Crowborough UKIP election candidate in holocaust storm

The Argus: UKIP candidate for Crowborough Anna-Marie Crampton with party leader Nigel Farage UKIP candidate for Crowborough Anna-Marie Crampton with party leader Nigel Farage

A UK Independence Party candidate in East Sussex has denied the holocaust, claiming World War Two was engineered by Zionists hoping to create the state of Israel.

Anna-Marie Crampton is representing the eurosceptic party in Crowborough for the East Sussex County Council elections.

But, with polling day just a week away, groups have reacted angrily after a website entry in her name claimed World War Two was financed by Jewish “banksters” to make the world feel guilty.

A further comment said: “It was thanks to them that six million Jews were murdered in the war along with 26 million Russians.”

Sam Westrop, director of Stand for Peace, a leading Jewish-Muslim interfaith organisation, said: “Time after time, conspiracy and anti-Zionist sentiment is revealed to be nothing more than thinly-veiled anti-Semitism.

“UKIP, to its credit, has expelled extremist and bigoted members in the past.

“They must also expel Anna-Marie Crampton. Such hatred must be fought at all times.”

The comments were made in Ms Crampton’s name on an article titled “Was Pope Benedict fired by the Knights of Malta?” on an external website called Secrets of The Fed.

The entry said: “The Rothschilds are Zionists. There is a difference between Jews and Zionists.

“These psychopaths hide behind and use the Jews.

“It was thanks to them that six million Jews were murdered in the War along with 26 million Russians.”

'Tired of being lied to"

The Facebook account, from which the comments were made, also separately shows pictures of her wearing a party rosette while stood next to UKIP leader Nigel Farage.

Also on the profile,  which claims to be verified by Facebook founder Mark Zuckerburg, is the statement: “I'm not a conspiracy theorist. I am a conscious, aware, critical thinker and tired of being lied to. Are you?!”

Despite numerous attempts to contact her, Ms Crampton, of Southview Road, Crowborough, was not available to comment yesterday.

She is standing for the party in the traditionally Conservative area alongside prominent UKIP member Sonia Finch.

A spokesman for UKIP said it would not be appropriate to comment until he had contacted Ms Crampton.

Manchester-based researcher Colin Cortbus, who contacted The Argus about the comments, said: "Anna Marie Crampton has revealed herself to be a repulsive anti-semite, who tramples upon history and truth with her baseless, long-discredited fabrications.

"Her use of the long discredited  Protocols of the Elders of Zion, used by the Nazis as a cornerstone of their racist indoctrination programmes and as school textbooks, shows that she will stop at nothing to push her racist agenda. UKIP should be utterly ashamed of her."

Holocaust denial is a crime in Germany, France, Poland, Switzerland, Belgium, Austria and Lithuania.

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Comments (60)

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11:47am Thu 25 Apr 13

Crystal Ball says...

Perhaps the woman might like to tour some of the POW camp sites, talk to the survivors and see if she keeps the same opinion?
Perhaps the woman might like to tour some of the POW camp sites, talk to the survivors and see if she keeps the same opinion? Crystal Ball

11:50am Thu 25 Apr 13

Tailgaters Anonymous says...

I always thought of UKIP as eclectic!!
..or should the headline read 'election'?
I always thought of UKIP as eclectic!! ..or should the headline read 'election'? Tailgaters Anonymous

11:53am Thu 25 Apr 13

s&k says...

Yes, she must be expelled. Just appalling.
Yes, she must be expelled. Just appalling. s&k

11:53am Thu 25 Apr 13

Sarah Booker Lewis says...

Tailgaters Anonymous wrote:
I always thought of UKIP as eclectic!!
..or should the headline read 'election'?
Slip of my finger corrected now.
[quote][p][bold]Tailgaters Anonymous[/bold] wrote: I always thought of UKIP as eclectic!! ..or should the headline read 'election'?[/p][/quote]Slip of my finger corrected now. Sarah Booker Lewis

11:57am Thu 25 Apr 13

Fight_Back says...

I don't support or agree with what the woman has said at all and UKIP should expel her BUT it's not factually correct to say she's denied the holocaust happened - she's just questioned the cause ( and completely incorrectly ).
I don't support or agree with what the woman has said at all and UKIP should expel her BUT it's not factually correct to say she's denied the holocaust happened - she's just questioned the cause ( and completely incorrectly ). Fight_Back

12:06pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Indigatio says...

DaRMiH wrote:
What a horrible piece of scum Ms Crampton appears to be. I keep thinking UKIP are just silly.... are they the suited face of EDL?
Wait until the facts are known. From the way this article is written it could be that this is a 'stitch up' and Ms Crampton has been impersonated. If she has its a nasty piece of work deliberately done to discredit her, if not, its putting me off UKIP.
[quote][p][bold]DaRMiH[/bold] wrote: What a horrible piece of scum Ms Crampton appears to be. I keep thinking UKIP are just silly.... are they the suited face of EDL?[/p][/quote]Wait until the facts are known. From the way this article is written it could be that this is a 'stitch up' and Ms Crampton has been impersonated. If she has its a nasty piece of work deliberately done to discredit her, if not, its putting me off UKIP. Indigatio

12:08pm Thu 25 Apr 13

tomp94 says...

I think this woman should see a doctor! Not a Jewish one, though. She seems the sort of person that sucks up to the Pallywood propaganda industry! Long live Israel.
I think this woman should see a doctor! Not a Jewish one, though. She seems the sort of person that sucks up to the Pallywood propaganda industry! Long live Israel. tomp94

12:09pm Thu 25 Apr 13

mimseycal says...

Surprised? Sadly, I'm not. She was indiscreet enough to put her beliefs on the matter out in the public domain. How many others are here that are not that stupid?

UKIP will be caught between a rock and a hard place as the elections in Crowborough are due 2nd May. Not really enough time to field another candidate.

Further, how many votes will this buy her and sadly, probably quite a few.
Surprised? Sadly, I'm not. She was indiscreet enough to put her beliefs on the matter out in the public domain. How many others are here that are not that stupid? UKIP will be caught between a rock and a hard place as the elections in Crowborough are due 2nd May. Not really enough time to field another candidate. Further, how many votes will this buy her and sadly, probably quite a few. mimseycal

12:20pm Thu 25 Apr 13

mimseycal says...

Indigatio wrote:
DaRMiH wrote:
What a horrible piece of scum Ms Crampton appears to be. I keep thinking UKIP are just silly.... are they the suited face of EDL?
Wait until the facts are known. From the way this article is written it could be that this is a 'stitch up' and Ms Crampton has been impersonated. If she has its a nasty piece of work deliberately done to discredit her, if not, its putting me off UKIP.
Having read some of what is posted in the name and by the image of of Ms Crampton, Ye gawds! Has the woman any concept of how ludicrous her post is regarding what deity Jews believe in or not? It is too David Icke to be real.
[quote][p][bold]Indigatio[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]DaRMiH[/bold] wrote: What a horrible piece of scum Ms Crampton appears to be. I keep thinking UKIP are just silly.... are they the suited face of EDL?[/p][/quote]Wait until the facts are known. From the way this article is written it could be that this is a 'stitch up' and Ms Crampton has been impersonated. If she has its a nasty piece of work deliberately done to discredit her, if not, its putting me off UKIP.[/p][/quote]Having read some of what is posted in the name and by the image of of Ms Crampton, Ye gawds! Has the woman any concept of how ludicrous her post is regarding what deity Jews believe in or not? It is too David Icke to be real. mimseycal

12:29pm Thu 25 Apr 13

NastyMrToms says...

And what with Farage praising Thatcher ... I won't be voting UKIP now.
And what with Farage praising Thatcher ... I won't be voting UKIP now. NastyMrToms

12:32pm Thu 25 Apr 13

hursthill says...

Her paranoid hatred of Israel is shared with Tony Greensteen. This is of no relevance to voters in Crowborough. When UKIP expel her she can join greensteen's gang.
Her paranoid hatred of Israel is shared with Tony Greensteen. This is of no relevance to voters in Crowborough. When UKIP expel her she can join greensteen's gang. hursthill

12:33pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Tammy Flugh says...

Indigatio wrote:
DaRMiH wrote:
What a horrible piece of scum Ms Crampton appears to be. I keep thinking UKIP are just silly.... are they the suited face of EDL?
Wait until the facts are known. From the way this article is written it could be that this is a 'stitch up' and Ms Crampton has been impersonated. If she has its a nasty piece of work deliberately done to discredit her, if not, its putting me off UKIP.
So why couldn't she be contacted by the Argus when she would have wanted to put the record straight?
[quote][p][bold]Indigatio[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]DaRMiH[/bold] wrote: What a horrible piece of scum Ms Crampton appears to be. I keep thinking UKIP are just silly.... are they the suited face of EDL?[/p][/quote]Wait until the facts are known. From the way this article is written it could be that this is a 'stitch up' and Ms Crampton has been impersonated. If she has its a nasty piece of work deliberately done to discredit her, if not, its putting me off UKIP.[/p][/quote]So why couldn't she be contacted by the Argus when she would have wanted to put the record straight? Tammy Flugh

12:33pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Dirk Von Roden says...

I abhore the party known as "UKIP" but reading what is allegedly written by her, I see NO Denial of the Holocaust ! I do see her making a statement that the Zionists were responsible for the war ! although outrageous and at worst slanderous! there is absolutely no denial! there is also Proof that funding for the second world war "ALLEGEDLY"came from the Rothschilds in the form of Loans! they ALLEGEDLY funded America Britain and Germany Spain Italy do we need to go on ? this is a subject I would really like to find out more about! the Funding issue was originally made public by a Jewish American way back in the 50s! now whether to believe the allegations or not is up to YOU and other conspiracy theorists! more important at the moment is "WAS her account hacked???"
I abhore the party known as "UKIP" but reading what is allegedly written by her, I see NO Denial of the Holocaust ! I do see her making a statement that the Zionists were responsible for the war ! although outrageous and at worst slanderous! there is absolutely no denial! there is also Proof that funding for the second world war "ALLEGEDLY"came from the Rothschilds in the form of Loans! they ALLEGEDLY funded America Britain and Germany Spain Italy do we need to go on ? this is a subject I would really like to find out more about! the Funding issue was originally made public by a Jewish American way back in the 50s! now whether to believe the allegations or not is up to YOU and other conspiracy theorists! more important at the moment is "WAS her account hacked???" Dirk Von Roden

12:40pm Thu 25 Apr 13

mr punch says...

maybe someone should drag her round the back of a car and stick het mouth on the exhaust for a few seconds. When she goes to the police, just say it never happened, see how she fels. Long Live Israel!
maybe someone should drag her round the back of a car and stick het mouth on the exhaust for a few seconds. When she goes to the police, just say it never happened, see how she fels. Long Live Israel! mr punch

12:49pm Thu 25 Apr 13

rexrex says...

not only a holocaust denier but a fully fledge conspiracy theorist nutjob. should read her comments on FB/Twitter about the sept11 attacks and even has audacity to comment on the Boston marathon bombing, saying or hinting that it was an inside job (same as she says for sept11) ie the US planned and executed such atrocities frtheir own good???. she does not seem too bright (understood from her statements) and hopefully will fail at local elections and climb back under her rock
not only a holocaust denier but a fully fledge conspiracy theorist nutjob. should read her comments on FB/Twitter about the sept11 attacks and even has audacity to comment on the Boston marathon bombing, saying or hinting that it was an inside job (same as she says for sept11) ie the US planned and executed such atrocities frtheir own good???. she does not seem too bright (understood from her statements) and hopefully will fail at local elections and climb back under her rock rexrex

1:00pm Thu 25 Apr 13

whereisthe...? says...

Lets see if the Right / Tories make *death threats* against HER - or is mocking Thatcher's funeral a bigger crime to them...?

Lets also see if Right Wing ARGUS KEEPS running update stories about her EVERY DAY as they did with Thatcher funeral mocker teacher......
Lets see if the Right / Tories make *death threats* against HER - or is mocking Thatcher's funeral a bigger crime to them...? Lets also see if Right Wing ARGUS KEEPS running update stories about her EVERY DAY as they did with Thatcher funeral mocker teacher...... whereisthe...?

1:00pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Mark63 says...

Why does anyone support vile people like this? The dregs of society!
Why does anyone support vile people like this? The dregs of society! Mark63

1:05pm Thu 25 Apr 13

John Steed says...

political dirty tricks afoot or just dirty tricks afoot???
political dirty tricks afoot or just dirty tricks afoot??? John Steed

1:06pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Cave Johnson says...

If you actually read the comments she doesn't deny a holocaust happened. She mentions 6 million jews were killed, so how do you equate that to denying a holocaust?
If you actually read the comments she doesn't deny a holocaust happened. She mentions 6 million jews were killed, so how do you equate that to denying a holocaust? Cave Johnson

1:08pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Cave Johnson says...

This woman is clearly nuts, but she states repeatedly she loves jewish people and ther was a holocaust, so maybe actually read something before making a knee-jerk reaction. Is there no depths you will not sink to to engineer outrage Argus?
This woman is clearly nuts, but she states repeatedly she loves jewish people and ther was a holocaust, so maybe actually read something before making a knee-jerk reaction. Is there no depths you will not sink to to engineer outrage Argus? Cave Johnson

1:29pm Thu 25 Apr 13

rexrex says...

Cave Johnson wrote:
If you actually read the comments she doesn't deny a holocaust happened. She mentions 6 million jews were killed, so how do you equate that to denying a holocaust?
Mr Johnson if you take time to read her statements elsewhere on line, she whole heartedly believes in a jewish conspiracy and indeed as part of her nutty internal belief system she states that figures/statistics have been manipulated, again by the Jews, to show that a holocaust took place when in fact it did not.. now in my book or understanding thats Holocaust denial..
[quote][p][bold]Cave Johnson[/bold] wrote: If you actually read the comments she doesn't deny a holocaust happened. She mentions 6 million jews were killed, so how do you equate that to denying a holocaust?[/p][/quote]Mr Johnson if you take time to read her statements elsewhere on line, she whole heartedly believes in a jewish conspiracy and indeed as part of her nutty internal belief system she states that figures/statistics have been manipulated, again by the Jews, to show that a holocaust took place when in fact it did not.. now in my book or understanding thats Holocaust denial.. rexrex

2:03pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Ish1 says...

Fight_Back wrote:
I don't support or agree with what the woman has said at all and UKIP should expel her BUT it's not factually correct to say she's denied the holocaust happened - she's just questioned the cause ( and completely incorrectly ).
That she chose not to be available to clarify her position speaks for itself!
[quote][p][bold]Fight_Back[/bold] wrote: I don't support or agree with what the woman has said at all and UKIP should expel her BUT it's not factually correct to say she's denied the holocaust happened - she's just questioned the cause ( and completely incorrectly ).[/p][/quote]That she chose not to be available to clarify her position speaks for itself! Ish1

2:15pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Point says...

I was thinking of voting UKIP not now...
I was thinking of voting UKIP not now... Point

2:33pm Thu 25 Apr 13

ronrostog says...

What a non-story. She has not denied the holocaust but has theories on Israel. So what? Anyone with an interest in world politics has. I'm more concerned about what UKIP have to offer as a party to the people of this country rather than what this woman has to personally spout about.
What a non-story. She has not denied the holocaust but has theories on Israel. So what? Anyone with an interest in world politics has. I'm more concerned about what UKIP have to offer as a party to the people of this country rather than what this woman has to personally spout about. ronrostog

2:53pm Thu 25 Apr 13

qm says...

So ridiculously departed from reality it's not even worth commenting on. My only concern would be that there are educationally challenged idiots out there that might pay this trollop tripe some credence!
So ridiculously departed from reality it's not even worth commenting on. My only concern would be that there are educationally challenged idiots out there that might pay this trollop tripe some credence! qm

3:17pm Thu 25 Apr 13

AJTurtle says...

If this is true, this lady needs a lesson in History. A trip to Auschwitz, a trip to Amsterdam to Anne Frank's house.
If this is true, this lady needs a lesson in History. A trip to Auschwitz, a trip to Amsterdam to Anne Frank's house. AJTurtle

3:21pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Ish1 says...

Indigatio wrote:
DaRMiH wrote:
What a horrible piece of scum Ms Crampton appears to be. I keep thinking UKIP are just silly.... are they the suited face of EDL?
Wait until the facts are known. From the way this article is written it could be that this is a 'stitch up' and Ms Crampton has been impersonated. If she has its a nasty piece of work deliberately done to discredit her, if not, its putting me off UKIP.
You are writing nonsense as if there was any truth in your assertions one would have expected Ms Crampton to have issued a statement clarifying or denying the story.

The fact that she has chosen not to do so speaks for itself!
[quote][p][bold]Indigatio[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]DaRMiH[/bold] wrote: What a horrible piece of scum Ms Crampton appears to be. I keep thinking UKIP are just silly.... are they the suited face of EDL?[/p][/quote]Wait until the facts are known. From the way this article is written it could be that this is a 'stitch up' and Ms Crampton has been impersonated. If she has its a nasty piece of work deliberately done to discredit her, if not, its putting me off UKIP.[/p][/quote]You are writing nonsense as if there was any truth in your assertions one would have expected Ms Crampton to have issued a statement clarifying or denying the story. The fact that she has chosen not to do so speaks for itself! Ish1

3:22pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Ish1 says...

tomp94 wrote:
I think this woman should see a doctor! Not a Jewish one, though. She seems the sort of person that sucks up to the Pallywood propaganda industry! Long live Israel.
Well said.
[quote][p][bold]tomp94[/bold] wrote: I think this woman should see a doctor! Not a Jewish one, though. She seems the sort of person that sucks up to the Pallywood propaganda industry! Long live Israel.[/p][/quote]Well said. Ish1

3:26pm Thu 25 Apr 13

wippasnapper says...

You know I’ve often heard over the years many Jewish people using the word “holocaust” to justify what they have been doing towards the Palestinian people, many Jewish people clamming that this is another anti-Zionist attack agents the Jewish religion… so if it is; what do they call what they are doing to the Palestinian people?

Fact! That it was not just many Jewish people that went to the gas chambers but many Jehovah Witnesses also went to the gas chambers but you dote hear them using the word “HOLOCAUST” to justify the horrible injustices dun towards them during ant times they have been preaching the word of god, so why do the Jewish people, why do they use the word “anti-Zionist hate” when in FACT each and everyone of USE have the right to our opinion or our beliefs weather or not it fits with what another people believe or feels,

So is it right that only the Jewish people use anti-Zionist hate words and crimes agents the Palestinian people and anyone ells they choose NO, is it right that they can use such anti-Semitism hate towards others without allowing them to speak of there own beliefs and give there own opines… we all have our opines and how we see things admittedly we should chose our words more carefully as not to upset those that are easily offended by such words but non of use are perfect especially those in the political Sean but with so many law’s protecting use from one thing or another soon we will not be able to give our opine or protest out beliefs.
You know I’ve often heard over the years many Jewish people using the word “holocaust” to justify what they have been doing towards the Palestinian people, many Jewish people clamming that this is another anti-Zionist attack agents the Jewish religion… so if it is; what do they call what they are doing to the Palestinian people? Fact! That it was not just many Jewish people that went to the gas chambers but many Jehovah Witnesses also went to the gas chambers but you dote hear them using the word “HOLOCAUST” to justify the horrible injustices dun towards them during ant times they have been preaching the word of god, so why do the Jewish people, why do they use the word “anti-Zionist hate” when in FACT each and everyone of USE have the right to our opinion or our beliefs weather or not it fits with what another people believe or feels, So is it right that only the Jewish people use anti-Zionist hate words and crimes agents the Palestinian people and anyone ells they choose NO, is it right that they can use such anti-Semitism hate towards others without allowing them to speak of there own beliefs and give there own opines… we all have our opines and how we see things admittedly we should chose our words more carefully as not to upset those that are easily offended by such words but non of use are perfect especially those in the political Sean but with so many law’s protecting use from one thing or another soon we will not be able to give our opine or protest out beliefs. wippasnapper

3:38pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Dealing with idiots says...

wippasnapper wrote:
You know I’ve often heard over the years many Jewish people using the word “holocaust” to justify what they have been doing towards the Palestinian people, many Jewish people clamming that this is another anti-Zionist attack agents the Jewish religion… so if it is; what do they call what they are doing to the Palestinian people? Fact! That it was not just many Jewish people that went to the gas chambers but many Jehovah Witnesses also went to the gas chambers but you dote hear them using the word “HOLOCAUST” to justify the horrible injustices dun towards them during ant times they have been preaching the word of god, so why do the Jewish people, why do they use the word “anti-Zionist hate” when in FACT each and everyone of USE have the right to our opinion or our beliefs weather or not it fits with what another people believe or feels, So is it right that only the Jewish people use anti-Zionist hate words and crimes agents the Palestinian people and anyone ells they choose NO, is it right that they can use such anti-Semitism hate towards others without allowing them to speak of there own beliefs and give there own opines… we all have our opines and how we see things admittedly we should chose our words more carefully as not to upset those that are easily offended by such words but non of use are perfect especially those in the political Sean but with so many law’s protecting use from one thing or another soon we will not be able to give our opine or protest out beliefs.
Thanks Tony for that but what is your mum doing running for UKIP?
[quote][p][bold]wippasnapper[/bold] wrote: You know I’ve often heard over the years many Jewish people using the word “holocaust” to justify what they have been doing towards the Palestinian people, many Jewish people clamming that this is another anti-Zionist attack agents the Jewish religion… so if it is; what do they call what they are doing to the Palestinian people? Fact! That it was not just many Jewish people that went to the gas chambers but many Jehovah Witnesses also went to the gas chambers but you dote hear them using the word “HOLOCAUST” to justify the horrible injustices dun towards them during ant times they have been preaching the word of god, so why do the Jewish people, why do they use the word “anti-Zionist hate” when in FACT each and everyone of USE have the right to our opinion or our beliefs weather or not it fits with what another people believe or feels, So is it right that only the Jewish people use anti-Zionist hate words and crimes agents the Palestinian people and anyone ells they choose NO, is it right that they can use such anti-Semitism hate towards others without allowing them to speak of there own beliefs and give there own opines… we all have our opines and how we see things admittedly we should chose our words more carefully as not to upset those that are easily offended by such words but non of use are perfect especially those in the political Sean but with so many law’s protecting use from one thing or another soon we will not be able to give our opine or protest out beliefs.[/p][/quote]Thanks Tony for that but what is your mum doing running for UKIP? Dealing with idiots

3:46pm Thu 25 Apr 13

longman says...

Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily.
Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily. longman

3:57pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Ish1 says...

Tammy Flugh wrote:
Indigatio wrote:
DaRMiH wrote:
What a horrible piece of scum Ms Crampton appears to be. I keep thinking UKIP are just silly.... are they the suited face of EDL?
Wait until the facts are known. From the way this article is written it could be that this is a 'stitch up' and Ms Crampton has been impersonated. If she has its a nasty piece of work deliberately done to discredit her, if not, its putting me off UKIP.
So why couldn't she be contacted by the Argus when she would have wanted to put the record straight?
The fact that she has chosen not to issue a statement or speak to the Argus speaks for itself!
[quote][p][bold]Tammy Flugh[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Indigatio[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]DaRMiH[/bold] wrote: What a horrible piece of scum Ms Crampton appears to be. I keep thinking UKIP are just silly.... are they the suited face of EDL?[/p][/quote]Wait until the facts are known. From the way this article is written it could be that this is a 'stitch up' and Ms Crampton has been impersonated. If she has its a nasty piece of work deliberately done to discredit her, if not, its putting me off UKIP.[/p][/quote]So why couldn't she be contacted by the Argus when she would have wanted to put the record straight?[/p][/quote]The fact that she has chosen not to issue a statement or speak to the Argus speaks for itself! Ish1

4:01pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Ish1 says...

getThisCoalitionOut wrote:
She has NOT denied the holocaust.

She is entitled to her opinion - we all are - if you don't like it, you don't have to read it.

The state of Israel was requested by Lord Rothschild here in the UK - he neither came from that area or was a jew.

The Rothschilds claim that they are Jewish, when in fact they are Khazars. They are from a country called Khazaria, which occupied the land locked between the Black Sea and the Caspian Sea which is now predominantly occupied by Georgia.

You will find that approximately 90% of people in the world today who call themselves Jews are actually Khazars, or as they like to be known, Ashkenazi Jews. These people knowingly lie to the world with their claims that the land of Israel is theirs by birthright, when in actual fact their real homeland is over 800 miles away in Georgia.

The facts are out there - it's up to each of us to find them and be aware of what is going on in the world.
You write absolute nonsense.

The Rothchilds were and still are Jewish and like me are proud to be Jews.
[quote][p][bold]getThisCoalitionOut[/bold] wrote: She has NOT denied the holocaust. She is entitled to her opinion - we all are - if you don't like it, you don't have to read it. The state of Israel was requested by Lord Rothschild here in the UK - he neither came from that area or was a jew. The Rothschilds claim that they are Jewish, when in fact they are Khazars. They are from a country called Khazaria, which occupied the land locked between the Black Sea and the Caspian Sea which is now predominantly occupied by Georgia. You will find that approximately 90% of people in the world today who call themselves Jews are actually Khazars, or as they like to be known, Ashkenazi Jews. These people knowingly lie to the world with their claims that the land of Israel is theirs by birthright, when in actual fact their real homeland is over 800 miles away in Georgia. The facts are out there - it's up to each of us to find them and be aware of what is going on in the world.[/p][/quote]You write absolute nonsense. The Rothchilds were and still are Jewish and like me are proud to be Jews. Ish1

5:02pm Thu 25 Apr 13

1286trev says...

' UKIP if you want to...but look at what a different world you could wake-up in.
' UKIP if you want to...but look at what a different world you could wake-up in. 1286trev

5:02pm Thu 25 Apr 13

1286trev says...

' UKIP if you want to...but look at what a different world you could wake-up in.
' UKIP if you want to...but look at what a different world you could wake-up in. 1286trev

5:23pm Thu 25 Apr 13

qm says...

1286trev wrote:
' UKIP if you want to...but look at what a different world you could wake-up in.
Yeah . . . terrifying isn't it?
[quote][p][bold]1286trev[/bold] wrote: ' UKIP if you want to...but look at what a different world you could wake-up in.[/p][/quote]Yeah . . . terrifying isn't it? qm

6:11pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Tedious Pedant says...

Dirk Von Roden wrote:
I abhore the party known as "UKIP" but reading what is allegedly written by her, I see NO Denial of the Holocaust ! I do see her making a statement that the Zionists were responsible for the war ! although outrageous and at worst slanderous! there is absolutely no denial! there is also Proof that funding for the second world war "ALLEGEDLY"came from the Rothschilds in the form of Loans! they ALLEGEDLY funded America Britain and Germany Spain Italy do we need to go on ? this is a subject I would really like to find out more about! the Funding issue was originally made public by a Jewish American way back in the 50s! now whether to believe the allegations or not is up to YOU and other conspiracy theorists! more important at the moment is "WAS her account hacked???"
Proof? Allegedly? Doesn't 'allegedly' mean not proved?
[quote][p][bold]Dirk Von Roden[/bold] wrote: I abhore the party known as "UKIP" but reading what is allegedly written by her, I see NO Denial of the Holocaust ! I do see her making a statement that the Zionists were responsible for the war ! although outrageous and at worst slanderous! there is absolutely no denial! there is also Proof that funding for the second world war "ALLEGEDLY"came from the Rothschilds in the form of Loans! they ALLEGEDLY funded America Britain and Germany Spain Italy do we need to go on ? this is a subject I would really like to find out more about! the Funding issue was originally made public by a Jewish American way back in the 50s! now whether to believe the allegations or not is up to YOU and other conspiracy theorists! more important at the moment is "WAS her account hacked???"[/p][/quote]Proof? Allegedly? Doesn't 'allegedly' mean not proved? Tedious Pedant

6:46pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Fight_Back says...

Ish1 wrote:
Fight_Back wrote:
I don't support or agree with what the woman has said at all and UKIP should expel her BUT it's not factually correct to say she's denied the holocaust happened - she's just questioned the cause ( and completely incorrectly ).
That she chose not to be available to clarify her position speaks for itself!
Errr .... maybe she wasn't available ? Regardless, her remarks were awful and incorrect but at least hang the woman by facts rather than "she's guilty because she refused / couldn't respond" !
[quote][p][bold]Ish1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Fight_Back[/bold] wrote: I don't support or agree with what the woman has said at all and UKIP should expel her BUT it's not factually correct to say she's denied the holocaust happened - she's just questioned the cause ( and completely incorrectly ).[/p][/quote]That she chose not to be available to clarify her position speaks for itself![/p][/quote]Errr .... maybe she wasn't available ? Regardless, her remarks were awful and incorrect but at least hang the woman by facts rather than "she's guilty because she refused / couldn't respond" ! Fight_Back

8:33pm Thu 25 Apr 13

mimseycal says...

Dirk Von Roden wrote:
I abhore the party known as "UKIP" but reading what is allegedly written by her, I see NO Denial of the Holocaust ! I do see her making a statement that the Zionists were responsible for the war ! although outrageous and at worst slanderous! there is absolutely no denial! there is also Proof that funding for the second world war "ALLEGEDLY"came from the Rothschilds in the form of Loans! they ALLEGEDLY funded America Britain and Germany Spain Italy do we need to go on ? this is a subject I would really like to find out more about! the Funding issue was originally made public by a Jewish American way back in the 50s! now whether to believe the allegations or not is up to YOU and other conspiracy theorists! more important at the moment is "WAS her account hacked???"
Well, yes, it could be argued that she isn't denying the Holocaust. After all she accepts that 6 million Jews and 26 million Russians died as a result of it. Let us forget for the moment that she hasn't acknowledged the exterminations of the Romas, political undesirables, Jehova Witnesses and a few other groups the Nazi Regime in Germany at that time did not approve of.

But then again, anyone who knows anything about the Holocaust is aware of the fact that Nazi ideology is a fundamental aspect of that period in modern history referred to as the Holocaust.

So it could be argued that by 'questioning' (a favourite excuse employed by more notable Holocaust deniers by the way) the actors behind the inhumanity as exemplified by the Holocaust she is in effect 'questioning' the Holocaust.

On the other hand she could of course be a rather incoherent thinker who is incapable of constructing a well reasoned argument in a debate. Either case, she don't come out of it smelling of roses really.
[quote][p][bold]Dirk Von Roden[/bold] wrote: I abhore the party known as "UKIP" but reading what is allegedly written by her, I see NO Denial of the Holocaust ! I do see her making a statement that the Zionists were responsible for the war ! although outrageous and at worst slanderous! there is absolutely no denial! there is also Proof that funding for the second world war "ALLEGEDLY"came from the Rothschilds in the form of Loans! they ALLEGEDLY funded America Britain and Germany Spain Italy do we need to go on ? this is a subject I would really like to find out more about! the Funding issue was originally made public by a Jewish American way back in the 50s! now whether to believe the allegations or not is up to YOU and other conspiracy theorists! more important at the moment is "WAS her account hacked???"[/p][/quote]Well, yes, it could be argued that she isn't denying the Holocaust. After all she accepts that 6 million Jews and 26 million Russians died as a result of it. Let us forget for the moment that she hasn't acknowledged the exterminations of the Romas, political undesirables, Jehova Witnesses and a few other groups the Nazi Regime in Germany at that time did not approve of. But then again, anyone who knows anything about the Holocaust is aware of the fact that Nazi ideology is a fundamental aspect of that period in modern history referred to as the Holocaust. So it could be argued that by 'questioning' (a favourite excuse employed by more notable Holocaust deniers by the way) the actors behind the inhumanity as exemplified by the Holocaust she is in effect 'questioning' the Holocaust. On the other hand she could of course be a rather incoherent thinker who is incapable of constructing a well reasoned argument in a debate. Either case, she don't come out of it smelling of roses really. mimseycal

8:39pm Thu 25 Apr 13

mimseycal says...

@ wippasnapper 3:26pm Thu 25 Apr 13
"You know I’ve often heard over the years many Jewish people using the word “holocaust” to justify what they have been doing towards the Palestinian people, many Jewish people clamming that this is another anti-Zionist attack agents the Jewish religion… so if it is; what do they call what they are doing to the Palestinian people?"

I've heard it claimed admittedly but I've never really seen a single instance of the State of Israel doing so. I've often heard English people telling their less light-skinned compatriots to go back to where they came from. Am I to hold the government of the UK to account for what some eejits shout?
@ wippasnapper 3:26pm Thu 25 Apr 13 "You know I’ve often heard over the years many Jewish people using the word “holocaust” to justify what they have been doing towards the Palestinian people, many Jewish people clamming that this is another anti-Zionist attack agents the Jewish religion… so if it is; what do they call what they are doing to the Palestinian people?" I've heard it claimed admittedly but I've never really seen a single instance of the State of Israel doing so. I've often heard English people telling their less light-skinned compatriots to go back to where they came from. Am I to hold the government of the UK to account for what some eejits shout? mimseycal

9:34pm Thu 25 Apr 13

Ish1 says...

Fight_Back wrote:
Ish1 wrote:
Fight_Back wrote:
I don't support or agree with what the woman has said at all and UKIP should expel her BUT it's not factually correct to say she's denied the holocaust happened - she's just questioned the cause ( and completely incorrectly ).
That she chose not to be available to clarify her position speaks for itself!
Errr .... maybe she wasn't available ? Regardless, her remarks were awful and incorrect but at least hang the woman by facts rather than "she's guilty because she refused / couldn't respond" !
If she cannot or probably more accurately chooses not to make
herself available to clarify her position then the voters should likewise not make themselves available to vote for her.
[quote][p][bold]Fight_Back[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Ish1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Fight_Back[/bold] wrote: I don't support or agree with what the woman has said at all and UKIP should expel her BUT it's not factually correct to say she's denied the holocaust happened - she's just questioned the cause ( and completely incorrectly ).[/p][/quote]That she chose not to be available to clarify her position speaks for itself![/p][/quote]Errr .... maybe she wasn't available ? Regardless, her remarks were awful and incorrect but at least hang the woman by facts rather than "she's guilty because she refused / couldn't respond" ![/p][/quote]If she cannot or probably more accurately chooses not to make herself available to clarify her position then the voters should likewise not make themselves available to vote for her. Ish1

12:32am Fri 26 Apr 13

Romola says...

Ish1 wrote:
getThisCoalitionOut wrote:
She has NOT denied the holocaust.

She is entitled to her opinion - we all are - if you don't like it, you don't have to read it.

The state of Israel was requested by Lord Rothschild here in the UK - he neither came from that area or was a jew.

The Rothschilds claim that they are Jewish, when in fact they are Khazars. They are from a country called Khazaria, which occupied the land locked between the Black Sea and the Caspian Sea which is now predominantly occupied by Georgia.

You will find that approximately 90% of people in the world today who call themselves Jews are actually Khazars, or as they like to be known, Ashkenazi Jews. These people knowingly lie to the world with their claims that the land of Israel is theirs by birthright, when in actual fact their real homeland is over 800 miles away in Georgia.

The facts are out there - it's up to each of us to find them and be aware of what is going on in the world.
You write absolute nonsense.

The Rothchilds were and still are Jewish and like me are proud to be Jews.
Except Ish1 would say you weren't. S/he's now the arbiter of who's Jewish and who isn't.
[quote][p][bold]Ish1[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]getThisCoalitionOut[/bold] wrote: She has NOT denied the holocaust. She is entitled to her opinion - we all are - if you don't like it, you don't have to read it. The state of Israel was requested by Lord Rothschild here in the UK - he neither came from that area or was a jew. The Rothschilds claim that they are Jewish, when in fact they are Khazars. They are from a country called Khazaria, which occupied the land locked between the Black Sea and the Caspian Sea which is now predominantly occupied by Georgia. You will find that approximately 90% of people in the world today who call themselves Jews are actually Khazars, or as they like to be known, Ashkenazi Jews. These people knowingly lie to the world with their claims that the land of Israel is theirs by birthright, when in actual fact their real homeland is over 800 miles away in Georgia. The facts are out there - it's up to each of us to find them and be aware of what is going on in the world.[/p][/quote]You write absolute nonsense. The Rothchilds were and still are Jewish and like me are proud to be Jews.[/p][/quote]Except Ish1 would say you weren't. S/he's now the arbiter of who's Jewish and who isn't. Romola

6:26am Fri 26 Apr 13

mimseycal says...

I've never heard a more utterly ludicrous, not to mention so missing the point argument about who is or isn't Jewish then that old chestnut about the Khazars. Quite aside of the fact that it is one of the most racist arguments ... along the lines of the old eugenics movement that is.

Generally trotted out by the type of debaters you find on those far right extremists sites who somehow cannot shake the concept of genetic purity from their puny little souls.

I have some old photographs dating back to the 1930s. When I first showed one of them to some people who knew my daughters when they were of a similar age, I was asked what my daughter was doing in that old fashioned gear.
It is in fact a photograph of a Serah van der Heijm (van der Heijm being my mothers' maiden name). Little Serah van der Heijm was born in Rotterdam on 27 June 1933. The list with the names of the transport Drancy-Auschwitz of 31st July 1943, have been saved and holds the names of Meijer (her father), Wilhelmina (her mother), Jacob (her brother older by two years) and Serah van der Heijm (aged approximately 10). They died in Auschwitz.
Just one little girl amongst many others, just one more child among many people who were perceived as being of lesser worth then the Aryans. They were gypsies, Jews, homosexuals, communists, Jehova Witnesses, blacks ... Men, women and children selected for nothing more then their birth and family line or their sexual preference, political conviction or religious affiliation.
Much along the lines of the Armenian Genocide where the Ottoman government targeted for extermination the Assyrians, the Greeks and other minority groups.

And we swore never again! And yet ... - Guatemala 1966-1996
- Pakistan (Bangladesh War of 1971) - Burundi 1972 (mass-killings of Hutu
by the Tutsi army)
followed by:
- Burundi 1993 (killing of Tutsi by the Hutu population)
- North Korea (Up to one million have died in North Korea's political prison camps which detain dissidents and their entire families, including children, for perceived political offences)
- Equatorial Guinea (Out of a population of 300,000, an estimated 80,000 had been killed, in particular those of the Bubi ethnic minority on Bioko associated with relative wealth and intellectualism. People were killed for wearing spectacles for crying out loud!)
- Laos 1975 (where the Hmong were targetted with up to 100,000 killed out of a population 400,000)

and those are just a few ... the list of targeting people for being 'other' goes on. And it all starts with they are just this, that or whatever but not the same as me/we/us ...
I've never heard a more utterly ludicrous, not to mention so missing the point argument about who is or isn't Jewish then that old chestnut about the Khazars. Quite aside of the fact that it is one of the most racist arguments ... along the lines of the old eugenics movement that is. Generally trotted out by the type of debaters you find on those far right extremists sites who somehow cannot shake the concept of genetic purity from their puny little souls. I have some old photographs dating back to the 1930s. When I first showed one of them to some people who knew my daughters when they were of a similar age, I was asked what my daughter was doing in that old fashioned gear. It is in fact a photograph of a Serah van der Heijm (van der Heijm being my mothers' maiden name). Little Serah van der Heijm was born in Rotterdam on 27 June 1933. The list with the names of the transport Drancy-Auschwitz of 31st July 1943, have been saved and holds the names of Meijer (her father), Wilhelmina (her mother), Jacob (her brother older by two years) and Serah van der Heijm (aged approximately 10). They died in Auschwitz. Just one little girl amongst many others, just one more child among many people who were perceived as being of lesser worth then the Aryans. They were gypsies, Jews, homosexuals, communists, Jehova Witnesses, blacks ... Men, women and children selected for nothing more then their birth and family line or their sexual preference, political conviction or religious affiliation. Much along the lines of the Armenian Genocide where the Ottoman government targeted for extermination the Assyrians, the Greeks and other minority groups. And we swore never again! And yet ... - Guatemala 1966-1996 - Pakistan (Bangladesh War of 1971) - Burundi 1972 (mass-killings of Hutu by the Tutsi army) followed by: - Burundi 1993 (killing of Tutsi by the Hutu population) - North Korea (Up to one million have died in North Korea's political prison camps which detain dissidents and their entire families, including children, for perceived political offences) - Equatorial Guinea (Out of a population of 300,000, an estimated 80,000 had been killed, in particular those of the Bubi ethnic minority on Bioko associated with relative wealth and intellectualism. People were killed for wearing spectacles for crying out loud!) - Laos 1975 (where the Hmong were targetted with up to 100,000 killed out of a population 400,000) and those are just a few ... the list of targeting people for being 'other' goes on. And it all starts with they are just this, that or whatever but not the same as me/we/us ... mimseycal

12:57pm Fri 26 Apr 13

Dirk Von Roden says...

yet again a reasoned well thought out return from Mimseycal , I know Mimseycal could tell us many things that would/could astound most of us ! one thing I have found She can back everything she says either by her first hand knowledge or by her unending research on the subjects she comments on! so I would rather listen to her arguements than some of the childish responses that have been pposted on here!
yet again a reasoned well thought out return from Mimseycal , I know Mimseycal could tell us many things that would/could astound most of us ! one thing I have found She can back everything she says either by her first hand knowledge or by her unending research on the subjects she comments on! so I would rather listen to her arguements than some of the childish responses that have been pposted on here! Dirk Von Roden

12:58pm Fri 26 Apr 13

Dirk Von Roden says...

yet again a reasoned well thought out return from Mimseycal , I know Mimseycal could tell us many things that would/could astound most of us ! one thing I have found She can back everything she says either by her first hand knowledge or by her unending research on the subjects she comments on! so I would rather listen to her educated answers than some of the childish responses that have been posted on here!
yet again a reasoned well thought out return from Mimseycal , I know Mimseycal could tell us many things that would/could astound most of us ! one thing I have found She can back everything she says either by her first hand knowledge or by her unending research on the subjects she comments on! so I would rather listen to her educated answers than some of the childish responses that have been posted on here! Dirk Von Roden

1:09pm Fri 26 Apr 13

Dirk Von Roden says...

getThisCoalitionOut wrote:
She has NOT denied the holocaust.

She is entitled to her opinion - we all are - if you don't like it, you don't have to read it.

The state of Israel was requested by Lord Rothschild here in the UK - he neither came from that area or was a jew.

The Rothschilds claim that they are Jewish, when in fact they are Khazars. They are from a country called Khazaria, which occupied the land locked between the Black Sea and the Caspian Sea which is now predominantly occupied by Georgia.

You will find that approximately 90% of people in the world today who call themselves Jews are actually Khazars, or as they like to be known, Ashkenazi Jews. These people knowingly lie to the world with their claims that the land of Israel is theirs by birthright, when in actual fact their real homeland is over 800 miles away in Georgia.

The facts are out there - it's up to each of us to find them and be aware of what is going on in the world.
I always thought the "Israelites ! were the thirteenth tribe Banished to the desert! if the Bible has anything to do with it! there was/has never been a land called Israel untill the 30s and that was leased by Ben Gurion in small plots of land on behalf of the Jews who were scattered around the world ! it was meant mostly as a refuge to the Jewish people who were being persecuted by Hitler and his Nazi party! due to the British giving in to terrorism ( a British sargeant had been kidnapped killed and bound to a tree and when British soldiers went to retrieve the body they were blown up by booby traps! "The first IEDs" I do not support Israels genocide/decimation of the Palestinian People or their theft of the Palestinians land ! But I do beleive some sort of agreement could be found for them to have some land so they can have a "Legitimate " place thay can call Israel! all the while there are deniers the Israelis have the worlds sympathy ! please note I call them Israelis not "JEWS" the Jewish people are as fed up with the Israeli /Palestine Situation as most decent thinking folk are!
[quote][p][bold]getThisCoalitionOut[/bold] wrote: She has NOT denied the holocaust. She is entitled to her opinion - we all are - if you don't like it, you don't have to read it. The state of Israel was requested by Lord Rothschild here in the UK - he neither came from that area or was a jew. The Rothschilds claim that they are Jewish, when in fact they are Khazars. They are from a country called Khazaria, which occupied the land locked between the Black Sea and the Caspian Sea which is now predominantly occupied by Georgia. You will find that approximately 90% of people in the world today who call themselves Jews are actually Khazars, or as they like to be known, Ashkenazi Jews. These people knowingly lie to the world with their claims that the land of Israel is theirs by birthright, when in actual fact their real homeland is over 800 miles away in Georgia. The facts are out there - it's up to each of us to find them and be aware of what is going on in the world.[/p][/quote]I always thought the "Israelites ! were the thirteenth tribe Banished to the desert! if the Bible has anything to do with it! there was/has never been a land called Israel untill the 30s and that was leased by Ben Gurion in small plots of land on behalf of the Jews who were scattered around the world ! it was meant mostly as a refuge to the Jewish people who were being persecuted by Hitler and his Nazi party! due to the British giving in to terrorism ( a British sargeant had been kidnapped killed and bound to a tree and when British soldiers went to retrieve the body they were blown up by booby traps! "The first IEDs" I do not support Israels genocide/decimation of the Palestinian People or their theft of the Palestinians land ! But I do beleive some sort of agreement could be found for them to have some land so they can have a "Legitimate " place thay can call Israel! all the while there are deniers the Israelis have the worlds sympathy ! please note I call them Israelis not "JEWS" the Jewish people are as fed up with the Israeli /Palestine Situation as most decent thinking folk are! Dirk Von Roden

1:24pm Fri 26 Apr 13

MuammarQaddafi says...

Sounds dodgy if Mr "Zuckerburg" can't spell his own name correctly. Still, Crampton's silence on the matter shows management skills unsuited to a Council member. Either way, it's idiocy on the loose, as usual.
Sounds dodgy if Mr "Zuckerburg" can't spell his own name correctly. Still, Crampton's silence on the matter shows management skills unsuited to a Council member. Either way, it's idiocy on the loose, as usual. MuammarQaddafi

1:28pm Fri 26 Apr 13

Dirk Von Roden says...

Tedious Pedant wrote:
Dirk Von Roden wrote:
I abhore the party known as "UKIP" but reading what is allegedly written by her, I see NO Denial of the Holocaust ! I do see her making a statement that the Zionists were responsible for the war ! although outrageous and at worst slanderous! there is absolutely no denial! there is also Proof that funding for the second world war "ALLEGEDLY"came from the Rothschilds in the form of Loans! they ALLEGEDLY funded America Britain and Germany Spain Italy do we need to go on ? this is a subject I would really like to find out more about! the Funding issue was originally made public by a Jewish American way back in the 50s! now whether to believe the allegations or not is up to YOU and other conspiracy theorists! more important at the moment is "WAS her account hacked???"
Proof? Allegedly? Doesn't 'allegedly' mean not proved?
I say allegedly as I have not seen the so called "Proof" It has not been Proven to me so again its alleged! just because someone says they have "PROOF" and has documents to "Prove" does not mean to say it is 100% correct and until you have seen said proof or said proof is a common belief I will still say alleged! thankyou Tedious! obviously you know the dictionary meaning of "PEDANT and Tedious" as it is the most apt description any poster has ever given themself! lol
[quote][p][bold]Tedious Pedant[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Dirk Von Roden[/bold] wrote: I abhore the party known as "UKIP" but reading what is allegedly written by her, I see NO Denial of the Holocaust ! I do see her making a statement that the Zionists were responsible for the war ! although outrageous and at worst slanderous! there is absolutely no denial! there is also Proof that funding for the second world war "ALLEGEDLY"came from the Rothschilds in the form of Loans! they ALLEGEDLY funded America Britain and Germany Spain Italy do we need to go on ? this is a subject I would really like to find out more about! the Funding issue was originally made public by a Jewish American way back in the 50s! now whether to believe the allegations or not is up to YOU and other conspiracy theorists! more important at the moment is "WAS her account hacked???"[/p][/quote]Proof? Allegedly? Doesn't 'allegedly' mean not proved?[/p][/quote]I say allegedly as I have not seen the so called "Proof" It has not been Proven to me so again its alleged! just because someone says they have "PROOF" and has documents to "Prove" does not mean to say it is 100% correct and until you have seen said proof or said proof is a common belief I will still say alleged! thankyou Tedious! obviously you know the dictionary meaning of "PEDANT and Tedious" as it is the most apt description any poster has ever given themself! lol Dirk Von Roden

1:45pm Fri 26 Apr 13

vivelavive says...

longman wrote:
Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily.
Try engaging your brain. Stealing a people's homeland and subjecting them to military occupation IS NOT OK! Giving some of them a job doesn't excuse the injustices and violence. And if you insist on holidaying in a conflict zone you take your chances. Fool!!
[quote][p][bold]longman[/bold] wrote: Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily.[/p][/quote]Try engaging your brain. Stealing a people's homeland and subjecting them to military occupation IS NOT OK! Giving some of them a job doesn't excuse the injustices and violence. And if you insist on holidaying in a conflict zone you take your chances. Fool!! vivelavive

3:30pm Fri 26 Apr 13

mimseycal says...

vivelavive, I'd be very careful about making the 'stealing homeland' accusations especially of you consider yourself one of the Western world. Until not so very long ago Britain, France, Holland and Spain were amongst the foremost in sailing forth and just acquisitioning whole tracts of land, not to mention a couple of continents, regardless of which people occupied them.

Indian reservations were not that long ago nor was the removal of aborigine children from their homes and families by force.

Many a country has expanded or lost territory through conflict; and just because Britain and the USofA elect to now fight wars far from their homeland borders, we cannot presume that using military force to extend political (and economic) power is not part of the game.

I would suggest you first and foremost concentrate on setting your own house in order before attempting to address the mess in your neighbours' back garden.
vivelavive, I'd be very careful about making the 'stealing homeland' accusations especially of you consider yourself one of the Western world. Until not so very long ago Britain, France, Holland and Spain were amongst the foremost in sailing forth and just acquisitioning whole tracts of land, not to mention a couple of continents, regardless of which people occupied them. Indian reservations were not that long ago nor was the removal of aborigine children from their homes and families by force. Many a country has expanded or lost territory through conflict; and just because Britain and the USofA elect to now fight wars far from their homeland borders, we cannot presume that using military force to extend political (and economic) power is not part of the game. I would suggest you first and foremost concentrate on setting your own house in order before attempting to address the mess in your neighbours' back garden. mimseycal

4:09pm Fri 26 Apr 13

mimseycal says...

I've just located the original postings. The woman actually claims the Protocols of Zion as a source. Ye gawds! That book has been acknowledged as a forgery since the practically day one of its publication. The only ones who still stand by it ARE the conspiracy theorists of the extreme far right.
I've just located the original postings. The woman actually claims the Protocols of Zion as a source. Ye gawds! That book has been acknowledged as a forgery since the practically day one of its publication. The only ones who still stand by it ARE the conspiracy theorists of the extreme far right. mimseycal

4:52pm Fri 26 Apr 13

John Steed says...

mimseycal wrote:
I've just located the original postings. The woman actually claims the Protocols of Zion as a source. Ye gawds! That book has been acknowledged as a forgery since the practically day one of its publication. The only ones who still stand by it ARE the conspiracy theorists of the extreme far right.
why not ask her who shot JFK, its a slow news day so the response might brighten things up.
but are we sure that she actually posted this twaddle, it is such a pointless rant
[quote][p][bold]mimseycal[/bold] wrote: I've just located the original postings. The woman actually claims the Protocols of Zion as a source. Ye gawds! That book has been acknowledged as a forgery since the practically day one of its publication. The only ones who still stand by it ARE the conspiracy theorists of the extreme far right.[/p][/quote]why not ask her who shot JFK, its a slow news day so the response might brighten things up. but are we sure that she actually posted this twaddle, it is such a pointless rant John Steed

6:06pm Fri 26 Apr 13

mimseycal says...

Oh, it is a pointless rant but then again, a lot of the ramblings of conspiracy theorists are. Try it sometimes. Post a thread on a far right extremist site moaning about the late blooming of daffodils this year and next thing you know you are in a deluge of how it is all the fault of the Protocols of Zion or the machinations of the establishment who are scared of them and therefore have done the special Mason rain-dance to ensure that the seasons are all mixed up and that it would all be fine if only we left the EU, got rid of all the immigrants, put the women in the kitchens, red pillar boxes, beat bobbies on a bike and white picket fences bestrewn with roses.

No, I don't know for sure that she made those posts, any more then I can be sure you are actually who you claim to be; or you can be sure that I am whom I claim to be. Such is the nature of internet posting.
But what I can know for sure is that a poster calling herself Anna-Marie Crampton, and until this afternoon accompanied by an avatar that was the spitting image of the woman portrayed above grinning companionably with Nigel Farage, posted the crapola discussed.
Oh, it is a pointless rant but then again, a lot of the ramblings of conspiracy theorists are. Try it sometimes. Post a thread on a far right extremist site moaning about the late blooming of daffodils this year and next thing you know you are in a deluge of how it is all the fault of the Protocols of Zion or the machinations of the establishment who are scared of them and therefore have done the special Mason rain-dance to ensure that the seasons are all mixed up and that it would all be fine if only we left the EU, got rid of all the immigrants, put the women in the kitchens, red pillar boxes, beat bobbies on a bike and white picket fences bestrewn with roses. No, I don't know for sure that she made those posts, any more then I can be sure you are actually who you claim to be; or you can be sure that I am whom I claim to be. Such is the nature of internet posting. But what I can know for sure is that a poster calling herself Anna-Marie Crampton, and until this afternoon accompanied by an avatar that was the spitting image of the woman portrayed above grinning companionably with Nigel Farage, posted the crapola discussed. mimseycal

7:29am Sun 28 Apr 13

juleshove says...

vivelavive wrote:
longman wrote:
Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily.
Try engaging your brain. Stealing a people's homeland and subjecting them to military occupation IS NOT OK! Giving some of them a job doesn't excuse the injustices and violence. And if you insist on holidaying in a conflict zone you take your chances. Fool!!
Eer actually.Vivlevive your the fool. Many other.western countries have gained land through wars. And remember Israel was attacked first and fought a war to protect its existence.

Nothing unusual about the situation other than it annoyed all of its extremist neighbours
[quote][p][bold]vivelavive[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]longman[/bold] wrote: Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily.[/p][/quote]Try engaging your brain. Stealing a people's homeland and subjecting them to military occupation IS NOT OK! Giving some of them a job doesn't excuse the injustices and violence. And if you insist on holidaying in a conflict zone you take your chances. Fool!![/p][/quote]Eer actually.Vivlevive your the fool. Many other.western countries have gained land through wars. And remember Israel was attacked first and fought a war to protect its existence. Nothing unusual about the situation other than it annoyed all of its extremist neighbours juleshove

1:16pm Mon 29 Apr 13

Pikey-Biker says...

Israel only got its way after terrorist atrocities leading up to their independence, that makes them as bad as the Palestinians
Israel only got its way after terrorist atrocities leading up to their independence, that makes them as bad as the Palestinians Pikey-Biker

2:02pm Mon 29 Apr 13

olebut says...

What she said, or didn't say, or indeed how she said it is 2ndry. , Her comments clearly indicate her political naivety and shows she is not fit to be a politician regardless.
What she said, or didn't say, or indeed how she said it is 2ndry. , Her comments clearly indicate her political naivety and shows she is not fit to be a politician regardless. olebut

5:01pm Mon 29 Apr 13

vivelavive says...

juleshove wrote:
vivelavive wrote:
longman wrote:
Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily.
Try engaging your brain. Stealing a people's homeland and subjecting them to military occupation IS NOT OK! Giving some of them a job doesn't excuse the injustices and violence. And if you insist on holidaying in a conflict zone you take your chances. Fool!!
Eer actually.Vivlevive your the fool. Many other.western countries have gained land through wars. And remember Israel was attacked first and fought a war to protect its existence.

Nothing unusual about the situation other than it annoyed all of its extremist neighbours
No actually you are the fool. Because of the holocaust many people in the West such as yourself only look at the origins of this conflict from a biased pro-Israeli position. Now try thinking about it from an Arab point of view.....

One morning they woke up to find that a document had been signed thousands of miles away at the behest of Britain and the US that all of a sudden gave their land to a bunch of European refugees/immigrants. Nothing to do with extremism. They attacked Israel in self-defence to take back their land.

If you have a different interpretation of the facts then you are misguided.
[quote][p][bold]juleshove[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]vivelavive[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]longman[/bold] wrote: Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily.[/p][/quote]Try engaging your brain. Stealing a people's homeland and subjecting them to military occupation IS NOT OK! Giving some of them a job doesn't excuse the injustices and violence. And if you insist on holidaying in a conflict zone you take your chances. Fool!![/p][/quote]Eer actually.Vivlevive your the fool. Many other.western countries have gained land through wars. And remember Israel was attacked first and fought a war to protect its existence. Nothing unusual about the situation other than it annoyed all of its extremist neighbours[/p][/quote]No actually you are the fool. Because of the holocaust many people in the West such as yourself only look at the origins of this conflict from a biased pro-Israeli position. Now try thinking about it from an Arab point of view..... One morning they woke up to find that a document had been signed thousands of miles away at the behest of Britain and the US that all of a sudden gave their land to a bunch of European refugees/immigrants. Nothing to do with extremism. They attacked Israel in self-defence to take back their land. If you have a different interpretation of the facts then you are misguided. vivelavive

5:26pm Mon 29 Apr 13

mimseycal says...

vivelavive wrote:
juleshove wrote:
vivelavive wrote:
longman wrote:
Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily.
Try engaging your brain. Stealing a people's homeland and subjecting them to military occupation IS NOT OK! Giving some of them a job doesn't excuse the injustices and violence. And if you insist on holidaying in a conflict zone you take your chances. Fool!!
Eer actually.Vivlevive your the fool. Many other.western countries have gained land through wars. And remember Israel was attacked first and fought a war to protect its existence.

Nothing unusual about the situation other than it annoyed all of its extremist neighbours
No actually you are the fool. Because of the holocaust many people in the West such as yourself only look at the origins of this conflict from a biased pro-Israeli position. Now try thinking about it from an Arab point of view.....

One morning they woke up to find that a document had been signed thousands of miles away at the behest of Britain and the US that all of a sudden gave their land to a bunch of European refugees/immigrants. Nothing to do with extremism. They attacked Israel in self-defence to take back their land.

If you have a different interpretation of the facts then you are misguided.
None so blind as those who will not see and none so myopic as those who only see what suits them.
[quote][p][bold]vivelavive[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]juleshove[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]vivelavive[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]longman[/bold] wrote: Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily.[/p][/quote]Try engaging your brain. Stealing a people's homeland and subjecting them to military occupation IS NOT OK! Giving some of them a job doesn't excuse the injustices and violence. And if you insist on holidaying in a conflict zone you take your chances. Fool!![/p][/quote]Eer actually.Vivlevive your the fool. Many other.western countries have gained land through wars. And remember Israel was attacked first and fought a war to protect its existence. Nothing unusual about the situation other than it annoyed all of its extremist neighbours[/p][/quote]No actually you are the fool. Because of the holocaust many people in the West such as yourself only look at the origins of this conflict from a biased pro-Israeli position. Now try thinking about it from an Arab point of view..... One morning they woke up to find that a document had been signed thousands of miles away at the behest of Britain and the US that all of a sudden gave their land to a bunch of European refugees/immigrants. Nothing to do with extremism. They attacked Israel in self-defence to take back their land. If you have a different interpretation of the facts then you are misguided.[/p][/quote]None so blind as those who will not see and none so myopic as those who only see what suits them. mimseycal

5:21pm Thu 2 May 13

vivelavive says...

mimseycal wrote:
vivelavive wrote:
juleshove wrote:
vivelavive wrote:
longman wrote:
Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily.
Try engaging your brain. Stealing a people's homeland and subjecting them to military occupation IS NOT OK! Giving some of them a job doesn't excuse the injustices and violence. And if you insist on holidaying in a conflict zone you take your chances. Fool!!
Eer actually.Vivlevive your the fool. Many other.western countries have gained land through wars. And remember Israel was attacked first and fought a war to protect its existence.

Nothing unusual about the situation other than it annoyed all of its extremist neighbours
No actually you are the fool. Because of the holocaust many people in the West such as yourself only look at the origins of this conflict from a biased pro-Israeli position. Now try thinking about it from an Arab point of view.....

One morning they woke up to find that a document had been signed thousands of miles away at the behest of Britain and the US that all of a sudden gave their land to a bunch of European refugees/immigrants. Nothing to do with extremism. They attacked Israel in self-defence to take back their land.

If you have a different interpretation of the facts then you are misguided.
None so blind as those who will not see and none so myopic as those who only see what suits them.
Is that right?!

Israel did not exist before 1948. Fact! The land was given to the jewish people by a decree forced through by two major world powers. Fact! The people already living on this land were terrorised off it and this situation continues to this day. Fact!

These are facts. You may not like them but that won't make them go away.
[quote][p][bold]mimseycal[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]vivelavive[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]juleshove[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]vivelavive[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]longman[/bold] wrote: Yet still the HOLIDAY MAKERS in Eilat, hundreds of whom are not Jewish or Israeli, but want to have a holiday on the Red Sea, have to suffer the rockets fired at the resort. Why should they suffer? They are not 'suppressing' the 'poor and badly treated' Palestinians. Before you go off on one, find out what is actually going on in Gaza; how the Israelis are employing them AND for a better wage than they get in Gaza. Try and find out for yourself and stop listening to the propaganda that is being fed to you daily.[/p][/quote]Try engaging your brain. Stealing a people's homeland and subjecting them to military occupation IS NOT OK! Giving some of them a job doesn't excuse the injustices and violence. And if you insist on holidaying in a conflict zone you take your chances. Fool!![/p][/quote]Eer actually.Vivlevive your the fool. Many other.western countries have gained land through wars. And remember Israel was attacked first and fought a war to protect its existence. Nothing unusual about the situation other than it annoyed all of its extremist neighbours[/p][/quote]No actually you are the fool. Because of the holocaust many people in the West such as yourself only look at the origins of this conflict from a biased pro-Israeli position. Now try thinking about it from an Arab point of view..... One morning they woke up to find that a document had been signed thousands of miles away at the behest of Britain and the US that all of a sudden gave their land to a bunch of European refugees/immigrants. Nothing to do with extremism. They attacked Israel in self-defence to take back their land. If you have a different interpretation of the facts then you are misguided.[/p][/quote]None so blind as those who will not see and none so myopic as those who only see what suits them.[/p][/quote]Is that right?! Israel did not exist before 1948. Fact! The land was given to the jewish people by a decree forced through by two major world powers. Fact! The people already living on this land were terrorised off it and this situation continues to this day. Fact! These are facts. You may not like them but that won't make them go away. vivelavive

7:13pm Thu 2 May 13

mimseycal says...

@ vivelavive 5:21pm Thu 2 May 13

"Israel did not exist before 1948. Fact! The land was given to the jewish people by a decree forced through by two major world powers. Fact! The people already living on this land were terrorised off it and this situation continues to this day. Fact!"

Despite the fact that this is not the place to go into this, I am getting just a tad fed up with these assertions. Look dearling, if you want to resort to historical Facts to support your rather one sided view of things do so by all means. But don't start with just an arbitrary point in yester-time that suits your agenda.

Why not select say 1878 when the first Jewish agricultural village was started in Petach Tikva. Not by European Jews as it happens but by old-time Jewish families from the old Jewish Quarter in Jerusalem: whom, according to the Turkish census of 1875, already constituted a majority of the population of Jerusalem and by 1905 comprised two-thirds of its citizens.
Or how about reading The Land System in Palestine (Eyre
and Spottiswoode, London, 1952) which states 57% of the land owned by Jews had been acquired from large Arab landowners. The rest having been acquired from churches, foreign companies and from the Palestinian Government amongst others.
Try reading the Report of the Palestine
Royal Commission 1937 as well. It has some interesting observations regarding its findings.

But realise this ... Nothing is going to change the situation in the Middle East as long as people are not prepared to address the need for a solution today because of a sin committed yesterday.

Neither Jew nor Arab, Israeli or Palestinian come out smelling of roses if we look back over time. Over the years all parties to this have sinned as well as been sinned against.
@ vivelavive 5:21pm Thu 2 May 13 "Israel did not exist before 1948. Fact! The land was given to the jewish people by a decree forced through by two major world powers. Fact! The people already living on this land were terrorised off it and this situation continues to this day. Fact!" Despite the fact that this is not the place to go into this, I am getting just a tad fed up with these assertions. Look dearling, if you want to resort to historical Facts to support your rather one sided view of things do so by all means. But don't start with just an arbitrary point in yester-time that suits your agenda. Why not select say 1878 when the first Jewish agricultural village was started in Petach Tikva. Not by European Jews as it happens but by old-time Jewish families from the old Jewish Quarter in Jerusalem: whom, according to the Turkish census of 1875, already constituted a majority of the population of Jerusalem and by 1905 comprised two-thirds of its citizens. Or how about reading The Land System in Palestine (Eyre and Spottiswoode, London, 1952) which states 57% of the land owned by Jews had been acquired from large Arab landowners. The rest having been acquired from churches, foreign companies and from the Palestinian Government amongst others. Try reading the Report of the Palestine Royal Commission 1937 as well. It has some interesting observations regarding its findings. But realise this ... Nothing is going to change the situation in the Middle East as long as people are not prepared to address the need for a solution today because of a sin committed yesterday. Neither Jew nor Arab, Israeli or Palestinian come out smelling of roses if we look back over time. Over the years all parties to this have sinned as well as been sinned against. mimseycal

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