Mum whose son died in A23 crash backs increase in fines

Marcus Mohabir

Marcus Mohabir

First published in News by

A MOTHER whose two-year-old son was one of eight people killed in a horror car crash has backed Government plans to quadruple fines for speeding motorists.

Tracey Mohabir’s son, Marcus, was killed along with two of her close friends in the two-car crash on the A23 near Pyecombe on May 16, 2004.

Her husband, Steve, who was the sole survivor of the collision, held their dying son’s hand as rescue teams battled to free them.

The mum, who now lives in Surrey, said: “In the 10 years since the crash, Steve and I have tried to move on.

“But I still think constantly about the day we lost Marcus and our friends Toby and Kate.

“We have since had another child, Max, who has grown up without ever having known his brother. He often asks about him.

“Many other families have lost loved ones on our motorways and dual carriageways since we lost Marcus, often as a result of people driving too fast and too close to other vehicles.

“Driving over the speed limit has become a habit for many people, and it’s a habit we have to break to prevent yet more needless deaths and injuries.”

The Government announcement will give magistrates greater powers to punish speeders.

Justice Minister Jeremy Wright said: “Magistrates are the cornerstone of our justice system and these changes will provide them with greater powers to deal with the day-to-day offences that impact their local communities.”

The proposals are part of a range of new sentencing powers. Those driving too quickly on the motorway could be fined a maximum of £10,000 – up from £2,500.

However, motoring groups have criticised the increase.

AA president Edmund King said: “For the vast majority of drivers, the prospect of the existing £2,500 fine is a pretty good deterrent against excessive speeding on the motorway. We would not condone excessive speeding in any way but fines have to be proportionate to the offence and one has to question whether increasing the fines four-fold is proportionate, and it probably is not.”

Comments (16)

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4:42pm Wed 11 Jun 14

theargusissoinformative says...

Do Skidrow/Anna Phylactic have any relevant comments, or are you hiding now little boys?
Do Skidrow/Anna Phylactic have any relevant comments, or are you hiding now little boys? theargusissoinformative
  • Score: -4

4:46pm Wed 11 Jun 14

Gary1965 says...

Bad driving was the cause of that awful crash.

Two cars travelling three hundred yards apart can safely exceed the speed limit, but if one is driving too close, then their speed is largely irrelevant.

Collisions on the motorway are very rarely caused by speed.
Bad driving was the cause of that awful crash. Two cars travelling three hundred yards apart can safely exceed the speed limit, but if one is driving too close, then their speed is largely irrelevant. Collisions on the motorway are very rarely caused by speed. Gary1965
  • Score: -6

5:00pm Wed 11 Jun 14

spa301 says...

theargusissoinformat
ive
wrote:
Do Skidrow/Anna Phylactic have any relevant comments, or are you hiding now little boys?
eh?
[quote][p][bold]theargusissoinformat ive[/bold] wrote: Do Skidrow/Anna Phylactic have any relevant comments, or are you hiding now little boys?[/p][/quote]eh? spa301
  • Score: 3

6:24pm Wed 11 Jun 14

lewes road low life says...

Gary1965 wrote:
Bad driving was the cause of that awful crash.

Two cars travelling three hundred yards apart can safely exceed the speed limit, but if one is driving too close, then their speed is largely irrelevant.

Collisions on the motorway are very rarely caused by speed.
I am sure all the families who have lost loved ones in car accidents will find comfort in your indepth knowledge on the subject and words of wisdom.
p r i c k
[quote][p][bold]Gary1965[/bold] wrote: Bad driving was the cause of that awful crash. Two cars travelling three hundred yards apart can safely exceed the speed limit, but if one is driving too close, then their speed is largely irrelevant. Collisions on the motorway are very rarely caused by speed.[/p][/quote]I am sure all the families who have lost loved ones in car accidents will find comfort in your indepth knowledge on the subject and words of wisdom. p r i c k lewes road low life
  • Score: 6

6:48pm Wed 11 Jun 14

Gary1965 says...

lewes road low life wrote:
Gary1965 wrote:
Bad driving was the cause of that awful crash.

Two cars travelling three hundred yards apart can safely exceed the speed limit, but if one is driving too close, then their speed is largely irrelevant.

Collisions on the motorway are very rarely caused by speed.
I am sure all the families who have lost loved ones in car accidents will find comfort in your indepth knowledge on the subject and words of wisdom.
p r i c k
You chose a good username there.

The fact is that the records show that speed is rarely the major factor in collisions between vehicles.

Mrs Mohabir acknowledged poor driving as being a problem.

You can ignore the facts all you want, but those of us in the real world will merely take pity on your ignorance.
[quote][p][bold]lewes road low life[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Gary1965[/bold] wrote: Bad driving was the cause of that awful crash. Two cars travelling three hundred yards apart can safely exceed the speed limit, but if one is driving too close, then their speed is largely irrelevant. Collisions on the motorway are very rarely caused by speed.[/p][/quote]I am sure all the families who have lost loved ones in car accidents will find comfort in your indepth knowledge on the subject and words of wisdom. p r i c k[/p][/quote]You chose a good username there. The fact is that the records show that speed is rarely the major factor in collisions between vehicles. Mrs Mohabir acknowledged poor driving as being a problem. You can ignore the facts all you want, but those of us in the real world will merely take pity on your ignorance. Gary1965
  • Score: -1

6:54pm Wed 11 Jun 14

Gary1965 says...

Gary1965 wrote:
lewes road low life wrote:
Gary1965 wrote:
Bad driving was the cause of that awful crash.

Two cars travelling three hundred yards apart can safely exceed the speed limit, but if one is driving too close, then their speed is largely irrelevant.

Collisions on the motorway are very rarely caused by speed.
I am sure all the families who have lost loved ones in car accidents will find comfort in your indepth knowledge on the subject and words of wisdom.
p r i c k
You chose a good username there.

The fact is that the records show that speed is rarely the major factor in collisions between vehicles.

Mrs Mohabir acknowledged poor driving as being a problem.

You can ignore the facts all you want, but those of us in the real world will merely take pity on your ignorance.
http://www.rospa.com
/faqs/detail.aspx?fa
q=298

HTH
[quote][p][bold]Gary1965[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lewes road low life[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Gary1965[/bold] wrote: Bad driving was the cause of that awful crash. Two cars travelling three hundred yards apart can safely exceed the speed limit, but if one is driving too close, then their speed is largely irrelevant. Collisions on the motorway are very rarely caused by speed.[/p][/quote]I am sure all the families who have lost loved ones in car accidents will find comfort in your indepth knowledge on the subject and words of wisdom. p r i c k[/p][/quote]You chose a good username there. The fact is that the records show that speed is rarely the major factor in collisions between vehicles. Mrs Mohabir acknowledged poor driving as being a problem. You can ignore the facts all you want, but those of us in the real world will merely take pity on your ignorance.[/p][/quote]http://www.rospa.com /faqs/detail.aspx?fa q=298 HTH Gary1965
  • Score: -3

7:26pm Wed 11 Jun 14

lewes road low life says...

Gary1965 wrote:
Gary1965 wrote:
lewes road low life wrote:
Gary1965 wrote:
Bad driving was the cause of that awful crash.

Two cars travelling three hundred yards apart can safely exceed the speed limit, but if one is driving too close, then their speed is largely irrelevant.

Collisions on the motorway are very rarely caused by speed.
I am sure all the families who have lost loved ones in car accidents will find comfort in your indepth knowledge on the subject and words of wisdom.
p r i c k
You chose a good username there.

The fact is that the records show that speed is rarely the major factor in collisions between vehicles.

Mrs Mohabir acknowledged poor driving as being a problem.

You can ignore the facts all you want, but those of us in the real world will merely take pity on your ignorance.
http://www.rospa.com

/faqs/detail.aspx?fa

q=298

HTH
I live very much in the real world, along with the consequences and heartache of a fatal car accident in which I was witness and passenger in and scars my life to this day.
This article is about a mother backing a campaign to increase the punishment for speeding motorists having lost her little boy.
Your comment will be of no comfort to her, me or anybody else for that matter who have lost in this way.
[quote][p][bold]Gary1965[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Gary1965[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lewes road low life[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Gary1965[/bold] wrote: Bad driving was the cause of that awful crash. Two cars travelling three hundred yards apart can safely exceed the speed limit, but if one is driving too close, then their speed is largely irrelevant. Collisions on the motorway are very rarely caused by speed.[/p][/quote]I am sure all the families who have lost loved ones in car accidents will find comfort in your indepth knowledge on the subject and words of wisdom. p r i c k[/p][/quote]You chose a good username there. The fact is that the records show that speed is rarely the major factor in collisions between vehicles. Mrs Mohabir acknowledged poor driving as being a problem. You can ignore the facts all you want, but those of us in the real world will merely take pity on your ignorance.[/p][/quote]http://www.rospa.com /faqs/detail.aspx?fa q=298 HTH[/p][/quote]I live very much in the real world, along with the consequences and heartache of a fatal car accident in which I was witness and passenger in and scars my life to this day. This article is about a mother backing a campaign to increase the punishment for speeding motorists having lost her little boy. Your comment will be of no comfort to her, me or anybody else for that matter who have lost in this way. lewes road low life
  • Score: 5

8:00pm Wed 11 Jun 14

lewes road low life says...

http://www.google.co
.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q
=&esrc=s&source=web&
cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&
ved=0CCAQFjAA&url=ht
tp%3A%2F%2Fwww.thear
gus.co.uk%2Fnews%2F1
1245383.Motorist__ca
ught_driving__71mph_
in_a_20mph_zone%2F&e
i=Z6SYU5BNjp7sBuqkgZ
gG&usg=AFQjCNGhyIWhL
OsxP0Z9K_Wpwr_YgwkeD
A&sig2=c2hvsdzDW2Tdp
QLfKukg2g
What exactly would you have to do, or speed would you have to be travelling to get the maximum penalty of £2500 as it stands , let alone £10000 ?
http://www.google.co .uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q =&esrc=s&source=web& cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8& ved=0CCAQFjAA&url=ht tp%3A%2F%2Fwww.thear gus.co.uk%2Fnews%2F1 1245383.Motorist__ca ught_driving__71mph_ in_a_20mph_zone%2F&e i=Z6SYU5BNjp7sBuqkgZ gG&usg=AFQjCNGhyIWhL OsxP0Z9K_Wpwr_YgwkeD A&sig2=c2hvsdzDW2Tdp QLfKukg2g What exactly would you have to do, or speed would you have to be travelling to get the maximum penalty of £2500 as it stands , let alone £10000 ? lewes road low life
  • Score: 0

8:08pm Wed 11 Jun 14

lewes road low life says...

lewes road low life wrote:
http://www.google.co

.uk/url?sa=t&rct
=j&q
=&esrc=s&sou
rce=web&
cd=1&cad=rja&amp
;uact=8&
ved=0CCAQFjAA&ur
l=ht
tp%3A%2F%2Fwww.thear

gus.co.uk%2Fnews%2F1

1245383.Motorist__ca

ught_driving__71mph_

in_a_20mph_zone%2F&a
mp;e
i=Z6SYU5BNjp7sBuqkgZ

gG&usg=AFQjCNGhy
IWhL
OsxP0Z9K_Wpwr_YgwkeD

A&sig2=c2hvsdzDW
2Tdp
QLfKukg2g
What exactly would you have to do, or speed would you have to be travelling to get the maximum penalty of £2500 as it stands , let alone £10000 ?
sorry about that link, I was referring to the man who was caughtt speeding on Elm Grove at 71 mph in a 20 zone.
He recieved a 28 day driving ban and less than £300 in fines !
[quote][p][bold]lewes road low life[/bold] wrote: http://www.google.co .uk/url?sa=t&rct =j&q =&esrc=s&sou rce=web& cd=1&cad=rja& ;uact=8& ved=0CCAQFjAA&ur l=ht tp%3A%2F%2Fwww.thear gus.co.uk%2Fnews%2F1 1245383.Motorist__ca ught_driving__71mph_ in_a_20mph_zone%2F&a mp;e i=Z6SYU5BNjp7sBuqkgZ gG&usg=AFQjCNGhy IWhL OsxP0Z9K_Wpwr_YgwkeD A&sig2=c2hvsdzDW 2Tdp QLfKukg2g What exactly would you have to do, or speed would you have to be travelling to get the maximum penalty of £2500 as it stands , let alone £10000 ?[/p][/quote]sorry about that link, I was referring to the man who was caughtt speeding on Elm Grove at 71 mph in a 20 zone. He recieved a 28 day driving ban and less than £300 in fines ! lewes road low life
  • Score: 2

8:17pm Wed 11 Jun 14

Gary1965 says...

"This article is about a mother backing a campaign to increase the punishment for speeding motorists having lost her little boy."

I know, and I fully understand why those who have been affected by traffic accidents applaud every measure aimed at road safety. Speed wasn't a factor in the horrific incident, and Mrs Mohabir didn't blame anyone for it.

In fact, speed rarely is the sole factor in accidents. Speeding in itself affects no-one apart from those who are penalised for doing so.

In case you were wondering, bad driving is the major cause of accidents, and these increased fines for speeding do NOTHING to address that.

"and scars my life to this day."

In view of your earlier abusive comment, I'm SO happy to learn of that.
"This article is about a mother backing a campaign to increase the punishment for speeding motorists having lost her little boy." I know, and I fully understand why those who have been affected by traffic accidents applaud every measure aimed at road safety. Speed wasn't a factor in the horrific incident, and Mrs Mohabir didn't blame anyone for it. In fact, speed rarely is the sole factor in accidents. Speeding in itself affects no-one apart from those who are penalised for doing so. In case you were wondering, bad driving is the major cause of accidents, and these increased fines for speeding do NOTHING to address that. "and scars my life to this day." In view of your earlier abusive comment, I'm SO happy to learn of that. Gary1965
  • Score: -3

8:54pm Wed 11 Jun 14

lewes road low life says...

Dear Gary1965, I actually came back on here to see if you would reply, I was set to apologise for my first comment, I was a bit quick off the mark, unfortunately I cannot go back and edit my own comments once sent.. It was said because I felt your first comment insensitive to the original article and can summon strong emotions from me, perhaps take a step back and consider that Mrs Mohabir may well be reading this ?
As for your last comment "SO happy to learn of that" you have no idea, and it is I and hopefully most others reading this that will pity YOUR ignorance.
Dear Gary1965, I actually came back on here to see if you would reply, I was set to apologise for my first comment, I was a bit quick off the mark, unfortunately I cannot go back and edit my own comments once sent.. It was said because I felt your first comment insensitive to the original article and can summon strong emotions from me, perhaps take a step back and consider that Mrs Mohabir may well be reading this ? As for your last comment "SO happy to learn of that" you have no idea, and it is I and hopefully most others reading this that will pity YOUR ignorance. lewes road low life
  • Score: 3

9:31pm Wed 11 Jun 14

Gary1965 says...

lewes road low life wrote:
Dear Gary1965, I actually came back on here to see if you would reply, I was set to apologise for my first comment, I was a bit quick off the mark, unfortunately I cannot go back and edit my own comments once sent.. It was said because I felt your first comment insensitive to the original article and can summon strong emotions from me, perhaps take a step back and consider that Mrs Mohabir may well be reading this ?
As for your last comment "SO happy to learn of that" you have no idea, and it is I and hopefully most others reading this that will pity YOUR ignorance.
You were abusive, but an apology would have sufficed, especially if you had taken the trouble to explain your anger.

I would have no problem with her reading any of this, because she would be doing so of her own choice. She certainly doesn't mind being reminded of the tragedy because she freely have an interview to someone over these fines. Further, I see the flowers etc placed at the scene every time I ride past.

My point throughout this has been that speeding doesn't cause accidents, and every time someone receives the maximum fine it will be proving that the fines aren't a deterrent.

I am more than happy with the other increased fines for mobile use, no insurance, etc, because things like that affect others directly.

Shall we just bump heads and move on, united in our anger at what useless drivers put us all through?
[quote][p][bold]lewes road low life[/bold] wrote: Dear Gary1965, I actually came back on here to see if you would reply, I was set to apologise for my first comment, I was a bit quick off the mark, unfortunately I cannot go back and edit my own comments once sent.. It was said because I felt your first comment insensitive to the original article and can summon strong emotions from me, perhaps take a step back and consider that Mrs Mohabir may well be reading this ? As for your last comment "SO happy to learn of that" you have no idea, and it is I and hopefully most others reading this that will pity YOUR ignorance.[/p][/quote]You were abusive, but an apology would have sufficed, especially if you had taken the trouble to explain your anger. I would have no problem with her reading any of this, because she would be doing so of her own choice. She certainly doesn't mind being reminded of the tragedy because she freely have an interview to someone over these fines. Further, I see the flowers etc placed at the scene every time I ride past. My point throughout this has been that speeding doesn't cause accidents, and every time someone receives the maximum fine it will be proving that the fines aren't a deterrent. I am more than happy with the other increased fines for mobile use, no insurance, etc, because things like that affect others directly. Shall we just bump heads and move on, united in our anger at what useless drivers put us all through? Gary1965
  • Score: 0

11:50pm Wed 11 Jun 14

Gruntfuggly says...

How do you reconcile this government announcement with the recent case of the guy doing 71mph in a 20mph zone and getting a 28 day ban and a £183 fine?

http://www.theargus.
co.uk/news/11245383.
Motorist__caught_dri
ving__71mph_in_a_20m
ph_zone/

Higher fines seems like a good idea, but maybe if the punishments were remotely realistic in the first place they wouldn't be needed?
How do you reconcile this government announcement with the recent case of the guy doing 71mph in a 20mph zone and getting a 28 day ban and a £183 fine? http://www.theargus. co.uk/news/11245383. Motorist__caught_dri ving__71mph_in_a_20m ph_zone/ Higher fines seems like a good idea, but maybe if the punishments were remotely realistic in the first place they wouldn't be needed? Gruntfuggly
  • Score: 2

1:36am Thu 12 Jun 14

lewes road low life says...

Gruntfuggly wrote:
How do you reconcile this government announcement with the recent case of the guy doing 71mph in a 20mph zone and getting a 28 day ban and a £183 fine?

http://www.theargus.

co.uk/news/11245383.

Motorist__caught_dri

ving__71mph_in_a_20m

ph_zone/

Higher fines seems like a good idea, but maybe if the punishments were remotely realistic in the first place they wouldn't be needed?
exactly my thoughts.
I tried to find a news report via search engine of a case where a motorist was fined the maximum penanlty as it stands but with no luck.
It makes you wonder just how much more "off the scale" (the judges words) that driver would have had to have been to get a harsher punishment given the number of parked cars, side streets etc. in a heavily residential area such as Elm grove ( although I am not nescessarily an advocate of the 20 mph zone in all streets )
Apologies to Gary1965 for my earlier abusive language, whilst I understand his point, it goes against the messages the police and government try to drum in to us that "speed kills".
reaction time is less, stopping time increased. I am sure there are plenty of cases where two vehicles driving too close but maybe not speeding have collided only to be hit by a speeding vehicle following that had no time to stop safely or avoid them.
As far as I am concerned speed is just as important as careful and considerate driving.
[quote][p][bold]Gruntfuggly[/bold] wrote: How do you reconcile this government announcement with the recent case of the guy doing 71mph in a 20mph zone and getting a 28 day ban and a £183 fine? http://www.theargus. co.uk/news/11245383. Motorist__caught_dri ving__71mph_in_a_20m ph_zone/ Higher fines seems like a good idea, but maybe if the punishments were remotely realistic in the first place they wouldn't be needed?[/p][/quote]exactly my thoughts. I tried to find a news report via search engine of a case where a motorist was fined the maximum penanlty as it stands but with no luck. It makes you wonder just how much more "off the scale" (the judges words) that driver would have had to have been to get a harsher punishment given the number of parked cars, side streets etc. in a heavily residential area such as Elm grove ( although I am not nescessarily an advocate of the 20 mph zone in all streets ) Apologies to Gary1965 for my earlier abusive language, whilst I understand his point, it goes against the messages the police and government try to drum in to us that "speed kills". reaction time is less, stopping time increased. I am sure there are plenty of cases where two vehicles driving too close but maybe not speeding have collided only to be hit by a speeding vehicle following that had no time to stop safely or avoid them. As far as I am concerned speed is just as important as careful and considerate driving. lewes road low life
  • Score: 2

7:25am Thu 12 Jun 14

Maxwell's Ghost says...

Sadly speeding fines do not prevent speeding. They are administered after the danger and risk has been carried out by the driver ie the chap in Elm Grove. The likelihood of these offenders being regular speeders in the past creating risk is high.
The only way to reduce speed and prevent accidents are cameras and police units on patrol.
It will be interesting to see if the fines imposed go to increasing traffic policing or are merely squirrelled away by the treasury for unrelated projects.
Also remember that those committing the extreme speeding often commit other offences such as the chap in elm grove - he was a mechanic yet drove a car without an MoT which meant the car was also a possible danger. The driver who caused the accident in the A 23 killing many was reported at the inquest to have been driving at high speed, tailgating, undertaking and traces of cannabis were found in his blood.
Drivers who commit these crimes are often committing other crimes, hence the need for mobile police units.
Sadly speeding fines do not prevent speeding. They are administered after the danger and risk has been carried out by the driver ie the chap in Elm Grove. The likelihood of these offenders being regular speeders in the past creating risk is high. The only way to reduce speed and prevent accidents are cameras and police units on patrol. It will be interesting to see if the fines imposed go to increasing traffic policing or are merely squirrelled away by the treasury for unrelated projects. Also remember that those committing the extreme speeding often commit other offences such as the chap in elm grove - he was a mechanic yet drove a car without an MoT which meant the car was also a possible danger. The driver who caused the accident in the A 23 killing many was reported at the inquest to have been driving at high speed, tailgating, undertaking and traces of cannabis were found in his blood. Drivers who commit these crimes are often committing other crimes, hence the need for mobile police units. Maxwell's Ghost
  • Score: 3

10:34am Thu 12 Jun 14

Gary1965 says...

"The driver who caused the accident in the A 23 killing many was reported at the inquest to have been driving at high speed, tailgating, undertaking and traces of cannabis were found in his blood."

So speeding wasn't the cause of the accident - it was bad driving coupled to impaired control of the vehicle.

"Apologies to Gary1965 for my earlier abusive language"

Accepted.

Disagree with me all you like on anything, but please don't get abusive.
"The driver who caused the accident in the A 23 killing many was reported at the inquest to have been driving at high speed, tailgating, undertaking and traces of cannabis were found in his blood." So speeding wasn't the cause of the accident - it was bad driving coupled to impaired control of the vehicle. "Apologies to Gary1965 for my earlier abusive language" Accepted. Disagree with me all you like on anything, but please don't get abusive. Gary1965
  • Score: -1

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