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Watchdogs back fight against bank charges

8:15am Monday 22nd January 2007

comment Comments (34)   Have your say »

By Rachel Fitch »

Consumer watchdogs have urged customers to fight their banks for a full refund of unfair charges.

They said powerful tools were available to challenge banks, as highlighted in The Argus's two-part series on reclaiming charges, and consumers must make use of them.

Banks have already repaid tens of thousands of pounds to customers in Sussex who asked for their charges back. Every day, dozens more are joining the campaign and threatening to take their banks to court.

Following our story on Saturday about how to beat the banks, readers have contacted us about their experiences.

Among them was choreographer Charles Linehan, 44, who has won back £387 from Lloyds TSB and is now claiming at least £1,000 from Co-op Business.

He said he had become frustrated by the way Lloyds TSB had handled his overdraft and decided to take action.

Mr Linehan, of Rochester Street, Brighton, said: "This is something everybody should be doing and I would really encourage people to look into it.

"I found it very easy to do and the more I read, the more confident I got.

"It was quite daunting at first but there is a lot of support out there and you just need to follow the instructions.

"The thing I like best is that I set the terms and conditions for the bank and when they need to reply to me by.

"It is a complete reversal of them setting the terms and charging if I am one day late making a payment or go a fraction over my limit."

Carla Newey, of Highbank, Bolnore Village, Haywards Heath, is due to fight Lloyds TSB in court on February 13.

She is asking for £2,000 back and hopes the bank will make an out- of-court settlement before then, like most banks do.

Most of her charges were accumulated on her student bank account while studying to be a social worker.

Mrs Newey, 25, said: "The charges can make life hell. I was once charged about £190 in a month, which is a lot of money.

"It is definitely worth trying to get your money back but you have to be prepared to persevere with it and hang in there.

"Banks will try to intimidate you and encourage you not to do it but it is worth sticking it out.

"I would encourage people to keep all their paperwork, read the forums on the internet and not give up."

Rosa Chaz, of Midhurst, is a member of the Consumer Action Group and said she was in the process of starting a claim and had requested copies of her statements for the last six years.

Groups including Which? and the Consumer Action Group have demanded banks stop over-the-top penalties imposed on people who go overdrawn or have insufficient funds for direct debit and cheque payments.

They claim most of the "unjust charges" are not legally enforceable, even if listed in the terms and conditions of an account or loan.

Which? estimates bank customers are paying at least £4.7 billion every year on default charges.

It argues that fees of up to £39 are unfair and excessive because they do not reflect the true administration costs of dealing with the problem.

The Office of Fair Trading is investigating unauthorised overdraft and credit card default charges.

Doug Taylor, personal finance campaigner at Which?, said: "These charges are nothing but an easy money-spinner for the banks.

"We think charges should be fair and reflect the costs involved. They should not be, as they are now, an arbitrary figure picked to make the most money out of unsuspecting customers.

"Banks and building societies have been hiding behind unacceptable excuses for too long. It simply cannot cost up to £39 to send a letter."

If you have beat your bank or would like more information, call 01273 544536, or visit www.theargus.co.uk and post a comment.


To view all four stages and the three letters, click here


For further advice and information visit the following,
www.which.co.uk
www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk
www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk
www.moneysavingexpert.com

Tell us what you think about unfair bank charges. Post your comments below.

Your Say YourArgus

Phillipa Smith, says...
10:34am Mon 22 Jan 07

Successfully claimed back £1300 from A & L, have two further claims against them, have two claims against MBNA and two claims against Capital One. All are trying to settle out of Court, but twist to tail MBNA have also breached Data Protection Act for non-compliance of SAR. Information Commissioner's Office have ruled I can claim compensation also under section13 of DPA.

People are no longer frightened by the banks or debt collectors and repairing your credit file is only matter of perseverance especially of any defaults or late payment markers are the result of your bank's actions.

I am fighting them all the way to get back what is rightfully mine.

The next on my list are the Credit Reference Agencies for recording erroneous information

Ian Shaw, says...
11:40am Mon 22 Jan 07

I too have managed to claim back charges successfully, I got £1700 from Halifax which was the full amount.

They tried 3 times to settle for amounts lower than what I was charged, 2 days before the court date they settled the full amount.

I used the information and letter templates from www.bankrefund.com which made the process extremely easy.

Marc, says...
1:11pm Mon 22 Jan 07

Congratulations, you have now brought forward the end of free banking for those of us who are able to manage our finances!

James, says...
1:34pm Mon 22 Jan 07

I am just starting the process - about to request my statements for the past 6 years. My bank have taken over £2,000 in charges during the past three months on my current account and I have had to cancel my direct debits as a result. I estimate that to have paid over £10,000 in charges over the past 6 years.

Kate S, says...
4:17pm Mon 22 Jan 07

Just claimed back £4500 from Natwest using the Consumer Action Group. I got lots of help and support from the other users. Their templates and speadsheets were invaluable. Reclaim the Right!

Phil Garvey, says...
8:24pm Mon 22 Jan 07

I am/was in the process of claiming my charges back when I heard that the Banks were stopping the overdraft facility to people who were claiming. I certainly couldn't afford for that to happen and so now don't know what to do. Does anyone know if this is correct.

James, says...
12:52pm Tue 23 Jan 07

Marc wrote:
Congratulations, you have now brought forward the end of free banking for those of us who are able to manage our finances!
Congratulations, you have managed to competely ignore the fact that banks are breaking the law!

Good article - you can find more information at <a href="http://www.unfair-bank-charges.org.uk">Unfair Bank Charges</a> too.

dan, says...
11:22am Wed 24 Jan 07

well done james, silly boy marc!

alun, says...
11:01pm Sun 28 Jan 07

Hi

Anybody have any dealings with capital one? They seem to ignore the 40 day rule.

Alun

Guy, says...
4:29pm Wed 31 Jan 07

I am waiting for £4100 from HSBC. They say they will defend all the claim so I have taken the next step. I am worried as they havn't even offered part payment and today is their last day to send their response. Does anybody think I should give up or is it just a tactic to see how far I will go?

Guy

karl, broadffield crawley says...
11:25am Thu 1 Feb 07

my mum and dad are really struggerling, they know they don't have enough income to pay bills that are going out ,haveing the bank change them up to £35-£39 for ever debit unpaid made life even harder mum then heard about this beat the bank and has contacted the bank and asked for 6 years of statments so that she can try and get all the overcharged money back.

i may only be 12 and so people may not think i can understand it fully but me and my 15 year old brother did not even have a christmas because the bank was constantly after us for more money and demanding money yet they think they will get paid when me and my brother did even have a christmas we couldn't afford 1.

my mum has even taken on a second job to try bringing in more income but we are still struggling and we are hoping and wishing we will beat the bank it might just make life that bit easier we don't even really have money to threaten the bank with legal action. if you want to give us support contact us by sending an email to the argus requesting them to forward on to us.

And thank you for taking the time to read what i have written.

karl

Joe Samolly, Beds says...
2:05pm Thu 1 Feb 07

Marc wrote:
Congratulations, you have now brought forward the end of free banking for those of us who are able to manage our finances!
Never mind eh Marc.. you can obviously afford to pay them...

charlie.l, Brighton says...
6:45pm Thu 1 Feb 07

Karl - do a search and find Consumer Action Group and post your comment there.
You will get a lot of support!Good luck & go get 'em.
C

Carly Follows, Brighton says...
9:09pm Mon 5 Feb 07

Can you do the sam e thing with store card accounts and they charge late payments etc and HFC bank who you have credit with when you buy something ???

Dave, Brighton says...
4:21pm Mon 12 Feb 07

Despite being someone on a modest income, supporting a wife and two kids I have never had to pay these (admittedly high) charges. I do this by whats known as budgeting. In other words, I dont go out or buy stuff until I can afford it. Its not easy, but as such I have had 'free' banking for 19 years. Banks will make money one way or another and soon we will ALL pay for every transaction. Your enthusiasm at getting a couple of hundred quid back now wont last for long when you have to pay for every cash withdrawal and cheque you pay in like many business accounts do...

stephen, chester says...
9:44pm Wed 14 Feb 07

I have sent my second letter to the bank threating them with court action it has been 13 days today. It will be 14 tommorow should i take them to court, they owe me £620 and about £60 in interest

leeanne, bolton says...
7:48pm Sat 17 Feb 07

Guy wrote:
I am waiting for £4100 from HSBC. They say they will defend all the claim so I have taken the next step. I am worried as they havn't even offered part payment and today is their last day to send their response. Does anybody think I should give up or is it just a tactic to see how far I will go? Guy
no you should not give up, the money is yours so hang in there, send them another letter, keep sending them till they give you whats wrightfully yours.

i'm going to see my bank as soon as and looking forward to it.

thankyou to whoever founded all of this thankyou.

scott, West Mids says...
5:57pm Fri 23 Feb 07

I have just sent of my first letter to HSBC asking for the last 6 years of statements. This is to see if i am owed anything. Bit worried incase it back fires on me. Is it as striaght forward as people are making out.? Scott

Jason, Liverpool says...
4:55pm Mon 26 Feb 07

Hey, am just in the process of adding up the list of charges Halifax has given me for my credit card. Can I claim back Cash Advance Charges or not? I know they're only £2 a go but over 6 years it adds up to a lot! Or am I just being greedy? ;)

sally-ann, worcestershire says...
5:11pm Tue 27 Feb 07

Does anyone know if it is possible to reclaim business charges or just personal?

Han, Brighton says...
4:04pm Thu 1 Mar 07

Dave wrote:
Despite being someone on a modest income, supporting a wife and two kids I have never had to pay these (admittedly high) charges. I do this by whats known as budgeting. In other words, I dont go out or buy stuff until I can afford it. Its not easy, but as such I have had 'free' banking for 19 years. Banks will make money one way or another and soon we will ALL pay for every transaction. Your enthusiasm at getting a couple of hundred quid back now wont last for long when you have to pay for every cash withdrawal and cheque you pay in like many business accounts do...
I'd prefer to pay a small amount for every transaction- rather than have the banks punish those who have little or no income.

john, cheshire says...
10:48pm Tue 13 Mar 07

how do i go about starting court action against my bank they have refused to settle and i need to know and what does it cost initially

anony, uk says...
1:42pm Sun 18 Mar 07

Guy wrote:
I am waiting for £4100 from HSBC. They say they will defend all the claim so I have taken the next step. I am worried as they havn\\\'t even offered part payment and today is their last day to send their response. Does anybody think I should give up or is it just a tactic to see how far I will go? Guy
Do not give up , I have taken them to court and they have indeed the intention to put in a defense for my claim as well. They will never turned up in court and will most likely settle my full claim , there legal office is a scam as it is really next door to their main office , solicitor smashator, its only so they can excatly calculate what they owe you they stall , it will never stand in court what they did and they know it


Gregg Lamb, London says...
11:37pm Mon 26 Mar 07

I am in the process of claiming over £3,000 from 6 bank accounts, and it's been 3 weeks since my 1st letter, and I have replies from 4 of the accounts saying they'll be using the 8 week period there aloud to use. I now have sent my 2nd letter to Barclays & Natwest threatning court as they have taken 16 days and counting to just acknowledge my 1st letter.

I don't know whether to threaten the rest with court as there taking there time with this, and I did request 14 days initially for them to sort these matters out.
Anyone got any advice.

Kindest Regards,
Gregg

Amanda, says...
8:34pm Wed 11 Apr 07

I have just sent the 1st letter requesting info from the past six years to HSBC. Has anyone had any luck in reclaiming from them??

Michael, Bury says...
12:20pm Thu 19 Apr 07

Ok a refund I was expecting came a day late and as a result I overdrew by a spectular three pounds for which I am now being charged 39. It gets better, as I check the math it seems there was enough money to pay after all. When I've finished grinding up halifax I'm switching to another bank.

Simon, Wales says...
12:54pm Fri 20 Apr 07

ABBEY NATIONAL BANK
Get Your Money Back

Telephone Direct and claim your bank charges back

MR TOM JERRED
SENIOR CUSTOMER RELATION MANAGER
0845 600 6014
Ask to Speak to him direct

PAM SPEED
BANKING SERVICING
08457 654321
Ask to Speak to her direct

MR RICHARD JONES
SENIOR MANAGER
0870 607 6000
Ask to speak to him direct


Simon, Wales says...
12:56pm Fri 20 Apr 07

This problem arises from the banks using poverty as a source of profit—a great deal of profit. The bank commission of BBC 2's "The Money Programme", which included eminent business academics and a former senior NatWest executive, concluded that the absolute maximum administrative cost to a bank of processing a bounced cheque—the most labour-intensive of the processes in question—is £4.50. For all other items, such as unauthorised overdrafts or bounced direct debits, the commission concluded that the absolute maximum, in this electronic age where everything is done automatically through a computer, is £2.50. However, the average charge is approximately £30. Some are as high as £38, and they are charged every time people make what the banks consider to be an unauthorised transaction. That is a substantial profit for the banks, which rake in some £4.5 billion, without even taking account of the similar examples that the Federation of Small Businesses found in business banking accounts.
Almost all of what is charged is profit, not costs. It is profit at the expense of hard-up customers. It is the biggest bank robbery in Britain, and it involves the banks robbing their own customers, especially their poorest ones. A common response when the practice is described is that there should be a law against it; but there is a law, or there are laws. First, under common law, disproportionate and punitive charges have always been illegal. In layman's terms, if a consumer breaks the contract the other party—the bank, in this case—cannot impose a charge greater than the reasonable estimate of its loss. That common law has been unchanged for 100 years, and numerous cases in the higher courts have confirmed it. However, we can go further. The rights in question are protected by statutory instrument. The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 made that clear.


Karen, United Kingdom says...
12:59pm Fri 20 Apr 07

ARE YOU GETTING ANY TYPE OF BENEFITS

INCOME SUPPORT, JOBSEEKERS ALLOWANCE, FAMILY TAX CREDITS..?

AND HAVE BEEN CHARGED EXCESSIVE PENALTY FEES/CHARGES BY YOUR BANK OVER THE LAST SIX YEARS, YOU CAN TAKE THEM TO COUNTY COURT TO RECOVER THOSE FEES AND IT WON'T COST YOU A PENNY IF YOU RECIEVE INCOME SUPPORT BENEFIT, JOB SEEKERS ALLOWANCE, OR YOU MIGHT HAVE TO PAY A REDUCED FEE IF YOU GET FAMILY TAX CREDITS.

IF YOU HAVE NO JOY IN YOUR CONTACT WITH THE BANK, JUST POP ALONG TO YOUR COUNTY COURT OFFICES AND FILL IN A SHORT FORM WITH 2 PROOF OF ID, AND PROOF THAT YOU ARE GETTING BENEFIT, THEN AFTER FILLING IN THAT FORM, FILL IN THE COUNTY COURT FORM TO ISSUE THE SUMMONS AT THE SAME TIME AND THAT'S IT.

GET THE BALL ROLLING, GET THOSE CHARGES BACK.

SHOW THEM YOU ARE NOT MESSING ABOUT, IT'S EASY,AND IF YOU WERE WORRIED ABOUT THE COST, DON'T BE, PROVIDED YOU FALL IN THE CATAGORY ABOVE, IT WON'T COST YOU ANYTHING...NOTHING TO LOSE, EVERYTHING TO GAIN....

GOOD LUCK TO YOU ALL

BANKS DON'T WANT CCJ'S

get your money back !


David Jackson, Rhyl says...
1:05pm Fri 20 Apr 07

CUSTOMERS SEEKING BANK REFUNDS SHOULD ALSO CONTACT

MR ANDREW NANSON
HEAD OF COMPLAINTS
0845 600 6014

David Jackson, 321-042 says...
1:09pm Fri 20 Apr 07

ABBEY TOP DOG IF YOU GET NOWHERE WITH THE OTHERS REGARDING YOUR CHARGES. INSIST ON SPEAKING TO HIM PERSONALLY.

DICK HARRIS
SENIOR HEAD OF COMPLAINTS

TEL 0845 600 6014
FAX 0845 600 1378

Simon, Wales says...
4:45pm Fri 20 Apr 07

RONNIE BIGGS BANK ROBBER WAS EVENTUALLY CAPTURED AND PUNISHED ACCORDINGLY.

THE CHIEF EXECUTIVES OF ALL THE BANKS SHOULD ALSO BE PUNISHED FOR UNLAWFUL CONDUCT IN MAKING PROFITS ( WHICH IS ILLEGAL) FROM THE EXCESSIVE PENALTY CHARGES THEY HAVE CHARGED US AND STOLEN FROM OUR BANK ACCOUNTS OVER THE YEARS.






caroline upton, leeds says...
9:12pm Wed 30 May 07

i have had bank charges every week for been a couple of pence short for a direct debit i think its disgusting £25 a charge so iv read the reclaim forms and im gonna claim back wat is mine thanks to the comments have put as when i went to the bank to claim back they refused me

sharon, midlands says...
7:53pm Tue 20 Nov 07

i called the financial obudsman today (unaware of the court case) and was told those recieving state benifits (i get disabilty) will be treated differently, the man i spoke to stated it was 'illegal' for the bank to 'take' means tested money but i cannot find anything in 'law' relating to this, can anyone advise me as to where to start looking?

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