Huge rise in council staff sick levels at Brighton and Hove City Council

Brighton and Hove City Council's King's House offices

Brighton and Hove City Council's King's House offices

First published in News
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COUNCIL staff are taking more than two weeks off sick a year – a rise of 18% in the past two years.

Ill employees took a total of 46,184 days off in 2013/14 – an average of more than 11 sick days a year each.

Union officials claim increasing demands on staff to deliver the same level of service with fewer people is to blame, as well as hot-desking spreading bugs.

The rising levels of sickness and stress were also noted by a party of senior officials from other local authorities who visited council offices last month. In response the city council is spending more money on occupational health so that staff can be seen more quickly.

From Page 1
The average number of sick days was higher in some departments, with adult services staff taking 13.5 days off sick on average and employees in the environment, development and housing team needing 14 days each.
The council is now specifically tackling these front-line staff for extra support.
Union bosses said that figures for adult services would be slightly “disproportionate” as staff were instructed to take longer off if suffering from infectious conditions to avoid passing it on to residents.
Comparatively in 2011/12 staff took a total of 38,832 sick days – an average of less than eight days per employee. The figures do not include school staff.

In the Local Government Association peer review senior officials said a “more accurate recording of sickness” could account for some of the rise.

The report said there is “still a way to go in addressing sickness absence” and recommended an employee well-being programme is extended to reduce stress.
GMB branch secretary Mark Turner said the problem lay with the council for trying to operate the same level of service with fewer staff.

He said: “Stress levels will continue to go up if you think that another £25 million will be taken out of the budget next year. Stress levels have gone up since the Government started taking money away from councils.

“If you take two people out of team with sickness it’s a problem because there’s the same level of work coming in.”

Sue Moorman, the council’s head of human resources, said the high levels of sickness are a concern and recognised there was “still more to do”.

She said: “Our approach is to support staff, agreeing realistic targets and increasing the numbers getting regular one-to-ones with their managers.

“Both adult services and environment, development and housing employ large numbers of front-line staff delivering services directly to the residents of Brighton and Hove.

“These areas have been prioritised for support and since the launch of our initiatives levels of sickness are reducing.”

Comments (51)

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6:28am Fri 8 Aug 14

Quiterie says...

This is disgusting. Never mind spending more on occupational health, the Council needs to get tough with these people. An average of 11 days sickness a year is obscene. And I don't buy the additional stress and workload argument. The sickness levels at Brighton and Hove Council are much higher than other Councils where there is also additional stress and workload. If these sickness figures were reduced to a more manageable level the Greens wouldn't need to propose such a large Council Tax increase.
This is disgusting. Never mind spending more on occupational health, the Council needs to get tough with these people. An average of 11 days sickness a year is obscene. And I don't buy the additional stress and workload argument. The sickness levels at Brighton and Hove Council are much higher than other Councils where there is also additional stress and workload. If these sickness figures were reduced to a more manageable level the Greens wouldn't need to propose such a large Council Tax increase. Quiterie
  • Score: 44

7:00am Fri 8 Aug 14

Youlikemyjugs says...

Sack them all now.
Sack them all now. Youlikemyjugs
  • Score: 4

7:07am Fri 8 Aug 14

rogerthefish says...

Clearly the ones operating the seafront maintenance and highways department are on permanent sick, or on a cruise as the money seems to be going somewhere.

Every day when I'm stuck in a jam in Brighton I'm counting the days till they go.
Clearly the ones operating the seafront maintenance and highways department are on permanent sick, or on a cruise as the money seems to be going somewhere. Every day when I'm stuck in a jam in Brighton I'm counting the days till they go. rogerthefish
  • Score: 46

7:07am Fri 8 Aug 14

Mng*68 says...

Really ..... How do you get tough with work related stress sickness - occupational health is designed to protect the needs of returning to work as soon as possible and reducing any future sickness. Quietrie - Can only assume the bubble you live in must be a picture of colour n bloom. Also do you honestly believe your council tax wouldn't get increased if there was no Council sickness ? Assure you , your wrong ! Your council tax is reflective to the figure central government provide and what your local council needs to spend in managing many services provided.
Really ..... How do you get tough with work related stress sickness - occupational health is designed to protect the needs of returning to work as soon as possible and reducing any future sickness. Quietrie - Can only assume the bubble you live in must be a picture of colour n bloom. Also do you honestly believe your council tax wouldn't get increased if there was no Council sickness ? Assure you , your wrong ! Your council tax is reflective to the figure central government provide and what your local council needs to spend in managing many services provided. Mng*68
  • Score: -12

7:11am Fri 8 Aug 14

hoveguyactually says...

"Sick" is the right word to describe this council. Unfortunately no one has come up with a cure yet.

"hot-desking spreading bugs." What on earth does that mean?
"Sick" is the right word to describe this council. Unfortunately no one has come up with a cure yet. "hot-desking spreading bugs." What on earth does that mean? hoveguyactually
  • Score: 18

7:21am Fri 8 Aug 14

Barney123 says...

It really makes you feel sick reading this! Public Sector staff just seem to be able to get away with massive amounts of sick leave - imagine the level of inefficiences at the council. Guess they'll be saying this is unfair, going on strike and saying how hard they work. Most of them should work in the private sector for a day and realise what a proper days work is!
It really makes you feel sick reading this! Public Sector staff just seem to be able to get away with massive amounts of sick leave - imagine the level of inefficiences at the council. Guess they'll be saying this is unfair, going on strike and saying how hard they work. Most of them should work in the private sector for a day and realise what a proper days work is! Barney123
  • Score: 23

7:22am Fri 8 Aug 14

dolphin 30 says...

Sickness on the council is brought up necause its a public office. I have no doubts there are other services, private or public that have high levels of absence that are not reported about. Yes, the council is stretched for resources
Like every council in the u.k at the moment. Council workers also pay council tax for services and would like to keep residents happy but when the resources arent there and the people want the same level of service. I dont see how this can happen.
Sickness on the council is brought up necause its a public office. I have no doubts there are other services, private or public that have high levels of absence that are not reported about. Yes, the council is stretched for resources Like every council in the u.k at the moment. Council workers also pay council tax for services and would like to keep residents happy but when the resources arent there and the people want the same level of service. I dont see how this can happen. dolphin 30
  • Score: 4

7:25am Fri 8 Aug 14

Quiterie says...

Mng*68 wrote:
Really ..... How do you get tough with work related stress sickness - occupational health is designed to protect the needs of returning to work as soon as possible and reducing any future sickness. Quietrie - Can only assume the bubble you live in must be a picture of colour n bloom. Also do you honestly believe your council tax wouldn't get increased if there was no Council sickness ? Assure you , your wrong ! Your council tax is reflective to the figure central government provide and what your local council needs to spend in managing many services provided.
Because by getting tough you prevent those employees who aren't really stressed, but who just fancy a few days off at the taxpayers expense from going off sick. The public sector average is about 7%. What makes our Council workers so special, that they need more time off than in other Councils? These workers should try the private sector where the average is about 5%. It would not be tolerated there.
[quote][p][bold]Mng*68[/bold] wrote: Really ..... How do you get tough with work related stress sickness - occupational health is designed to protect the needs of returning to work as soon as possible and reducing any future sickness. Quietrie - Can only assume the bubble you live in must be a picture of colour n bloom. Also do you honestly believe your council tax wouldn't get increased if there was no Council sickness ? Assure you , your wrong ! Your council tax is reflective to the figure central government provide and what your local council needs to spend in managing many services provided.[/p][/quote]Because by getting tough you prevent those employees who aren't really stressed, but who just fancy a few days off at the taxpayers expense from going off sick. The public sector average is about 7%. What makes our Council workers so special, that they need more time off than in other Councils? These workers should try the private sector where the average is about 5%. It would not be tolerated there. Quiterie
  • Score: 14

7:28am Fri 8 Aug 14

We love Red Billy says...

Unfortunately councils tend to suck up the weak and inept who then hide behind union protection. Recently encountered a classic one at the 'customer sevices desk' in Hove town hall. All I wanted was a receipt for the letter I was delivering because B and H had lost them before. Woman spent five minutes explaining why they were too busy to give one. Eventually with a harumph she got the manager who suggested I que for one with those paying parking fines. Having then received a brief education as to her duties a receipt was produced within 30 seconds. Never be afraid to remind them who they work for. Us.
Unfortunately councils tend to suck up the weak and inept who then hide behind union protection. Recently encountered a classic one at the 'customer sevices desk' in Hove town hall. All I wanted was a receipt for the letter I was delivering because B and H had lost them before. Woman spent five minutes explaining why they were too busy to give one. Eventually with a harumph she got the manager who suggested I que for one with those paying parking fines. Having then received a brief education as to her duties a receipt was produced within 30 seconds. Never be afraid to remind them who they work for. Us. We love Red Billy
  • Score: 27

7:48am Fri 8 Aug 14

matlock says...

I have a friend on the inside at B&H council. My friend is fully committed to doing a good job, and rarely takes time off sick.. However, she has colleagues who completely let their team down by (a) doing very little, (b) being incompetent and (c) taking excessive sickness. She says that the managers and directors tolerate it for an easy life partly because they don't want the hassle of the unions and partly because they are weak managers. There is on director who is split between two locations, but his staff quickly worked with a phone call to the other location, that he is often at neither.

The only way this will change is with the appointment of a robust, passionate, experienced and suitably rewarded council leader who cut their teeth in an aggressive cost-driven commercial sector. Sadly, only one of the above adjectives applies to the current leadership.
I have a friend on the inside at B&H council. My friend is fully committed to doing a good job, and rarely takes time off sick.. However, she has colleagues who completely let their team down by (a) doing very little, (b) being incompetent and (c) taking excessive sickness. She says that the managers and directors tolerate it for an easy life partly because they don't want the hassle of the unions and partly because they are weak managers. There is on director who is split between two locations, but his staff quickly worked with a phone call to the other location, that he is often at neither. The only way this will change is with the appointment of a robust, passionate, experienced and suitably rewarded council leader who cut their teeth in an aggressive cost-driven commercial sector. Sadly, only one of the above adjectives applies to the current leadership. matlock
  • Score: 38

7:58am Fri 8 Aug 14

psychoderek56 says...

Don't pay them - that's the only cure for sickness
Don't pay them - that's the only cure for sickness psychoderek56
  • Score: -1

8:03am Fri 8 Aug 14

matlock says...

psychoderek56 wrote:
Don't pay them - that's the only cure for sickness
I agree, but paid sick-leave is probably a contractual entitlement for them. However, the council could employ a doctor who's role is to visit the homes of people who call-in sick to 'check on their welfare'. Then see how rapidly the sickness level plummets!
[quote][p][bold]psychoderek56[/bold] wrote: Don't pay them - that's the only cure for sickness[/p][/quote]I agree, but paid sick-leave is probably a contractual entitlement for them. However, the council could employ a doctor who's role is to visit the homes of people who call-in sick to 'check on their welfare'. Then see how rapidly the sickness level plummets! matlock
  • Score: 10

8:29am Fri 8 Aug 14

Quiterie says...

matlock wrote:
I have a friend on the inside at B&H council. My friend is fully committed to doing a good job, and rarely takes time off sick.. However, she has colleagues who completely let their team down by (a) doing very little, (b) being incompetent and (c) taking excessive sickness. She says that the managers and directors tolerate it for an easy life partly because they don't want the hassle of the unions and partly because they are weak managers. There is on director who is split between two locations, but his staff quickly worked with a phone call to the other location, that he is often at neither.

The only way this will change is with the appointment of a robust, passionate, experienced and suitably rewarded council leader who cut their teeth in an aggressive cost-driven commercial sector. Sadly, only one of the above adjectives applies to the current leadership.
Very well said. Can you name this Director? I wouldn't be surprised if it's Geoff Raw. He is useless. A complete waste of space (and our taxpayer money).
[quote][p][bold]matlock[/bold] wrote: I have a friend on the inside at B&H council. My friend is fully committed to doing a good job, and rarely takes time off sick.. However, she has colleagues who completely let their team down by (a) doing very little, (b) being incompetent and (c) taking excessive sickness. She says that the managers and directors tolerate it for an easy life partly because they don't want the hassle of the unions and partly because they are weak managers. There is on director who is split between two locations, but his staff quickly worked with a phone call to the other location, that he is often at neither. The only way this will change is with the appointment of a robust, passionate, experienced and suitably rewarded council leader who cut their teeth in an aggressive cost-driven commercial sector. Sadly, only one of the above adjectives applies to the current leadership.[/p][/quote]Very well said. Can you name this Director? I wouldn't be surprised if it's Geoff Raw. He is useless. A complete waste of space (and our taxpayer money). Quiterie
  • Score: 28

8:43am Fri 8 Aug 14

platelet says...

More sick leave in the pipeline if their is relocation to Hove Town Hall for some as it is one of the ugliest, depressing building I could imagine having to work in.
More sick leave in the pipeline if their is relocation to Hove Town Hall for some as it is one of the ugliest, depressing building I could imagine having to work in. platelet
  • Score: 8

8:44am Fri 8 Aug 14

Fight_Back says...

I've seen some wild claims from the Unions but hot desking spreading bugs ???? Really ???? Many big companies use hot desking and we're talking about companies such as HP and Microsoft in Reading and Google in London. In fact HP have some buildings and sections that are only hot desking. Having worked in all these buildings alongside these companies employees I can assure you they don't have anywhere near the sickness levels mentioned in this report.

The Unions might like to look at other reasons for the sickness level rather than blaming hot desking. My experience of council employees when I've used is that there are many lazy ones that leave the majority of work to the hardworking few.
I've seen some wild claims from the Unions but hot desking spreading bugs ???? Really ???? Many big companies use hot desking and we're talking about companies such as HP and Microsoft in Reading and Google in London. In fact HP have some buildings and sections that are only hot desking. Having worked in all these buildings alongside these companies employees I can assure you they don't have anywhere near the sickness levels mentioned in this report. The Unions might like to look at other reasons for the sickness level rather than blaming hot desking. My experience of council employees when I've used is that there are many lazy ones that leave the majority of work to the hardworking few. Fight_Back
  • Score: 19

8:46am Fri 8 Aug 14

TIMBURRY says...

matlock wrote:
psychoderek56 wrote:
Don't pay them - that's the only cure for sickness
I agree, but paid sick-leave is probably a contractual entitlement for them. However, the council could employ a doctor who's role is to visit the homes of people who call-in sick to 'check on their welfare'. Then see how rapidly the sickness level plummets!
Not only is it against the law, can you imagine the cost.
[quote][p][bold]matlock[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]psychoderek56[/bold] wrote: Don't pay them - that's the only cure for sickness[/p][/quote]I agree, but paid sick-leave is probably a contractual entitlement for them. However, the council could employ a doctor who's role is to visit the homes of people who call-in sick to 'check on their welfare'. Then see how rapidly the sickness level plummets![/p][/quote]Not only is it against the law, can you imagine the cost. TIMBURRY
  • Score: 4

8:49am Fri 8 Aug 14

Morpheus says...

I bet there is a strong correlation between sickness and the hours of sunshine.
I bet there is a strong correlation between sickness and the hours of sunshine. Morpheus
  • Score: 6

9:02am Fri 8 Aug 14

Can this be says...

It is not that difficult. Schedule out the sick leave of all employees, highlighting Fridays and Mondays in particular. Initially interview the staff with (say) more than 5 days in a year and then tighten this down later. They will be surprised that anyone is looking.

Over harsh? No, it enables managers with the support of HR staff to focus on those who do have real health problems and provide them with the help they truly need.

Note that it is the responsibility of managers, not HR who are there to provide support.
It is not that difficult. Schedule out the sick leave of all employees, highlighting Fridays and Mondays in particular. Initially interview the staff with (say) more than 5 days in a year and then tighten this down later. They will be surprised that anyone is looking. Over harsh? No, it enables managers with the support of HR staff to focus on those who do have real health problems and provide them with the help they truly need. Note that it is the responsibility of managers, not HR who are there to provide support. Can this be
  • Score: 10

9:09am Fri 8 Aug 14

Cyril Bolleaux says...

I was having a chat with a local council union rep who I shall call AndyR. He explained how stressful his publicly funded job is. He has to be in the office by 10AM and then spends his morning insulting the public on various websites such as The Argus. Lunch at noon is followed by his surgery for union members at the Druid's Head all afternoon. Despite this busy day he sometimes has to do overtime at the weekend protesting against Israel. No wonder he is stressed.
I was having a chat with a local council union rep who I shall call AndyR. He explained how stressful his publicly funded job is. He has to be in the office by 10AM and then spends his morning insulting the public on various websites such as The Argus. Lunch at noon is followed by his surgery for union members at the Druid's Head all afternoon. Despite this busy day he sometimes has to do overtime at the weekend protesting against Israel. No wonder he is stressed. Cyril Bolleaux
  • Score: 19

9:11am Fri 8 Aug 14

still waiting says...

The quickest cure for staff sickness tends to be self-employment
The quickest cure for staff sickness tends to be self-employment still waiting
  • Score: 4

9:11am Fri 8 Aug 14

ThinkBrighton says...

Hot desking does not spread bugs, what it really is that the council workers are a bunch of lazy buggers. this sort of behaviour would not happen in the private sector, so why should it happen in the public sector, as for stress at work they must be joking, they are just looking for excusses to have a few days off.
Hot desking does not spread bugs, what it really is that the council workers are a bunch of lazy buggers. this sort of behaviour would not happen in the private sector, so why should it happen in the public sector, as for stress at work they must be joking, they are just looking for excusses to have a few days off. ThinkBrighton
  • Score: 4

9:12am Fri 8 Aug 14

Sir Prised says...

Well one answer would be to crush the travellers vehicles instead of continually chasing them around the city with bins and clear up people - I know we're not really allowed to express a view on travellers, despite them spending MY taxes and using MY facilities !
Well one answer would be to crush the travellers vehicles instead of continually chasing them around the city with bins and clear up people - I know we're not really allowed to express a view on travellers, despite them spending MY taxes and using MY facilities ! Sir Prised
  • Score: 24

9:12am Fri 8 Aug 14

s_james says...

This doesn't mean everyone takes 11 days sick leave a year. Where I work the median sick leave is probably 4 days or so max, but the mean is distorted by a couple of people who have been on long term sick for extremely serious diseases.
This doesn't mean everyone takes 11 days sick leave a year. Where I work the median sick leave is probably 4 days or so max, but the mean is distorted by a couple of people who have been on long term sick for extremely serious diseases. s_james
  • Score: 17

9:16am Fri 8 Aug 14

matlock says...

TIMBURRY wrote:
matlock wrote:
psychoderek56 wrote:
Don't pay them - that's the only cure for sickness
I agree, but paid sick-leave is probably a contractual entitlement for them. However, the council could employ a doctor who's role is to visit the homes of people who call-in sick to 'check on their welfare'. Then see how rapidly the sickness level plummets!
Not only is it against the law, can you imagine the cost.
Yes, it would cost, but can you imagine the savings?

Which law does this contravene, exactly?
[quote][p][bold]TIMBURRY[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]matlock[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]psychoderek56[/bold] wrote: Don't pay them - that's the only cure for sickness[/p][/quote]I agree, but paid sick-leave is probably a contractual entitlement for them. However, the council could employ a doctor who's role is to visit the homes of people who call-in sick to 'check on their welfare'. Then see how rapidly the sickness level plummets![/p][/quote]Not only is it against the law, can you imagine the cost.[/p][/quote]Yes, it would cost, but can you imagine the savings? Which law does this contravene, exactly? matlock
  • Score: 0

9:26am Fri 8 Aug 14

lovethegreens says...

Require a letter from the GP for each absence and see absence levels plummet, seen it work at my place.
Require a letter from the GP for each absence and see absence levels plummet, seen it work at my place. lovethegreens
  • Score: 6

9:29am Fri 8 Aug 14

We love Red Billy says...

Morpheus wrote:
I bet there is a strong correlation between sickness and the hours of sunshine.
I feel an information request coming on.
[quote][p][bold]Morpheus[/bold] wrote: I bet there is a strong correlation between sickness and the hours of sunshine.[/p][/quote]I feel an information request coming on. We love Red Billy
  • Score: -4

9:59am Fri 8 Aug 14

TIMBURRY says...

lovethegreens wrote:
Require a letter from the GP for each absence and see absence levels plummet, seen it work at my place.
The reason they brought in self certification in was to stop people wasting doctors time.
[quote][p][bold]lovethegreens[/bold] wrote: Require a letter from the GP for each absence and see absence levels plummet, seen it work at my place.[/p][/quote]The reason they brought in self certification in was to stop people wasting doctors time. TIMBURRY
  • Score: 7

10:57am Fri 8 Aug 14

dingdong2 says...

Why not hire a doctor and send them round the every person calling in sick - would soon pay for itself with people caught out making it up - thats if the council had the balls to sack anyone.
Why not hire a doctor and send them round the every person calling in sick - would soon pay for itself with people caught out making it up - thats if the council had the balls to sack anyone. dingdong2
  • Score: 1

11:42am Fri 8 Aug 14

Fairfax Aches says...

Brilliant! Where can I sign up?
Brilliant! Where can I sign up? Fairfax Aches
  • Score: -2

11:46am Fri 8 Aug 14

sussexram40 says...

Average numbers are meaningless.
Take a department of 10 people. Take a 1 year study.
8 of the 10 people have no sick absence whatsoever while the other 2 are off for each 4 months each due to more serious illness or operations such as for heart surgery.
The number of sickness days for the department in the year is 240, divided by 10 gives a department average of 24 days per person. Yet 80% of the staff had no sick leave at all and the other 20% had very genuine, serious health conditions.
Average numbers are meaningless. Take a department of 10 people. Take a 1 year study. 8 of the 10 people have no sick absence whatsoever while the other 2 are off for each 4 months each due to more serious illness or operations such as for heart surgery. The number of sickness days for the department in the year is 240, divided by 10 gives a department average of 24 days per person. Yet 80% of the staff had no sick leave at all and the other 20% had very genuine, serious health conditions. sussexram40
  • Score: 15

11:53am Fri 8 Aug 14

ThinkBrighton says...

TIMBURRY wrote:
lovethegreens wrote:
Require a letter from the GP for each absence and see absence levels plummet, seen it work at my place.
The reason they brought in self certification in was to stop people wasting doctors time.
It saves doctors time, but wastes everybody elses.
[quote][p][bold]TIMBURRY[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lovethegreens[/bold] wrote: Require a letter from the GP for each absence and see absence levels plummet, seen it work at my place.[/p][/quote]The reason they brought in self certification in was to stop people wasting doctors time.[/p][/quote]It saves doctors time, but wastes everybody elses. ThinkBrighton
  • Score: 3

11:55am Fri 8 Aug 14

ThinkBrighton says...

The problem is that public sector workers view the sick entitlement as an
extension to their holiday leave time .
The problem is that public sector workers view the sick entitlement as an extension to their holiday leave time . ThinkBrighton
  • Score: -7

12:51pm Fri 8 Aug 14

lovethegreens says...

ThinkBrighton wrote:
TIMBURRY wrote:
lovethegreens wrote:
Require a letter from the GP for each absence and see absence levels plummet, seen it work at my place.
The reason they brought in self certification in was to stop people wasting doctors time.
It saves doctors time, but wastes everybody elses.
You only do it once sickness reaches a certain trigger - in my experience its only the genuine that will go to the GP and therefore no additional pressure on them. Yes, I am sure that that there is a contractual benefit to sick pay but this is often at managers discretion. The US have it right, they get so much leave a year that can be used either as holiday or sick (and generally significantly less than European employers). Get a grip people and get to work, you are not owed a living.
[quote][p][bold]ThinkBrighton[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]TIMBURRY[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]lovethegreens[/bold] wrote: Require a letter from the GP for each absence and see absence levels plummet, seen it work at my place.[/p][/quote]The reason they brought in self certification in was to stop people wasting doctors time.[/p][/quote]It saves doctors time, but wastes everybody elses.[/p][/quote]You only do it once sickness reaches a certain trigger - in my experience its only the genuine that will go to the GP and therefore no additional pressure on them. Yes, I am sure that that there is a contractual benefit to sick pay but this is often at managers discretion. The US have it right, they get so much leave a year that can be used either as holiday or sick (and generally significantly less than European employers). Get a grip people and get to work, you are not owed a living. lovethegreens
  • Score: -12

2:03pm Fri 8 Aug 14

NickBrt says...

When labour was in power there was minimal absence. Now we have the greens its rockerted. Greens are useless. Greens do not champion work ethic. Greens must go.
When labour was in power there was minimal absence. Now we have the greens its rockerted. Greens are useless. Greens do not champion work ethic. Greens must go. NickBrt
  • Score: 11

3:25pm Fri 8 Aug 14

BlackRocker says...

Mng*68 wrote:
Really ..... How do you get tough with work related stress sickness - occupational health is designed to protect the needs of returning to work as soon as possible and reducing any future sickness. Quietrie - Can only assume the bubble you live in must be a picture of colour n bloom. Also do you honestly believe your council tax wouldn't get increased if there was no Council sickness ? Assure you , your wrong ! Your council tax is reflective to the figure central government provide and what your local council needs to spend in managing many services provided.
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
zzzzzzzzz
P.S. You mean "you're wrong" not "your wrong"; "reflective to"????
[quote][p][bold]Mng*68[/bold] wrote: Really ..... How do you get tough with work related stress sickness - occupational health is designed to protect the needs of returning to work as soon as possible and reducing any future sickness. Quietrie - Can only assume the bubble you live in must be a picture of colour n bloom. Also do you honestly believe your council tax wouldn't get increased if there was no Council sickness ? Assure you , your wrong ! Your council tax is reflective to the figure central government provide and what your local council needs to spend in managing many services provided.[/p][/quote]zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzz P.S. You mean "you're wrong" not "your wrong"; "reflective to"???? BlackRocker
  • Score: -1

4:00pm Fri 8 Aug 14

Tring says...

ThinkBrighton wrote:
The problem is that public sector workers view the sick entitlement as an
extension to their holiday leave time .
Erm, bit of an extreme generalisation perhaps?

I've worked in the public sector and the private sector and there are grafters and lazy sods in both.

One difference. The private sector doesn't release this kind of information, so it's impossible to make a meaningful comparison.

Eleven days sick per person sounds like a lot, but remember this figure will be jacked up by those signed off long term sick. For better and for worse, the public sector offers considerably more generous provision for this.
[quote][p][bold]ThinkBrighton[/bold] wrote: The problem is that public sector workers view the sick entitlement as an extension to their holiday leave time .[/p][/quote]Erm, bit of an extreme generalisation perhaps? I've worked in the public sector and the private sector and there are grafters and lazy sods in both. One difference. The private sector doesn't release this kind of information, so it's impossible to make a meaningful comparison. Eleven days sick per person sounds like a lot, but remember this figure will be jacked up by those signed off long term sick. For better and for worse, the public sector offers considerably more generous provision for this. Tring
  • Score: 2

5:20pm Fri 8 Aug 14

DCCCCCC says...

We love Red Billy wrote:
Unfortunately councils tend to suck up the weak and inept who then hide behind union protection. Recently encountered a classic one at the 'customer sevices desk' in Hove town hall. All I wanted was a receipt for the letter I was delivering because B and H had lost them before. Woman spent five minutes explaining why they were too busy to give one. Eventually with a harumph she got the manager who suggested I que for one with those paying parking fines. Having then received a brief education as to her duties a receipt was produced within 30 seconds. Never be afraid to remind them who they work for. Us.
Try working in a child protection team for a day, doubt you'd be of the same opinion then.
[quote][p][bold]We love Red Billy[/bold] wrote: Unfortunately councils tend to suck up the weak and inept who then hide behind union protection. Recently encountered a classic one at the 'customer sevices desk' in Hove town hall. All I wanted was a receipt for the letter I was delivering because B and H had lost them before. Woman spent five minutes explaining why they were too busy to give one. Eventually with a harumph she got the manager who suggested I que for one with those paying parking fines. Having then received a brief education as to her duties a receipt was produced within 30 seconds. Never be afraid to remind them who they work for. Us.[/p][/quote]Try working in a child protection team for a day, doubt you'd be of the same opinion then. DCCCCCC
  • Score: 11

7:45pm Fri 8 Aug 14

vogon1 says...

Working for kitcat and his cronies would make me sick too..
Working for kitcat and his cronies would make me sick too.. vogon1
  • Score: 4

7:58pm Fri 8 Aug 14

We love Red Billy says...

DCCCCCC wrote:
We love Red Billy wrote:
Unfortunately councils tend to suck up the weak and inept who then hide behind union protection. Recently encountered a classic one at the 'customer sevices desk' in Hove town hall. All I wanted was a receipt for the letter I was delivering because B and H had lost them before. Woman spent five minutes explaining why they were too busy to give one. Eventually with a harumph she got the manager who suggested I que for one with those paying parking fines. Having then received a brief education as to her duties a receipt was produced within 30 seconds. Never be afraid to remind them who they work for. Us.
Try working in a child protection team for a day, doubt you'd be of the same opinion then.
I can only speak as I find. 30 years of dealing with those sucking on the hind teat of public money has somewhat formed my opinion.
[quote][p][bold]DCCCCCC[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]We love Red Billy[/bold] wrote: Unfortunately councils tend to suck up the weak and inept who then hide behind union protection. Recently encountered a classic one at the 'customer sevices desk' in Hove town hall. All I wanted was a receipt for the letter I was delivering because B and H had lost them before. Woman spent five minutes explaining why they were too busy to give one. Eventually with a harumph she got the manager who suggested I que for one with those paying parking fines. Having then received a brief education as to her duties a receipt was produced within 30 seconds. Never be afraid to remind them who they work for. Us.[/p][/quote]Try working in a child protection team for a day, doubt you'd be of the same opinion then.[/p][/quote]I can only speak as I find. 30 years of dealing with those sucking on the hind teat of public money has somewhat formed my opinion. We love Red Billy
  • Score: -9

8:01pm Fri 8 Aug 14

ourcoalition says...

Barney123 wrote:
It really makes you feel sick reading this! Public Sector staff just seem to be able to get away with massive amounts of sick leave - imagine the level of inefficiences at the council. Guess they'll be saying this is unfair, going on strike and saying how hard they work. Most of them should work in the private sector for a day and realise what a proper days work is!
First - it is the same in the private sector but they are not required to count sickness on the same basis, so the stats are significantly lower.

Two - the private sector, sadly, is not unionised, so employers frequently sack people in the first few weeks of sickness, and those staff cannot afford legal advice to make a claim for unfair dismissal (especially since last August when our wonderful government brought in a £1,200 charge to go to a Tribunal).

Three - because this Council is heavily unionised, we practice a quaint old fashioned thing called "fairness".

How can I make these statements about each sector? Because I represent both sets of workers on a daily basis. It is easy to make generalised comments, but these are real people, who are hard workers. Like the myth of scroungers on the dole (actually 0.7% are fraudulent claims), so the myth of lazy Council staff. In real life, these are Home Helps with back injuries, roads workers who have accidents, and so on.

Anyone who wants to come and see some real people, are welcome to contact me at the UNISON Office to make arrangements.
[quote][p][bold]Barney123[/bold] wrote: It really makes you feel sick reading this! Public Sector staff just seem to be able to get away with massive amounts of sick leave - imagine the level of inefficiences at the council. Guess they'll be saying this is unfair, going on strike and saying how hard they work. Most of them should work in the private sector for a day and realise what a proper days work is![/p][/quote]First - it is the same in the private sector but they are not required to count sickness on the same basis, so the stats are significantly lower. Two - the private sector, sadly, is not unionised, so employers frequently sack people in the first few weeks of sickness, and those staff cannot afford legal advice to make a claim for unfair dismissal (especially since last August when our wonderful government brought in a £1,200 charge to go to a Tribunal). Three - because this Council is heavily unionised, we practice a quaint old fashioned thing called "fairness". How can I make these statements about each sector? Because I represent both sets of workers on a daily basis. It is easy to make generalised comments, but these are real people, who are hard workers. Like the myth of scroungers on the dole (actually 0.7% are fraudulent claims), so the myth of lazy Council staff. In real life, these are Home Helps with back injuries, roads workers who have accidents, and so on. Anyone who wants to come and see some real people, are welcome to contact me at the UNISON Office to make arrangements. ourcoalition
  • Score: 5

9:19pm Fri 8 Aug 14

Quiterie says...

ourcoalition wrote:
Barney123 wrote:
It really makes you feel sick reading this! Public Sector staff just seem to be able to get away with massive amounts of sick leave - imagine the level of inefficiences at the council. Guess they'll be saying this is unfair, going on strike and saying how hard they work. Most of them should work in the private sector for a day and realise what a proper days work is!
First - it is the same in the private sector but they are not required to count sickness on the same basis, so the stats are significantly lower.

Two - the private sector, sadly, is not unionised, so employers frequently sack people in the first few weeks of sickness, and those staff cannot afford legal advice to make a claim for unfair dismissal (especially since last August when our wonderful government brought in a £1,200 charge to go to a Tribunal).

Three - because this Council is heavily unionised, we practice a quaint old fashioned thing called "fairness".

How can I make these statements about each sector? Because I represent both sets of workers on a daily basis. It is easy to make generalised comments, but these are real people, who are hard workers. Like the myth of scroungers on the dole (actually 0.7% are fraudulent claims), so the myth of lazy Council staff. In real life, these are Home Helps with back injuries, roads workers who have accidents, and so on.

Anyone who wants to come and see some real people, are welcome to contact me at the UNISON Office to make arrangements.
With respect you're biased because you're a union official.

The earlier comment from someone is much more like the reality....... "colleagues who completely let their team down by (a) doing very little, (b) being incompetent and (c) taking excessive sickness. She says that the managers and directors tolerate it for an easy life partly because they don't want the hassle of the unions and partly because they are weak managers."

........ I think we all suspect that this is the true picture of what goes on in the Council. I've certainly thought this all along and I've now had it confirmed to me.

You talk about "fairness" ..... what about "fairness" for taxpayers who have to fund this excessive sickness leave?

Just out of interest what sickness percentage would you start to get suspicious about? 15%? 20%? 25%? Or would they all be ok?
[quote][p][bold]ourcoalition[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Barney123[/bold] wrote: It really makes you feel sick reading this! Public Sector staff just seem to be able to get away with massive amounts of sick leave - imagine the level of inefficiences at the council. Guess they'll be saying this is unfair, going on strike and saying how hard they work. Most of them should work in the private sector for a day and realise what a proper days work is![/p][/quote]First - it is the same in the private sector but they are not required to count sickness on the same basis, so the stats are significantly lower. Two - the private sector, sadly, is not unionised, so employers frequently sack people in the first few weeks of sickness, and those staff cannot afford legal advice to make a claim for unfair dismissal (especially since last August when our wonderful government brought in a £1,200 charge to go to a Tribunal). Three - because this Council is heavily unionised, we practice a quaint old fashioned thing called "fairness". How can I make these statements about each sector? Because I represent both sets of workers on a daily basis. It is easy to make generalised comments, but these are real people, who are hard workers. Like the myth of scroungers on the dole (actually 0.7% are fraudulent claims), so the myth of lazy Council staff. In real life, these are Home Helps with back injuries, roads workers who have accidents, and so on. Anyone who wants to come and see some real people, are welcome to contact me at the UNISON Office to make arrangements.[/p][/quote]With respect you're biased because you're a union official. The earlier comment from someone is much more like the reality....... "colleagues who completely let their team down by (a) doing very little, (b) being incompetent and (c) taking excessive sickness. She says that the managers and directors tolerate it for an easy life partly because they don't want the hassle of the unions and partly because they are weak managers." ........ I think we all suspect that this is the true picture of what goes on in the Council. I've certainly thought this all along and I've now had it confirmed to me. You talk about "fairness" ..... what about "fairness" for taxpayers who have to fund this excessive sickness leave? Just out of interest what sickness percentage would you start to get suspicious about? 15%? 20%? 25%? Or would they all be ok? Quiterie
  • Score: -5

10:20pm Fri 8 Aug 14

Bill in Hanover says...

Actually, compared to teachers taking time off 'sick', these figures are quite good.
Actually, compared to teachers taking time off 'sick', these figures are quite good. Bill in Hanover
  • Score: 0

10:21pm Fri 8 Aug 14

Bill in Hanover says...

Quiterie wrote:
ourcoalition wrote:
Barney123 wrote:
It really makes you feel sick reading this! Public Sector staff just seem to be able to get away with massive amounts of sick leave - imagine the level of inefficiences at the council. Guess they'll be saying this is unfair, going on strike and saying how hard they work. Most of them should work in the private sector for a day and realise what a proper days work is!
First - it is the same in the private sector but they are not required to count sickness on the same basis, so the stats are significantly lower.

Two - the private sector, sadly, is not unionised, so employers frequently sack people in the first few weeks of sickness, and those staff cannot afford legal advice to make a claim for unfair dismissal (especially since last August when our wonderful government brought in a £1,200 charge to go to a Tribunal).

Three - because this Council is heavily unionised, we practice a quaint old fashioned thing called "fairness".

How can I make these statements about each sector? Because I represent both sets of workers on a daily basis. It is easy to make generalised comments, but these are real people, who are hard workers. Like the myth of scroungers on the dole (actually 0.7% are fraudulent claims), so the myth of lazy Council staff. In real life, these are Home Helps with back injuries, roads workers who have accidents, and so on.

Anyone who wants to come and see some real people, are welcome to contact me at the UNISON Office to make arrangements.
With respect you're biased because you're a union official.

The earlier comment from someone is much more like the reality....... "colleagues who completely let their team down by (a) doing very little, (b) being incompetent and (c) taking excessive sickness. She says that the managers and directors tolerate it for an easy life partly because they don't want the hassle of the unions and partly because they are weak managers."

........ I think we all suspect that this is the true picture of what goes on in the Council. I've certainly thought this all along and I've now had it confirmed to me.

You talk about "fairness" ..... what about "fairness" for taxpayers who have to fund this excessive sickness leave?

Just out of interest what sickness percentage would you start to get suspicious about? 15%? 20%? 25%? Or would they all be ok?
Up to a few years ago the average amount of sick leave across the whole of the public and private sectors was 6 days a year, anything above that is suspicious.
[quote][p][bold]Quiterie[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]ourcoalition[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Barney123[/bold] wrote: It really makes you feel sick reading this! Public Sector staff just seem to be able to get away with massive amounts of sick leave - imagine the level of inefficiences at the council. Guess they'll be saying this is unfair, going on strike and saying how hard they work. Most of them should work in the private sector for a day and realise what a proper days work is![/p][/quote]First - it is the same in the private sector but they are not required to count sickness on the same basis, so the stats are significantly lower. Two - the private sector, sadly, is not unionised, so employers frequently sack people in the first few weeks of sickness, and those staff cannot afford legal advice to make a claim for unfair dismissal (especially since last August when our wonderful government brought in a £1,200 charge to go to a Tribunal). Three - because this Council is heavily unionised, we practice a quaint old fashioned thing called "fairness". How can I make these statements about each sector? Because I represent both sets of workers on a daily basis. It is easy to make generalised comments, but these are real people, who are hard workers. Like the myth of scroungers on the dole (actually 0.7% are fraudulent claims), so the myth of lazy Council staff. In real life, these are Home Helps with back injuries, roads workers who have accidents, and so on. Anyone who wants to come and see some real people, are welcome to contact me at the UNISON Office to make arrangements.[/p][/quote]With respect you're biased because you're a union official. The earlier comment from someone is much more like the reality....... "colleagues who completely let their team down by (a) doing very little, (b) being incompetent and (c) taking excessive sickness. She says that the managers and directors tolerate it for an easy life partly because they don't want the hassle of the unions and partly because they are weak managers." ........ I think we all suspect that this is the true picture of what goes on in the Council. I've certainly thought this all along and I've now had it confirmed to me. You talk about "fairness" ..... what about "fairness" for taxpayers who have to fund this excessive sickness leave? Just out of interest what sickness percentage would you start to get suspicious about? 15%? 20%? 25%? Or would they all be ok?[/p][/quote]Up to a few years ago the average amount of sick leave across the whole of the public and private sectors was 6 days a year, anything above that is suspicious. Bill in Hanover
  • Score: -1

11:29pm Fri 8 Aug 14

notaconspiracy says...

My first job after college was with East sussex County Council, in Lewes.

At the end of my first year, the Union Rep. came to tell me that I was 'letting the side down' because I hadn't used my sick leave.

Seems they encouraged members to take at least two weeks 'sick leave'. I wonder if they still apply the same pressure?

This was way back in the 1980s and the union wasn't Unison back then, but their predecessors.
My first job after college was with East sussex County Council, in Lewes. At the end of my first year, the Union Rep. came to tell me that I was 'letting the side down' because I hadn't used my sick leave. Seems they encouraged members to take at least two weeks 'sick leave'. I wonder if they still apply the same pressure? This was way back in the 1980s and the union wasn't Unison back then, but their predecessors. notaconspiracy
  • Score: -1

11:32pm Fri 8 Aug 14

MasonStorm says...

what a bunch of lazy c unts. 2 weeks??
what a bunch of lazy c unts. 2 weeks?? MasonStorm
  • Score: -14

11:48pm Fri 8 Aug 14

Andy R says...

notaconspiracy wrote:
My first job after college was with East sussex County Council, in Lewes.

At the end of my first year, the Union Rep. came to tell me that I was 'letting the side down' because I hadn't used my sick leave.

Seems they encouraged members to take at least two weeks 'sick leave'. I wonder if they still apply the same pressure?

This was way back in the 1980s and the union wasn't Unison back then, but their predecessors.
This begs so many questions.......
Why would a union rep want to do that?
In what way would this be "letting the side down"?
How many union reps would be keeping meticulous records of how much sick leave all their members were taking?
Do people post patent BS on internet comment sites just for the lolz, or because they think some simple souls will just suck it up?
[quote][p][bold]notaconspiracy[/bold] wrote: My first job after college was with East sussex County Council, in Lewes. At the end of my first year, the Union Rep. came to tell me that I was 'letting the side down' because I hadn't used my sick leave. Seems they encouraged members to take at least two weeks 'sick leave'. I wonder if they still apply the same pressure? This was way back in the 1980s and the union wasn't Unison back then, but their predecessors.[/p][/quote]This begs so many questions....... Why would a union rep want to do that? In what way would this be "letting the side down"? How many union reps would be keeping meticulous records of how much sick leave all their members were taking? Do people post patent BS on internet comment sites just for the lolz, or because they think some simple souls will just suck it up? Andy R
  • Score: 7

11:52pm Fri 8 Aug 14

Andy R says...

Quiterie wrote:
ourcoalition wrote:
Barney123 wrote:
It really makes you feel sick reading this! Public Sector staff just seem to be able to get away with massive amounts of sick leave - imagine the level of inefficiences at the council. Guess they'll be saying this is unfair, going on strike and saying how hard they work. Most of them should work in the private sector for a day and realise what a proper days work is!
First - it is the same in the private sector but they are not required to count sickness on the same basis, so the stats are significantly lower.

Two - the private sector, sadly, is not unionised, so employers frequently sack people in the first few weeks of sickness, and those staff cannot afford legal advice to make a claim for unfair dismissal (especially since last August when our wonderful government brought in a £1,200 charge to go to a Tribunal).

Three - because this Council is heavily unionised, we practice a quaint old fashioned thing called "fairness".

How can I make these statements about each sector? Because I represent both sets of workers on a daily basis. It is easy to make generalised comments, but these are real people, who are hard workers. Like the myth of scroungers on the dole (actually 0.7% are fraudulent claims), so the myth of lazy Council staff. In real life, these are Home Helps with back injuries, roads workers who have accidents, and so on.

Anyone who wants to come and see some real people, are welcome to contact me at the UNISON Office to make arrangements.
With respect you're biased because you're a union official.

The earlier comment from someone is much more like the reality....... "colleagues who completely let their team down by (a) doing very little, (b) being incompetent and (c) taking excessive sickness. She says that the managers and directors tolerate it for an easy life partly because they don't want the hassle of the unions and partly because they are weak managers."

........ I think we all suspect that this is the true picture of what goes on in the Council. I've certainly thought this all along and I've now had it confirmed to me.

You talk about "fairness" ..... what about "fairness" for taxpayers who have to fund this excessive sickness leave?

Just out of interest what sickness percentage would you start to get suspicious about? 15%? 20%? 25%? Or would they all be ok?
So....ourcoalition quotes a series of straightforward facts....you rely on a second-hand anecdote....but somehow he's the one who's "biased"...?
[quote][p][bold]Quiterie[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]ourcoalition[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Barney123[/bold] wrote: It really makes you feel sick reading this! Public Sector staff just seem to be able to get away with massive amounts of sick leave - imagine the level of inefficiences at the council. Guess they'll be saying this is unfair, going on strike and saying how hard they work. Most of them should work in the private sector for a day and realise what a proper days work is![/p][/quote]First - it is the same in the private sector but they are not required to count sickness on the same basis, so the stats are significantly lower. Two - the private sector, sadly, is not unionised, so employers frequently sack people in the first few weeks of sickness, and those staff cannot afford legal advice to make a claim for unfair dismissal (especially since last August when our wonderful government brought in a £1,200 charge to go to a Tribunal). Three - because this Council is heavily unionised, we practice a quaint old fashioned thing called "fairness". How can I make these statements about each sector? Because I represent both sets of workers on a daily basis. It is easy to make generalised comments, but these are real people, who are hard workers. Like the myth of scroungers on the dole (actually 0.7% are fraudulent claims), so the myth of lazy Council staff. In real life, these are Home Helps with back injuries, roads workers who have accidents, and so on. Anyone who wants to come and see some real people, are welcome to contact me at the UNISON Office to make arrangements.[/p][/quote]With respect you're biased because you're a union official. The earlier comment from someone is much more like the reality....... "colleagues who completely let their team down by (a) doing very little, (b) being incompetent and (c) taking excessive sickness. She says that the managers and directors tolerate it for an easy life partly because they don't want the hassle of the unions and partly because they are weak managers." ........ I think we all suspect that this is the true picture of what goes on in the Council. I've certainly thought this all along and I've now had it confirmed to me. You talk about "fairness" ..... what about "fairness" for taxpayers who have to fund this excessive sickness leave? Just out of interest what sickness percentage would you start to get suspicious about? 15%? 20%? 25%? Or would they all be ok?[/p][/quote]So....ourcoalition quotes a series of straightforward facts....you rely on a second-hand anecdote....but somehow he's the one who's "biased"...? Andy R
  • Score: 0

7:25am Sat 9 Aug 14

Quiterie says...

sussexram40 wrote:
Average numbers are meaningless.
Take a department of 10 people. Take a 1 year study.
8 of the 10 people have no sick absence whatsoever while the other 2 are off for each 4 months each due to more serious illness or operations such as for heart surgery.
The number of sickness days for the department in the year is 240, divided by 10 gives a department average of 24 days per person. Yet 80% of the staff had no sick leave at all and the other 20% had very genuine, serious health conditions.
Average numbers are pretty meaningless in a department of 10, but not in a big employer like Brighton & Hove council where hundreds of people work. It's very clear there's a culture problem. It's seen as acceptable to take time off sick, whereas in most private sector companies it's seen as unacceptable. As someone else has mentioned it's due to weak management - the Council is full of exceptionally weak managers, and being scared of the unions.
[quote][p][bold]sussexram40[/bold] wrote: Average numbers are meaningless. Take a department of 10 people. Take a 1 year study. 8 of the 10 people have no sick absence whatsoever while the other 2 are off for each 4 months each due to more serious illness or operations such as for heart surgery. The number of sickness days for the department in the year is 240, divided by 10 gives a department average of 24 days per person. Yet 80% of the staff had no sick leave at all and the other 20% had very genuine, serious health conditions.[/p][/quote]Average numbers are pretty meaningless in a department of 10, but not in a big employer like Brighton & Hove council where hundreds of people work. It's very clear there's a culture problem. It's seen as acceptable to take time off sick, whereas in most private sector companies it's seen as unacceptable. As someone else has mentioned it's due to weak management - the Council is full of exceptionally weak managers, and being scared of the unions. Quiterie
  • Score: -9

8:59am Sat 9 Aug 14

Mng*68 says...

BlackRocker wrote:
Mng*68 wrote:
Really ..... How do you get tough with work related stress sickness - occupational health is designed to protect the needs of returning to work as soon as possible and reducing any future sickness. Quietrie - Can only assume the bubble you live in must be a picture of colour n bloom. Also do you honestly believe your council tax wouldn't get increased if there was no Council sickness ? Assure you , your wrong ! Your council tax is reflective to the figure central government provide and what your local council needs to spend in managing many services provided.
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

zzzzzzzzz
P.S. You mean "you're wrong" not "your wrong"; "reflective to"????
What a boring reply
[quote][p][bold]BlackRocker[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Mng*68[/bold] wrote: Really ..... How do you get tough with work related stress sickness - occupational health is designed to protect the needs of returning to work as soon as possible and reducing any future sickness. Quietrie - Can only assume the bubble you live in must be a picture of colour n bloom. Also do you honestly believe your council tax wouldn't get increased if there was no Council sickness ? Assure you , your wrong ! Your council tax is reflective to the figure central government provide and what your local council needs to spend in managing many services provided.[/p][/quote]zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzz P.S. You mean "you're wrong" not "your wrong"; "reflective to"????[/p][/quote]What a boring reply Mng*68
  • Score: -1

9:04am Sat 9 Aug 14

Thay Qon U says...

Quiterie wrote:
sussexram40 wrote:
Average numbers are meaningless.
Take a department of 10 people. Take a 1 year study.
8 of the 10 people have no sick absence whatsoever while the other 2 are off for each 4 months each due to more serious illness or operations such as for heart surgery.
The number of sickness days for the department in the year is 240, divided by 10 gives a department average of 24 days per person. Yet 80% of the staff had no sick leave at all and the other 20% had very genuine, serious health conditions.
Average numbers are pretty meaningless in a department of 10, but not in a big employer like Brighton & Hove council where hundreds of people work. It's very clear there's a culture problem. It's seen as acceptable to take time off sick, whereas in most private sector companies it's seen as unacceptable. As someone else has mentioned it's due to weak management - the Council is full of exceptionally weak managers, and being scared of the unions.
The published Peer Review report supports this contention on 'weak management' needing "development", particularly at middle-management level in BHCC:-
"The ‘middle management’ tier is widely seen within the council as requiring development, with variability in skills and attitudes."

This doesn't say much for the current recruitment/promotio
n processes at BHCC, nor for the current Personal Development regime no doubt operating within BHCC.

Having read the report I am surprised at the amount of repetition/triplicat
ion of the key themes in the 17 page Final report from the LGA - it could have given the key messages and findings in about 6 pages.
[quote][p][bold]Quiterie[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]sussexram40[/bold] wrote: Average numbers are meaningless. Take a department of 10 people. Take a 1 year study. 8 of the 10 people have no sick absence whatsoever while the other 2 are off for each 4 months each due to more serious illness or operations such as for heart surgery. The number of sickness days for the department in the year is 240, divided by 10 gives a department average of 24 days per person. Yet 80% of the staff had no sick leave at all and the other 20% had very genuine, serious health conditions.[/p][/quote]Average numbers are pretty meaningless in a department of 10, but not in a big employer like Brighton & Hove council where hundreds of people work. It's very clear there's a culture problem. It's seen as acceptable to take time off sick, whereas in most private sector companies it's seen as unacceptable. As someone else has mentioned it's due to weak management - the Council is full of exceptionally weak managers, and being scared of the unions.[/p][/quote]The published Peer Review report supports this contention on 'weak management' needing "development", particularly at middle-management level in BHCC:- "The ‘middle management’ tier is widely seen within the council as requiring development, with variability in skills and attitudes." This doesn't say much for the current recruitment/promotio n processes at BHCC, nor for the current Personal Development regime no doubt operating within BHCC. Having read the report I am surprised at the amount of repetition/triplicat ion of the key themes in the 17 page Final report from the LGA - it could have given the key messages and findings in about 6 pages. Thay Qon U
  • Score: 0

2:02pm Sat 9 Aug 14

Goldenwight says...

Working for BHCC makes me feel green, too!
Working for BHCC makes me feel green, too! Goldenwight
  • Score: -1

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