Gang of rapists on the loose in Brighton (From The Argus)

Quote -A spokeswoman for Sussex Police said: “At no point was there a risk to the general public. All the victims and suspects in these cases are from the street community"

Unbelievable! Homeless people can be raped or mugged ad it's alright because they are not the "general public". The police are there to protect everyone, regardless of their work/home status.

ahhh I see so there is a gang of foreign rapists on the loose but we arent to be informed because they have only thus far been shown to rape homeless deffenceless women.

and what if your homeless you arent a member of the general public? sounds like the way they put it homeless women bring rape upon themselves.

the police have been discrimantory and stupid.

This is going to be like Christmas come early for DRIBBLE. He sure is going to milk this one.

I echo the other comments here about homeless people and the general public.

The police must think this gang are "nice" rapists, only attacking some of the most vulnerable people in society.

Vitriola wrote:
Quote -A spokeswoman for Sussex Police said: “At no point was there a risk to the general public. All the victims and suspects in these cases are from the street community" Unbelievable! Homeless people can be raped or mugged ad it's alright because they are not the "general public". The police are there to protect everyone, regardless of their work/home status.

Hear! Hear!

Well described Vitriola ..
Sussex Police are quite literally, Unbelievable!

Its shocking it only comes out now two weeks after the event.

Just because these rapists chose a homeless victim does not mean the general public are at risk though. They wont be sticking to a code of conduct. Hopefully they will find the evidence they need soon, because frankly if they've done it twice they'll probably do it again.

Now we have more PC terms to learn. Must remember that the "street community" are different to normal people.

It is worth mentioning a report from the Fawcett Society about rape convictions by county, using Home Office crime figures. In 2006, Sussex had a 3.2% conviction rate, compared with 7% (approx) nationally.

Sussex Police, the gold standard of ineptitude.

cheezburger wrote:
Its shocking it only comes out now two weeks after the event.

Just because these rapists chose a homeless victim does not mean the general public are at risk though. They wont be sticking to a code of conduct. Hopefully they will find the evidence they need soon, because frankly if they've done it twice they'll probably do it again.

I meant to say just because the victim was homeless does not mean the general public are NOT at risk.

"Under no circumstances can a suspect be remanded in custody unless they have been charged with an offence"

I thought that they could keep suspects on hold for quite a long period of time now without charge? Wasnt this part of all the knee jerk terrorist laws? Does anyone know how long a suspect can be held?

These people should be watched very closely now. But how do you keep tabs on someone who is homeless?

I would be interested to learn the logic behind the comment that as only people on the street have been attacked there is no threat to the general public.
The suspects must be amazed that they have been released on bail on such a serious charge.

cheezburger wrote:

cheezburger wrote: Its shocking it only comes out now two weeks after the event. Just because these rapists chose a homeless victim does not mean the general public are at risk though. They wont be sticking to a code of conduct. Hopefully they will find the evidence they need soon, because frankly if they've done it twice they'll probably do it again.

I meant to say just because the victim was homeless does not mean the general public are NOT at risk.

If Gentleman Jim is referring to my comment he didnt read my amendment.

I'm saying the public ARE at risk as well as the homeless.

This is the most astonishing story I have ever read.
Now what's the bet these men released on bail do a disappearing act.
Now all those human rights people opposed to ID cards put your hands up.
This country is becoming a terrifying place for women, children and the elderly.
What are we going to do about it?

Day today / Brass Eye eat your heart out.

TheInsider wrote:
This is the most astonishing story I have ever read. Now what's the bet these men released on bail do a disappearing act. Now all those human rights people opposed to ID cards put your hands up. This country is becoming a terrifying place for women, children and the elderly. What are we going to do about it?

What do ID cards have to do with these alleged rapists? They have already been arrested and released on police bail.

Tell us all, how would ID cards help.

Can't people dissappear with their ID cards too?

cheezburger wrote:
"Under no circumstances can a suspect be remanded in custody unless they have been charged with an offence"

I thought that they could keep suspects on hold for quite a long period of time now without charge? Wasnt this part of all the knee jerk terrorist laws? Does anyone know how long a suspect can be held?

These people should be watched very closely now. But how do you keep tabs on someone who is homeless?

TheInsider; I almost got raped the other day but everything was OK because I asked the potential assailant to show me his National Identity Card at which point he quickly backed off... So I totallly agree.
And yes cheezburger, Terror Laws. Of course it's okay to stop demonstrators leaving the country, stop Joe Bloggs to nick his spliff and harass old women near nuclear power stations under Terrorism laws. But of course rape is not nearly as bad as any of the aforementioned.

Why is everyone so outraged about the suspects being Polish ?

There are rapes and sex offences reported all the time . . . bet you 'bloggers ' on this site or whatever you're called don't think about the fact that men are the suspects .. ooooh lets take all you're passports ?? WTF ?

Is it OK to rape women back in Poland then ? You mugs ...

!6 minutes and no response ?


What , you all watching coronation street or something ??? liven up !

Because it is easy for anyone to disappear and not be picked up again when they have no foolproof ID. Some people even dress as women and go through airport security to flee terrorism charges.
Look at the millions of pounds owned to the UK from overseas students who took loans from us and then left and cannot be traced.
Sit and watch these idiotic real life police programmes where people are picked up and waste hours of tax payers money refusing to say who they are even for petty crimes they have been caught red handed for.
The UK has already got a type of ID card via the photographic driving licenses which were introduced due to the extremely high level of fraud being committed by certain groups in the UK: licence pooling, car pooling and insurance fraud and drivers escaping justice for some serious accidents.
And we already have an ID process for convicted sex offenders called the sex offenders register so by stealth, the process is already underway. Before the register was created these perverts were always disappearing into the ether and committing new offences.
Now how many of you who get uptight about ID cards are quite happy to hand your passport to the nice man in the hotel complex reception because you like to go on holiday. How many of you like to hand over your utility bills, passport, payslips to the teenager processing your mortgage application.
Hooray. Let's send it all to India and let everyone there see it too. Fax it, photocopy it, Facebook yourself and even put your CVs online. And please don't use a mobile as they even know which mast you are using and what messages you have been sending and to whom.
It's too late British people are already being watched, so we may as well watch the visitors too.

I trust full police resources will be in order to catch these fiends, rather than pointless (and illegal) random breath tests

TheInsider wrote:
Because it is easy for anyone to disappear and not be picked up again when they have no foolproof ID. Some people even dress as women and go through airport security to flee terrorism charges. Look at the millions of pounds owned to the UK from overseas students who took loans from us and then left and cannot be traced. Sit and watch these idiotic real life police programmes where people are picked up and waste hours of tax payers money refusing to say who they are even for petty crimes they have been caught red handed for. The UK has already got a type of ID card via the photographic driving licenses which were introduced due to the extremely high level of fraud being committed by certain groups in the UK: licence pooling, car pooling and insurance fraud and drivers escaping justice for some serious accidents. And we already have an ID process for convicted sex offenders called the sex offenders register so by stealth, the process is already underway. Before the register was created these perverts were always disappearing into the ether and committing new offences. Now how many of you who get uptight about ID cards are quite happy to hand your passport to the nice man in the hotel complex reception because you like to go on holiday. How many of you like to hand over your utility bills, passport, payslips to the teenager processing your mortgage application. Hooray. Let's send it all to India and let everyone there see it too. Fax it, photocopy it, Facebook yourself and even put your CVs online. And please don't use a mobile as they even know which mast you are using and what messages you have been sending and to whom. It's too late British people are already being watched, so we may as well watch the visitors too.

So, some wanted people go through airport security controls, with whatever passport they have. But are you saying that is not as good as an ID card?

The sex offenders register. What a marvellous example. There was a report in The Argus just on Monday about Jason Waller. He's described as a "dangerous missing paedophile." He's been missing for 9 months. He has disappeared, despite the police doing their "level best" to find him. The sex offenders register did not stop him disappearing, did it? This is somebody who the police are supposed to have an active interest in, but he's gone...

There is a very big difference between me offering my ID, and have some jumped up little Hitler demanding it who wants to treat me as a suspect.

You haven't yet shown how having ID of any kind would have either stopped these attacks, nor how it would have helped catch the alleged culprits. What you have done is made yourself look like a government minister trying to justify ID cards on the very false grounds that they are a panacea against crime. Numerous countries with compulsory ID cards have very serious levels of crime.

there's nothing pointless and illegal about catching drink drivers at christmas . . . come
on.

lord Donald stokes wrote:
I trust full police resources will be in order to catch these fiends, rather than pointless (and illegal) random breath tests

You show a little bit too much trust.

I predict there is going to be another crackdown on extremely dangerous pavement cyclists soon. Plus people being arrested in possession of an egg with intent to throw.

(!Sorry incoming ID card rant!) When I got on holiday I CHOOSE to give my details to the hotel. I'm not forced to go on holiday. The same goes with any other time I provide information. And yes, so what if my mobile company keeps a record of my texts. These are all individual databases.. What the government are proposing is CENTRALISING all their information into one handy file. Who first came up with that idea I wonder? Oh yes, it was the Nazis. This is why any kind of centralised database is now strictly prohibited in Germany. Can't we learn from their mistakes???

No law against egg with intent last time I checked .. unless committing criminal damage !

I cannot believe this, a gang of four men have attacked a woman and raped her and the police dont think that this is something the public should be conserned about??? Does it make any difference at all regards a persons status? A vile gang are at loose and any person whom has a loved one living/working in or near brighton will in no doubt be so. They should be arrested and deported no questions. The fact that they are homeless only serves to show that they most likely have entered ileagally. Bailing them will only serve to allow them time to abscond to another part of this once great nation so now overun and drained. Charity begins at home not in a foregin country and so should be the focus of this government.

yea a bit late but general public not to be alarmed oh well dont worry about homeless women cos according to goverment they dont exist - i know better to my cost
believe it or not security word - easy shot ,

quote: Four Eastern European men, all of no fixed abode, were arrested on suspicion of rape on November 28 and released on bail.

who paid bail, and where have they gone to if they are homeless? Please someone tell me this is a joke.

I always thought that "all people are equal under the law"applied in this country.

So bibble what is your answer to protecting women and children from perverts and nut cases.
How would you improve policing.
All you ever do is offer a negative and that negative is often in the most inappropriate places suggesting you have a persecution complex regarding the police.
I would rather help the police and my fellow neighbours create good communities than live with people like you who spout bile without reason.
You use the phrase jumped up little Hitler, but you actually sound a like a little Hitler because you don't like any democratic process.

bug eye wrote:
quote: Four Eastern European men, all of no fixed abode, were arrested on suspicion of rape on November 28 and released on bail.

who paid bail, and where have they gone to if they are homeless? Please someone tell me this is a joke.

sorry bug eye, but this is no joke. broken britain at its best(worst). anyone arrested for a serious crime, and i believe rape to be serious, should never be allowed bail, as they will do what these 4 have done. disappear. coming to a town near you soon!
come on bibble, a comment on that idea.

We Need a proper system of law, like in the US, someone puts up a bail who is a third party of a fixed abode, and it would be a large one, if they cant make bail they stay in jail and await trial, if they skip on their bail they would loose the money and be hunted by bounty hunters for the bail bond.

The police are useless, I dont ask for better I demmand better, its a suprise we dont have vigilantes out there it has gotten so bad, I would join the force myself, I work in private security, but I bet I solve more crimes and hand out justice in my current line of work.

Until there is corroborating evidence and/or witnesses who can back up the claims, then these men are free to walk the streets. If anyone really knows anything about this tell the police. Otherwise it will happen again.

TheInsider wrote:
So bibble what is your answer to protecting women and children from perverts and nut cases. How would you improve policing. All you ever do is offer a negative and that negative is often in the most inappropriate places suggesting you have a persecution complex regarding the police. I would rather help the police and my fellow neighbours create good communities than live with people like you who spout bile without reason. You use the phrase jumped up little Hitler, but you actually sound a like a little Hitler because you don't like any democratic process.

I am quite sure that ID cards will not protect any woman from a rapist, nor a child from a paedophile.

Policing is a difficult problem (which is not the same thing as saying that the police have a difficult job). The unavoidable fact is that crime is now a bigger problem than it was a few years ago, and detection rates remain woeful.

This should tell us that policing today, supposedly in the hands of "experts" who are so clever that they don't need to listen to anyone else, is not working properly. In fact, these "experts" are so clever they actually resent anyone telling them they are not doing a wonderful job at all times, and that any hint of giving the public more control over the policing that we pay for is a very very bad idea. I say these "experts" are wrong.

It is not the job of members of the public to help the police create good communities. It is the job of the police to help the public create good communities.

Alas, what has happened with policing by "experts" is that all we have ended up with "don't interfere, call us if you see something, snoop on your neighbours, report it anyonmously and you can get some money, blah blah blah". That method of policing has failed, as it was sure to. That is reactive policing, no different from calling for the fire brigade when you see smoke.

If you look at the history of policing, it has never been universally wanted or accepted in this country. Here's a little snippet about Robert Peel's police:

"Some people believed that if the people wanted one they should do it themselves, not have the government do it for them.

It was also feared that the police force would be used to arrest opponents of the government, stop protests and destroy free speech. It was thought that the idea of a police force belonged in a foreign country."

Look what has happened! Today the police are more concerned with stopping demonstrations than they are with stopping murderers and rapists. They have demanded these powers, and (notionally our) supine parliament gave it to them. Today we have the police demanding ID from people living in their own homes!

Policing needs complete reform, not just tinkering around the edges. It has grown bit by bit into something that many people do not want and do not support. It is no good just saying that the public should support the police. No, it is the job of the police to listen to the public. If they don't enjoy their support, they have failed on that score too.

If I want to see policemen on their beat 24 hours a day, that is my prerogative. It is not acceptable for a high up police "expert" who went to the "police staff college" to say they want to do things their way. Too bad, pal. Take it or lump it. You work for the public, not the other way round.

Policemen on the streets deters street crime. That is an unarguable fact.

I could go on, but I'm tired now. Going to bed.

Have a sleep as you have exhausted yourself pointing out the failings of modern policing, but I ask again, what is your solution?

davyboy wrote:

bug eye wrote: quote: Four Eastern European men, all of no fixed abode, were arrested on suspicion of rape on November 28 and released on bail. who paid bail, and where have they gone to if they are homeless? Please someone tell me this is a joke.

sorry bug eye, but this is no joke. broken britain at its best(worst). anyone arrested for a serious crime, and i believe rape to be serious, should never be allowed bail, as they will do what these 4 have done. disappear. coming to a town near you soon! come on bibble, a comment on that idea.

My last comment before bed.

How long would you allow between arrest and charge? Suppose it takes the police, who are not always known to act like Speedy Gonzales, 8 months to bring a charge or not charge. Would you want somebody innocent, and merely suspected of a crime, to be held at the whim of a policeman for 8 months?

It is entirely right that people are treated as innocent until proven guilty. In this case (or these cases) so far there hasn't been a charge. I would hope that the police are acting expeditiously in making a case (or not).

No, the proper place to hold custody hearings is in a public court. Anything else is ripe for the worst excesses of corruption and despotism.

Although the district judges (relatively recent and pointless name change for magistrates, to make them feel more important) are usually biased police sympathisers rather than independent jurists, it is still a better system to go before a judge where there an accused person will have legal representation.

Bibble, im not the police's greatest fan, contrary to what you may think. But i think you suggest anarchism/existentia
lism. (not the perceived view that anarchy means chaos), that we should be 'policing' ourselves. But its not going to happen. I wish it could, but it wont. In New York there is police everywhere, and you do feel safe there. I think the police are more respected over there maybe, probably because they earn more respect. The system isnt perfect here, but its the only one we've got.

bibble wrote:

davyboy wrote:

bug eye wrote: quote: Four Eastern European men, all of no fixed abode, were arrested on suspicion of rape on November 28 and released on bail. who paid bail, and where have they gone to if they are homeless? Please someone tell me this is a joke.

sorry bug eye, but this is no joke. broken britain at its best(worst). anyone arrested for a serious crime, and i believe rape to be serious, should never be allowed bail, as they will do what these 4 have done. disappear. coming to a town near you soon! come on bibble, a comment on that idea.

My last comment before bed.

How long would you allow between arrest and charge? Suppose it takes the police, who are not always known to act like Speedy Gonzales, 8 months to bring a charge or not charge. Would you want somebody innocent, and merely suspected of a crime, to be held at the whim of a policeman for 8 months?

It is entirely right that people are treated as innocent until proven guilty. In this case (or these cases) so far there hasn't been a charge. I would hope that the police are acting expeditiously in making a case (or not).

No, the proper place to hold custody hearings is in a public court. Anything else is ripe for the worst excesses of corruption and despotism.

Although the district judges (relatively recent and pointless name change for magistrates, to make them feel more important) are usually biased police sympathisers rather than independent jurists, it is still a better system to go before a judge where there an accused person will have legal representation.

A single man raping is dreadful, but we are talking gang rape here. The fact it appears not too serious to gang rape the homeless, is a concept probably worse than the rape itself. Maybe it will be only taken seriously when there isn't a homeless woman handy to rape and the rape someone's daughter

Maybe the police have let then go to see if they do it again ?
I agree NO, ID cards more waste of good money.

How do police give bail with no address?

Err am i missing something here? It seems like a few reasonable comments have dissapeared, including one i just wrote saying that they only delete comments if someone reports it, and if it indeed does overstep the mark. Puzzled.

cheezburger wrote:
Err am i missing something here? It seems like a few reasonable comments have dissapeared, including one i just wrote saying that they only delete comments if someone reports it, and if it indeed does overstep the mark. Puzzled.

If you say anything that strays from their agenda they hit the delete button.
They are illiterate lefty loons.

Angryoldman wrote:

cheezburger wrote: Err am i missing something here? It seems like a few reasonable comments have dissapeared, including one i just wrote saying that they only delete comments if someone reports it, and if it indeed does overstep the mark. Puzzled.

If you say anything that strays from their agenda they hit the delete button. They are illiterate lefty loons.

No i disagree. I think they are usually quite fair. I've had a fair few of my own comments removed occasionally and probably rightly so, we all get carried away now and again. But there have been perfectly reasonable comments that have gone recently.

This article is badly written and IMHO elicits fear / does not question the received 'authority' of the local police. As a female, I find it abhorrent as it suggest that the rights of homeless women are of no account. ANYONE could become homeless through circumstance and thus fall through the 'cracs' of society. Everyone should be appalled (sp?) at the conviction rates for rape. Most people (male or female) do not report rape lightly.

stan bailey wrote:

bibble wrote:

davyboy wrote:

bug eye wrote: quote: Four Eastern European men, all of no fixed abode, were arrested on suspicion of rape on November 28 and released on bail. who paid bail, and where have they gone to if they are homeless? Please someone tell me this is a joke.

sorry bug eye, but this is no joke. broken britain at its best(worst). anyone arrested for a serious crime, and i believe rape to be serious, should never be allowed bail, as they will do what these 4 have done. disappear. coming to a town near you soon! come on bibble, a comment on that idea.

My last comment before bed. How long would you allow between arrest and charge? Suppose it takes the police, who are not always known to act like Speedy Gonzales, 8 months to bring a charge or not charge. Would you want somebody innocent, and merely suspected of a crime, to be held at the whim of a policeman for 8 months? It is entirely right that people are treated as innocent until proven guilty. In this case (or these cases) so far there hasn't been a charge. I would hope that the police are acting expeditiously in making a case (or not). No, the proper place to hold custody hearings is in a public court. Anything else is ripe for the worst excesses of corruption and despotism. Although the district judges (relatively recent and pointless name change for magistrates, to make them feel more important) are usually biased police sympathisers rather than independent jurists, it is still a better system to go before a judge where there an accused person will have legal representation.

A single man raping is dreadful, but we are talking gang rape here. The fact it appears not too serious to gang rape the homeless, is a concept probably worse than the rape itself. Maybe it will be only taken seriously when there isn't a homeless woman handy to rape and the rape someone's daughter

Notwithstanding your comments, your final statement "Maybe it will be only taken seriously when there isn't a homeless woman handy to rape and the rape someone's daughter.", in my view, is a little nosensical as every woman is someone's daughter. Given the subject has raised issues of how we percieve and treat homeless people, your statement does reflect and unfortunately imply that a homeless woman doesn't have the same status as '...someone's daughter..' but am sure that was not your intent.

"All the victims and suspects in these cases are from the street community"

Isn't it just wonderful there are all these little communities in Brighton - it's a real global village!!