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St James's Street Starbucks - 'not a coffee shop'
2:06pm Thursday 26th June 2008
Comments (57)
By Ruth Lumley »
A Starbucks that opened without planning permission has managed to get a six-month stay of execution - by claiming it is not a coffee shop.
The branch in St James's Street, Brighton, caused controversy when it opened last month, despite being refused planning permission.
Residents and traders believe it is detrimental to the area.
The store, which used to be a bookshop, has permission for retail use but not to be run as a coffee shop. Bosses are now using this to say that it is used as a shop by people to buy bags of coffee, mugs and sandwiches.
Council planning chiefs will now monitor the premises to see how much they are selling of each item. The firm also has six months to lodge an appeal against the council's decision and can continue to trade in that time.
Starbucks had started renovating the store even before the Brighton and Hove City Council meeting which refused it planning permission.
A Facebook group called Stop Starbucks Opening On St James's Street started by Jon Barrenechea, 31, of New Steine, Brighton, gained 1,355 members and filed more than 500 letters of objection against the application.
Another application to put signs up outside Starbucks was also refused by the council on June 18.
The council is still deciding on whether to grant permission for air conditioning inside the premises. A council spokesman said the shop could legally operate because of the retail part of their planning permission.
He said: "We will have to monitor the business and ask them to show us how much they are selling of each item."
Phil Broad, managing director of Starbucks Coffee Company UK and Ireland said: "Starbucks is planning to submit the appeal documentation within the statutory time frame."
Your Say YourArgus
No, Way says...
2:17pm Thu 26 Jun 08
seriously, if Starbucks wasn't in it, who would be? would it just be another empty shop in a rubbish street?
seriously, people. it's HELPING THE FRICKIN' AREA!
seriously, people. it's HELPING THE FRICKIN' AREA!
Big Al, Hove says...
2:18pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Do they have sufficient grounds for an appeal?
Bob, Brighton says...
2:21pm Thu 26 Jun 08
What would the moaning anti-Starbucks idiots prefer? A nice new coffee shop or a nice new Poundstretcher?
Or maybe another Scope charity shop, or even better a hardcore sex shop?
Coffee seems to be the least thing to worry about.
Or maybe another Scope charity shop, or even better a hardcore sex shop?
Coffee seems to be the least thing to worry about.
Fatima, Brighton says...
2:45pm Thu 26 Jun 08
6 months of Starbucks. That is great news. When a few of the crappy independent coffee shops go bust, then the protesters will soon shut up knowing Starbucks will be their only choice for a decent cup of coffee.
Louie, Kemptown says...
2:51pm Thu 26 Jun 08
"Residents and traders believe it is detrimental to the area."
Funny, I live there and don't remember being asked if I believed it was detrimental? Is that ALL residents or just a few stoners from Hanover?
Saw the great unwashed outside on Saturday, (fewer by the week I note) Can you believe some of them dragged their kids along to protest. They should have the kids taken away. Fancy dragging your kid along to stand outside Starbucks on a Saturday morning. Could be doing something more useful like playing with the kids in the park, swimming, reading but no they have to massage their inflated egos and drag some poor little kid to inhale the fumes of St James's St....Shame on them....
Funny, I live there and don't remember being asked if I believed it was detrimental? Is that ALL residents or just a few stoners from Hanover?
Saw the great unwashed outside on Saturday, (fewer by the week I note) Can you believe some of them dragged their kids along to protest. They should have the kids taken away. Fancy dragging your kid along to stand outside Starbucks on a Saturday morning. Could be doing something more useful like playing with the kids in the park, swimming, reading but no they have to massage their inflated egos and drag some poor little kid to inhale the fumes of St James's St....Shame on them....
anti-capitalist, hard at work says...
3:01pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Whether you like Starbucks or not being there, this story is about how a giant company filled with over paid lawyers can do whatever it likes. If I put up a new extension on my house and was told I didn't have planning permission could I just change the name of it to a collection of bricks and get away with it?
And you all know that Starbucks has a branch in Guantanamo prison camp where the US army gets free coffee? That's you lot subsidising free coffee for the US military. Do you lot like that with your exploited over charged lattes?
And you all know that Starbucks has a branch in Guantanamo prison camp where the US army gets free coffee? That's you lot subsidising free coffee for the US military. Do you lot like that with your exploited over charged lattes?
G. NEWMAN, brighton says...
3:06pm Thu 26 Jun 08
NOT LOOKING TOO CLEVER NOW,IS IT JON! EVERY WEEK I MISSED MY BATH TO JOIN THE GREAT UNWASHED,AND WHERE HAS IT GOT ME? BECAUSE STARBUCKS IS TRADING.AR-WELL,I MIGHT AS WELL GO IN AND HAVE A COFFEE.THEY TELL ME ITS RATHER GOOD!!!!!!
FRED, brighton says...
3:21pm Thu 26 Jun 08
I did not know they served that coffee at Guantanamo prison.I must find out if they do holidays there.It would be rather nice to see them locked up and know they ca"nt hurt us any more.Keep them there and that lets the rest of those nutters know where they go to when caught.Our best wishes to the brave American personal who work there and long may they enjoy a good cup of starbucks coffee.
The Avangelist, St James St says...
3:22pm Thu 26 Jun 08
I really do not understand what peoples problem is, why don't you get on with your life? if you don't want it do go in there, you are probably the same people that complain about rubbish in the streets but don't want community bins. Just let it be said that not all the residence of St J St and Kemptown are anally retentive, uptight swaggerers or the homeless.
Get over it. Jog on.
Get over it. Jog on.
Natalie B, Brighton says...
3:24pm Thu 26 Jun 08
anti-capitalist wrote:That is pleasing to hear. The guards of the worlds worst terrorists should enjoy some decent coffee.
Whether you like Starbucks or not being there, this story is about how a giant company filled with over paid lawyers can do whatever it likes. If I put up a new extension on my house and was told I didn't have planning permission could I just change the name of it to a collection of bricks and get away with it?
And you all know that Starbucks has a branch in Guantanamo prison camp where the US army gets free coffee? That's you lot subsidising free coffee for the US military. Do you lot like that with your exploited over charged lattes?
Are there any other ways I can donate towards to upkeep of criminals at Guantanamo?
Graham, Brighton says...
3:32pm Thu 26 Jun 08
The Facebook
group,currently has 1,749 members and continues to grow.
group,currently has 1,749 members and continues to grow.
Neil, Worthing says...
3:37pm Thu 26 Jun 08
If you don't like, don't drink there...
dubya, hove says...
3:39pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Graham wrote:well ought to teach em a lesson eh Gray?
The Facebook group,currently has 1,749 members and continues to grow.
Jiggler, Brighton says...
3:46pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Graham wrote:So that's er.... 0.6% of the population of the city then, a positively resounding result in favour of shutting them down then.
The Facebook group,currently has 1,749 members and continues to grow.
Oh...
Cub, says...
3:46pm Thu 26 Jun 08
The guards of the worlds worst terrorists should enjoy some decent coffee.
Are the Cubans known as the Guards of the US army now a'days?
Johnboy, brighton says...
3:50pm Thu 26 Jun 08
What are you moaning about"Anti" the"ve stopped water boarding at Guantanamo Prison{just the odd kicking now and then} and most will be released in the next twenty or so years.Except those they shoot.Its like a hotel over there.Get a life Anti,and cool down with a Starbucks coffee.
Angela, Kemptown says...
4:09pm Thu 26 Jun 08
"This story is about how a giant company filled with over paid lawyers can do whatever it likes"
NO THIS STORY IS ABOUT HOW A HANDFULL OF LEFT WING NO HOPERS CONTINUE TO LIVE IN A DREAM WORLD.
Oh my god! - there are some proper idiots about arent there! Many many many individuals (one man bands) open shops, then have to appeal against council rulings over usage, signs, displays etc! Starbucks arent doing anything that thousands of shops have to do when changing use. Grow up for gods sake. What would you rather have here - a 24hr off licence maybe? Or another secondhand shop? A pawn brokers maybe? You lot of retards dont represent the people of Kemptown, so shut up.
This shop (Starbucks) opening in St James's is the best thing that could happen around here. All you anti American left wing dimbos and moaners and groaners and squatters and anti establishment **** can go and have a funny run down to the refuse collection place, then jump in a big skip with all the other rubbish.
Im going in the lovely new Starbucks to have a chocolate whirl cake and a lovely iced choccy drink. Come and join me if you want - NO ON SECOND THOUGHTS, DONT.
NO THIS STORY IS ABOUT HOW A HANDFULL OF LEFT WING NO HOPERS CONTINUE TO LIVE IN A DREAM WORLD.
Oh my god! - there are some proper idiots about arent there! Many many many individuals (one man bands) open shops, then have to appeal against council rulings over usage, signs, displays etc! Starbucks arent doing anything that thousands of shops have to do when changing use. Grow up for gods sake. What would you rather have here - a 24hr off licence maybe? Or another secondhand shop? A pawn brokers maybe? You lot of retards dont represent the people of Kemptown, so shut up.
This shop (Starbucks) opening in St James's is the best thing that could happen around here. All you anti American left wing dimbos and moaners and groaners and squatters and anti establishment **** can go and have a funny run down to the refuse collection place, then jump in a big skip with all the other rubbish.
Im going in the lovely new Starbucks to have a chocolate whirl cake and a lovely iced choccy drink. Come and join me if you want - NO ON SECOND THOUGHTS, DONT.
m.p.allen, Brighton says...
4:17pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Starbruck's arrogance is effrontery yet predictably so, but the Council's apparent position is downright disgraceful. I have written to the planning office, c/o the Council, and they haven't responded. Perhaps they feel beyond public accountability.
Dave, Wivelsfield says...
4:17pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Jiggler wrote:.6% at best. I bet a lot of them don't even come from Brighton. (or know where it is)
Graham wrote: The Facebook group,currently has 1,749 members and continues to grow.So that's er.... 0.6% of the population of the city then, a positively resounding result in favour of shutting them down then. Oh...
Paul, Peacehaven says...
4:29pm Thu 26 Jun 08
I wonder how many of the people in the Facebook group actually live in the area? Or even in Brighton???
Rupe, Brighton says...
4:31pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Dave wrote:Check it out - there are people from London, the West Midlands, Aberystwyth, Japan, Portsmouth, etc. - most of them look like students with nothing better to do with their time, or people of no fixed abode. What a bunch of wasters.
Jiggler wrote:.6% at best. I bet a lot of them don't even come from Brighton. (or know where it is)Graham wrote: The Facebook group,currently has 1,749 members and continues to grow.So that's er.... 0.6% of the population of the city then, a positively resounding result in favour of shutting them down then. Oh...
Paul, Peacehaven says...
4:57pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Rupe wrote:That reduces the 0.6% down even further then!! :-)
Dave wrote:Check it out - there are people from London, the West Midlands, Aberystwyth, Japan, Portsmouth, etc. - most of them look like students with nothing better to do with their time, or people of no fixed abode. What a bunch of wasters.Jiggler wrote:.6% at best. I bet a lot of them don\'t even come from Brighton. (or know where it is)Graham wrote: The Facebook group,currently has 1,749 members and continues to grow.So that\'s er.... 0.6% of the population of the city then, a positively resounding result in favour of shutting them down then. Oh...
James, Brighton says...
5:22pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Gosh, some of you really see the world as defined by opposition don't you?
It's laughable defining the anti-Starbucks campaigners as unwashed, anti-American lefties.
I'm a company director and hold a US passport. Jon, who started the group, manages a successful Brighton business and also holds a US passport.
This is not a left-right issue. This is about following legal process. If we let this kind of outrage go unchecked then we won't have a free market - a handful of major corporations will stifle choice.
And on a not of personal taste. Those people who think Starbucks makes good coffee really ought to compare it with the coffee from Red Roaster or Taylor St. Baristas on Queens Road.
It's laughable defining the anti-Starbucks campaigners as unwashed, anti-American lefties.
I'm a company director and hold a US passport. Jon, who started the group, manages a successful Brighton business and also holds a US passport.
This is not a left-right issue. This is about following legal process. If we let this kind of outrage go unchecked then we won't have a free market - a handful of major corporations will stifle choice.
And on a not of personal taste. Those people who think Starbucks makes good coffee really ought to compare it with the coffee from Red Roaster or Taylor St. Baristas on Queens Road.
Paul, Here and there says...
5:23pm Thu 26 Jun 08
At least it's only a coffee bar - imagine the fuss if it had been a Tesco Express...
Nick, Hove says...
5:31pm Thu 26 Jun 08
I enjoy a good mug of Starbucks coffee...it may be not quite as good as Cafe Nero or Coffee Republic, but enjoyable none the less. For me the issue here is a corporation running coach and horses through loopholes in the law. It casts them in bad light and makes you wonder whether their corportae social responsibility policies are anything but a sham. If Starbucks really want to be a good citizen then they would follow the spirit of the law as well as the letter...surely six months worth of profits isn't worth the harm they do to the reputation by acting in this way.
Jonah, the level says...
6:06pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Paul wrote:Wow you must have been the smartest kid in school. Have a lie down before you hurt yourself.
Rupe wrote:That reduces the 0.6% down even further then!! :-)Dave wrote:Check it out - there are people from London, the West Midlands, Aberystwyth, Japan, Portsmouth, etc. - most of them look like students with nothing better to do with their time, or people of no fixed abode. What a bunch of wasters.Jiggler wrote:.6% at best. I bet a lot of them don\'t even come from Brighton. (or know where it is)Graham wrote: The Facebook group,currently has 1,749 members and continues to grow.So that\'s er.... 0.6% of the population of the city then, a positively resounding result in favour of shutting them down then. Oh...
Nikki, Kemp Town says...
6:11pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Hi, I'm part of the protest too. I have a job, pay my taxes, live in the area and as ever, am stunned at the vitriol that oozes from this board. It's like a parallel universe! Students are 'time wasters' parents who care enough about the future of the high street to take their kids with them rather than dumping them in front of the TV should 'have their kids taken away'. Sheer lunacy.
Starbucks are arrogant and it's great that people are calling them on this.
I am a grown up. I am not wasting my time. I have a great, happy, fulfilled life - I just want to see legal process followed and for St james not to become just A N Other high street. I LIKE that it has character - and so do the majority of people that we talk to every single week when we protest. That's pensioners, families and young people alike.
Starbucks are arrogant and it's great that people are calling them on this.
I am a grown up. I am not wasting my time. I have a great, happy, fulfilled life - I just want to see legal process followed and for St james not to become just A N Other high street. I LIKE that it has character - and so do the majority of people that we talk to every single week when we protest. That's pensioners, families and young people alike.
dj, her n there says...
6:41pm Thu 26 Jun 08
any one fancy an extra karge white chocolate mocha with whipped cream ???
YUM YUM YUM
YUM YUM YUM
Disgruntled, btn says...
7:04pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Everyone so concerned about following the rules and abiding by the law..ha ha..! Get off the pavements when I want to walk past Starbucks..you causing are an obstruction.
Get a life and do something useful. St James Str. has enough litter and junk in it.
Get a life and do something useful. St James Str. has enough litter and junk in it.
Mel, Hove says...
7:19pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Of course there are plenty of idiots willing to pay for the overpriced ghastly coffee, but do we really want every street in the country to be a clone of all the others? Starbucks, Tesco, Costa and so many of the chains are like a cancer spreading around the place. What is going to disappear now that they have mnoved in illegally, is the very special character of St James Street, with its individual shops and cafes. Is that what Brighton wants? And is it really right that the council, who are quite happy to overcharge us with their high taxes, are once again too feeble to deal with the big boys, just as they have been with the developers of ugly blocks of flats going up all over Hove? As for Starbucks denying that it is a coffee shop, that is laughable. As with all their branches, it is a high-priced hideously ugly coffe shop. I just hope that Brighton residents will have the sense to boycott the place, and it will go out of business very rapidly. Good luck to the protesters. You have my support any day. And yes, I would rather see the shop empty or turned into a charity shop any day.
Mel, Hove says...
7:29pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Oh, and how interesting that the "sex goddess" Letitia can often be seen in St James Street. I wonder if she has frequented Starbucks yet. It would be quite appropriate since the council has prostituted itself over this matter.
Kemptown Lad, brighton says...
7:37pm Thu 26 Jun 08
If it is such a wicked thing,then nobody will drink there will they.And as for legal process,would you be legal in Aran,james?
James, Brighton says...
9:11pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Yes, Kemptown Lad. I will be legal in Aran, Galway and most other parts of Ireland. What on earth are you on about?
Engage brain before mobilising fingers.
Engage brain before mobilising fingers.
Patricia, Kemptown says...
9:42pm Thu 26 Jun 08
Mel wrote:"And yes, I would rather see the shop empty or turned into a charity shop any day"
Of course there are plenty of idiots willing to pay for the overpriced ghastly coffee, but do we really want every street in the country to be a clone of all the others? Starbucks, Tesco, Costa and so many of the chains are like a cancer spreading around the place. What is going to disappear now that they have mnoved in illegally, is the very special character of St James Street, with its individual shops and cafes. Is that what Brighton wants? And is it really right that the council, who are quite happy to overcharge us with their high taxes, are once again too feeble to deal with the big boys, just as they have been with the developers of ugly blocks of flats going up all over Hove? As for Starbucks denying that it is a coffee shop, that is laughable. As with all their branches, it is a high-priced hideously ugly coffe shop. I just hope that Brighton residents will have the sense to boycott the place, and it will go out of business very rapidly. Good luck to the protesters. You have my support any day. And yes, I would rather see the shop empty or turned into a charity shop any day.
You really are a total moron arent you . . .
marion, Brighton says...
9:50pm Thu 26 Jun 08
these people that go to all this trouble to object to a shop opening have obviously got a problem.
go and find something worthwhile to do you load of idiots.
go and find something worthwhile to do you load of idiots.
Dean, Kemptown says...
12:05am Fri 27 Jun 08
If another retailer had wanted to open a shop at the old Sussex Stationers store those protesting against the Starbucks store would have a well balanced argument. The truth is that the small independent business that they and I, would prefer to be there have not expressed any interest or cant afford to be there.
With the above in mind the Starbucks is probably a better plan, otherwise the shop would be left empty and probably fall into disrepair over a short period of time attracting vandals and other unsavoury goings on.
There doesnt seem to be any other plan for this shop so why close it? If people dont want it there then it will close without a protest. I doubt if I will go in there and I would have preferred a different store there but we have to face facts and be realistic.
There are many more issues of concern to be vocal over and protest about in Brighton, Starbucks is pretty low on the list unless you have time on your hands I suppose.
With the above in mind the Starbucks is probably a better plan, otherwise the shop would be left empty and probably fall into disrepair over a short period of time attracting vandals and other unsavoury goings on.
There doesnt seem to be any other plan for this shop so why close it? If people dont want it there then it will close without a protest. I doubt if I will go in there and I would have preferred a different store there but we have to face facts and be realistic.
There are many more issues of concern to be vocal over and protest about in Brighton, Starbucks is pretty low on the list unless you have time on your hands I suppose.
Gentleman Jim, Brighton says...
12:06am Fri 27 Jun 08
Starbucks are quite right its not a coffee house.If you doubt this fact try the stuff they sell as coffee and you will agree with them.I think the Trading Standards officials would have a good case to investigate if Starbucks should change their mind.
Lucy, Kemptown says...
12:37am Fri 27 Jun 08
Dean wrote:Exactly
If another retailer had wanted to open a shop at the old Sussex Stationers store those protesting against the Starbucks store would have a well balanced argument. The truth is that the small independent business that they and I, would prefer to be there have not expressed any interest or cant afford to be there. With the above in mind the Starbucks is probably a better plan, otherwise the shop would be left empty and probably fall into disrepair over a short period of time attracting vandals and other unsavoury goings on. There doesnt seem to be any other plan for this shop so why close it? If people dont want it there then it will close without a protest. I doubt if I will go in there and I would have preferred a different store there but we have to face facts and be realistic. There are many more issues of concern to be vocal over and protest about in Brighton, Starbucks is pretty low on the list unless you have time on your hands I suppose.
And I think the number of empty shops in St James's should be of concern at the moment. The big clothes shop (cant recall its name) is about to close as well.
Thanks god for Starbucks coming to the area.
James, Brighton says...
1:21am Fri 27 Jun 08
I think some people are missing the point somewhat. Sussex Stationers has not gone out of business. It still has 40+ shops around Sussex and Kent. We're not talking about a bankrupt business leaving a site derelict.
The rent on the St James Street site was put up by the freeholder. As I understand it, Sussex Stationers wished to continue trading from that site, but the increased burden of rent made it uneconomic. The profit margin on books isn't great. But would you want to live in a world without bookshops?
What is peculiar is that the rent went up amidst a general deflationary trend in the property market. Make of that what you will.
I'm not an anti-capitalist. What annoys me is that this company is treating planning law with contempt.
There is a reason for planning law. We simply can't have streets full of cafes. We need to have grocers, bookshops, pet shops, hardware stores and all the other shops that make St James's Street a one-stop shopping centre for Kemptown residents.
Starbucks is not a company in which you would want to buy shares at the moment:
http://finance.googl
e.com/finance?client
=ob&q=NASDAQ:SBUX
Its tactic of market saturation in the USA has backfired: Starbucks outlets are cannibalising the profits of neighbouring Starbucks outlets.
Is its solution to shore up profits in the short term by an aggressive overseas expansion that takes a devil-may-care attitude to planning laws? Never mind the fact that the council can shut the outlet down after six months; those six months of trading won't half look good on the balance sheet.
The rent on the St James Street site was put up by the freeholder. As I understand it, Sussex Stationers wished to continue trading from that site, but the increased burden of rent made it uneconomic. The profit margin on books isn't great. But would you want to live in a world without bookshops?
What is peculiar is that the rent went up amidst a general deflationary trend in the property market. Make of that what you will.
I'm not an anti-capitalist. What annoys me is that this company is treating planning law with contempt.
There is a reason for planning law. We simply can't have streets full of cafes. We need to have grocers, bookshops, pet shops, hardware stores and all the other shops that make St James's Street a one-stop shopping centre for Kemptown residents.
Starbucks is not a company in which you would want to buy shares at the moment:
http://finance.googl
e.com/finance?client
=ob&q=NASDAQ:SBUX
Its tactic of market saturation in the USA has backfired: Starbucks outlets are cannibalising the profits of neighbouring Starbucks outlets.
Is its solution to shore up profits in the short term by an aggressive overseas expansion that takes a devil-may-care attitude to planning laws? Never mind the fact that the council can shut the outlet down after six months; those six months of trading won't half look good on the balance sheet.
saint nick, melbourne, victoria says...
1:37am Fri 27 Jun 08
I really do not see what all the fuss is about.
If you don't like the place, go somewhere else. Besides, it's one less empty property in the area being put to a good use
If you don't like the place, go somewhere else. Besides, it's one less empty property in the area being put to a good use
Flat Foot Soozie, Brunswick Square says...
11:20am Fri 27 Jun 08
I suppose Starbucks is right to say that it is not a coffee shop.
Their stuff tastes very little of coffee. It is watery and milky.
I cannot understand why people pay such a lot of money for cups of the stuff there. Some of them must spend £1000 a year or more. That's £10,000 in a decade.
Their stuff tastes very little of coffee. It is watery and milky.
I cannot understand why people pay such a lot of money for cups of the stuff there. Some of them must spend £1000 a year or more. That's £10,000 in a decade.
The LJ Kid., Portsmouth says...
11:36am Fri 27 Jun 08
Starbucks isn't a coffee shop?
???
How can they say that and get away with it?
Surely not just because they don't just sell expensive coffee??
???
How can they say that and get away with it?
Surely not just because they don't just sell expensive coffee??
Louie, Kemptown says...
12:50pm Fri 27 Jun 08
James wrote:"And on a not of personal taste. Those people who think Starbucks makes good coffee really ought to compare it with the coffee from Red Roaster or Taylor St. Baristas on Queens Road."
Gosh, some of you really see the world as defined by opposition don't you? It's laughable defining the anti-Starbucks campaigners as unwashed, anti-American lefties. I'm a company director and hold a US passport. Jon, who started the group, manages a successful Brighton business and also holds a US passport. This is not a left-right issue. This is about following legal process. If we let this kind of outrage go unchecked then we won't have a free market - a handful of major corporations will stifle choice. And on a not of personal taste. Those people who think Starbucks makes good coffee really ought to compare it with the coffee from Red Roaster or Taylor St. Baristas on Queens Road.
I have tried Red Roaster and like the coffee but can't be bothered to queue for 15 minutes and I have no intention of going to Queens Road for a cup coffee! Freedom of choice. If Starbucks lose their planning application then I will join the protest but until then if I get one more idiot trying to give me a leaflet as I go about my business on a Saturday morning then I'll tell them (in front of their kids if they're there) where to shove it.....
Mikethe Planner, St James's St says...
12:52pm Fri 27 Jun 08
Paul wrote:What like the one they're going to open in QS? Whoops...secret squirrel....
At least it's only a coffee bar - imagine the fuss if it had been a Tesco Express...
Dreamer, Brighton says...
12:59pm Fri 27 Jun 08
"And on a not of personal taste. Those people who think Starbucks makes good coffee really ought to compare it with the coffee from Red Roaster or Taylor St. Baristas on Queens Road."
Thank you, if I want your opinion then I'll ask for it. It really is a matter of personal taste I think you'll find. Whilst you may like those 2 places the coffee sold there may not be to everyones personal taste. The trouble with people like you is your condescending attitude in telling people where YOU think the best coffee is. (are you the self appointed arbeiter of good coffee?) Horses for courses......
Thank you, if I want your opinion then I'll ask for it. It really is a matter of personal taste I think you'll find. Whilst you may like those 2 places the coffee sold there may not be to everyones personal taste. The trouble with people like you is your condescending attitude in telling people where YOU think the best coffee is. (are you the self appointed arbeiter of good coffee?) Horses for courses......
AmyWhinehouse, Rehab-no-no-no says...
2:34pm Fri 27 Jun 08
Listen guys
Until we had Starbucks it was easier to get a decent gram of coke than get a decent cup of coffee in St James St! F@ck the Dead Roaster and all who sip in her, plus all those glorifed greasy spoons that serve coffee that tastes like dried dog turds, ground up and covered in hot water. It's a coffee shop for pete's sake. It peddles coffee not class A's (more's the pity) I live in Charles St and am fed up with the crap left by those bunch of loosers filling up my street on a Saturday. All they care about is their self-righteousness and nothing for the environment around them-or else they would take their rubbish home with them - or maybe in the bins provided? Just a thought as it's ruining the "unique character" of the area they are trying to "protect".
Until we had Starbucks it was easier to get a decent gram of coke than get a decent cup of coffee in St James St! F@ck the Dead Roaster and all who sip in her, plus all those glorifed greasy spoons that serve coffee that tastes like dried dog turds, ground up and covered in hot water. It's a coffee shop for pete's sake. It peddles coffee not class A's (more's the pity) I live in Charles St and am fed up with the crap left by those bunch of loosers filling up my street on a Saturday. All they care about is their self-righteousness and nothing for the environment around them-or else they would take their rubbish home with them - or maybe in the bins provided? Just a thought as it's ruining the "unique character" of the area they are trying to "protect".
The LJ Kid., Portsmouth says...
2:46pm Fri 27 Jun 08
F@ck the Dead Roaster and all who sip in her, plus all those glorifed greasy spoons that serve coffee that tastes like dried dog turds, ground up and covered in hot water.
... and you would know how this tastes?
Excuse me for intruding on your personal bubble.. but it would be nice to see some people actually try and find a useful word in their vocabularies rather than resorting to profanity.
(Oh and by the way, I'm not picking on you AmyWhinehouse, merely using you as an example. Sorry!)
Rev Ponge, brighton says...
4:22pm Fri 27 Jun 08
I hereby call this debate over.World war 3,over a cup of coffee must now stop.Any one who wants to carry on with this rather silly demo,will have to meet me on saturday morning over a cup of coffee in Starbucks,to explain why. I HAVE SPOKEN.
Nikki, Kemp Town says...
5:08pm Fri 27 Jun 08
"I live in Charles St and am fed up with the crap left by those bunch of loosers filling up my street on a Saturday. "
Amy - what are we leaving behind? We pick up any leaflets that get dropped and don't litter. I've been there every single week but one - there is absolutely no litter from us at all.
Amy - what are we leaving behind? We pick up any leaflets that get dropped and don't litter. I've been there every single week but one - there is absolutely no litter from us at all.
Tim, Hove says...
10:09pm Fri 27 Jun 08
To everyone who is apathetic about this subject in general, I don't think you are seeing a major point.
The Brighton we know and love is the way it is because it is an individual place. Full of independent clothes shops, cafes,bars etc. This is not just about Starbucks, but the way bit by bit all towns, cities in England are becoming clones of each other! Either you care about the spirit and fabric of brighton, or you can just carry on calling it a non issue and insulting people who just actually give some thought to how they spend they're money.
I guess ignorance really is bliss. But hey as long as you get your Mocha choca frappa latte with a chocolate muffin.
Ps if you bothered to research Starbucks as a company you will find that they also are the worst coffee "chain" for exploiting workers and pickers of the coffee beens they use in Africa. As someone who has been to tea and coffee plantations in Kenya and Tanzania this is a subject close to my heart,
Stop making this some simplistic political, "Left and Right" cliche. Its just a matter of some people care about these issues and some people don't think that its worth thinking about!
The Brighton we know and love is the way it is because it is an individual place. Full of independent clothes shops, cafes,bars etc. This is not just about Starbucks, but the way bit by bit all towns, cities in England are becoming clones of each other! Either you care about the spirit and fabric of brighton, or you can just carry on calling it a non issue and insulting people who just actually give some thought to how they spend they're money.
I guess ignorance really is bliss. But hey as long as you get your Mocha choca frappa latte with a chocolate muffin.
Ps if you bothered to research Starbucks as a company you will find that they also are the worst coffee "chain" for exploiting workers and pickers of the coffee beens they use in Africa. As someone who has been to tea and coffee plantations in Kenya and Tanzania this is a subject close to my heart,
Stop making this some simplistic political, "Left and Right" cliche. Its just a matter of some people care about these issues and some people don't think that its worth thinking about!
Lucy, brighton says...
10:46pm Sat 28 Jun 08
Just shows that multi-national corporations can do what ever they want. wether its a coffee shop or a dog shop, they have no right to stomp around and do as they **** well please. local independant traders dont have that luxury, they have to abide by the rules and regs coz they cant afford big shot lawers.
You dont see the flower shops calling themselves supermarkets, or leather shops caling themselves a cattle market. starbucks are trying every trick in the book and it just wont do
You dont see the flower shops calling themselves supermarkets, or leather shops caling themselves a cattle market. starbucks are trying every trick in the book and it just wont do
sam, btn says...
2:59am Sun 29 Jun 08
St James Street is obviously changing, it's no longer viable as the road of little independant shops as there just isn't enough of those shops around that can afford to open up there when they could rent places in the lanes with a much greater customer base.
Its time to accept that things are changing and if you look in any high street thanks alot to the internet alot of shops just disappeared from the street and trade near enough solely online, how mnay coffee shops are there now along Western Road where as 10 years ago it was full of proper shops.
You've got supermarket up there, now theres the big name coffee shop, all thats missing now is McDonalds and then it's a proper modern high street.
Its time to accept that things are changing and if you look in any high street thanks alot to the internet alot of shops just disappeared from the street and trade near enough solely online, how mnay coffee shops are there now along Western Road where as 10 years ago it was full of proper shops.
You've got supermarket up there, now theres the big name coffee shop, all thats missing now is McDonalds and then it's a proper modern high street.
brightonian, Brighton says...
11:33am Sun 29 Jun 08
"multi-national corporations can do what ever they want" - this is the real issue - the same happened in Palmeria Square when Tesco's ruined one of Hove's finest buildings. The council does nothing - too busy checking that double glazed windows have been installed in private homes or using surveillance cameras to check on dog owners. The council these days just goes for the easy target - private individuals and small businesses. It is time they realised they represent Brighton residents and are not a business making easy money out of a captive audience.
F, whitehawk says...
5:33pm Sun 29 Jun 08
brightonian wrote:The council does nothing?????
\"multi-national corporations can do what ever they want\" - this is the real issue - the same happened in Palmeria Square when Tesco\'s ruined one of Hove\'s finest buildings. The council does nothing - too busy checking that double glazed windows have been installed in private homes or using surveillance cameras to check on dog owners. The council these days just goes for the easy target - private individuals and small businesses. It is time they realised they represent Brighton residents and are not a business making easy money out of a captive audience.
I believe the council refused planning permission because this particular shop is designated as a retail establishment not a cafe, starbucks ignored this and renovated the shop anyway and then went for an appeal using a the arguement that they are actually selling bags of coffee unfotunatly this now has to be proved wrong ie monitor what they sell - planning policy & the council have tried to prevent starbucks opening but clearly they have well paid lawyers who can try every trick in the book ! Planning policy is set to create diversity in a street so that not every shop is a coffee shop etc. It wouldnt matter whether this was starbucks or an independant coffee shop is just isnt meant to be a coffe shop!
Albert, Square says...
4:03pm Mon 30 Jun 08
Tim, the Brighton you refer to disappeared long before Starbucks opened anywhere. Brighton was at it's best pre-1998. Since then it's been a parody of its former self trying to recapture the independent glory from when it truly was "the place to be".
Richard Hurst, says...
9:35pm Mon 14 Jul 08
This would be moderately more amusing if it weren't on the comments section of a newspaper owned by the giant transatlantic Gannett Corporation. Har.
mark, brighton says...
2:12pm Thu 26 Jun 08