injury record, which has been an issue for him for years, just doesn't seem to improve. Whilst I agree with Alan Skinner, he is a terrific player to watch, he just doesn't play enough. Is it time to move on, cancel his contract and let him go to Elche (or wherever it was that he wanted to go to). Maybe this would free up some extra funds for the big striker. Just my thoughts, which count for nothing, but there they are anyway!
My thoughts exactly. When Gus invoked that clause I fully expected this to happen. You can take a horse to water...... Bit like trying to force that glove on O J Simpson's hand!!!
Have I missed something there Keefy? What's the O J Simpson thing with gloves?
The case against OJ collapsed because a glove found at the scene was handed to him, and ad when you try to dress a child who resists, OJ made it look just as awkward as if the glove couldn't possibly have belonged to him and made the prosecution look stupid. As I said, You can take a horse to water....... Forcing Vicente to abide by the contract may have kept him here but can't make him willingly play for us. Sorry for the oblique reference, seemed to make sense at the time.

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VegasSeagull says...
6:54pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Were we not told some weeks ago that Vicente would be back in training after the Birmingham match, this article now tells us that it won't be until after this two week international break.

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VegasSeagull says...
7:09pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Is Vicente in a self imposed exile? Whilst his injury is the reason for not training with the team what could be the reason for him not to visit with the players after his treatment. The squad's training schedule might not always fit in with his treatment schedule but surely there are times when it does.
I don't think that there is a mystery about him, I am sure Gus knows the situation, but I do wonder why, as this article suggests, he chooses to keep himself to himself.

I am left wondering if there isn't a huge rift between him and the club and that his current injury is nothing more than an excuse. I guess that can't be right because we have been told to expect him back on the park, but I do wonder.

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wiseman of hove says...
7:17pm Tue 9 Oct 12

VegasSeagull wrote:
Were we not told some weeks ago that Vicente would be back in training after the Birmingham match, this article now tells us that it won't be until after this two week international break.
And I'm afaid Vegas that there will be another false dawn after the international break. Month after month last season and now this season, the club have held out the promise of seeing Vicente again in action. Why do they do it? There is now just a dwindling group of supporters who still expect that he will be back. I will now refrain from commenting on this saga further.

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IRISHGULL says...
7:36pm Tue 9 Oct 12

BobbyLaverick wrote:
Vicente? Who is Vicente?
Probably as good a player as any to don an albion shirt. Whilst understanding all the negativity surrounding vincente, the last two home games were simply crying out for his creativity. One cameo like the second half against pompey, and he will once again be our messi. The man is quality, and i for one would love him back .

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born again seagull says...
7:45pm Tue 9 Oct 12

wiseman of hove wrote:
VegasSeagull wrote:
Were we not told some weeks ago that Vicente would be back in training after the Birmingham match, this article now tells us that it won't be until after this two week international break.
And I'm afaid Vegas that there will be another false dawn after the international break. Month after month last season and now this season, the club have held out the promise of seeing Vicente again in action. Why do they do it? There is now just a dwindling group of supporters who still expect that he will be back. I will now refrain from commenting on this saga further.
I suppose it is human nature to take the negative view when the expected excitement of seeing a star on the pitch does not materialise. Too much to expect that maybe, just maybe he is shy and injury prone. My glass remains over half full on this and if Vicente returns for the last 10 games of the season, to see us over the line I will be chuffed, as will you all. UTA

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ballantrrae says...
8:32pm Tue 9 Oct 12

BobbyLaverick wrote:
Vicente? Who is Vicente?
Hopefully in the next 4 to 5 weeks Vicente will get fully fit (wishful thinking) and then we will all know 'who Vicente is'.
He certainly looked both the player we know he can be and fit against Chelsea in preseason. Mark you the prospect of playing the Champions League winners must have been a great incentive.

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hannover seagull says...
8:58pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Poyet and his staff have not seen much of him as he´s been stuck across the other side of the training ground in the medical room

Urrm ...go and see him then

Or is this code for other side of the water ?

Anyway, during the break (The Scarlet Pimpernel) is always a hot topic

I think the current management at the Amex are a little ecomonic with the truth on player fitness and availability and this leads to a lot of supposition and rumour
Hoskins another example

We should open up a pulled/tight hamstring clinic we must be experts by now

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kwaidam says...
9:17pm Tue 9 Oct 12

We all know Vicente is absolute class and, if we are to mount a sustained play-off/promotion campaign, he will need to be playing regularly as he is a game-changer off the bench. Sadly, i fear it will not happen. Come January there will be another announcement from the club saying we have cancelled his contract and he has moved back to Spain, where he will no doubt surface at Elche. Negative post, for sure, but realistic.

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Ringmer Rich says...
9:21pm Tue 9 Oct 12

IRISHGULL wrote:
BobbyLaverick wrote:
Vicente? Who is Vicente?
Probably as good a player as any to don an albion shirt. Whilst understanding all the negativity surrounding vincente, the last two home games were simply crying out for his creativity. One cameo like the second half against pompey, and he will once again be our messi. The man is quality, and i for one would love him back .
He is definitely the best player ever to put on the blue and white stripes. He is top drawer, and the only reason he is playing for us is because of his injury problems. To be totally honest, I couldn't give a toss whether we get to the premier or not, I just want to see quality passing football from technically gifted players. Viva el rey - Vicente!!

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hannover seagull says...
9:45pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Ringmer Rich wrote:
IRISHGULL wrote:
BobbyLaverick wrote:
Vicente? Who is Vicente?
Probably as good a player as any to don an albion shirt. Whilst understanding all the negativity surrounding vincente, the last two home games were simply crying out for his creativity. One cameo like the second half against pompey, and he will once again be our messi. The man is quality, and i for one would love him back .
He is definitely the best player ever to put on the blue and white stripes. He is top drawer, and the only reason he is playing for us is because of his injury problems. To be totally honest, I couldn't give a toss whether we get to the premier or not, I just want to see quality passing football from technically gifted players. Viva el rey - Vicente!!
Great player yes

Best player?

Needs to show that in a couple of seasons not matches

UTA,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,





I

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lonegull says...
11:10pm Tue 9 Oct 12

Why is everyone so negative?
Why so many assumptions?
It's obvious the guy loves to play.
I don't believe he would miss the opportunity just to throw a sulk because he wants to go home. He's free to leave in May anyway and I'm sure he'd rather do that with his integrity intact.
I find some of the posts very disrespectful. If the player was to read this what would he think of clubs supposed supporters.
Yes with his history he is a gamble but now is not the time to judge.
We are talking about a player that when fit is still more than capable of lighting up the Premiership or La Liga. In fact if there is a more technically gifted player in the England squad I've not seen him.
If we don't see him to the last six games of the season then he helps get us promoted how many £millions is that worth to the club?

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Alfie T says...
11:35pm Tue 9 Oct 12

hannover seagull wrote:
Ringmer Rich wrote:
IRISHGULL wrote:
BobbyLaverick wrote:
Vicente? Who is Vicente?
Probably as good a player as any to don an albion shirt. Whilst understanding all the negativity surrounding vincente, the last two home games were simply crying out for his creativity. One cameo like the second half against pompey, and he will once again be our messi. The man is quality, and i for one would love him back .
He is definitely the best player ever to put on the blue and white stripes. He is top drawer, and the only reason he is playing for us is because of his injury problems. To be totally honest, I couldn't give a toss whether we get to the premier or not, I just want to see quality passing football from technically gifted players. Viva el rey - Vicente!!
Great player yes

Best player?

Needs to show that in a couple of seasons not matches

UTA,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,





I
The exuberance of youth I suspect Hanover, I doubt he saw the legend that was Mark Lawrenson gliding over the Goldstone turf, what a player.

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Ringmer Rich says...
6:56am Wed 10 Oct 12

Thank you for the kind comment, I haven't considered myself a youth in many a year - first started watching the Albion in 76-77. Lawro was probably the best central defender in the world at that time. Vicente is the most technically gifted player we've ever had.

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thruball says...
8:14am Wed 10 Oct 12

Nah - Andy Rollings was world's best central defender!

GP's injury updates are all smoke & mirrors. He's nobody's fool.

El Rey is dead to us. He won't play for us in anger again. Shame.

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tug509 says...
10:12am Wed 10 Oct 12

If i were Vicente i would make every effort to inform us (the supporters) of my progress,hence stopping random speculation and keeping the fans on my side,because as this thread has proved,a lot of us are losing faith in him,regardless of the promise of his exceptional skills.UTA

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Hovite says...
10:30am Wed 10 Oct 12

lonegull wrote:
Why is everyone so negative?
Why so many assumptions?
It's obvious the guy loves to play.
I don't believe he would miss the opportunity just to throw a sulk because he wants to go home. He's free to leave in May anyway and I'm sure he'd rather do that with his integrity intact.
I find some of the posts very disrespectful. If the player was to read this what would he think of clubs supposed supporters.
Yes with his history he is a gamble but now is not the time to judge.
We are talking about a player that when fit is still more than capable of lighting up the Premiership or La Liga. In fact if there is a more technically gifted player in the England squad I've not seen him.
If we don't see him to the last six games of the season then he helps get us promoted how many £millions is that worth to the club?
I do agree with you lonegull and you are not alone, I have spoken out on the negativity many times including when everyone wrote him off last season. But when he played he became the fan's hero.

If I was him and I read what was written on here, it wouldn't inspire me to want to play for us.

I liken it to pooing on your own doorstep.

If anything Andy Naylor wrote the story to have a laugh at the response he has got, ranging from mental health to a criminal behavior.

He is a soft target for anyone wanting shooting practice.

Well done Andy.

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tug509 says...
10:52am Wed 10 Oct 12

It`s not so much a case of negativity as a lack of positivity,i would`nt buy a car that spent 75% of the time time in the garage,even if it was a ferrari,as i said earlier all it takes is a word from V to put paid to speculation.UTA

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Hovite says...
11:07am Wed 10 Oct 12

V doesn't owe us anything, however we owe him respect and the benefit of the doubt.

If I were him I certainly wouldn't lower, and defend myself on some of the comments made on here.

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tug509 says...
11:40am Wed 10 Oct 12

Yes he does,if i decide not to go to work my boss expects a reason and quite right.Fratsomrover pointed out that if he had as much sicktime,he would get the sack! So far from "lowering "himself he is elevating himself above the rest of us.As for respect,well we all know that is earned,you have taken time to put your opinion on this site,why cant he tell the Argus how he is progressing,how hard can it be.UTA

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mr punch says...
12:11pm Wed 10 Oct 12

what a bizarre story? Are they sure that he's actually in the country? Is he the Lord Lucan of Falmer? Maybe everyone should wear Vincente masks at the next home game so that Gus and his staff remember what he looks like. Or, alternatively; just forget about him.

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Hovite says...
1:14pm Wed 10 Oct 12

tug509 wrote:
Yes he does,if i decide not to go to work my boss expects a reason and quite right.Fratsomrover pointed out that if he had as much sicktime,he would get the sack! So far from "lowering "himself he is elevating himself above the rest of us.As for respect,well we all know that is earned,you have taken time to put your opinion on this site,why cant he tell the Argus how he is progressing,how hard can it be.UTA
What, so if you are sick off work, youve got to write into the Argus and make a statement.

You have quite clearly said that Vicente should make every effort to inform us (the supporters). Inform us of what? What do you want him to tell you?

Anyway I wasn't going to get involved and I was just laughing at the comments on here, especially the OJ Simpson one.

All I did was agree with Lonegull to make him not feel alone. You know, I sort of warmed to his name and he put a smile on my face.

Now youv'e jumped on my back for me agreeing with him, when you should be disagreeing with him, rather than disagreeing with me agreeing with him.

So how would you like to progress with this Tug?

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Hovite says...
1:27pm Wed 10 Oct 12

p.s. I don't see anyone having a dig at Hoskins and wanting him to make a public statement?

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tug509 says...
2:14pm Wed 10 Oct 12

I thought i was paranoid! ALL of us crave up to date information on OUR team,when a player makes a statement of intent as to his recovery and hopeful return to the squad it gives us something to look forward to and keeps us in the loop so to speak.However,as with V we have nothing! as for Hoskins his situation imo is completely seperate and quite different.I dont know why you get the impression i`ve "jumped on your back" this is after all a forum for an exchange of opinions,for my part there is no animosity and i am happy to be proved wrong if it means i have learned something.My main concern with V is that he is taking up resources which could be better used,and that he will keep being injured until his contract runs out,I`ve heard people say that he could win us promotion with his presence,my worry is he could lose us the chance with his absence.UTA

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WisdomSpeaks says...
2:19pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Ringmer Rich wrote:
Thank you for the kind comment, I haven't considered myself a youth in many a year - first started watching the Albion in 76-77. Lawro was probably the best central defender in the world at that time. Vicente is the most technically gifted player we've ever had.
Hey what about Dennis Windross - now there was a master!!!!

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VegasSeagull says...
2:33pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Hovite I don't think that the posts on here regarding Vicente are written out of some form of dislike for him, they all tell of frustration.

All who come to this site would wish to see Vicente playing for us, all want his undoubted talents to be on display.
The fans were told about Hoskins, we were given a date for his return and it happened, maybe too quickly but that's another story. The club gives info on Vicente, that is true and fot that reason maybe Vicente doesn't have to, I get that. The problem with what the fans are being told is that it doesn't happen. Vicente, we were told, would be back in training after the Birmingham match, now it's after this break but will that happen?

I get the feeling that you are of the opinion that the club/players do not have a duty to keep the fans informed but they do. If the player doesn't want to speak that's fine but the club should fill the void and fill it with genuine factual statements. "Vicente will get back to full training after the Birmingham match," well yes but Christmas is after the Birmingham match, is that when he will be read?

I think the lack of his services and the tone of the comments on here are linked. The fans on here want him back, even those that say he should be, 'cut loose,' frustration born out of a desire that which is not being met. The fans are asking for clarity that's all.

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WisdomSpeaks says...
2:37pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Joking apart - Vicente is a class act when he is fit. It was fascinating to see the whole stand get off their seats as soon as he received the ball against Reading........he is one of those players, like Peter Ward, who excites people when he gets the ball.

I think the more troubling question is how modern are this medical team?

Are they up to date with energy medicine which is the medicine of the 21st Century. Often the medical establishment can be very arrogant and cynical about 'new' ideas - even though these ideas were presented by Einstein nearly 100 years ago - and he was ridiculed then!

To me I've always thought that Vicente, who I love as a player, is kind of depressed - his body language screams that out - and he seems overly concerned at even the slightest of 'knocks' taking time to examine them all carefully.

If you are a manager of men I believe I would do all in my powers to examine every avenue to get the best out of my most gifted employee.

There used to be an attitude amongst the old school of managers that when a player got injured you treated him like a leper to encourage him to get fit.

I'm not sure that is the most sensible way to treat people who you care about - or should care about and we are in a different era.

What does seem strange is that with all this supposed high flying medical assistance we appear to have numerous injuries especially hamstring problems.

I would definitely be looking at that if I were in their position. I like the Chinese system of doctors who only get paid when they have NO patients!!!

That seems a great enlightened idea!!!

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VegasSeagull says...
2:40pm Wed 10 Oct 12

VegasSeagull wrote:
Hovite I don't think that the posts on here regarding Vicente are written out of some form of dislike for him, they all tell of frustration. All who come to this site would wish to see Vicente playing for us, all want his undoubted talents to be on display. The fans were told about Hoskins, we were given a date for his return and it happened, maybe too quickly but that's another story. The club gives info on Vicente, that is true and fot that reason maybe Vicente doesn't have to, I get that. The problem with what the fans are being told is that it doesn't happen. Vicente, we were told, would be back in training after the Birmingham match, now it's after this break but will that happen? I get the feeling that you are of the opinion that the club/players do not have a duty to keep the fans informed but they do. If the player doesn't want to speak that's fine but the club should fill the void and fill it with genuine factual statements. "Vicente will get back to full training after the Birmingham match," well yes but Christmas is after the Birmingham match, is that when he will be read? I think the lack of his services and the tone of the comments on here are linked. The fans on here want him back, even those that say he should be, 'cut loose,' frustration born out of a desire that which is not being met. The fans are asking for clarity that's all.
Where I write about Hoskins I should have wrote Buckley as that is who I was thinking of.

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Hovite says...
3:18pm Wed 10 Oct 12

tug509 wrote:
I thought i was paranoid! ALL of us crave up to date information on OUR team,when a player makes a statement of intent as to his recovery and hopeful return to the squad it gives us something to look forward to and keeps us in the loop so to speak.However,as with V we have nothing! as for Hoskins his situation imo is completely seperate and quite different.I dont know why you get the impression i`ve "jumped on your back" this is after all a forum for an exchange of opinions,for my part there is no animosity and i am happy to be proved wrong if it means i have learned something.My main concern with V is that he is taking up resources which could be better used,and that he will keep being injured until his contract runs out,I`ve heard people say that he could win us promotion with his presence,my worry is he could lose us the chance with his absence.UTA
There is no animosity, but you and I know exactly where we stand on V, I'm not going to convince you or change your opinion and likewise you mine.

But for some reason you have drawn me into a debate that won't progress, when I was talking to someone else.

I know your thoughts Tug, I was just agreeing to someone elses.

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Baldseagull says...
6:18pm Wed 10 Oct 12

mark5 wrote:
Seagullsays, do not put yourself down! Your thoughts and opinions are in my view spot on! My thoughts on Vicente are very well documented on this site, over a long period, often to the point of attracting derision from my fellow contributers! There is no mystery over Vicente at all. He does not want to play for us as demonstrated in his activities over the summer and Gus has exercised the clause in his contract, effectively making him stay! The result is a pointless stalemate, with Vicente permanently injured or struggling, while making the odd cameo appearance to keep himself in the public eye for when his contract ends! And yes he is a quality player without doubt,and could do a great job for us, but he won't!! Time to end the farce and "mystery" and move him on. I have no insight into the complexities of his contract, but if money could then be allocated for a decent alternative striker, then great!
Vicente could say he is injured and is frustrated at not playing, just like every other injured player who is ever asked does, but I haven't seen one from Hoskins confirming his injury, or Crofts, or CMS and Tommy Elphick only spoke about his year long lay off 10 months into it.
The guy is injured, he will be back, he may get injured again and he may take a long time to recover but when he is on the pitch he is sublime.

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Hovite says...
6:24pm Wed 10 Oct 12

Vegas, I really can't be bothered and I refer you to my comment to Tug above.

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VegasSeagull says...
7:10pm Wed 10 Oct 12

As we go through these two weeks of waiting for our next game I would suggest that we be a tad careful when reading the headline stories posted for debate.

The club, for what ever reasons, will not want to tell all they know about all that we want to know. We were not told of the injury Buckley was carrying, I use that just as an example.

Those that run this site have a vested interest in keeping us coming back. If you want 60+ responses to a headline then all you need is to do is suggest that there is a, 'mystery,' about Vicente.

We have the rest of this week and all of the next one to get through, I guess that there will be other contentious headlines to come.

..

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