Christian Brighton and Hove councillor kicked out over same-sex marriage stance claims she was intimidated

The Argus: Christian councillor kicked out over same-sex marriage stance claims she was intimidated Christian councillor kicked out over same-sex marriage stance claims she was intimidated

A Christian councillor who voted against supporting same-sex marriage claimed she has been intimated by Green party members over her stance.

Yesterday we revealed how Christina Summers is to be expelled from sitting with her colleagues on Brighton and Hove City Council after voting against supporting the policy in a town hall meeting earlier this year.

The decision was taken after an internal inquiry by Brighton and Hove Green Party ruled she had breached an agreement made before she stood as a candidate to “uphold and advance the values of equality for all people”.

When approached by The Argus with the decision, Coun Summers, who represents Hollingdean and Stanmer ward, said she was “crestfallen” by the decision which, if officially ratified by a number of Green councillors, will leave her as the only independent councillor on the local authority.

She said she had received intimidating emails from Green Party members before and after the council meeting for taking the “decision of conscience”.

Coun Summers said: “I have been waiting for weeks for my colleagues to make a clear and public decision.

“They have no idea how much I have been wanting to say to them and how many emails, blogs and tweets from the wider party membership I wanted to refute and respond to. But there is a time to speak and a time to be silent.

“In view of the Green Party’s own special interpretation of equality, my expulsion from the Green Group of councillors should not, in the end, come as a surprise.

“Nonetheless I can’t help but feel crestfallen.

“After at least two intimate years of campaigning and then serving together in administration, my own colleagues, who should know me well by now, have chosen to believe a lie.

“Party policy, however vague, is sovereign.”

Equality

The vote came after the local authority’s councillors were asked if they supported a motion to lobby the Government on changing the law at a meeting in July.

Coun Summers was the only member to vote against the proposal. This is despite the Greens being the first party nationally to supportthe idea of lifting the ban on same-sex marriage taking place through a civil ceremony.

Coun Summers, who is a devout Christian, told The Argus after the vote she did not agree that “disagreeing with same-sex marriage was disagreeing with equality”.

She added: “I’m accountable to God above any political party.”

The Brighton and Hove Green Party, which does not have a whip for its councillors, maintained the panel’s decision announced on Monday was not an issue of free speech or religion but about the candidate agreement.

Coun Summers said yesterday: “Anyone would have signed that agreement.

Who does not believe in promoting equality? I’m quite heartbroken as I’m Green in every other way.

“Whether I remain as a councillor or not remains to be seen.

“I was voted in by the residents of Hollingdean and Stanmer and I refuse to believe they voted me in specifically on equality and particularly as interpreted by the Green Party of Brighton and Hove.”

Sqaubbling

Responding to claims about intimidation from Green members, Rob Shepherd, of the Brighton and Hove Green Party, said: “The party has never said anything negative about Christina.

“Particularly in the early stages there were some people who said things which I would not want to be associated with.

“The issue is that, just as Christina has complete freedom of speech, so do other party members, providing it is within the law.”

Colleagues of Coun Summers were quick to give their view on the issue.

Conservative group leader Geoffrey Theobald said: “Rather than wasting all their time on internal squabbling, the Greens should be getting on with running this city, talking to businesses and sorting out the mess that their parking charges have created for example.

“I’m afraid this episode is just a symptom of the wider lack of political direction at the top of the Green Party.”

Labour group leader Gill Mitchell said: “This is an internal Green Party matter.”

Conservative councillor Dawn Barnett said: “God doesn’t pay his debts in money; he pays it in mysterious ways.

“This will come back and haunt the Green group.

Comments (37)

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6:19pm Wed 12 Sep 12

john5001 says...

shes right .good on her sticking to her guns
shes right .good on her sticking to her guns john5001

6:24pm Wed 12 Sep 12

bruce_ says...

What is equality, anyway? It's obviously open to interpretation -- and any councillor who interprets it in such a narrow and partisan way as the majority of Green councillors cannot have my vote at the next local elections.
What is equality, anyway? It's obviously open to interpretation -- and any councillor who interprets it in such a narrow and partisan way as the majority of Green councillors cannot have my vote at the next local elections. bruce_

6:25pm Wed 12 Sep 12

Hove Actually says...

“The issue is that, just as Christina has complete freedom of speech, so do other party members, providing it is within the law.”

And so will the rest of us when we get the chance to speak on your first and last failed attempt at holding office.....
“The issue is that, just as Christina has complete freedom of speech, so do other party members, providing it is within the law.” And so will the rest of us when we get the chance to speak on your first and last failed attempt at holding office..... Hove Actually

6:31pm Wed 12 Sep 12

Maxwell's Ghost says...

If you wish to vote on issues on behalf of god then stand for a Christian Party so the people who elect you at least have an idea that you have a higher boss.
I think you've been naughty standing for a particular party and then voting on behalf of god.
If you wish to vote on issues on behalf of god then stand for a Christian Party so the people who elect you at least have an idea that you have a higher boss. I think you've been naughty standing for a particular party and then voting on behalf of god. Maxwell's Ghost

6:33pm Wed 12 Sep 12

JoeBlow says...

So where does this end? What if they decide that equality for all includes respecting those who believe in bigamy? Or marriage with animals? Good for you, Christina, for sticking up for what you believe. It makes you a most unusual politician.
So where does this end? What if they decide that equality for all includes respecting those who believe in bigamy? Or marriage with animals? Good for you, Christina, for sticking up for what you believe. It makes you a most unusual politician. JoeBlow

6:34pm Wed 12 Sep 12

Goldenwight says...

She added: “I’m accountable to God above any political party.”

Presumably this lady does not feel in any way accountable to those she has been elected to represent, then? In the circumstances I think we can look forward to receiving her imminent resignation at any moment.
She added: “I’m accountable to God above any political party.” Presumably this lady does not feel in any way accountable to those she has been elected to represent, then? In the circumstances I think we can look forward to receiving her imminent resignation at any moment. Goldenwight

6:40pm Wed 12 Sep 12

General Dreedle says...

"Responding to claims about intimidation from Green members, Rob Shepherd, of the Brighton and Hove Green Party, said: “The party has never said anything negative about Christina.
“Particularly in the early stages there were some people who said things which I would not want to be associated with.
Classic doublethink from the totallitarian spin doctor.

The official party machine may not have released any negative press statements about Councillor Summers but Green Party members have. You only have to look on some of their blogs.

I hope Councillor Summers informs us of some of the specific examples of intimidation so we can see these bullies for what they are.
"Responding to claims about intimidation from Green members, Rob Shepherd, of the Brighton and Hove Green Party, said: “The party has never said anything negative about Christina. “Particularly in the early stages there were some people who said things which I would not want to be associated with. Classic doublethink from the totallitarian spin doctor. The official party machine may not have released any negative press statements about Councillor Summers but Green Party members have. You only have to look on some of their blogs. I hope Councillor Summers informs us of some of the specific examples of intimidation so we can see these bullies for what they are. General Dreedle

7:09pm Wed 12 Sep 12

John Steed says...

john5001 wrote:
shes right .good on her sticking to her guns
makes a refreshing change to see a politician stand up for a genuinely held belief.
wether I agree with you or not I respect your action. expose the green party bully boys,sorry sad persons for what they are. we still live in a democracy and have more or less the right to free speech
[quote][p][bold]john5001[/bold] wrote: shes right .good on her sticking to her guns[/p][/quote]makes a refreshing change to see a politician stand up for a genuinely held belief. wether I agree with you or not I respect your action. expose the green party bully boys,sorry sad persons for what they are. we still live in a democracy and have more or less the right to free speech John Steed

7:11pm Wed 12 Sep 12

nocando says...

All are born equal but some are more equal than others.
I hope these hysterical green clowns were conducting this kangaroo court in their own time and not taxpayer funded working time.
All are born equal but some are more equal than others. I hope these hysterical green clowns were conducting this kangaroo court in their own time and not taxpayer funded working time. nocando

7:14pm Wed 12 Sep 12

george smith says...

Bit bored with Christina now, what interests me is the councillor who left the chamber before the vote, was it the wife of jason?
Bit bored with Christina now, what interests me is the councillor who left the chamber before the vote, was it the wife of jason? george smith

7:18pm Wed 12 Sep 12

Martha Gunn says...

This story becomes more worrying as time goes on. For what it matters, and that is very little, I think her views and actions are extremely peculiar.

However what does matter is that the Councillor has obviously been intimidated and persecuted in an extremely unpleasant manner There is clearly something very sinister about the way in which the Green Party operates locally.
What is needed now is:

First - a rigorous investigation by the national Green Party into the operations of its local officers. Many Green Party members will feel something has gone very wrong here.
Second - an investigation by appropriate officers of BHCC to see if the Local Government Code of Practice has been breached in any respect as a consequence of the treatment of Cllr. Summers by the Green Party.
Third - Sympathisers of free speech will surely want to contribute to a fighting fund for Cllr. Summers in order that she can seek proper legal advice and remedies in the face of this persecution.
This story becomes more worrying as time goes on. For what it matters, and that is very little, I think her views and actions are extremely peculiar. However what does matter is that the Councillor has obviously been intimidated and persecuted in an extremely unpleasant manner There is clearly something very sinister about the way in which the Green Party operates locally. What is needed now is: First - a rigorous investigation by the national Green Party into the operations of its local officers. Many Green Party members will feel something has gone very wrong here. Second - an investigation by appropriate officers of BHCC to see if the Local Government Code of Practice has been breached in any respect as a consequence of the treatment of Cllr. Summers by the Green Party. Third - Sympathisers of free speech will surely want to contribute to a fighting fund for Cllr. Summers in order that she can seek proper legal advice and remedies in the face of this persecution. Martha Gunn

7:40pm Wed 12 Sep 12

General Dreedle says...

george smith wrote:
Bit bored with Christina now, what interests me is the councillor who left the chamber before the vote, was it the wife of jason?
Indeed it was. By leaving before the vote she failed to 'promote and advance equalities etc etc' but no action taken. now why could that be?
[quote][p][bold]george smith[/bold] wrote: Bit bored with Christina now, what interests me is the councillor who left the chamber before the vote, was it the wife of jason?[/p][/quote]Indeed it was. By leaving before the vote she failed to 'promote and advance equalities etc etc' but no action taken. now why could that be? General Dreedle

7:51pm Wed 12 Sep 12

Maxwell's Ghost says...

If she a Christian I will expect to see her campaigning to allow the travellers to stay in our parks, the squatters to remain in people's homes etc, then let's see how many people support her freedom of speech and her work for god.
What is unsavoury is the disingenous way in which she gained a seat which was under the Green banner and then failed to tell the electorate that actually she would be voting for god.
If she a Christian I will expect to see her campaigning to allow the travellers to stay in our parks, the squatters to remain in people's homes etc, then let's see how many people support her freedom of speech and her work for god. What is unsavoury is the disingenous way in which she gained a seat which was under the Green banner and then failed to tell the electorate that actually she would be voting for god. Maxwell's Ghost

8:27pm Wed 12 Sep 12

Martha Gunn says...

For those of us a bit slow on the uptake could someone explain what Cllr. A. Kitcat actually did during this episode? This is becoming a very murky and disagreeable story. The more clarity we can get the better.

Has anyone else found it a bit peculiar that apart from the statement of Commissar Shepherd of the Brighton Green Party Politburo all else has been silence?
For those of us a bit slow on the uptake could someone explain what Cllr. A. Kitcat actually did during this episode? This is becoming a very murky and disagreeable story. The more clarity we can get the better. Has anyone else found it a bit peculiar that apart from the statement of Commissar Shepherd of the Brighton Green Party Politburo all else has been silence? Martha Gunn

8:29pm Wed 12 Sep 12

Fight_Back says...

General Dreedle wrote:
george smith wrote:
Bit bored with Christina now, what interests me is the councillor who left the chamber before the vote, was it the wife of jason?
Indeed it was. By leaving before the vote she failed to 'promote and advance equalities etc etc' but no action taken. now why could that be?
At least it shows the Greens are maturing politically ...... they've learnt to be as morally corrupt as any other party !

As for “I’m accountable to God above any political party.” - well, good grief, hopefully this so called god is slightly more understanding of true equality than Cllr Summers.
[quote][p][bold]General Dreedle[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]george smith[/bold] wrote: Bit bored with Christina now, what interests me is the councillor who left the chamber before the vote, was it the wife of jason?[/p][/quote]Indeed it was. By leaving before the vote she failed to 'promote and advance equalities etc etc' but no action taken. now why could that be?[/p][/quote]At least it shows the Greens are maturing politically ...... they've learnt to be as morally corrupt as any other party ! As for “I’m accountable to God above any political party.” - well, good grief, hopefully this so called god is slightly more understanding of true equality than Cllr Summers. Fight_Back

8:34pm Wed 12 Sep 12

HJarrs says...

This is a difficult one to judge. The Argus is notoriosly unreliable, but based on their coverage it seems the party would have been bound to act in some way. Permanent expulsion would seem to be on the harsh side, a temporary withdrawl of the whip may have been more proportionate. Mind you it is very unusual for a party to stick by its values when not in a comfortable majority.

I was reminiscing about my time in Brent under the Tories in the 90s and their desperation to stay in power with a council majority of one; a regime propped up by dodgy practice, dodgy councillors, favours and who's curruption was raised in parliament. It was an embarrassing joke; Bob Blackman the council leader is now a Tory MP! (http://bobblackmanm
p.info/bob.html makes very interesting reading).
This is a difficult one to judge. The Argus is notoriosly unreliable, but based on their coverage it seems the party would have been bound to act in some way. Permanent expulsion would seem to be on the harsh side, a temporary withdrawl of the whip may have been more proportionate. Mind you it is very unusual for a party to stick by its values when not in a comfortable majority. I was reminiscing about my time in Brent under the Tories in the 90s and their desperation to stay in power with a council majority of one; a regime propped up by dodgy practice, dodgy councillors, favours and who's curruption was raised in parliament. It was an embarrassing joke; Bob Blackman the council leader is now a Tory MP! (http://bobblackmanm p.info/bob.html makes very interesting reading). HJarrs

9:09pm Wed 12 Sep 12

Martha Gunn says...

Indeed HJarrs we are all beginning to think and worry about probity. But why on earth are the Green Party saying nothing and sitting on their hands? Do they imagine they will simply ride this scandal out in silence?
Indeed HJarrs we are all beginning to think and worry about probity. But why on earth are the Green Party saying nothing and sitting on their hands? Do they imagine they will simply ride this scandal out in silence? Martha Gunn

9:51pm Wed 12 Sep 12

General Dreedle says...

HJarrs wrote:
This is a difficult one to judge. The Argus is notoriosly unreliable, but based on their coverage it seems the party would have been bound to act in some way. Permanent expulsion would seem to be on the harsh side, a temporary withdrawl of the whip may have been more proportionate. Mind you it is very unusual for a party to stick by its values when not in a comfortable majority.

I was reminiscing about my time in Brent under the Tories in the 90s and their desperation to stay in power with a council majority of one; a regime propped up by dodgy practice, dodgy councillors, favours and who's curruption was raised in parliament. It was an embarrassing joke; Bob Blackman the council leader is now a Tory MP! (http://bobblackmanm

p.info/bob.html makes very interesting reading).
Come on Jarrs, you know as a Green supporter that they have no Whip so can't withdraw it. The most bizarre element of their decision is that Kitkat (and his non-voting, missus) have expelled Summers from the Green Councillors Group but not the party. i.e. she has been expelled from the elite but they are happy to take her tainted gay-hating annual subscription fee as a party member as long as she remains with the powerless party Worker-Ant Proles. If they really believe she is anti-gay then surely she should be expelled from the party. I appreciate that the panel does not have the power to expel her from the party but they could have a made a recommendation that she be expelled. The panel (with KitKat's admitted input in terms of a conversation about sanctions, although he bottled it from being a member of the panel) have tried to steer a spin doctor influenced middle line to avoid alienating faith groups and the lbgt community. In fact by allowing her to remain a member of the party they have alienated both. The message being that she can't be in the elite of councillors because of her 'predjudice' but is still a party member (so we accept Christians). But by allowing her to remain a member of the party they are saying to the lgbt community that they are prepared to accept such predjudice within their ranks. Talk about shooting yourself in both feet!
[quote][p][bold]HJarrs[/bold] wrote: This is a difficult one to judge. The Argus is notoriosly unreliable, but based on their coverage it seems the party would have been bound to act in some way. Permanent expulsion would seem to be on the harsh side, a temporary withdrawl of the whip may have been more proportionate. Mind you it is very unusual for a party to stick by its values when not in a comfortable majority. I was reminiscing about my time in Brent under the Tories in the 90s and their desperation to stay in power with a council majority of one; a regime propped up by dodgy practice, dodgy councillors, favours and who's curruption was raised in parliament. It was an embarrassing joke; Bob Blackman the council leader is now a Tory MP! (http://bobblackmanm p.info/bob.html makes very interesting reading).[/p][/quote]Come on Jarrs, you know as a Green supporter that they have no Whip so can't withdraw it. The most bizarre element of their decision is that Kitkat (and his non-voting, missus) have expelled Summers from the Green Councillors Group but not the party. i.e. she has been expelled from the elite but they are happy to take her tainted gay-hating annual subscription fee as a party member as long as she remains with the powerless party Worker-Ant Proles. If they really believe she is anti-gay then surely she should be expelled from the party. I appreciate that the panel does not have the power to expel her from the party but they could have a made a recommendation that she be expelled. The panel (with KitKat's admitted input in terms of a conversation about sanctions, although he bottled it from being a member of the panel) have tried to steer a spin doctor influenced middle line to avoid alienating faith groups and the lbgt community. In fact by allowing her to remain a member of the party they have alienated both. The message being that she can't be in the elite of councillors because of her 'predjudice' but is still a party member (so we accept Christians). But by allowing her to remain a member of the party they are saying to the lgbt community that they are prepared to accept such predjudice within their ranks. Talk about shooting yourself in both feet! General Dreedle

10:03pm Wed 12 Sep 12

General Dreedle says...

Martha Gunn wrote:
For those of us a bit slow on the uptake could someone explain what Cllr. A. Kitcat actually did during this episode? This is becoming a very murky and disagreeable story. The more clarity we can get the better.

Has anyone else found it a bit peculiar that apart from the statement of Commissar Shepherd of the Brighton Green Party Politburo all else has been silence?
She put her name to the notice of motion supporting gay marriage but left the chamber just before the vote was taken.
[quote][p][bold]Martha Gunn[/bold] wrote: For those of us a bit slow on the uptake could someone explain what Cllr. A. Kitcat actually did during this episode? This is becoming a very murky and disagreeable story. The more clarity we can get the better. Has anyone else found it a bit peculiar that apart from the statement of Commissar Shepherd of the Brighton Green Party Politburo all else has been silence?[/p][/quote]She put her name to the notice of motion supporting gay marriage but left the chamber just before the vote was taken. General Dreedle

10:11pm Wed 12 Sep 12

General Dreedle says...

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
If she a Christian I will expect to see her campaigning to allow the travellers to stay in our parks, the squatters to remain in people's homes etc, then let's see how many people support her freedom of speech and her work for god.
What is unsavoury is the disingenous way in which she gained a seat which was under the Green banner and then failed to tell the electorate that actually she would be voting for god.
She probably would support these issues as do the Greens. The difference you would notice is that she would do it openly.
[quote][p][bold]Maxwell's Ghost[/bold] wrote: If she a Christian I will expect to see her campaigning to allow the travellers to stay in our parks, the squatters to remain in people's homes etc, then let's see how many people support her freedom of speech and her work for god. What is unsavoury is the disingenous way in which she gained a seat which was under the Green banner and then failed to tell the electorate that actually she would be voting for god.[/p][/quote]She probably would support these issues as do the Greens. The difference you would notice is that she would do it openly. General Dreedle

10:28pm Wed 12 Sep 12

see and speak sense says...

General Dreedle wrote:
"Responding to claims about intimidation from Green members, Rob Shepherd, of the Brighton and Hove Green Party, said: “The party has never said anything negative about Christina.
“Particularly in the early stages there were some people who said things which I would not want to be associated with.
Classic doublethink from the totallitarian spin doctor.

The official party machine may not have released any negative press statements about Councillor Summers but Green Party members have. You only have to look on some of their blogs.

I hope Councillor Summers informs us of some of the specific examples of intimidation so we can see these bullies for what they are.
Here Here!!
Im sure in todays world of electronics that Christina has a complete catalogue of emails /comments and tweets recorded from each and every individual member of the green group and party that has passed any form of intimidation and bully tactics....But i am also sure that she will need to keep these to present as legal evidence.How sad that the comment waved around by green members/councillors at the pride event concerning Brighton not yet having attained equality is undermined by they themselves!!
The amazing thing is that the green party knew full well that Christina was a devout Christian before they took her on board..nothing was hidden at all... yet the way it is reported lets people believe that Christina was some kind of trojan horse!!If there is any trojan horse its the green party themselves..the should change their name to "rainbow or Pride"..then we will know exactly what we are getting!!

Come on council...get your act together....and stop your twisted, under hand, double standard , unorganised,unprofes
sion bias postioning and for the sake of the city start( or at least try to)govern with the genuine desire to see all residents treated equal( people of faith especially).And incase any one is wondering it is not the stance that christina has made that has infuriated me but the way the FREEDOM OF SPEACH HAS BEEN DENIED!!
[quote][p][bold]General Dreedle[/bold] wrote: "Responding to claims about intimidation from Green members, Rob Shepherd, of the Brighton and Hove Green Party, said: “The party has never said anything negative about Christina. “Particularly in the early stages there were some people who said things which I would not want to be associated with. Classic doublethink from the totallitarian spin doctor. The official party machine may not have released any negative press statements about Councillor Summers but Green Party members have. You only have to look on some of their blogs. I hope Councillor Summers informs us of some of the specific examples of intimidation so we can see these bullies for what they are.[/p][/quote]Here Here!! Im sure in todays world of electronics that Christina has a complete catalogue of emails /comments and tweets recorded from each and every individual member of the green group and party that has passed any form of intimidation and bully tactics....But i am also sure that she will need to keep these to present as legal evidence.How sad that the comment waved around by green members/councillors at the pride event concerning Brighton not yet having attained equality is undermined by they themselves!! The amazing thing is that the green party knew full well that Christina was a devout Christian before they took her on board..nothing was hidden at all... yet the way it is reported lets people believe that Christina was some kind of trojan horse!!If there is any trojan horse its the green party themselves..the should change their name to "rainbow or Pride"..then we will know exactly what we are getting!! Come on council...get your act together....and stop your twisted, under hand, double standard , unorganised,unprofes sion bias postioning and for the sake of the city start( or at least try to)govern with the genuine desire to see all residents treated equal( people of faith especially).And incase any one is wondering it is not the stance that christina has made that has infuriated me but the way the FREEDOM OF SPEACH HAS BEEN DENIED!! see and speak sense

10:35pm Wed 12 Sep 12

One View says...

Somehow if the shoe was on the other foot; she was a senior member of an organisation in favour of "gay marriage" that the organisation itself was opposed "gay marriage" I would feel the same fate would behold...
Somehow if the shoe was on the other foot; she was a senior member of an organisation in favour of "gay marriage" that the organisation itself was opposed "gay marriage" I would feel the same fate would behold... One View

10:45pm Wed 12 Sep 12

Maxwell's Ghost says...

This woman doesn't want freedom of speech. She wants to speak on behalf of Christians and god.
She has no freedom of thought or conscience as her decision making process is ruled by her religious beliefs therefore she does not fit with the Green party.
In fact she is more of a Tory.
This woman doesn't want freedom of speech. She wants to speak on behalf of Christians and god. She has no freedom of thought or conscience as her decision making process is ruled by her religious beliefs therefore she does not fit with the Green party. In fact she is more of a Tory. Maxwell's Ghost

11:47pm Wed 12 Sep 12

General Dreedle says...

see and speak sense wrote:
General Dreedle wrote:
"Responding to claims about intimidation from Green members, Rob Shepherd, of the Brighton and Hove Green Party, said: “The party has never said anything negative about Christina.
“Particularly in the early stages there were some people who said things which I would not want to be associated with.
Classic doublethink from the totallitarian spin doctor.

The official party machine may not have released any negative press statements about Councillor Summers but Green Party members have. You only have to look on some of their blogs.

I hope Councillor Summers informs us of some of the specific examples of intimidation so we can see these bullies for what they are.
Here Here!!
Im sure in todays world of electronics that Christina has a complete catalogue of emails /comments and tweets recorded from each and every individual member of the green group and party that has passed any form of intimidation and bully tactics....But i am also sure that she will need to keep these to present as legal evidence.How sad that the comment waved around by green members/councillors at the pride event concerning Brighton not yet having attained equality is undermined by they themselves!!
The amazing thing is that the green party knew full well that Christina was a devout Christian before they took her on board..nothing was hidden at all... yet the way it is reported lets people believe that Christina was some kind of trojan horse!!If there is any trojan horse its the green party themselves..the should change their name to "rainbow or Pride"..then we will know exactly what we are getting!!

Come on council...get your act together....and stop your twisted, under hand, double standard , unorganised,unprofes

sion bias postioning and for the sake of the city start( or at least try to)govern with the genuine desire to see all residents treated equal( people of faith especially).And incase any one is wondering it is not the stance that christina has made that has infuriated me but the way the FREEDOM OF SPEACH HAS BEEN DENIED!!
Absolutely! I don't agree with her view but (again) to use the oft quoted maxim of Evelyn Beatrice Hall, 'I disapprove of what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it'.

People need to wake up to where the Greens are going with their censure of free speech. Today, it's one of their own rank. Tomorrow, if they ever get power, it's the population over whom they have control. Labour have already laid the foundations by classifying the expression of certain views as hate crime. The law in the UK no longer applies equally to all people. The forefathers of our liberal democracy, John Stuart Mill, John Locke et al must be turning in their graves. The reason so many people seek to emmigrate to the UK is our history as a decent, tolerant liberal democracy that (on the whole) accepts people for who they are and allows freedom of speech as a cornerstone of what we are about. Most of us (a minority of w*nkers excluded) welcome those wishing to join us in our free world. It's in our DNA to not take things too seriously and reject tw*ts in authority, particularly political parties that tell us what to do. But in order to maintain that liberal democracy we must be on guard against those totallitarian, nanny state f**k**s who think they know what is best for us, corrupt the meaning of language and seek to gain an advantage by changing laws in their favour so that the rule of law does not apply equally to all. The Summers episode has driven me back to read Aminal Farm and 1984 again. Two books could not be more appropriate to what we are currently witnessing. I raise a glass to Orwell. A prophet who was only out by 50 years or so.
[quote][p][bold]see and speak sense[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]General Dreedle[/bold] wrote: "Responding to claims about intimidation from Green members, Rob Shepherd, of the Brighton and Hove Green Party, said: “The party has never said anything negative about Christina. “Particularly in the early stages there were some people who said things which I would not want to be associated with. Classic doublethink from the totallitarian spin doctor. The official party machine may not have released any negative press statements about Councillor Summers but Green Party members have. You only have to look on some of their blogs. I hope Councillor Summers informs us of some of the specific examples of intimidation so we can see these bullies for what they are.[/p][/quote]Here Here!! Im sure in todays world of electronics that Christina has a complete catalogue of emails /comments and tweets recorded from each and every individual member of the green group and party that has passed any form of intimidation and bully tactics....But i am also sure that she will need to keep these to present as legal evidence.How sad that the comment waved around by green members/councillors at the pride event concerning Brighton not yet having attained equality is undermined by they themselves!! The amazing thing is that the green party knew full well that Christina was a devout Christian before they took her on board..nothing was hidden at all... yet the way it is reported lets people believe that Christina was some kind of trojan horse!!If there is any trojan horse its the green party themselves..the should change their name to "rainbow or Pride"..then we will know exactly what we are getting!! Come on council...get your act together....and stop your twisted, under hand, double standard , unorganised,unprofes sion bias postioning and for the sake of the city start( or at least try to)govern with the genuine desire to see all residents treated equal( people of faith especially).And incase any one is wondering it is not the stance that christina has made that has infuriated me but the way the FREEDOM OF SPEACH HAS BEEN DENIED!![/p][/quote]Absolutely! I don't agree with her view but (again) to use the oft quoted maxim of Evelyn Beatrice Hall, 'I disapprove of what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it'. People need to wake up to where the Greens are going with their censure of free speech. Today, it's one of their own rank. Tomorrow, if they ever get power, it's the population over whom they have control. Labour have already laid the foundations by classifying the expression of certain views as hate crime. The law in the UK no longer applies equally to all people. The forefathers of our liberal democracy, John Stuart Mill, John Locke et al must be turning in their graves. The reason so many people seek to emmigrate to the UK is our history as a decent, tolerant liberal democracy that (on the whole) accepts people for who they are and allows freedom of speech as a cornerstone of what we are about. Most of us (a minority of w*nkers excluded) welcome those wishing to join us in our free world. It's in our DNA to not take things too seriously and reject tw*ts in authority, particularly political parties that tell us what to do. But in order to maintain that liberal democracy we must be on guard against those totallitarian, nanny state f**k**s who think they know what is best for us, corrupt the meaning of language and seek to gain an advantage by changing laws in their favour so that the rule of law does not apply equally to all. The Summers episode has driven me back to read Aminal Farm and 1984 again. Two books could not be more appropriate to what we are currently witnessing. I raise a glass to Orwell. A prophet who was only out by 50 years or so. General Dreedle

11:58pm Wed 12 Sep 12

see and speak sense says...

Animal farm indeed fits well...
Animal farm indeed fits well... see and speak sense

6:23am Thu 13 Sep 12

george smith says...

see and speak sense wrote:
Animal farm indeed fits well...
Yep very scary
[quote][p][bold]see and speak sense[/bold] wrote: Animal farm indeed fits well...[/p][/quote]Yep very scary george smith

7:56am Thu 13 Sep 12

Angryoldman says...

Oh dear now she's the poor persecuted victim who has been denied her right to persecute and discriminate against others.
You need to read that bible in its entirety dear instead of cherry picking.
After all isnt it all the word of your God?
Even the masoganistic hateful murderous bits?
I would be more worried about the rampant sexual abuse of children in your church before anything else!!
Oh dear now she's the poor persecuted victim who has been denied her right to persecute and discriminate against others. You need to read that bible in its entirety dear instead of cherry picking. After all isnt it all the word of your God? Even the masoganistic hateful murderous bits? I would be more worried about the rampant sexual abuse of children in your church before anything else!! Angryoldman

8:10am Thu 13 Sep 12

Angryoldman says...

What about this bit of Gods word?
Leviticus accepts the practice of slavery; it assigns women a position of absolute inferiority and virtual servitude to males (50 shekels for a male between the age of twenty and sixty, 30 shekels for a female; 20 shekels for a male between the age of five to twenty, 10 for a female; women who bear a son are declared ceremonially unclean for 7 days, two weeks if a daughter is born); it bans the wearing of any cloth of mixed material (so much for T shirts of cotton and polyester); it declares pork, ostrich meat and eels detestable, unclean and not to be eaten, but allows crickets, grasshoppers and locusts to be on the menu. It gives elaborate instructions for the slaughter of sacrificial animals so that God may smell the pleasing odour of such choice bits as the fat covering the entrails, and be pleased by a thank-offering or placated by a guilt-offering. It proclaims a justice code of strict revenge-punishments -- 'a life for a life, anyone who maims another is to be maimed, fracture for fracture, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, the injury inflicted is the inhury to be suffered'.
What about this bit of Gods word? Leviticus accepts the practice of slavery; it assigns women a position of absolute inferiority and virtual servitude to males (50 shekels for a male between the age of twenty and sixty, 30 shekels for a female; 20 shekels for a male between the age of five to twenty, 10 for a female; women who bear a son are declared ceremonially unclean for 7 days, two weeks if a daughter is born); it bans the wearing of any cloth of mixed material (so much for T shirts of cotton and polyester); it declares pork, ostrich meat and eels detestable, unclean and not to be eaten, but allows crickets, grasshoppers and locusts to be on the menu. It gives elaborate instructions for the slaughter of sacrificial animals so that God may smell the pleasing odour of such choice bits as the fat covering the entrails, and be pleased by a thank-offering or placated by a guilt-offering. It proclaims a justice code of strict revenge-punishments -- 'a life for a life, anyone who maims another is to be maimed, fracture for fracture, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, the injury inflicted is the inhury to be suffered'. Angryoldman

8:12am Thu 13 Sep 12

still waiting says...

In all of the debate about Christina Summers and whether she owes more to the Green Party, or to God, or whoever or whatever, one thing seems to me to be missing. Would anything have been different if she were claiming to follow Allah's will, or Jehovah's will, or the God of some other religion than Christianity? Somehow I think it might....
In all of the debate about Christina Summers and whether she owes more to the Green Party, or to God, or whoever or whatever, one thing seems to me to be missing. Would anything have been different if she were claiming to follow Allah's will, or Jehovah's will, or the God of some other religion than Christianity? Somehow I think it might.... still waiting

8:53am Thu 13 Sep 12

Cyril Bolleaux says...

Angryoldman wrote:
What about this bit of Gods word?
Leviticus accepts the practice of slavery; it assigns women a position of absolute inferiority and virtual servitude to males (50 shekels for a male between the age of twenty and sixty, 30 shekels for a female; 20 shekels for a male between the age of five to twenty, 10 for a female; women who bear a son are declared ceremonially unclean for 7 days, two weeks if a daughter is born); it bans the wearing of any cloth of mixed material (so much for T shirts of cotton and polyester); it declares pork, ostrich meat and eels detestable, unclean and not to be eaten, but allows crickets, grasshoppers and locusts to be on the menu. It gives elaborate instructions for the slaughter of sacrificial animals so that God may smell the pleasing odour of such choice bits as the fat covering the entrails, and be pleased by a thank-offering or placated by a guilt-offering. It proclaims a justice code of strict revenge-punishments -- 'a life for a life, anyone who maims another is to be maimed, fracture for fracture, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, the injury inflicted is the inhury to be suffered'.
What is your view of Love thy neighbour as thyself? Do you also think that is nonsense? What is your preference, to hate people?
[quote][p][bold]Angryoldman[/bold] wrote: What about this bit of Gods word? Leviticus accepts the practice of slavery; it assigns women a position of absolute inferiority and virtual servitude to males (50 shekels for a male between the age of twenty and sixty, 30 shekels for a female; 20 shekels for a male between the age of five to twenty, 10 for a female; women who bear a son are declared ceremonially unclean for 7 days, two weeks if a daughter is born); it bans the wearing of any cloth of mixed material (so much for T shirts of cotton and polyester); it declares pork, ostrich meat and eels detestable, unclean and not to be eaten, but allows crickets, grasshoppers and locusts to be on the menu. It gives elaborate instructions for the slaughter of sacrificial animals so that God may smell the pleasing odour of such choice bits as the fat covering the entrails, and be pleased by a thank-offering or placated by a guilt-offering. It proclaims a justice code of strict revenge-punishments -- 'a life for a life, anyone who maims another is to be maimed, fracture for fracture, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, the injury inflicted is the inhury to be suffered'.[/p][/quote]What is your view of Love thy neighbour as thyself? Do you also think that is nonsense? What is your preference, to hate people? Cyril Bolleaux

8:55am Thu 13 Sep 12

see and speak sense says...

Angryoldman wrote:
Oh dear now she's the poor persecuted victim who has been denied her right to persecute and discriminate against others.
You need to read that bible in its entirety dear instead of cherry picking.
After all isnt it all the word of your God?
Even the masoganistic hateful murderous bits?
I would be more worried about the rampant sexual abuse of children in your church before anything else!!
For Godness sake... Grow up and at least recognise that everyone is untitled to have ,give and stand by their position of conscience....we are a democracy ... And I happen to know Christina and can completely 100% say that not only does her life reflect her deply held belief but also her deeply held position of equality .What is so ridiculous about the greens taking this position is that her actual 100%commitment to the party and the local manifesto that was declared when she stood.Among many of her green friends she was the also one to do everything she possibly could at personnel cost ( much more than the income she attains as a councillor)to enable the green party to fulfil many demands...How sad that the memory of her party is so effected that they have so quickly forgotten ...but then it appears that selective memory is the in thing...!!!
Don't get me wrong.. Of course there are a list of atrocities , including abuse that is in the history of the christian church... But there is also a greater list of genuine care , and acts of humanity and self sacrifice that has and continues to happen everyday by nameless faceless individuals .Isnt it remarkable that here in Brighton and Hove there appears to be such a level of irritation and intolerance towards genuine Christians and at the same time a lack of acknowledgement of the amount of self sacrifice and service carried out in this city for the citizens of the city , without funding from the council .Carried out without question because they are impassioned by their faith!!The city and the council owe a debt to them as without them things would collapse!!!So please if you want to bring a accusation against anyone who stands with their conscience then ask first ... Is there freedom of speech or are we facing the fact that we have a council that unless we think exactly like them we have no speech??no whip!!!! Youust be joking!!!
[quote][p][bold]Angryoldman[/bold] wrote: Oh dear now she's the poor persecuted victim who has been denied her right to persecute and discriminate against others. You need to read that bible in its entirety dear instead of cherry picking. After all isnt it all the word of your God? Even the masoganistic hateful murderous bits? I would be more worried about the rampant sexual abuse of children in your church before anything else!![/p][/quote]For Godness sake... Grow up and at least recognise that everyone is untitled to have ,give and stand by their position of conscience....we are a democracy ... And I happen to know Christina and can completely 100% say that not only does her life reflect her deply held belief but also her deeply held position of equality .What is so ridiculous about the greens taking this position is that her actual 100%commitment to the party and the local manifesto that was declared when she stood.Among many of her green friends she was the also one to do everything she possibly could at personnel cost ( much more than the income she attains as a councillor)to enable the green party to fulfil many demands...How sad that the memory of her party is so effected that they have so quickly forgotten ...but then it appears that selective memory is the in thing...!!! Don't get me wrong.. Of course there are a list of atrocities , including abuse that is in the history of the christian church... But there is also a greater list of genuine care , and acts of humanity and self sacrifice that has and continues to happen everyday by nameless faceless individuals .Isnt it remarkable that here in Brighton and Hove there appears to be such a level of irritation and intolerance towards genuine Christians and at the same time a lack of acknowledgement of the amount of self sacrifice and service carried out in this city for the citizens of the city , without funding from the council .Carried out without question because they are impassioned by their faith!!The city and the council owe a debt to them as without them things would collapse!!!So please if you want to bring a accusation against anyone who stands with their conscience then ask first ... Is there freedom of speech or are we facing the fact that we have a council that unless we think exactly like them we have no speech??no whip!!!! Youust be joking!!! see and speak sense

9:57am Thu 13 Sep 12

Maxwell's Ghost says...

Love thy neighbour but not too much if they are the same sex.
Love thy neighbour but not too much if they are the same sex. Maxwell's Ghost

10:54am Thu 13 Sep 12

Cyril Bolleaux says...

Maxwell's Ghost wrote:
Love thy neighbour but not too much if they are the same sex.
That is not what it says - please don't twist Christian views to suit your own small mind.
[quote][p][bold]Maxwell's Ghost[/bold] wrote: Love thy neighbour but not too much if they are the same sex.[/p][/quote]That is not what it says - please don't twist Christian views to suit your own small mind. Cyril Bolleaux

1:24pm Thu 13 Sep 12

Roger Francais says...

John Steed wrote:
john5001 wrote:
shes right .good on her sticking to her guns
makes a refreshing change to see a politician stand up for a genuinely held belief.
wether I agree with you or not I respect your action. expose the green party bully boys,sorry sad persons for what they are. we still live in a democracy and have more or less the right to free speech
Hear Hear!

I too am sick and tired of all this bean flicking nonsense......... only in bloody Brighton!
[quote][p][bold]John Steed[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]john5001[/bold] wrote: shes right .good on her sticking to her guns[/p][/quote]makes a refreshing change to see a politician stand up for a genuinely held belief. wether I agree with you or not I respect your action. expose the green party bully boys,sorry sad persons for what they are. we still live in a democracy and have more or less the right to free speech[/p][/quote]Hear Hear! I too am sick and tired of all this bean flicking nonsense......... only in bloody Brighton! Roger Francais

1:51pm Thu 13 Sep 12

F in L says...

Surely people will see that this is the kind of people that make up the Green Party. By their very nature a lot of them are reactionary zealots or cranks, I am unable to print what the rest of them are due to the limitations and censorship of the Argus Spell Checker.
Surely people will see that this is the kind of people that make up the Green Party. By their very nature a lot of them are reactionary zealots or cranks, I am unable to print what the rest of them are due to the limitations and censorship of the Argus Spell Checker. F in L

2:20pm Thu 13 Sep 12

fredflintstone1 says...

General Dreedle wrote:
see and speak sense wrote:
General Dreedle wrote:
"Responding to claims about intimidation from Green members, Rob Shepherd, of the Brighton and Hove Green Party, said: “The party has never said anything negative about Christina.
“Particularly in the early stages there were some people who said things which I would not want to be associated with.
Classic doublethink from the totallitarian spin doctor.

The official party machine may not have released any negative press statements about Councillor Summers but Green Party members have. You only have to look on some of their blogs.

I hope Councillor Summers informs us of some of the specific examples of intimidation so we can see these bullies for what they are.
Here Here!!
Im sure in todays world of electronics that Christina has a complete catalogue of emails /comments and tweets recorded from each and every individual member of the green group and party that has passed any form of intimidation and bully tactics....But i am also sure that she will need to keep these to present as legal evidence.How sad that the comment waved around by green members/councillors at the pride event concerning Brighton not yet having attained equality is undermined by they themselves!!
The amazing thing is that the green party knew full well that Christina was a devout Christian before they took her on board..nothing was hidden at all... yet the way it is reported lets people believe that Christina was some kind of trojan horse!!If there is any trojan horse its the green party themselves..the should change their name to "rainbow or Pride"..then we will know exactly what we are getting!!

Come on council...get your act together....and stop your twisted, under hand, double standard , unorganised,unprofes


sion bias postioning and for the sake of the city start( or at least try to)govern with the genuine desire to see all residents treated equal( people of faith especially).And incase any one is wondering it is not the stance that christina has made that has infuriated me but the way the FREEDOM OF SPEACH HAS BEEN DENIED!!
Absolutely! I don't agree with her view but (again) to use the oft quoted maxim of Evelyn Beatrice Hall, 'I disapprove of what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it'.

People need to wake up to where the Greens are going with their censure of free speech. Today, it's one of their own rank. Tomorrow, if they ever get power, it's the population over whom they have control. Labour have already laid the foundations by classifying the expression of certain views as hate crime. The law in the UK no longer applies equally to all people. The forefathers of our liberal democracy, John Stuart Mill, John Locke et al must be turning in their graves. The reason so many people seek to emmigrate to the UK is our history as a decent, tolerant liberal democracy that (on the whole) accepts people for who they are and allows freedom of speech as a cornerstone of what we are about. Most of us (a minority of w*nkers excluded) welcome those wishing to join us in our free world. It's in our DNA to not take things too seriously and reject tw*ts in authority, particularly political parties that tell us what to do. But in order to maintain that liberal democracy we must be on guard against those totallitarian, nanny state f**k**s who think they know what is best for us, corrupt the meaning of language and seek to gain an advantage by changing laws in their favour so that the rule of law does not apply equally to all. The Summers episode has driven me back to read Aminal Farm and 1984 again. Two books could not be more appropriate to what we are currently witnessing. I raise a glass to Orwell. A prophet who was only out by 50 years or so.
In case you're not aware of this, such censorship has now been extended to this very forum. No-one can post anything on stories relating to travellers in the city boundaries here, thanks to "discussions" between the Council and Argus.

The message is clear - if you don't agree with the Greens, then tough! Brighton libertarian reputation is seriously threat while this odious party remains in power.
[quote][p][bold]General Dreedle[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]see and speak sense[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]General Dreedle[/bold] wrote: "Responding to claims about intimidation from Green members, Rob Shepherd, of the Brighton and Hove Green Party, said: “The party has never said anything negative about Christina. “Particularly in the early stages there were some people who said things which I would not want to be associated with. Classic doublethink from the totallitarian spin doctor. The official party machine may not have released any negative press statements about Councillor Summers but Green Party members have. You only have to look on some of their blogs. I hope Councillor Summers informs us of some of the specific examples of intimidation so we can see these bullies for what they are.[/p][/quote]Here Here!! Im sure in todays world of electronics that Christina has a complete catalogue of emails /comments and tweets recorded from each and every individual member of the green group and party that has passed any form of intimidation and bully tactics....But i am also sure that she will need to keep these to present as legal evidence.How sad that the comment waved around by green members/councillors at the pride event concerning Brighton not yet having attained equality is undermined by they themselves!! The amazing thing is that the green party knew full well that Christina was a devout Christian before they took her on board..nothing was hidden at all... yet the way it is reported lets people believe that Christina was some kind of trojan horse!!If there is any trojan horse its the green party themselves..the should change their name to "rainbow or Pride"..then we will know exactly what we are getting!! Come on council...get your act together....and stop your twisted, under hand, double standard , unorganised,unprofes sion bias postioning and for the sake of the city start( or at least try to)govern with the genuine desire to see all residents treated equal( people of faith especially).And incase any one is wondering it is not the stance that christina has made that has infuriated me but the way the FREEDOM OF SPEACH HAS BEEN DENIED!![/p][/quote]Absolutely! I don't agree with her view but (again) to use the oft quoted maxim of Evelyn Beatrice Hall, 'I disapprove of what you say but I will defend to the death your right to say it'. People need to wake up to where the Greens are going with their censure of free speech. Today, it's one of their own rank. Tomorrow, if they ever get power, it's the population over whom they have control. Labour have already laid the foundations by classifying the expression of certain views as hate crime. The law in the UK no longer applies equally to all people. The forefathers of our liberal democracy, John Stuart Mill, John Locke et al must be turning in their graves. The reason so many people seek to emmigrate to the UK is our history as a decent, tolerant liberal democracy that (on the whole) accepts people for who they are and allows freedom of speech as a cornerstone of what we are about. Most of us (a minority of w*nkers excluded) welcome those wishing to join us in our free world. It's in our DNA to not take things too seriously and reject tw*ts in authority, particularly political parties that tell us what to do. But in order to maintain that liberal democracy we must be on guard against those totallitarian, nanny state f**k**s who think they know what is best for us, corrupt the meaning of language and seek to gain an advantage by changing laws in their favour so that the rule of law does not apply equally to all. The Summers episode has driven me back to read Aminal Farm and 1984 again. Two books could not be more appropriate to what we are currently witnessing. I raise a glass to Orwell. A prophet who was only out by 50 years or so.[/p][/quote]In case you're not aware of this, such censorship has now been extended to this very forum. No-one can post anything on stories relating to travellers in the city boundaries here, thanks to "discussions" between the Council and Argus. The message is clear - if you don't agree with the Greens, then tough! Brighton libertarian reputation is seriously threat while this odious party remains in power. fredflintstone1

5:31pm Thu 13 Sep 12

PorkBoat says...

The watermelon party showing their true colours once again. Green on the outside, Red on the inside. Red with the blood of 100 million+ victims of Marxist inspired ideology.
The watermelon party showing their true colours once again. Green on the outside, Red on the inside. Red with the blood of 100 million+ victims of Marxist inspired ideology. PorkBoat

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