Get orf your land! Saltdean farmers face abuse from dog walkers for grazing sheep on their fields

Michael, left, and David Carr

Michael, left, and David Carr

First published in News by

Farmers trying to graze sheep on their land claim they have been abused and threatened by dog walkers.

Members of farming partnership WD Carr said they could be fined if they do not maintain the field at the conservation area at the top of Coombe Rise in Saltdean.

But when one farmer started to put up a sheep-proof fence around the open-access land a dog-walker threatened to “knock his lights out” if sheep were put in the field.

Another pet owner allegedly threatened to cut down and vandalise the fence.

Michael Carr, 55, of WD Carr Partnership said: “The dog walkers' problem is that if there are animals in the field they would have to keep their dogs under control, on a leash, while they pass through it.

“Our man who tried to put the fence up was very upset about it all. We can't do anything if we're being threatened.

"It would only be for a few weeks while the sheep graze the field to encourage flowers to grow and the field is only about a quarter of a mile long.

“We have no problem with dog walkers being on there and they would only need to have their dogs on leashes for about ten minutes.”

He said the conservation area has been designated by Natural England.

Mr Carr added: “We are required to keep it in check, which includes grazing. If we don't keep it maintained we could lose the conservation status and even get fined.

“Plus we would lose all the money we've received so far from Natural England to keep it a conservation site.

“It is an awkward situation for us.”

Although the field is owned by the farming partnership, it is designated as open access under the Countryside and Rights of Way Act 2000 (CROW).This means the public can walk freely on it without having to stick to paths.

Since CROW came into effect in 2005, people across England now have more than 865,000 hectares of land to freely explore without having to stay on paths.

Mr Carr said the incidents were not reported to Sussex Police and the partnership would try to erect a fence again soon.

Comments (23)

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6:52am Thu 10 Apr 14

Juleyanne says...

This is laughable from a farming family with a long history of being not very nice to just about everyone and everything!
This is laughable from a farming family with a long history of being not very nice to just about everyone and everything! Juleyanne
  • Score: 11

6:52am Thu 10 Apr 14

brightonbatfink says...

Ridiculous that people think they can tell a farmer whether or not he can graze his own land. It might be public access, but that does not mean it is owned by the public.

Most dog owners enjoy yhe countryside while acting responsibly with dogs, respecting farmland and access where livestock are present and keep dogs on leads where needed. Why must the minority be so disrespectful.

The CROW Act actually says that between beginning or March and end of July dogs must be kept on short leads...whether there are livestock present or not. Thats not enforced on this site when livestock aren't present, or on most CROW access land.
Ridiculous that people think they can tell a farmer whether or not he can graze his own land. It might be public access, but that does not mean it is owned by the public. Most dog owners enjoy yhe countryside while acting responsibly with dogs, respecting farmland and access where livestock are present and keep dogs on leads where needed. Why must the minority be so disrespectful. The CROW Act actually says that between beginning or March and end of July dogs must be kept on short leads...whether there are livestock present or not. Thats not enforced on this site when livestock aren't present, or on most CROW access land. brightonbatfink
  • Score: 20

6:57am Thu 10 Apr 14

brightonbatfink says...

Juleyanne wrote:
This is laughable from a farming family with a long history of being not very nice to just about everyone and everything!
I don't know the detaiks, but I see why people would be upset then, despite what I right above. If public aren't respected I guess the farmers can't expect it back.

The poor guy putting the fence up probably didn't deserve the agression though!
[quote][p][bold]Juleyanne[/bold] wrote: This is laughable from a farming family with a long history of being not very nice to just about everyone and everything![/p][/quote]I don't know the detaiks, but I see why people would be upset then, despite what I right above. If public aren't respected I guess the farmers can't expect it back. The poor guy putting the fence up probably didn't deserve the agression though! brightonbatfink
  • Score: 4

7:45am Thu 10 Apr 14

hoveguyactually says...

Farmers have a tough time, especially with the extraordinary weather we have had in recent years. They should not be subjected to the utterly selfish behaviour of dog owners, In any case, dogs should be kept on a lead a all times in public places. When I go into the countryside I don't want them running up and jumping on me, with their filthy paws and their owners saying "It's all right. He doesn't bite".
Farmers have a tough time, especially with the extraordinary weather we have had in recent years. They should not be subjected to the utterly selfish behaviour of dog owners, In any case, dogs should be kept on a lead a all times in public places. When I go into the countryside I don't want them running up and jumping on me, with their filthy paws and their owners saying "It's all right. He doesn't bite". hoveguyactually
  • Score: 23

8:04am Thu 10 Apr 14

spa301 says...

Not sure if some of the commentators above have any knowledge of the Carr family but to a significant number of residents in Saltdean they are notoriously unpleasant. A few years back they were extremely unpleasant and aggressive with my elderly mother so I wish them nothing but ill will. How dare they try and come across as the victims.
Not sure if some of the commentators above have any knowledge of the Carr family but to a significant number of residents in Saltdean they are notoriously unpleasant. A few years back they were extremely unpleasant and aggressive with my elderly mother so I wish them nothing but ill will. How dare they try and come across as the victims. spa301
  • Score: 19

8:13am Thu 10 Apr 14

salty_pete says...

So next time I see him in the early hours of the morning in his long wheel base Land Rover with his infa red lamp pointing in the direction of houses, no doubt looking for foxes on private land (not his). I'll be ringing the police to see if he's actually pointing a high powered rifle in the same direction. It may also be that as it is now lambing season he will now think it is open season to shoot dogs ... if he can't put his fence up.
So next time I see him in the early hours of the morning in his long wheel base Land Rover with his infa red lamp pointing in the direction of houses, no doubt looking for foxes on private land (not his). I'll be ringing the police to see if he's actually pointing a high powered rifle in the same direction. It may also be that as it is now lambing season he will now think it is open season to shoot dogs ... if he can't put his fence up. salty_pete
  • Score: 2

8:53am Thu 10 Apr 14

HJarrs says...

There are a tiny but persistent number of antisocial dog owners that are spoiling it for the 99% of responsible owners. Last year I dragged a dog off a sheep in Sheepcote Valley, the owner could not have cared less. I was helped by a number of people who were able to keep their dogs under control.

It is time we stopped some people from keeping dogs due to their lack of respect for others.
There are a tiny but persistent number of antisocial dog owners that are spoiling it for the 99% of responsible owners. Last year I dragged a dog off a sheep in Sheepcote Valley, the owner could not have cared less. I was helped by a number of people who were able to keep their dogs under control. It is time we stopped some people from keeping dogs due to their lack of respect for others. HJarrs
  • Score: 28

9:48am Thu 10 Apr 14

tykemison says...

Dogs on leads and their owners to for that matter! I reckon if man sets foot on mars there will probably be some buffoon walking his Dog's, annoying everyone else and smiling as if it's ok his mutt is salivating all over the place.
Dogs on leads and their owners to for that matter! I reckon if man sets foot on mars there will probably be some buffoon walking his Dog's, annoying everyone else and smiling as if it's ok his mutt is salivating all over the place. tykemison
  • Score: -2

9:55am Thu 10 Apr 14

plantwoman says...

Walk somewhere else!
Walk somewhere else! plantwoman
  • Score: 3

10:16am Thu 10 Apr 14

stuffy says...

This story is not about the carr family. Its about the irresponsible few dog walkers who it seems cannot read signs. Dogs should be on a fixed lead between march and july, always where live stock is kept whilst walking through the field even if livestock are not present there are signs on the gates. Livestock means every farm animal. There is always anotherside to every story of course people are not always going to get on and will make stories up about people. The dog walkers didnt like the sheep on telscombe tye or the hirses for that matter. They probably didnt like the cow's either. For me I woukd rather have my dog in control whilst walking on farm land.
This story is not about the carr family. Its about the irresponsible few dog walkers who it seems cannot read signs. Dogs should be on a fixed lead between march and july, always where live stock is kept whilst walking through the field even if livestock are not present there are signs on the gates. Livestock means every farm animal. There is always anotherside to every story of course people are not always going to get on and will make stories up about people. The dog walkers didnt like the sheep on telscombe tye or the hirses for that matter. They probably didnt like the cow's either. For me I woukd rather have my dog in control whilst walking on farm land. stuffy
  • Score: 7

10:47am Thu 10 Apr 14

tishy1 says...

This is nothing to do with the Carr family and what they may have or may not have done this is basic principal, keep your dogs on leads when near live stock and shut all gates so livestock remains in it's place. Unfortunately some dog walkers are arrogant and believe they own every part of land that has a bit of grass on. This is happening everywhere not just salt dean farmers even councils can't graze their land because of irresponsible dog walkers to allow their dogs to attack animals. Saltdean is a beautiful place with a lot of countryside, dog walkers have the whole of Telscombe tye to
Wallk over yet they are getting violent over one field. What's is this world coming to when a farmer can't even graze his land without being theftened by frankly a small minded idiot, who believes they rule Saltdean. It's pathetic really. Just stick to the rules keep your dog on a lead when around livestock and maybe there wouldn't be so many killings when it comes to helpless livestock being attacked by unleashed dogs.
This is nothing to do with the Carr family and what they may have or may not have done this is basic principal, keep your dogs on leads when near live stock and shut all gates so livestock remains in it's place. Unfortunately some dog walkers are arrogant and believe they own every part of land that has a bit of grass on. This is happening everywhere not just salt dean farmers even councils can't graze their land because of irresponsible dog walkers to allow their dogs to attack animals. Saltdean is a beautiful place with a lot of countryside, dog walkers have the whole of Telscombe tye to Wallk over yet they are getting violent over one field. What's is this world coming to when a farmer can't even graze his land without being theftened by frankly a small minded idiot, who believes they rule Saltdean. It's pathetic really. Just stick to the rules keep your dog on a lead when around livestock and maybe there wouldn't be so many killings when it comes to helpless livestock being attacked by unleashed dogs. tishy1
  • Score: 11

3:43pm Thu 10 Apr 14

fredflintstone1 says...

HJarrs wrote:
There are a tiny but persistent number of antisocial dog owners that are spoiling it for the 99% of responsible owners. Last year I dragged a dog off a sheep in Sheepcote Valley, the owner could not have cared less. I was helped by a number of people who were able to keep their dogs under control.

It is time we stopped some people from keeping dogs due to their lack of respect for others.
You also should bear in mind that if the Council stopped taking over public parks and turning them into city sheep farms, then this type of tragic incident simply wouldn't happen.
[quote][p][bold]HJarrs[/bold] wrote: There are a tiny but persistent number of antisocial dog owners that are spoiling it for the 99% of responsible owners. Last year I dragged a dog off a sheep in Sheepcote Valley, the owner could not have cared less. I was helped by a number of people who were able to keep their dogs under control. It is time we stopped some people from keeping dogs due to their lack of respect for others.[/p][/quote]You also should bear in mind that if the Council stopped taking over public parks and turning them into city sheep farms, then this type of tragic incident simply wouldn't happen. fredflintstone1
  • Score: 0

5:03pm Thu 10 Apr 14

Fairfax Aches says...

What a pansy this farmer is. If anyone spoke to me like that, on my own property or anywhere, they'd get a jolly good seeing to and make no mistake.
What a pansy this farmer is. If anyone spoke to me like that, on my own property or anywhere, they'd get a jolly good seeing to and make no mistake. Fairfax Aches
  • Score: 1

7:17pm Thu 10 Apr 14

DCCCCCC says...

hoveguyactually wrote:
Farmers have a tough time, especially with the extraordinary weather we have had in recent years. They should not be subjected to the utterly selfish behaviour of dog owners, In any case, dogs should be kept on a lead a all times in public places. When I go into the countryside I don't want them running up and jumping on me, with their filthy paws and their owners saying "It's all right. He doesn't bite".
My dogs are always off lead in public places where appropriate and never have or would they jump up anyone as they have been trained not to. I wouldn't want them catching anything from the likes of you, typical dog hater over reacting!
[quote][p][bold]hoveguyactually[/bold] wrote: Farmers have a tough time, especially with the extraordinary weather we have had in recent years. They should not be subjected to the utterly selfish behaviour of dog owners, In any case, dogs should be kept on a lead a all times in public places. When I go into the countryside I don't want them running up and jumping on me, with their filthy paws and their owners saying "It's all right. He doesn't bite".[/p][/quote]My dogs are always off lead in public places where appropriate and never have or would they jump up anyone as they have been trained not to. I wouldn't want them catching anything from the likes of you, typical dog hater over reacting! DCCCCCC
  • Score: -5

7:20pm Thu 10 Apr 14

DCCCCCC says...

tykemison wrote:
Dogs on leads and their owners to for that matter! I reckon if man sets foot on mars there will probably be some buffoon walking his Dog's, annoying everyone else and smiling as if it's ok his mutt is salivating all over the place.
Oh get a life. You don't know how pathetic you sound!
[quote][p][bold]tykemison[/bold] wrote: Dogs on leads and their owners to for that matter! I reckon if man sets foot on mars there will probably be some buffoon walking his Dog's, annoying everyone else and smiling as if it's ok his mutt is salivating all over the place.[/p][/quote]Oh get a life. You don't know how pathetic you sound! DCCCCCC
  • Score: 2

9:39pm Thu 10 Apr 14

ghost bus driver says...

Fairfax Aches wrote:
What a pansy this farmer is. If anyone spoke to me like that, on my own property or anywhere, they'd get a jolly good seeing to and make no mistake.
I bet they would ;)
[quote][p][bold]Fairfax Aches[/bold] wrote: What a pansy this farmer is. If anyone spoke to me like that, on my own property or anywhere, they'd get a jolly good seeing to and make no mistake.[/p][/quote]I bet they would ;) ghost bus driver
  • Score: 1

10:31pm Thu 10 Apr 14

Juleyanne says...

I do not condone irresponsible dog ownership, nor sheep chasing. However, I have heard far too many alleged stories, from too many people over the years,who have had guns pointed at their dogs who where not interested or even able to chase sheep.
I have also heard another alleged account from a lone lady who claimed she was chased and intimidated by a tractor whilst on a right of way footpath, which was ploughed up and muck spreading made it impassable. Also I have heard of sheep breaking into surrounding gardens and elderly pensioners being verbally abused. I reserve the right to make my own decision about this story and my conclusion remains - it is laughable!
I do not condone irresponsible dog ownership, nor sheep chasing. However, I have heard far too many alleged stories, from too many people over the years,who have had guns pointed at their dogs who where not interested or even able to chase sheep. I have also heard another alleged account from a lone lady who claimed she was chased and intimidated by a tractor whilst on a right of way footpath, which was ploughed up and muck spreading made it impassable. Also I have heard of sheep breaking into surrounding gardens and elderly pensioners being verbally abused. I reserve the right to make my own decision about this story and my conclusion remains - it is laughable! Juleyanne
  • Score: 7

10:23am Fri 11 Apr 14

B rian Tawses left foot says...

Mr Hoogstraten was right !
Mr Hoogstraten was right ! B rian Tawses left foot
  • Score: 0

5:13pm Fri 11 Apr 14

getThisCoalitionOut says...

Bet these disgusting farmers are hunters as well as shooters. May their guns explode in their faces.
Bet these disgusting farmers are hunters as well as shooters. May their guns explode in their faces. getThisCoalitionOut
  • Score: 0

9:39pm Fri 11 Apr 14

tishy1 says...

The way some people speak is actually discusting, shooting dogs that attack sheep wouldn't happen if owners kept them on a lead when around livestock! It's the owner that needs shooting if they can't control their animal!! This article says nothing about these farmer wanting to shoot animals only that they want to graze THEIR fields and they have every single right to do so on the land they own! with out being theftened and feeling harm will come to their animals if they do so.
The way some people speak is actually discusting, shooting dogs that attack sheep wouldn't happen if owners kept them on a lead when around livestock! It's the owner that needs shooting if they can't control their animal!! This article says nothing about these farmer wanting to shoot animals only that they want to graze THEIR fields and they have every single right to do so on the land they own! with out being theftened and feeling harm will come to their animals if they do so. tishy1
  • Score: 0

12:15am Sat 12 Apr 14

RossC21 says...

getThisCoalitionOut wrote:
Bet these disgusting farmers are hunters as well as shooters. May their guns explode in their faces.
"getthiscoalitionout
"

No doubt, a green flailing arm vegetarian hippy with no concept of game management of human nutrition, aye?

Moron.
[quote][p][bold]getThisCoalitionOut[/bold] wrote: Bet these disgusting farmers are hunters as well as shooters. May their guns explode in their faces.[/p][/quote]"getthiscoalitionout " No doubt, a green flailing arm vegetarian hippy with no concept of game management of human nutrition, aye? Moron. RossC21
  • Score: -1

5:57am Sat 12 Apr 14

menton says...

The Carrs are not the nicest of people, but in this case they are absolutely right. Sheep belong on the Downs where their grazing keeps the scrub down. Some dog owners are just plain selfish and arrogant. Either keep the dog on a lead or walk elsewhere.
The Carrs are not the nicest of people, but in this case they are absolutely right. Sheep belong on the Downs where their grazing keeps the scrub down. Some dog owners are just plain selfish and arrogant. Either keep the dog on a lead or walk elsewhere. menton
  • Score: 0

9:08am Tue 15 Apr 14

spa301 says...

Tw4t
Tw4t spa301
  • Score: 0

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